DrunkBomber

I think its fair to compare Ortons and Grossmans numbers at the end of the season. Grossman played roughly 3.50 games and Orton played 3 games. Grossman played the 2nd half of the Oakland game and came in when they were losing and won the game. He then went against the best CB tandem in the league, Denver. Playoff team Seattle and against the Super Bowl champs, NYG. After those 3.5 games Grossmans rating was 88.8. If you dont believe it you can calculate it yourselves. Orton came in and lost his first game to Minnestoa and then beat the Packers and the Saints. His rating was 73.9. Now I understand that people are going to be quick to refer back to the bad games Grossman had and try to focus on the negatives, but if you look at the way he played at the end of the season he was a completely different quarterback. Objectively would you not say you would like to have a qb with a rating of 88.8? I was also impressed by Ortons play and I think he is capable of being a good qb and I like the open competition and I will support whoever wins the job. I just dont see how anyone can honestly say that Orton is significantly better the Grossman. The last 7 games of the season both guys had pretty much the same guys around them and expectations for the playoffs were roughly at the same point. We cant say for certain if Grossman will pick up where he left off, but if he does we might have lucked out by resigning him, and if not we give Orton a shot.

They talk about other positions like SS and TE/FB but this one applied to the Bears better. They did use AA as an example for SS but as you can imagine it wasnt saying he is a good fit for the new types of safeties. Sounds to me like theyre saying Singeltary and Butkus cant do what Urlacher can and would be situational players in this era (Dont blame me, I just post the articles)

First 3 games: 47 of 89 exactly 500 yards 1 td 6 int Oakland: 7 of 14 142 yards 1 td and 0 ints Seattle: 24 of 37 266 yards 0 td and 0 int Denver: 17 of 33 193 yards 1 td and 1 int Giants: 25 of 46 296 yards 1 td and 0 int With the exception of Oakland the other three are all playoff teams including the champs and the best CB tandem in the NFL. Those numbers arent satisfactory for a team with a dominant defense, a returner who gets good field position and a team that is supposed to run first? I would think most Bears fans would be happy if he could produce like that for a whole season. He looked good the whole end of the year when he was playing.

You dont think Rex looked much better from when he came in during the Oakland game on?

Theres a lot of things that factor into the ups and downs of Grossmans career. He has been the best qb weve had since Kramer. We have also had a lot of success with him. Two years ago, he was considered an MVP candidate up until the Arizona game. Then after that game he went out and torched San Fransisco the next week. Then, in the beginning of last season there was a lot of pressure on him and the team. They were picked to pretty much stroll through the NFC. However, we lost our best offensive weapon, Jones and our offensive line took a huge step back. He also didnt get much time with Olsen either. After he say for a while and the pressure was off, when he came back he looked like a completely different QB. He wasnt forcing throws, he wasnt staring down the WRs and he was keeping the team in position to win games which is what we wanted him to do. this was also with injuries on the line and AP as the running game. With low expectations this season, and a different mix of skill players around him I think he is going to win the starting job and actually surprise a lot of people.

WRONG Its from 4 years ago

Youre right, when he came back during that Oakland game from then on he seemed much more comfortable out there and wasnt making the risky throws he had been known for. If he can continue the way he looked at the end of the year and develop timing with his weapons he might be able to minimize mistakes and manage the games better.

If they do we better extend Mike Brown quickly too

When hes healthy has as big an impact on games as Bob Sanders. He can simply dominate a game. It would be nice if he can stay healthy this year.

I think Clark was more of a favorite target for him than Moose. I also think that Olsen will be a better target than either of them. Then factor in Hester keeping defenses honest and he might surprise some people.

Something tells me Belichick and company wont be quick to accept the apology.

More or less the people that said some of the harsher things I listed. I wasnt really looking at who wrote what when I was copying them. Like I said, I understand people wishing this was done behind closed doors, I just think its ridiculous how far some people have gone in the things theyre saying about him and those were the comments I was mostly responding to.

Youre right about that. I realized the difference later in the thread which is why I switched from saying we all would do the same thing to saying it is a much different situation, which I think it is. I think its unfair to say because somebody would do that in their job that he should have to do it at his based on the enormous differences between the jobs of the fans compared to the jobs of professional athletes. So to imply that the situations are relevant skews the logic of the thread. Which might not have been your intentions but thats how it came across to me.

That wasnt really geared at you.

It has nothing to do with being on a high horse. Im replying to things people are saying in this thread. This is a message board and its used to discuss and debate topics and thats what Im doing. Theres no need to be on a high horse when you have people saying things like this: "My advice to Url...shut your mouth and draw your check...or does his back bother him that much? Hmmmm" "Urlacher's a big baby. He wasn't pouting when he signed the largest deal in NFL history (or something close). The times change, honor your freakin contract." "hey! man up Url, you signed the contract, now honor it..." "Urlacher is that bright anyway. Judging by the way he's already alienatied the fans, he's gonna be the biggest loser here." "I would honor the contract that I signed. My word is no good if I do not. That is how I was raised." (like this has any relevance and is a realistic comparison, who is on the high horse?) "He whined like a little bitch last year about the media, then he said he was playing hurt, then on top of all that, he has surgery on his neck. After ALL THAT, now he wants the Bears to pay him more money? Jesus, this guy just seems like a complete IDIOT! I don't care what he's done for the Bears. HE"S BEEN PAID FOR IT." "If this goes on for awhile, people are going to start bringing up the selfish player stereotype. Singletary, Butkus, did they ask for new contracts with 4 years left on their current ones? Even if they were playing today, they would never do that. That is just what type of people they were. Obvioulsy Brian doesn't belong with them. As a player maybe, but thats about it." (this is my favorite by far because of the link posted next about Singeltary holding out in '85) Im responding to stuff like this and if you look at it as a whole you can see how ridiculous this stuff is. Nobody should compare this situation to their jobs because it is such a different industry and stuff like this happens all the time. So for you to say youd honor your contract because thats the way you were raised doesnt compare because in Urlachers case he has more power than any of us do leverage wise against our employers. Hes one of the top 5 at what he does in the world. If any of us tried to do this they would just replace us with someone else. So I understand the people who dont like dirty laundry being aired out in the media, I just dont see the point in saying stuff like I posted above. Those are simply low blows and they are coming from people who are fans of his which is what makes me scratch my head.

I know players look out for their best interest first and I was using this topic as a reason why I think its justified. I realize Urlacher doesnt factor in fan approval when he makes business decisions that affect his life, we have to realize though, no athletes do. However, he has done enough in his time here to earn the fans respect and has done a good job keeping it. I also think you mis categorized what type of fan I am. I didnt run out and buy Urlachers jersey and I dont buy products just because he endorses them. I do however, respect what hes done on and off the field since he has been a Bear and I wouldnt let something like this make me resort to calling him selfish or even an idiot because of it. Its amazing to hear you guys bash the organization for things like JAs inability to draft offensive talent, or our coaching staff not using players right and then you turn right around and bash the players too. Are you even a fan of the team or do you just watch to criticize how these people conduct their business? So people hate the gm, the coaches, players that hold out, players that put themselves in a bad situation (hanging out with friends and family on an anchored boat) What Im gathering is that Devin Hester and Garrett Wolfe are the most popular players on the team. So everyone continue to rip Urlacher and Ill keep your seats warm on the bandwagon for when EVERY SINGLE ONE OF YOU is singing his praises again once he returns to anchor one of the best and most feared defenses in the NFL. By the time the season starts will be right about the time the Cubs are wrapping up their season so it will be a seamless transition between bandwagons.

I think everyone would like to see this handled behind closed doors. I also think that Brians first attempts to renegotiate were probably strictly behind closed doors. That didnt work so now its in the media. I think its important to note that he has said he wants to finish his career as a Bear and didnt ask to be traded or anything. I just dont understand how so many fans can turn on Urlacher so quickly for this. Its business and most of us understand that, and I bet if hes healthy there isnt a chance he isnt playing in week 1. I think Urlacher deserves some slack because hes played balls out for the Bears his entire career and has been a great teammate and does great things in the community. Hes never bashed a teammate or the organization and hes meant a lot to the franchise and the fans and if theres one person who I think people should wait to see what happens before calling him selfish or crucify him. There were people in this thread even saying things like he isnt very intelligent and how stupid he is. It puts things into perspective, stuff like this situation proves why athletes should probably look out for their best interest and not care about the team or fans because obviously theyll turn on you quickly.

Maybe next time theyll poll fans to see if they approve what means they use as leverage to negotiate their contracts.

I think its good that we have a chance to fly under the radar. We have a tough schedule but I think if we can stay healthy we have a good shot at the division. I might be in the minority but I think our division is going to be severely overrated this year.

That settles it, our WR corps is now called The Killer B's

So Im assuming Lovie Smith is selfish and you hate him too right?

Its nothing compared to what Chad Johnson is doing or Lance Briggs did. He isnt going out of his way to go on tv and blast the organization or demanding to be traded or anything, hes answering questions and was joking around about retiring. Jockeying through the media is a tactic that players and teams used and he hasnt used it in a negative way like others have in the past.

Thats what Larry Mayer has to say about the situation. Granted he doesnt have the resources of some people here where he can call up and ask Butkus and Singletary if they would do something like this but its almost as though he has some type of knowledge about the business side of football. Hopefully this gets straightened out soon so all the people who have called him selfish and even an idiot in this very thread can go back to riding his jock until we know who the starting quarterback is going to be and the die hards can start ripping into them and call them names.

Whether you agree with what I say about Urlacher or not, thanks for posting that link. TNrick, do you even know how ridiculous what you just said was? Like you know what kind of guys they are and that you know they would never do something like this. Seriously, where did that even come from, comparing Urlachers character to guys you probably have never even see play?