BearFan PHX

Ben Johnson's amazing offense in Detroit is run first too. He throws off of play action and the defense is gutted because LBers have to come up and respect the run with their offensive line. Also, i dont think Vrabel is stuck in the past any more than tough guy Dan Campbell is? Vrabel might bring in a guy like Josh McDaniels. He understands modern offense, and was kind of like Johnson is now, a well touted OC under a strong head coach (Belichick) who went on to fail as head coach twice. Youd surely get experience, and unlikely hed be offered head coaching jobs right away either? Then bring in Saleh as DC and youve got three great coaches, each on the position they do best, with three head coaches worth of experience between them. That's the pitch anyway

true, but Poles stayed with bad coaches when better choices were available too? Id give him a mixed grade - some hits, some misses, but more inconsistent than youd like in a guy you want to trust but are good coaches critical? absolutely!

Here is a great video about how Ben Johnson uses plays to set up other plays. How he leverages a strong offensive line into wide open middle passing routes. I just want to say i LOVE Ben Johnson as an OC. I wont belabor the point that I am unsure of him as a head coach here, but he is a really great OC. Maybe he will be a great head coach too. I just dont have any evidence either way which is why I'm on the fence. But this thread is about good football, and this certainly qualifies. You have to follow the link to youtube to see it, but its worth it if you havent yet. It's what every offensive coordinator SHOULD be doing - using plays and formations to scout tendencies and then using what you learn to set up your opponent for failure later in the game. As you watch this, you may wonder why we never seem to be doing anything like this. Also, it's interesting to note that Ben Johnson's mentor was John Shoop.

without knowing any of the players specifically, this seems right to me.

for sure - we see how bad coaching makes decent players awful in a unit. A bunch of Bears OL castaways are starting on other teams, and not looking like they did when they were here. Daniels, Patrick, Leno, there are one or two others I'm forgetting too. They look like absolute losers for us, and then go on to be serviceable for someone else. WRs too.

it's the unfair advantage that comes with winning. hopefully we enjoy it some day too!

I dont think we disagree, maybe I didnt say it right. Im saying that good teams have an edge on bad teams, so the chaos gets somewhat absorbed by their advantage. If the Chiefs are 8 points better, but the other team tries hard, a few things go their way, then they end up losing to the chiefs by 3. It's not like either team had an equal shot at being on the winning side of that 3 points. It's that the winning team was better than 3 points better, and so it absorbs the effort and chaos that flow through every game. The good teams don't lose close chaotic outcomes as often as the win them. So I was just saying that the bears haven't been "unlucky", even when theyve seemed close at the end. Its that they werent already up 3 at that time that they didnt win. Sure in each case they had a shot, but it was a shot from behind that didnt pay off. Not because of luck, but because we are bad, and were behind LOL

I think if you're a good team, you arent winning by such thin margins, and magical things dont cost you the win. I think as an NFL team you have to be aiming at winning by two scores to moderate the influence of turnovers and flukes. If your margin for victory is razor thin, then you look unlucky, when whatyou really are is bad, and little things are enough to cost you tenuous wins?

Ill check it out, thank you. I dont usually start draft stuff until after the superbowl, but thats a good place to look.

OK! So instead of rehashing what an awful situation we are in, and how much I want Vrabel lol I thought I'd start a thread about good football. Good coaching, smart plays. So here's an awesome fake punt, and the backstory on how they got there is even better. THAT is coaching!

Oh I didn't mean you were making excuses, I'm speaking just to the evaluation that happens in all of our minds. I'm guarding against myself putting too much faith in the reasons (or excuses) why it isn't really Brown's fault. Because it isn't. But that still doesn't mean he would be excellent if he was HC of the team in August, it just means we cant know either way. And in the hole we are in, that isn't enough in my view. I didnt think you were disagreeing.

so true. and it damns Eberflus even more, because not only did he allow the hail mary, but he was unable to stop the bleeding after and get us back on track. Here's where a guy like Vrabel could help. A fancy offensive gameplan wouldnt make a difference to that kind of locker room momentum - only a head coach who leads men can.

right, thats how I took it too. Maybe in a few months I'll be arguing "this guy is terrible" or "what a value to get that guy so low" but right now theyre just positions to me, and with legendary trade downs (all these draft games let you do that more than is probably likely) you end up with a ton of players at positions of need and it looks really good.

I think Shanahan always had that energy? I dont know much about Siriani. Like I said it doesn't have to be some cartoonish alpha, Shanahan isnt that, but you can see that he isnt begging players to buy in, he's leading. I see films of Johnson where other coaches are condescending to him, teasing him, and he takes a submissive role as an answer. I see films of people teasing Vrabel, and he gets a huge smiles and gives it right back. As for the OC position, if he brings in McDaniels, he's not going anywhere. I just think we are making a mistake thinking we should hire an OC to be OC from the HC position? Johnsons is as good an OC as there is, I totally agree. I'd LOVE to have him as our OC, but HC isnt OC, and i think a lot of people like sportswriters etc are missing that.

I really hope they dont screw this up, or take too long talking about it and lose him to someone else. he really would be a perfect fit for this city. I could see him here for a decade or longer. Like a real team. With a real coach. At this point it's either we go up from here, or total destruction, and becoming basically an expansion team starting from scratch, because Caleb, Jaylon Johnson and others simply aren't gonna sit around for 4 more years of corporate nonsense.