BearFan PHX

First off, no one is using anyone as a whipping boy - thats when you unfairly blame someone. This correct analysis of DJ Moore is fair and deserved. Did you see what JT OSullivan called that play? "F--- You effort" was what he called DJ's lack of caring. When you use someone as a whipping boy that means you have some psychological issue: that youre a bully. So again, noticing DJs faults is not a matter of the person noticing them being mean, or unfair or psychologically deficient. It's because DJ has taken a lot of plays off. Hes been lazy and not reliable. Secondly, GMs around the league see the tape. They dont need posters on this site to tell them what is true about DJ, so the idea that we all need to pretend hes not flawed so its easier to trade him is nuts. its just another way to try to stop people saying anything negative. This is feeling very Justin Fields all over again. Here on a Bears discussion board it really is OK to say one of the players isnt giving a consistent effort. It's not traitorous. Its not a sign of a psychological deficiency. It's just an opinion, widely held by many so called experts too. But most of all, it's on the film. And as for his cap number - this trade scenario was easy to see the moment we drafted Luther Burden. We were talking about this in July - remember? I remember saying that DJ, Kmet and Swift were on the bubble. And so they are. It wasnt dark magic, or a crystal ball. It wasnt someone saying they are smarter than everyone or being mean. It's just there in the contracts and salary cap numbers. Now I gotta admit, Swift has played well. Im not saying that because suddenly Im a psychological lover. Its just because his performance on tape is what it is. Some day he will be replaced, but i think he played himself back on the roster - doing things id really not seen from him before. But Kmet? He didnt play up to his cap number, and Dj surely hasnt either. This isnt about being nice or mean. We have to get past these simplistic and childish ways of looking at player evaluations. The tape and the contracts can and will decide the plan going forward. And if you wanted a culture and accountability - then here's our chance to stand by those words. And anyway, even if we dont, Ben Johnson isnt gonna play games. He knows what time it is.

We spent top draft picks on Williams, Odunze, Loveland, Burden and Wright. No one is dismantling the offense. Those are our core players. Moore, Swift and Kmet were/are all place holders until someone better comes along. None iof them s the kind of stud that those players I listed above can grow to be. If Swift were to suddenly just disappear, replacing him would not be an impossible task. It mostly relies on the run blocking from the OL anyway. But you could find someone to pair with Monangai and be fine. He will probably stick around, he's not getting paid THAT much, but he's not a top 5 back. He's a decent vet. Meanwhile this team is going NOWHERE without a pass rush, and we arent finding a player with the 25th pick that ready to be a league wrecker on day 1. We may well draft DL with our first round pick. I wouldnt be shocked if our first three picks go to defense. But we need a veteran who can reliably pressure the QB from day one if we are going to take Caleb seriously. Every starter on the 1985 team replaced someone who came before them. I'm sure someone was crying about their predecessors, but no one really ever talks about any of them anymore. But they do remember that 85 team. So lets build a winner and stop hanging on to every mid level vet thats ont he roster like theyre gold, and trust Johnson to tell Poles who to get to replace them.

The team that trades for DJ will only have to pay him $16M because we will pay the rest of it, and because they pay that $16M, it will open up $16M on our cap.

This feels a lot like the Justin Fields debate. We are at the point where the offseason is next, and we start discussing the good and bad of the players, and for some people, that's difficult, because they are loyal fans, and so they defend the players as if people were insulting their younger sister or something. And I do get where it comes from - a love of the Bears, on all sides. But in reality, if we want to be winners, we have to make tough choices. When the Patriots made the decision not to re-sign Akeim Hicks, was it because Bill Belichick failed to see the kind of player that was? of course not. Everyone in the league knew that Hicks was a good player. It was a business decision - how to allocate your cap to give your TEAM the best chance. I dont hear anyone saying DJ sucks. I'll bet most of us would be for keeping him if his cap number was $12M. But it isnt, and we need resources elsewhere. Also, no player is perfect. I love Caleb Williams, I can say with confidence that he is the best player on the team. He is easily the bears MVP. I can also say that he will be better 3 years from now than he is right now. So that means he has room to grow, and so does that mean Im slamming Caleb? If I see the good and bad parts of him? I love DJ Moore after the catch. He's like a little running back out there with the ball. But he is often not ont he same page with Williams, and his body language is "goofy" at best and possibly "entitled and over it" like a Jay Cutler at worst. There are times he does great things, but there are many times where he jogs his routes, and gives less than a full effort. It might even be possible to move on from DJ for that reason alone. Ben Johnson doesnt want guys that tell the others it's OK to give less than the maximum effort! Remember when we wanted BJ to change the culture? Well that means accountability. And his heir apparent (who will hopefully exceed anything Dj ever did) is ALREADY on the team in Luther Burden III. He is a DJ Moore clone - he has the same skill set, body type and abilities. Sure he's rougher, but you gotta respect that the coaches will coach him up, and he will ascend. And then there are the salary cap ramifications. That makes it pretty clear that DJ Moore is on the trading block. The team that trades for him will pay him $16M, so he's a good value for them at that number. And you know what? I dunno if he would fetch a 2nd rounder. I would imagine a 3rd or 4th rounder might be more likely. If DJ was part of a trade to the Raiders for Max Crosby for example, I'd expect to give DJ, our 2026 1st rounder, a 2027 second rounder and even that might not be enough in the real world. So it is more than fair to speculate about a trade involving DJ that opens up $16M of cap space for us, and fetches a 3rd rounder in the process. But it is also fair to notice the MANY times DJ has quit on his routes. I'll bet behind the scenes, in private conversations with Poles and Johnson, Caleb is lobbying to move on from Moore. I get the fan love, but if you love the player more than the team, then I think that's not how you win Super Bowls.

Swift is a decent RB, but with no blocking he doesnt do much, and with good blocking he looks great. Most RBs are like that.

Noticing that DJ quits a lot isnt because people have a psychological issue about being too critical. It's because he quits a lot. I remember when I was a hater, but then it turned out that it wasnt a psychological flaw, it was just that Eberflus and Fields suck. And now Im a homer FOR Caleb LOL I must be schizo lol

I gotta agree. It's kind of football 101, maybe 201 , but the main idea is you run away fromt he defender, not on a path that will make you covered. Caleb also had been telling his WRs this same coaching point last week during the packers game. it got caught on camera and audio, and he was saying, if the safety is above you, you gotta flatten out. I think most of these plays have adjustments that payers are coached to make. QBs and WRs have to be on the same page. So is it easy? of course not! But it's what you expect from a guy youre paying that much? If DJ cost $15M, hed be easy to keep, but at $25M its too much in my opinion.

well done, again!

maybe. i remember Bienemy left because he wasnt getting head coach offers because everyone knew Reid was calling the plays. If Bienemy goes to KC, he probably will need a promise that he can call the plays, or that he will get the HC job if/when Reid retires?

So he only threw it out in front of him, if you assume that where the ball landed was the targeted area. it was hands high five yards close to the line of scrimmage, and not as far out in front of him if you can visualize that triangle. DJ ran the wrong route, and should have flattened his route - Caleb said as much in the press conference. Also some pretty damning tweets from Terrell Owens and Kurt Warner say the same. DJ jogged his route when he saw the ball was out of reach, but he ran his route too deep before that, and the ball would have been caught further inside if DJ had run it correctly. DJs a very talented player, but hes been taking plays off all season. I would keep him at $16M a year, but not at $24.5 - hes trade bait for sure.

every year before the draft, teams sign free agents to fill holes so they can go best player available. Some of the Free Agents are big splash signings, some are "vet stop gap" players like you say. But either way, we will sign free agents all across the DL before the draft. You can bet on that, because every team does it every year.

possibly until Trapilo is ready anyway?

Apparently the Bears have been practicing with Thuney at LT and McFadden at LG. Is this how were gonna go? Or maybe this is in case Benedet gets injured?

At this point, with all my goals reached for the season, entering into a playoff game in which we are strongly underdogs, I am putting the analytical part of my brain to the side in regards to these games now. We are underdogs and we are scrappers, and there only 3 games to win. Why not us? Right now, I'm just rooting as a fan. I dont care about the odds. I want to see Sweat and Booker come alive. I dont care about what anyone has done previously in the season - it's time to show up. BEAR freakin DOWN Lets go.

wow, that guy is great. and he doesnt treat us like we dont know what quarters is, he doesnt draw it out, he quickly just makes the point - so quickly that you can remember it and comapre it to other similar situations. Thats a really cool way to look at all of this.

For sure, any defensive scheme requires a pass rush, and any defense is made better when you have one. Of course that's edge rushers and pocket collapsing DTs as well. We can look at our LBs and DBs too. No one is really a core player that youll still have in 4 years (including re-signing), except maybe Booker. Even Byard has an expiration date due to age. Of course we wont be able to replace everyone, but anyone except Booker is a potential casualty or trade bait i think. And I dont think you can count on Booker to be your primary edge either. Hes probably DE3 fighting to become DE2. As to how to acquire these players, we have no cap space right now. We can draft some players, but they wont be ready to dominate out of the box, especially picking 32nd No better than 25th I think? Were gonna need to get some players off of the books to afford Free Agents, so they might as well be trades so you get something else in return too?

I know people are fans, and love our players, but at some point the rah rah stuff has to give way to reality. We are not going anywhere, and we will waste Caleb Williams if the plan is to come back with the same defense again next year and just try harder. Thats not a plan for winning, it's just being in love with the players without considering that other more talented players could be on our roster. And then we could love THOSE guys and win games. This defense is slow and was built as a cover 2 zone team. We need to clean house on the defensive side this offseason, and that is going to require some money.

We need to get back to the run this week. Move the chains, eat clock, leave the Rams offense cold on the bench for 20 minutes at a time, and tire that D line out

I really like DJ Moore - especially the past few weeks. He's been balling out for us. I just know that without a pass rush, we are unlikely to be a real threat for the super bowl. i mean this year might we scratch our way there? its not impossible! Im here for it! But i think its a lot more credible going foward, if this team has a defense. And so I dont pick DJ Moore because hes the worst WR we have. FAR from it. He might be the best. But he's the one with the $24.5M payday. And for that reason ONLY I think he's trade bait And would clear up $16.5M in cap space for us. It's nothing more than that. i think hes a fantastic player. The entire argument is only his cap hit, and how badly the other side of the ball needs that money.

yeah, theyre meatheads. when youre not great youre awful, when youre kinda good, youre amazing. they just over state whatever the common wisdom is, which is usually how many games youve won or lost in the past 5 weeks. Dont believe em when youre down, dont believe em when youre up.

well said. Caleb is a "winner" thats that weird illogical ability to make plays when it matters most. One example i think of is when the guy caught the ball on top of his helmet late in the super bowl, when Eli Manning threw it - thats a winner. Its not logical, and you cant teach it, but when it matters you find a way. Now of course you have to be good regularly too, and the Caleb critics arent wrong. 50% completion isnt gonna cut it. But anyone fairly looking at his season has to conclude that Caleb has gotten much better at playing from the pocket, making throws in rhythm (like the one you mentioned) and you can tell from his body language the game is slowing down for him This is why i say he is special, a winner, elite and still not good. LOL There is no reason to expect that Caleb wont continue to grow in the regular part of his game - it's already night and day from the first 4 weeks of this season. And while he spent this past offseason learning footwork and trying to digest the playbook, next year he will be working on the more subtle things, and I expect a big improvement in doing the regular "good" things. We have a real winner here, and I am so excited for where he will take us. Like you say, we have nothing in Bears history to compare it to, the closest perhaps would be Michael Jordan. He didnt start off perfectly and it took a minute to get past the Pistons. He got his coach with a new fangled triangle offense, and after a time, he was dominant. I think that's what we're in for here. I honestly thought this was possible from his college film. I knew what he still needed to learn, but that stuff is teachable, and being a winner isnt. GO BEARS!

Yeah, I keep saying "Caleb is a winner, he is special and elite, and hes not even good yet."

Amen!