BearFan PHX

It's all been said over and over. The reasons i think what i think are clear, and the stats you're using to bolster your argument are clear too. There's no need to go around in circles so i won't repeat it all again. Time will tell what happens.

Yeah Im not pointing the finger at anyone here, I dont hear anyone here saying he is a true stud, obviously weve had discussions about future trades (or not!) for him, but Im not saying anyone is overstating him. I dont know if I agree he has "good" hands or anything, BUT I was just saying that if Kmet plays well, I totally agree Johnson will know how to use them, and i was even thinking of some of what the Patriots did with Gronkowski and Hernandez when they had them both. So I agree there too. I'm not betting the farm on Kmet, but I don't think it is impossible for him to play well. I just think he would have progressed more by now, so he's kind of topping out, way short of his expectations or contract, but if he DOES mature this offseason, having 2 TEs that can really play will be a fun toy for Johnson for sure. I just think he's gonna have to show quick, this train is leaving the station, and they aren't gonna wait around for the light to come on for Kmet. I always though he had potential, but i think we all agree that so far, he hasn't really lived up to his draft status. I really hope he does! That would be an extra weapon Im not counting on right now, and Johnson would be even scarier with yet another dimension.

OMG YES thank you for saying that. I've been hating that for a while about Caleb, and I also just noticed him NOT doing it in camp clips. Theyre fixing his footwork, eliminating the pat, and working on pouty body language. Only time will tell, but right now i am really glad we got Johnson and not Mike Vrabel. I wanted Vrabel early because I know this team needs discipline, but i gotta say, so far it sure looks like Ben Johnson has brought some. And it's not from rah rah speeches at the press conferences either. No HITS acronyms. or all male disco parties after wins. It's just on the field, in the play to play mechanics, where it's real.

PFF is random. People love it because they do a lot of clear rankings and ratings, and they use numbers, so they are fun and easy to understand an compare. But PFF is nonsense. Now, despite my feelings about what I think Cole Kmet really is, *IF* he was to break out and be a great player, then we might be looking at film of the Patriots when they had Gronkowski and Hernandez for ideas. I'm sure there are a lot of ways to use two great TEs, especially with Moore and Odunze on the outside. So I understand the excitement from those that think Kmet has that kind of skill set. Of course, neither one is Gronkowski, especially Loveland being more of a tall and nifty slot receiver, so the same concepts wouldn't map over 1 to 1, but the matchup problems are obvious, and a true dual TE threat is a real problem for defenses. If Loveland could be a Tony Gonzalez type for us, that alone is gonna be great for Caleb and our offense.

well Bagent was always bad with the long ball, and im not shocked that Keenum is putting touch and leading swing routes like a vet while Caleb is still learning the finer points of touch. That doesnt really concern me too much at this point. I am eager to see this on the field and then start picking it apart, or praising it, or both.

Yeah and I didn't dig - I mean if I'd have even read the amount ($37.5M!) I'd have choked right there and known something was wrong.

You know what Stinger? I think you're right. I saw the story a few weeks ago, from several sources, but not any sources i really knew. And today i just googled it and pasted it without really reading it. I re-reading, there is NO WAY we signed Bagent for $18M a year for 2 years! And as I looked futher, no reputable sources had it. So I guess it's internet bullshit, and I have no problem saying you were right and I was wrong about this. I had seen some opinion pieces in reputable places that said he would be in line for an extension, so when I saw the fake story, I just thought it was true - it wasnt particularly interesting, so i didnt dig into to it - but I should have. But 2 years $37.5M?? LOL no way. So, I full admit you were right and I was wrong about this one.

https://sportfigur.com/2025/05/09/tyson-bagent-signs-two-year-37-5-million-contract-extension-with-chicago-bears/

And the NFL is reworking some of the race based policies too i think, so I hope we will still get those picks when Cunningham gets a GM job.

something is up - I dunno what it is, but yes something...

Yes, I JUST wrote "And of course Ersery was on my radar and Trapilo wasnt, so it was a surpise for me, but Im willing to say that was a good trade."

no its not the original contract anymore - they extended it, which means a new longer deal.

they extended Bagents contract.

I actually think they KIND OF can, and that we did a good job of that. We targeted tradedowns, and the teams that took the players before us traded up into those spots, and that's where we were potentially a little too greedy? So we might have correctly predicted the teams on the board, but not considered people trading ahead of us.

right, Im talking about the tradedowns after that. 3rd round and later. I would have taken Ersery at 41, but if Trapilo works out, then that trade down was fantastic, and Turner (is that who you meant instead of Stewart?) is going to be great for us. So that trade down worked out OK *IF* Trapilo is good. And of course Ersery was on my radar and Trapilo wasnt, so it was a surpise for me, but Im willing to say that was a good trade. Im talking about after that, when we let HBs go, traded down, and then saw them stolen right before we picked - I think that happened twice? Like we were going down our HB list, and kept getting played. The question was more like KJ or Sketebo vs Rah the CB and someone else from the 5th round.

that all makes sense. i think they Bears might toy with the idea of converting him to a coach if circumstances force it, like an injury like you say, or a good crop of developing young players.

true. the 3rd emergency QB doesnt count against the gameday 47 or 48 or whatever that number is. But if that costs us one of our drafted guys getting poached off of the practice squad, then all the more reason to have taken a HB earlier and not trade down?

Im talking about in the 3rd round and later - our trade backs. There was an interview with Jeff King, which i cant find now, where he acknowledged that they were hoping for other HBs earlier; Kaleb Johnson, Cam Sketbo and one other guy I forget. There have also been a ton of articles suspecting the same. It seems like, more than once, we targeted a HB and traded back only to have someone pop up in front of us and take one of those HBs within a few picks of our new traded back picks. From all of this, I conclude that Pace read the board as afar as who needed what, and maximized value by trading back, but failed to calculate other teams trading in front of us to snag that HB. Also, just logically, would you rather have Kaleb Johnson or Cam Skatebo vs. our extra later picks that we got in those tradedowns?

Here's an interesting idea. Im not saying it will happen, but it has occurred to me. Given these facts: Case Keenum has said in interviews that he had planned to retire before this offseason, and then he met with Ben Johnson, and that turned him around. Keenum's primary role on this team is to mentor Caleb. We just paid Tyson Bagent, extending his contract. Roster spots are precious. Is it possible that Keenum will transition from player to coach when we cut down the roster? I could see him as Caleb's mentor, and he doesnt need to be a player to do that. Just thinking about stuff. Not saying i know it will happen, but it does fit the facts, and open a roster spot on the 53?

Yes, I am talking about the HBs. In multiple cases, we could have taken a HB we coveted, but instead traded down, betting they would still be there, and in each case, they miscalculated. I've also said that if Trapilo starts and does well, and Monangai is a good contributor, then it all ended well anyway. That's true. But it doesn't change that Poles also misread the board multiple times. If you have 30 lottery tickets, and you trade them for 1 lottery ticket, that is a mistake, EVEN IF the one you got turns out to be the winner in the end. Unless you had some inside info that your ticket had a batter chance to win, it was a mistake. The conversation with Jeff King was about missing on HBs. So unless we had Monongai rated higher than Kaleb Johnson, Cam Skatebo, and there was one other I'm forgetting, it was a series of mistakes. And that doesnt mean that the players we DID get wont be good. We could have done a great job of identifying late round talent, and having a board deep enough to withstand these mistakes too. We could have a great board, and misplayed draft day, both. But if I'm gonna praise Poles for drafting Odunze, for example, then I can criticize him for misjudging how far he could trade down to get HBs too.

again, most of what im talking about is the trade downs, and whether we got the player we expected to get when we made the trade. i think we didnt, and so we miscalculated in our trade downs throughout the draft. And I think that's a problem. Its OK to see positive and negative things in your team.

I think when there is a negative media story, and you want to get ahead of it, you WANT that hard question, because it gives you the chance to say your side of it? From the reporter's point of view, he's hoping Caleb says something definitive, so he can write his story with quotes "I am my own man, my dad doesnt speak for me" etc It's like when reporters ask "how did it feel scoring the winning TD?" It's not because the reporter is wondering whether the player was sad or happy lol everyone knows the player is thrilled - it's to generate a quote for the article "Winning means everything to me" or whatever. AZ54 - completely agree with your take on it.

yeah its obvious that BJ was thrilled with Loveland. On that day I said i suspected he knew he ought to get a LT, but wanted the TE instead, when Loveland was the guy, he was overjoyed, not having to do the boring conservative thing, but to add firepower. But mostly, despite the only quotes i had happened to find, i was more talking about about whether we traded back too far and missed HBs we wanted with those tradebacks, and that it happened more than once. Probably Kaleb Johnson and Cam Skatebo. Now I cant say Im unhappy with Kyle Monangai either. And if Trapilo ends up starting, and Monangai ends up a big contributor, then im gonna say our board was pretty smart and deep. But none of that says that Poles didnt miscalculate the trade downs either?

Yeah I am not finding it at all - which is weird. I know it happened on April 26th, the last day of the draft, after it was all over, and I know it was CC at Halas Hall with Jeff King. I remember they were standing. I remember first seeing it in a vertical clip on youtube. I remember being surprised that Jeff King was so forthcoming about getting played on the trade downs. He used softer terms, but he admitted targeting several HBs and seeing them go before they picked after tradebacks. I think it might have been a remote for ESPN? Ive used google filters to limit to the day, and with those names, it should come right up. Possibly the Bears asked to have that removed because of what it said? i remember at the time I thought "holy crap thats a headline!" but it was just in the conversation and didnt get focus at the time. Just kind of "oh ok, thats what happened" Later, in the TTNL clip I posted above, a few days later, she spoke authoritatively about it. If you look at her twitter from the 24th to the 26th you see she gets a lot of quotes from underlings - scouts, asst directors of scouting etc. So she was in the building at Halas Hall talking to people on those days. Both covering press conferences, and getting quotes from people like Jeff King. She also still has tweets up with other quotes from Jeff King, so we know she interviewed him then too. Crazy that it's missing, unless the bears requested it to come down?

I havent found it yet - it was from Halas Hall, with Jeff King, who was standing to the left of CC from our perspective (CC's right) I remember the setup very clearly. Ill keep looking. In the meanwhile, here is CC saying it without attributing it. She says it in a definite way, so shes not expressing a guess. She had already said these were facts in the video Im not finding, but at least you can hear her say it with some authority. Go to 50:30