BearFan PHX

I have to disagree on that one, Odunze throttled down, to settle into the zone, but the zone was even wider if he had continued across and gained depth. Had Odunze been there, the ball would have been fine for a nice throw. Settling down into a zone isnt a bad thing, and continuing across and up is a great thing to do too. Caleb has to throw long before Odunze's final position can be known from what you see, with anticipation, so it's a matter of what the team is preaching, and what the anticipation rules are. Clearly, by Caleb showing "go deeper and across" with his hands to Odunze, Caleb was convinced that was the right answer. Maybe he was wrong, but usually it's what the QB wants that is the right answer? It's gonna be one of those things that is clearer in the all 22 film later in the week I think. I'm personally convinced that was on Odunze.

I think that was a case of Odunze not working up and across the field. Not on Caleb.

Glad to see Dexter out there.

That's how i see it too - those are the two scenarios, and the associated questions that go along with each of them. And does Johnson have what it takes to lead as a Head Coach.

A guy like Pete Carroll will know how to run an offense. He wont be giving the ball to a converted offensive lineman at the goalline in a critical moment - he will know to give it to our power back to run in, and not fool around, with, say a slant pass or something. LOL Its a cheap shot, just a joke

Ha!

Merry Christmas everyone!

yup

Im starting to think we havent been a very good franchise LOL

maybe 31 - 14 but yeah this is sure looking like it.

If that scandal didnt exist, Id fully agree about Gruden. And you said it well about commanding a room. And the scandal doesnt really bother me, but I don't know how it plays with each player, many of whom have chosen to put "stop hate" on their helmets. But im not even saying I know what theyd think. I just dont know how to value it for each player at all. I also really hope we get it right, and i am less interested in having called it correctly than I am in Caleb becoming an all time great QB. If that happens with any of these guys, i will be ecstatic!

I see that too. I dont see him as uncomfortable or insecure, the way Thomas Brown is in press conferences. I just see him as an assistant type. Same as Kevin OConnell, I agree. At some point soon we will all have said what we think and there will be no point in debating it further. I dont want to sound like a broken record, and I dont have any proof of anything, so it's just a gut call. I do absolutely recognize Johnson's offensive scheme skills. If we could have him as OC, I'd do it in a heartbeat, so I get it. And if he can do that for us, it will be great. If we hire any of these guys, I'm gonna be all in, and hope for the positive traits to win out. I just personally cant help but to think that this team needs a strong identity and not just a big brain. I feel like the Bears need a chip on their shoulder so I prefer Vrabel. If we do go with Vrabel, then Im gonna want a guy very much like Johnson for OC, and it'll matter a lot who it is.

Vrabel obviously has a commanding physical presence, but as you say that isnt necessary. Leadership is. I see guys like McVey and Shanahan who are not physically imposing, but their chests speak dominance. Not that they are muscular, just their body language, to me, looks like a leader. Your example of OConnell is a good one. I agree he doesnt have the thing I'm talking about, but his team has been successful. I don't think they've beaten many good teams, but we almost beat them a few weeks ago. But Im not gonna try to argue that the Vikings arent really that good, no matter how you get to 13-2, it's still good of course. I wouldnt trust a guy like that to lead the Bears. But I agree you made a good point with him as an example. I dunno how long it will last, but at 13-2 you have the right to claim that example until they falter, and I cant prove they ever will. I just think in general those kind of guys cant keep the team together if they hit adversity?

I don't feel it at all - it's all good we just disagree about it. To me he feels corporate and assistant-ish, deferential. Confident, but because of his title, not like shines from inside confidence. And again, it's cool if we read him differently. I don't want to turn this discussion over the next months into anyone checking any one else's man card or ability to read strength or anything like that. I respect you, Mongo, and I respect most on this board as grown men, so this subject could be dicey. I look at this, and it feels different.

lets go Carolina! and as always, love the ongoing analysis - better than you get anywhere else on the web.

It seems to me to be a choice between 1) a guy who has great offensive schemes but is an unknown as a head coach and 2) a guy who is a strong head coach, but is an unknown as far as who the OC would be. Either way there is some unknown involved. I also agree that building Caleb is the #1 priority, but I'm not sure that's just about being super creative with offensive wrinkles. To me it'll be more about protecting him, demanding full effort from WRs, establishing a run game, creating a winning culture for the team, and building Caleb as a man and player to some extent. I think to think of Vrabel like Eberflus (when we hired him) - just a defensive guy who hopefully will build a culture is selling Vrabel short. I think he knows a lot about offense, and specifically about blocking technique, how to run polished routes, how to establish run blocking rules etc. I think he knows football from the field, rather than the sideline, and can get the best performances out of players by demanding accountability and by teaching physical technique. I've seen plenty of film on Vrabel working with offensive players on the practice field, and he fully understands each position down to the small body cues and leverages.

I get it - Harbaugh is a pain in the ass, but he is a hard ass that demands accountability too. I can understand passing on him specifically, but I'd like to get someone similar.

I cant remember shit anymore, but I can still spell Wojciechowski LOL

this is a good point. and a head coach who has been a successful player is a plus too.

I agree. If I thought that would be Vrabel's production here i wouldn't be supporting him. But we disagree on what Vrabel would do with this team. And that's OK. I still want Vrabel over a first time HC who is an Xs and Os guy but lacks that spark of leadership. We should have grabbed Harbaugh. If Warren didnt get along with him, we could have easily replaced Warren instead.

when you said Foster, you mean Johnson I assume. I make those kind of typo things all the time too. any decision has risk of course. and whoever we hire I'm gonna root hard for them. But yes, I think we need someone to set the culture right, and not just bring in Xs and Os. We need that too, but thats really the OCs job.

Vrabel got fired because his GM picked bad QBs, and got fired. Your stats show that. Also Vrabel will not be the OC. He will be the HC. You can argue that you like Johnson better, but you cant really say that Vrabel is a bad head coach, it's just not true.

I dont think they will bring back Jenkins as a starter. I think we need four new starters on the OL, with at least 2 of them being rookies.

exactly, and thats what i worry about. That someone uses this when he stumbles in some way - like loses a few games for example?