AZ54

If his agent brings those stats to the table all he is doing is clearly showing Cutler doesn't belong, unless you consider him to be worth what Eli is being paid. Eli is having a bad year (again) but he has two Superbowl rings. Right after that is discussed Emery is going to slide McCown's salary and stats across the table and say here is what I can get for a #2 QB salary. It appears both sides want a deal done I have no idea what value but I believe Cutler will accept some significant incentives in the deal.

Doesn't look all that favorable to Cutler IMO. I'd say that data likely puts him back near the top 10 as in 10th. Could be lower depending on which stat you look at such as redone INTs. Could be higher They made their comparison based on salaries but we have to compare to all QBs and include guys like Russell Wilson, Kap, and even Carson Palmer. It's going to be interesting to see where we end up on this one.

The market backed up your sentiments of Urlacher's ability (one I agreed with) when he was offered no contracts besides the Bears. I also think Tillman has another season or two left in him and the market would prove that by him getting offers from other teams. I just don't think he'll command a lot of money and hopefully he's a Bear next year.

I too was LMAO at the Defense comments. The read between the lines translation is "we're so bad at D we can't afford any risk on offense". In reality any INTs do not matter as our D was giving up a scoring drive no matter where the opponents started. I hope this changes with Briggs back on the field this week and Ratliff is playing well. He's already the best player on our Dline.

Right now the rankings show McCown ranked #1 in total QBR. Cutler is ranked #7 and ahead of Tom Brady who is #11. Like any "stat" in the NFL context is important because I have no about which QB among those 3 anyone in the league would take first. Yet the point is valid about Cutler being ranked top 10 this year. http://espn.go.com/nfl/qbr/_/type/player-week

We need pass rush help either at DE or DT.

Is there a QB controversy in Green Bay now?

For a decade or more we have sat and watched bad offensive play on this team even as the NFL rules allowed for improved offense. In one season we hire a new HC who turns what has been crap into #7 in yds/gm and #2 in pts/gm. If the guy who did that says Cutler is our best QB I don't see a reason not to trust him. Reading a headline in one of the Chicago papers about how Trestman was sticking his neck out by putting Cutler back in as our starter made me laugh. I understand all the points about McCown and I"m glad he's gotten us 3 wins and I also remember his 2 losses. I won't belabor those points anymore. I lean toward Cutler being the better player...not perfect but better. I like the points in this article linked by BT and agree that our best move going forward is to keep both and build the D. That's the future. Right now, I trust the guy who built this offense to tell me who the best QB is.

Found this highlight clip someone put together on the top DTs for the draft. So as we head to bowl season here's some names to watch for. This was put together before the college season started but still worthwhile. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ymLcqEQKYI

I only watched him play one game against Auburn and my issue with Franklin is that he's just a one-read and run QB. These guys usually flame out in the NFL. The last big name player like this was Cam Newton and although he had a good rookie campaign he is still learning the game. I do like Franklin's physical tools though and if Trestman feels he can learn the offense then he'd be a good 7th Rd pick.

In the midst of all this "Josh is great" discussion we need to keep in mind just how awful the Cowboy's defense is. Everyone has lit them up just like everyone runs all over our defense and has a career day. I'm sure all those RBs would love to sign their next contract the day after they played the Bears. It's great we rolled over the Cowboys 32nd ranked defense but we also couldn't move the ball well against Minnesota's 31st ranked defense. The Rams 19th ranked defense looked pretty good against us too and I watched what the Cardinals mediocre offense just did to them. I think the last game was McCown's best since he's been our starter. It was good to finally see less of the WR screens and us throwing more downfield. It worked well but there were several throws that should have, or would have, been INTs (even leaving out the Def Holding against Marshall) if Dallas' DBs could catch. The Cowboys also made Michael Bush look like a good backup RB and we know he's not. That's not to put McCown in the same category of Bush's play, he's not there by any means. No different than the Rams weren't putting Zach Stacy in the elite category of RBs after his game against us.

Slap the tag on Cutler, we have tons of cap room. Yes, we have tons of positions that need to be filled out but we shouldn't let Cutler go with no compensation even if it ends up being a simple 3rd or 4th Rd pick I'll take it. To make all this work we need to get him back on the field as our starter, if we go with McCown the rest of the season then it's clear to all we won't re-sign Cutler. Despite looking good against the league's worst defense I'm still not that enamored with McCown as our long term starter but I love him as our backup.

Bush needs to go after the season. He has no burst, no power, and he used to have some shiftiness to him but that's gone too. He is at least better in pass protection than Ford so he stays through the end of the season.

It is inevitable. Bad teams need to find good players and Cutler, at least as a short term fix at QB is a pretty good option.

When I talk with Cowboy fans they pretty much say the same thing about their D coaches....I wish we had "......" I'm not ready to throw in the towel on Tucker. We will see what happens in the next couple games with Ratliff and Paea back on the field. Then Briggs will be back next week and that will help dramatically because 1) it gets Greene off the field and 2) he will be making the play calls better and that will also help Bostic. I am very unimpressed with Decammilis. His demise started when he talked about how great Hester was as a returner on tape in 2012. I hoped Hester would return to his productive ways and some aspects he has but he's nowhere near what he used to be and it shows with each fair catch he makes when players are still 10 yards away from him. Beyond that Decamillis has often had a group that was unprepared (see missed blocks on FGs).

By the way, TD you did a great job putting those stats together.

McCown in his own words really gets it now. I'm paraphrasing of course but the guy admits how much he has changed with his understanding of the game. Jay Cutler hasn't had that moment yet but I think he's getting close to it because his approach the last couple seasons with his teammates has improved. This season he's been even better helping McCown while we he sits on the sideline. Part of the reason I think Cutler is close is that he sees what a high school football coach is capable of while running this offense. When he hits that moment I want him to be a Bear. As I've said before, I'm on board with a contract in the 13-14mil/yr range.

Where exactly did I "crush" Emery? Emery in the past has stated he does not want any negotiations discussed in public. Not that he was discussing negotiations directly but I believe those statements indicate in his heart he does not feel Cutler is worth the $16mil cap hit. Nor do I. I still want to keep Cutler for a reasonable top 15 QB deal, maybe somewhere around top 10 money, because I believe we can win a Superbowl with him. I actually think Emery is being a bit smart here by saying we don't want to tag you because, as Grizz just stated, we have a lot of good things going on offense right now. Jay knows that, and everyone else in the league knows that now too. We have a young WR in Marquess Wilson that was a potential 1-2nd Rd pick playing sparingly now but if he develops as expected next season he could make this one very dangerous trio of WRs...plus Matt Forte. There's a nice 2-3 year outlook on our offense right now. So Emery states we want Jay to be a part of this long term not just for one year. Does Jay want to be a part of this? For his part I think Cutler was insinuating a similar sentiment when he said he didn't mind if he was given the franchise tag for a year. None of this truly tells us where either party thinks the value is but recent statements make me think they might not be too far apart. Time will tell but one things is certain: Cutler's next contract is the biggest part of the puzzle going forward and it would be great if they could agree to terms early in the offseason so Emery can get cracking on fixing this defense.

Emery just set aside the use of the franchise tag for Cutler. http://www.suntimes.com/sports/football/be...jay-cutler.html Although he clarifies his position based on the need to spread out the cap hit over years, in essence he also gave away that he does not feel Cutler's value is worth that much money.

Regarding his drafting: I believe his evaluation was based on the draft picks of SMC, the 3rd Rd safety who got cut this season (so bad can't recall his name), Greene and Bostic so far have had a couple moments but far more often are lost on the field and take bad angles. I believe both will learn and they are in a bad spot behind off-the-street DTs and DEs who are making the same mistakes. I think Washington will develop into a solid player for us but like Wotton it will take a couple seasons and his ceiling is much higher if the light ever goes on for him. Isaiah Frey has turned out to be a good player for us. That's all projection, right now I think it is fair to say Emery has not hit on a standout defensive player. In FA I think he did well with Anderson who looked much better before all the injuries and rookies hit the field. I like the Ratliff signing as well even though it was a gamble we haven't seen payoff yet I think he was much better in his 20 snaps than the no-names we've had at DT the last month. Still he hasn't had the opportunity yet to make a big splash in FA on D so we will have to sit back and see what we do this offseason.

Trestman is guilty of putting too much faith in his players. At times it has worked out such as the 4th and 1 against the Packers or today with back-to-back deep passes to a covered Alshon Jeffrey - one missed, one was a great TD catch. Other times his faith does not pan out as it has on a 4th-and-goal plays, or today's 2nd down FG attempt by Gould. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt, it's his rookie season and mistakes will be made. He seems like a guy who can reflect and study things in retrospect so I will hope that happens in the offseason and next year some of these gambles are less frequent or at better situations in the game. For now he's still my guy because we have an offense. I believe Emery will get the defense righted this offseason, at least back to a respectable level. Now I want to head over to an old thread to see how full the Josh McCown bandwagon is.

While that would be nice to see I don't think Ratliff is in game shape well enough to handle 50% of the snaps, probably around 30%. That means Cohen is going to get a fair amount of playing time but if that keeps the 4th and/or 5th guy off the field and gets Wootton back to some snaps at DE we will be in better shape.

I don't think we are as far off as coaches and Emery have made us to be from having the right personnel for a 3-4 Defense. Change the focus of the offseason (and Emery will never let on we're doing this) and all you need to add to the front 7 is a big NT and a big run stuffing MLB. We can keep Bostic inside next to the new guy and put Briggs/Greene off into space on the outside. Use SMC, Bass, Washington (fast enough to play LB) as rush outside LBs. I'm not sure Bass couldn't project as our inside MLB but that's a significant change for him. I think Wootton can play well as a DE in a 3-4 especially with what we've seen of him lately at DT. Some combination of Paea and Melton at DE also works. Ratliff, if we should keep him, has played NT in the 3-4. In the draft we need to add one more NT and another MLB.

I haven't posted in this thread because I initially felt it was a bit early to compare anything McCown had done to what Cutler had done. Defenses need to see McCown's tendencies in the new offense and make their adjustments before we get a true sense of what he can do. I do not see McCown as a starter. Period. (Or is that two periods?) He does not have a strong enough arm to threaten the defense over the top. Never more obvious than his incomplete deep pass that was 10 yards short in the Rams game. With Trestman's offense that isn't a killer as it might be say with Bruce Arians' offense. I agree that McCown has run this offense better in some ways than what Cutler was doing. Flying by the seat of my pants as usual.... I prefer Cutler in the redzone on fades and back shoulder throws. No data to back that up just like how Cutler fits the ball into a tight space better and his passes, even on fades, are more linear (i.e. faster throws rather than lobs) making it harder for a defender to adjust to the ball. Between the 20s I like McCown as he seems to take the proper early read more often. However, I do not like all the WR screens we've been running with McCown in there. I feel these screens are getting less and less effective as teams play closer to the LOS realizing we don't go deep as often, or as well as we did with Cutler in there. Can Cutler learn from watching some of this? One point I haven't seen in this debate has been the offense and Oline as they learned the new scheme. Games like New Orleans were the Oline was clueless about who to block for much of the game come to mind. That gets pinned on Cutler's performance. By the time McCown entered the scene the Oline and WRs were more settled in the offense. Preference 1) Keep Cutler for around $14mil/yr ideally a 5 year deal that gives us a way out after 3 seasons. Plenty of time to draft and groom a replacement if needed, and if he's playing lights out by then we can keep him and pay him some big $$ on a backloaded deal in the last couple years. If that happens he'll have earned it. If we can't get him to agree to a reasonable starters salary then I prefer to keep Cutler for at least one more season under the franchise tag. Draft an early round QB...don't care which round either. If the guy Trestman likes is there in Rd 1 make it happen or if nobody stands out take whoever drops to us in the 2nd or 3rd Rd. I'm not opposed to the idea of franchising Cutler and trading him if we get the right compensation. I'm not pushing for that to happen but if the club feels we get fair value and the right guy is there for us in the draft then do it. McCown IMO is the perfect caretaker while the young gun learns the ropes because he can win games in the first part of the season and he will help the new guy learn the offense. Let the new guy takeover mid-season and we're off. If the team has determined Cutler is not our guy for the future there is zero reason to simply let him walk. Any QB with his mid-level starter talent has a lot of value in this league. Before his injury we averaged 28pts per game and there are always a few teams that will trade for that kind of production. P.S. As I looked up team scoring stats I'm surprised to see us ranked 4th right behind New Orleans, and ahead of the Cowboys, Patriots, and Lions. Granted we've had 4 INT returned for TD in there but we also have the #1 WR duo, something that teams will consider when evaluating Cutler or McCown.

We have Washington on the roster. I like his athleticism and he has the size to handle the run game just needs to develop. Very disappointing that we had to bring in Bass and now Cheta is ahead of him.