Alaskan Grizzly

In the spirit of some of the discussions here regarding whether McCown can 'carry the team' (long term - this season) or otherwise. McCown and the playoffs? So if I understand it, the burden is more on Trestman at this point than McCown to produce. Again, the 'operator vs scheme' discussion.

Fair enough. I actually like your anaology better. Especially given the "off" comment. Think of it as a clogged carb type of off.

Lucky, as before its been a pleasure. To see you flummoxed because of a little adversity always humors me. I was all set to continue the back and forth and discuss the rationale of our opposite views, but since "you are done with me". So be it.

First I would like to say how thrilled I am at seeing Jason egging you on. That makes my day. Anyhow, you really don't support your arguement because I was discussing the injury (pulled groin) in particular with this particular player. The history of other players with this injury, even as of late, has proven difficult to rebound from. Throw in the fact that Cutler is 30, has been 'abused' and considered "mobile" could all correlate to him not being the same as he was before. I appreciate that all these other illustrious QB's suffered their varied maladies but that isn't pertinent to the discussion here. The common head cold will affect you and I differrently and assuming we did the same job, perhaps affect how we performed in that job. If you have the flu and I rhumatoid arthritis, again our performances would be affected differently. For the sake of this discussion I am speaking specifically to this injury, that is the point. Emphasis on the bold: Yet Cutler has a HISTORY of concussions. In some cases moreso than do several RB's, TE's and other players. As far as concern in signing Marshall or Jefferies, not part of this discussion and totally different subject. Stay focused. You almost support my point of our earlier discussion by bringing these statements to light. I wouldn't go as far as categorizing it as "criminal" but whatever floats your boat. Ironically, Jason and I have disussed many a times on whether the Oline was deficient in protection or was it Cutler's need for being mobile that caused him to be hit so much. I said that he has always been a mobile QB (Vanderbilt, Denver and Chicago). His point; the oline was always garbage. I will say Cutler has talent, there is no devaluing that. Unfortunately I think time is now his enemy. Oddly enough this very thing (line rating) was discussed in another thread. And from my recollection, the current line didn't fare well. And there is a discussion that the current line is progressively backsliding, to which I would agree. But again, not the point of this discussion. Cutler is regressing. Or at least times he is. Two games this year he had mutliple turnovers (I think at least three minimum). In those two games, against Minnesota and NO(?) two of those turonvers resulted in direct points. The other turnovers were interceptions where in most instances the teams have been inept to convert the turnover to points. But the fact that Cutler continues to have these "Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde" games make him unpredicitable and unstable to stake long term trust in. That paired with what is clearly a history of injury, could result in his not returning.

As I suspected, you didn't answer my question. Too much hypothesis on my part and the situation at hand. All the rest of your answer is fluff because I won't argue the point that he is a BACK UP QB. I never said he is a starting QB, although he will be when the Bears play next against the Packers. But he's not a true starter....again, I will agree this point. I also never said that I think the team should invest in him as the starter, your words...not mine. The bolded above, are your words. Don't know that I've seen anyone here say what you suggested. I know I didn't. Again though, the fact is he is now the starter.

The injury history HAS to be considered. He is 30 years old and just suffered a relatively significant injury. An injury to other players that has proven debilitating. Maybe not to the point of being an invalid but less capable in their profession. Concussion history is what it is. Cutler has a history, one more hit to the noggin could be the calling card for his career. Some of his other injuries; finger, knee etc by themselves are not factors. But they do add up. And you're right, he has taken a pretty good lickin since playing in Chicago. But what has that done to his overall health? If he pulls an Adrian Peterson-esque return then history (and i) will be flat wrong. And to be frank, id be happy to in this case. Lastly and in regards to his skills. Plain and simple, he's degraded. I dont necessarily agree with the thought of his gradual progression this year. He's turned over the ball a few times in critical moments. A few of them resulting in direct scores for the opposition. That is a problem. He's never been a "Ferrari" per se but more like an Accord with the upper end trim line.

What say you IF McCown has as much if not better success for the time he fills in?

Wow, if that doesn't take me back. I might have had one or two of these, right next to my Princess Leia (with the buns on the side of her head) pic. A few observations. I was just doing the "ickey shuffle" for my kids the other day to demonstrate a TD dance that even I could do. "The Bermuda Triangle" - really? Why are Otis, Mike and Wilbur all in their pajamas? Man, Randall Cunnigham was more magical than was Majikowski. Talk about an escape artist. THE NIGERIAN NIGHTMARE!!! I love me some heavy hitting and Okoye did that. I did have the "Chicago Vice" poster. "Bo knows football, Bo knows baseball" Bo knows dislocated hip. Ouch. Is that a cocaine cloud in LT's poster? The Land of Boz....'nuff said. Ronnie Lott...see the Okoye comment. Awesome and wicked.

Exactly right.... "that's why they play the game.".

First thought and in response to bold. I don't think the team would have won every game if Cutler continued as starting QB. So really what is the difference? To analyze that we need to ask the question you posed. What really is the back up QB's job? The answer is what exactly do what McCown did. Put our team in a position to win the game...offensively. Unfortuantely our defense wasn't able to hold up its end of the deal...hence why our team lost by 3 pts. Not because of what McCown DIDN'T do, but beause of what the D didn't do. Remember, before the final drive by Washington our team was ahead by 4. The other part to consider is if they are not a back up QB, they are starting somewhere else or out of the league. McCown is better than our previous and recent back up situations mostly due to the cast that surrounds him. Hanie and Campbell did not have the combinations of Marshall, Jeffery, M. Bennet and Forte along with the Oline that has been constructed. As another here pointed out, if McCown can come in and produce as quickly as he did, with limited reps and playing time, then its the operator not the scheme that is the problem. And one last point I'd like to address. There has been much discussion about "tape on McCown" and how teams will have an opportunity to prepare for him and blunt his performance. I think we need to remember that there is already evidence out there, he's been in the league for 11 years and played for 5 other NFL teams. The 'tape' is already out there.

"Crazy". But not really a bad idea. Cousins is a better player than where he was drafted at. It's almost like Washington has two starting QB's...just with different skills sets.

I like most of what you laid out here but the question regarding the bolded area. With both Melton and Collins presumably returning from ACL injuries, is there a risk to signing both back? Chances are they won't have issues but you're talking about two sizable dudes that are in the trenches needing mass leverage. I fear one or both will have another blow out.

Doesn't the team have to make room for Palmer and I suspect another player they'll need to cover for Briggs' loss?

Yes Costanzo was. He looked and played horrible. The one play that Greene was out, to relieve Costanzo for some unkown malady, he committed a penalty. But from what I saw (taking into account his preseason play) he (Greene) will probably be the better option. This bye couldn't of had come at a better time. Will give the team some prepartion time to learn play calls (McCown and Bostic) a few others to heal (Peanut) and others to learn their roles (Palmer, Greene...etc). And next on the sched....Green Bay on a Monday night. Sheesh.

Before we start collectively breathing a sigh of relief, think we need to see what the report says and really what it means. As you have probably seen from a few comments here and there, this (groin tear) is not an injury you simply are back in the game after the 'recommend' heal time. Sometimes recovering from such an injury depends on many factors; to include history of this injury, grade of tear (minor, incomplete or complete) and possibility of replicating the injury. As pointed out in this article Groin Injuries in Athletes sometimes athletes are able to return to their playing abilty after "4-8 weeks" for "acute musculotendinous strain" or as long as "six months for chronic strains." The article continues to say that a larger number of players "...were able to return to their sport after an eight- to 12-week active training program". Now all that being said and conventional wisdom being what it is, they said that after two-three concussions the athlete should consider not playing anymore. Yet Cutler is still playing. Problem here is that this injury affects mobility more than anything else. The other issue that needs to be noted is that Briggs is out for six weeks. What condition will the team be in come six weeks from now? Will it be worthwhile for Cutler to hurry himself back to play or just call it a year and accept the fact that either he won't be a Bear next year or need to be Franchise tagged?

As I said in the game thread; Cutler is done in Chicago. The offense that Trestman is using plays more to McCowns style... That being conservative. Cutler is a big play type of guy with much risk and way too hot and cold. Before the injury today, he was anemic at best. The team will need to address defense probably before anything else. Some would say "draft a QB and let Trestman groom him" but I still say that remains to be seen. McCown, I think, can be a good caretaker (ala Orton) this year and possibly still make the playoffs. Again as I mentioned previous, you still have Marshall, Bennett and Forte playing for the team. O

Agreed. McCown played smart and has a tendency to do that. All he needs are good players; Marshall, Bennett and Forte and he'll turn out fine. My next "bold" prediction; Cutler is done in Chicago.

Uhm they've only played 7 games this year. When I said it, it was after someone (probably you) said Hester was "done". And how about that McCown? What did you say about him?

Since Peanut can't seem to stay on the field and is losing his cover ability, maybe the time for the move to safety is now?

Yeah I think WCO plays more to the conservative approach. Which is not Cutlers style. McCown showed the team is not that bad off with Cutler out. He's not nearly the risk taker Jay is.

Bet its a groin.

And just like I said earlier this year "Devin Hester will return one this year". Take THAT to the bank!

Good thing the Bears are going to wait until next year and draft a player they can groom and not sign someone this year.

Not yet. But I didn't say that either.

And to play my own 'adversary', I've been reading that some are glad he's gone. But can't argue against success in KC. FWIW I'm cool with the idea of the team drafting for a successor IF they address more pressing needs (where have we heard that before?), IF they find the right guy and IF Trestman proves to be what everyone expects him to be.