Mongo3451

Yes, OL is the safest bet for 1st round picks. I believe the stat is 68% become starters.

Not a stock analist by any means: but I can say I'd love to average 9% in the market. I do, however, think that NFL teams have a much easier time predicting future income than any corporation I can think of. The TV contracts make up such a huge portion of the pot that the smaller pieces don't sway the overall percentage as much as Auto, Retail and Pharma. It's like they have a crystal ball for the most part. I've been loving this conversation looking from the outside. Keep up the good debate!

I agree the D sould take most of the heat. I was actually impressed with the O the first half of the season. Then the wheels fell off. I think the combination of Orton's injury and opposing defenses figuring out that our OL the patchwork at best lead to teams gameplanning better against us. I actually have some hope for the O again this season. I just need to see an upgrade at OL and WR to gain real faith / hope that we won't regress. The D better step up, period. I'm still mad at that mess.

The topic is: "Should We Just Trade for Holt?" Anyway, he's not a Prima Donna. He will suit up for any team that he feels can win. If he goes to free agency, he will get to pick and choose, not if we trade for him.

I think both are out of the question. However, it was reported that Cutler's meeting with the new HC didn't go as well as planned.

I'm struggling with this one. I think he would have great value. But how would it affect the future, Williams in particular. How do you bring in Pace and not give him a chance to win the position of LT? My overall feeling is that we should strongly upgrade our OL weather it be from the draft or FA. My preference for now would be to sign Barnes and draft a day one stud OL.

I would much rather have Barnes than St.Clair. They both are marginal pass blockers, but Barnes is a beast to run behind. We would have to pay more for Barnes, but IMO that would still pay greater dividend. That would allow us to be more comfortable with grabbing more BPA in the draft.

Agreed. See below. I don't think that's the case at all. I believe that St Clair has one option right now. He was arguably the worst starting left tackle in the NFL last year. Who wants to pay him 15 mil to be a backup. That's honestly where he will end up for us. If he doesn't then our team is not making the progress it needs to make in order to make the OL a strength. Plus there are better / younger free agents out there. Option 3: Is the ultimatum JA gave someone a few years ago. "The offer has been laid on the table. It will not increase. The offer only goes down from here." I think that was Benson.

We don't run 5-7 step drops. We overwhelmingly use 3 step drops.

I generally agree with this philosophy and stand by it. IMO - this year is an abnormality. We have gaping holes at OT, WR and safety. Free agncy could have eliminated 2 out of 3 concerns without affecting our cap space much, especially with not needing to re-sign much of our own. IMO part II, is I honestly feel we were in the catbird seat, this off season, to seriously improve on our weaknesses without having to break the bank, even though that was possible. The core is established, the fire has been lit, but I'm afraid they feel that's enough. I just didn't see the talent.

I totally agree with that philosophy. Here's the rub. After we sign our draft picks, we have 15-20 mil left. I'd rather it go toward aquiring more talent than it going to the family coffers. I'd rather sign 2 difference makers than sign 5 ho hums. I'll also go with something you brought up regarding Pitt and beg the team to spend on people who can bring the right talent in via the draft. Anything but the coffers. The McCaskeys owe the fan base more. Some of may be that I've seen too many talentless hacks have fortune and fame off a predessessor that had greatness.

oops. Sorry

Me too, I about 20 miles NE.

Kirwan is former cap guy and coach. Definately inner circle, definately reliable. I was actually shocked he was this loose lipped.

Please tell me you are offended because I abbreviated your name when replying to your post,,, It was not my intention. BTW - you misspelled spelling.

Are you saying you don't think the story is legitimate? Pat Kirwan is in the "inner circle" of people GM's will talk to. What I found odd is that Kirwan said as much as he did. Angelo will probably blacklist him for that. Just like I said in your, "Angelo sabatage post", it must be higher than Angelo. Guess what, this is close to confirmation as you are ever going to see. To Conners post: The Bears are indeed cheep, and they may rightfully have to be. The 10 mil they ratholed last year kept us out of the playoffs. They will rathole more this year as well. And you will probably never hear of them having cap issues(which is a good thing). Untill we see their P&L statement, we not know if they can afford to spend or not.

Took the words right out of my mouth. Also, in hindsight the Berrian deal would have been more than worth it to us, as it elevated the the Vikes and lowered us in one move.

I just don't see it. I guess it's simply because I am not wired that way. IMO - The job of a GM is competetive in nature. That being said, Angelo in no way would have the mental make up to sabotage Lovie, knowing he's tanking on purpose. On the other hand, I can see a conversation that would make the whole scenario unfold. Phillips calls Angelo into the office and says something like, " Jerry, the family is a little concerned that their return on investment wasn't what they thought they were going to see. You assured us we were a playoff team and although we almost made it, there were scenarios that had to unfold to even put us in position. Now you and Lovie have assured us, that we are close. Define close. OK, go out and prove it. If not, we'll be using our extra money to show a new coach and GM the kind of money we have to immediately re-build this team. Have a nice day." This is why I feel it runs deeper than Angelo. Position coaches run the day to day. Coordinators run the week the week. Head coach runs the season. The GM runs the season to future seasons. That tells me Angelo is just as much a victim as Lovie. On the other hand, Phillips and above are looking past this season to the next generation. That tells me it has to be Phillips or higher. GM's simply don't have a high enough calling to cause pain on that scale for the "greater good" of the franchise.

I'm not outraged yet. I'm kinda numb though. With the huge amount of money at JA's disposal and no significant FA's to sign, we've done relatively nothing to shore our weakest areas. I'm still holding out for a slew of signings to provide more talent and depth at key positions. The draft will not suffice. At this rate, the surplus will be huge and if JA starts handing out early extensions to our current roster I will go postal. Add to that JA will have affectively closed the window on this team. We are NOT close as Lovie speculated. Everybody knows that.

Like it!

As of now, I consider our OL considerably worse than last year in depth, experience and talent.(ouch) Williams - completely unproven Beekman - should continue to develop Kruetz - one year older to decline Garza - push=sucks same as last year. Right tackle - new guy and practice squad guy Even if we re-sign St. Clair is that improvement or just depth. IMO - he blows. IMO - drafting or signing another starting caliber tackle is a necessity. The off-season is still young. Hopefully JA has not been handcuffed by the bean counters.

I see it both ways. If the Titans offered him a deal that was close and he turns it down, I could see being a little pissed. If not, he should go for the money. These players don't get these contracts on God given talent alone. They work hard and take extreme beatings. To put up with that over years being competitive has to come into play. I believe these guys are competitive about their contracts as well.

It's a funny thing , Chile; I had the same BPA comment in my post but deleted because I didn't want it to cloud the OL message. But yes, that and any other FA pickups will eliminate a stresser for JA on draft day so he can focus on less and hopefully get more out of it.