jason
-
Posts
8,658 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Events
Posts posted by jason
-
-
Not exactly trying to make a connection, just trying to play devil's advocate by pointing out that just because they have a badge, doesn't mean we have to take them at their word 100% of the time. Legit questions have been raised int his particular incident with Benson and I'm willing to hear them out. For all the stuff we hate about Benson, no one has ever really called him a liar (as far as I know). In fact, many people hate how honest he's been when speaking publicly, even when it was to his detriment.
Yeah...wasn't sure if you were making the connection or not.
-
The argument about police isnt even the topic of the thread. Lets just stick to the topic.
I won't sit idly by while people make comments that disparage cops - men and women who give more on a daily basis than probably any profession. If it's not the topic, it was introduced into the topic.
-
"In a surprising move, the Chicago Bears released safety Adam Archuleta, a little more than a year after they acquired him in a trade."
This is a clear indication that the media has no clue and just bases their "reporting" on highlight reels. Every diehard Chicago fan knows that Arch sucked last year, and with the addition of Steltz, the writing was on the wall.
-
Those were just a few examples. If you like Im sure I can type "police officer corruption" into google and give you a few thousand examples very easily.
And I would counter that I could find more articles showing bravery and self-sacrifice. Not only that, I'm willing to bet that the majority of "police officer corruption" found online will be people acting stupid and then blaming police, shaky video not showing the entire picture, lopsided editorials, and an overall slanted point of view from an age group from 18-26 or so.
I'm simply amazed at how many here are so willing to take the word of Cedric Benson, by nearly all accounts a complete turd, over a police officer. I can see why someone would be hesitant to believe either side fully, since they are so far apart, but it's simply baffling to me.
Miami BEAR
I don't necessarily think that your example fits the case with Benson (if you were even trying to make that connection). The topic of racial profiling aside, I'm quite sure that there weren't too many black guys with massive party boats out on the water that day. There's a pretty good chance that the cops went directly to the guy for whom they were searching.
-
Couple points.
Terrell had 4 years w/ the Bears to Benson's three. Terrell also had two full seasons as a starter, to Benson's one.
Not every player breaks out right away. In fact, the GREAT Thomas Jones was labeled a total bust after his first three years. Think Az would like to have his services back.
While not a success story, Rex hasn't seem to "get it" after 5 years, and yet the team is giving him yet another chance.
Bradley has had two years and shown even less than Benson, and is not only getting another shot, but the staff even talked about him as a starter.
Point is, I think is wrong to simply assume a player has no shot because he didn't earn his stripes sooner.
Finally, I think you sort of avoid the point. Maybe he will not get better, but as mentioned above, some players do get better and our staff seems all about continuing to give players a chance to prove themselves. I just do not see the point in not waiting a couple more months to find out. If he doesn't "cut it" at camp, then you cut him. No questions asked. But I just do not see the point is cutting him now.
Again, as said before, you need more than just 3 RBs heading into camp. Too often a player gets injured, and you need that 4th RB. Also, as we have too often seen, that well hyped rookie doesn't turn into the stud fans expected. Give Benson the rope to hang himself. If he sucks and will always suck, as you say, then he is gone. So one but Benson is hurt. But if he does step up, or Forte doesn't, then we have a solid option still on the roster, rather than hoping to find scraps off the waiver wire to fill out the roster.
I agree that the past history of the Bears (Rex, Bradley, etc.) seems to say that Benson will get another chance. I would like to note, however, that Terrell was only the full-time starter for one year. He had to split starts with Dez "Stone Hands" White at other times.
-
Since Benson was already on thin ice, and clearly not living up to expectations, is this arrest the opportunity the coaches needed to supplant him as training camp #1? Will there be a "RB Battle" similar to the "QB Battle"? I could easily see the coaches going with the rookie from day one, saying that he just plain ol' beat out Cedric Benson in camp.
Is this a possibility?
Would it be wise?
-
Back to the "presented himself in an aggressive manner" I believe the cop when he said he gently touched Benson to steer him in a direction about as much as I believe Benson when he said he continued to be polite through out the incident. I have a feeling, just my own, that Benson was likely drunk and not extremely cooperative, which is not good, yet at the same time also believe the cop was likely considerably over-aggressive in his actions dealing w/ Benson.
So the cop's supposed to wait until Benson acts on those aggressive, non-cooperative actions in a confined area? I've seen enough videos of massive guys who are the size of professional athletes, but probably with less dexterity, speed, and strength, just mercilessly beating a cop. Benson is a pro football player, and until more information is let out proving otherwise, I think the cop had every right to blast Benson with spray if he was acting hostile. I've been cuffed before, and it's a 2-second process if complicit. There would be no inclination whatsoever to spray someone unless the someone was acting stupid. Until we find out otherwise, and since his past lines up nicely with the idea, I tend to believe that Benson was asking for it.
-
I didnt say theyre all like that. However, there are enough corrupt ones to give the group a bad name. I personally have seen off duty cops driving drunk, rear end someone, kick the shit out of him and then have other cops come and arrest him for resisting arrest. Theres the story about the cop who beat up that tiny bartender in Chicago and then had other cops go in their and threaten her. There was that video that surfaced less than a year ago where a kid actually put a camera in his car because he was getting harassed by cops and then he actually got the cop on camera threatening him. Giving people the kind of power police officers have is very dangerous and when there are so many examples of the power being abused it is very easy to lose sympathy for the group as a whole and thats the point I am at. I know theyre not all like that but until something is done to try and clean it up thats how I choose to perceive it.
Doesn't seem like so many to me. When you consider the fact that there are literally thousands of cops and the best anyone can do is provide a handful of them who are corrupt...seems like pretty good odds of finding a good one.
As for Benson, he's yet another troubled athlete in professional sports. It sure does seem like many more of them get in trouble percentage-wise, than any collection of cops, or for that matter the general population.
-
LMAO - How often do you think a "river police" risk their lives? I don't know about other places, but here in Illinois, I'd put them on a par with the forest preserve police. I'm not even sure they are allowed to carry guns.
I was generalizing with the concept of police in general. As a whole, their opinions, morals, ethics, and word are far superior to what we have seen from Cedric Benson.
-
Who cares about Rhodes past? I'm looking at the present.
The guy is a solid RB. Ced has 10 rushing TD's compared to Rhodes 20 rushing TD's. (career)
Rhodes > Benson.
Scott Williams has 1+ NBA Championship Rings, Karl Malone has 0
Scott Williams > Karl Malone
-
Pepperspray??? Christ almighty, all the cops had to do is hold up their arms & Cedric drops like a whore on the boardwalk.
Cedric's lawyers are currently gathering game-film of the 2007 season as evidence to how easy he is to subdue.
The cops must be Longhorn fans who remember the days when he didn't drop so easily.
When I read, "Pepperspray?? Christ almighty" I started to side against you.
When I read the rest of the post, I quietly laughed in my office, clicked reply, and found the following appropriate:
-
Have you read this. This is a quote from the arresting officer,
"I touched his body in an attempt to direct him and he presented himself in a very hostile way," Snyder wrote.
"Benson is a very muscular person and easily capable of overpowering me," Snyder wrote in the affidavit. "As I had exhausted all attempts to gain control of Benson had been met with resistance and what I perceived as a threat, I administered pepper spray to regain control."
So Benson presented himself in a hostile way? Huh? Read his comments. Sure sounds to be like a smaller cop got scared and over-reacted.
Not saying Benson is innocent, but when I read the officers owns statements, its sounds a bit fishy. I have no doubt Benson was drinking and may well have been drunk. At the same time, it just seems "off".
Or maybe, just maybe, Benson was presenting himself in a hostile manner, and deserved to get a face full of pepper spray from an officer who didn't want to get into a physical altercation.
Pepper spray is a non-lethal alternative to what otherwise could have been a nightstick to the head, and a cracked open skull or broken leg.
Personally, I take a police officer's word over Benson's. I don't know the cop, but I know Benson has pretty much been a selfish, greedy, ignorant turd the entire time he's been with the Bears. We may never find out what actually happened, but there's a pretty safe bet in siding with an officer who risks his life daily over friggin' Benson.
-
Jason, I appreciate your loyalty to a douchbag such as CB, but will you PLEASE tell me this: (I've been asking this for a while). Other then the occassional few and far between great run, what does Cedric do well??? Seriously? On my list I have: Can't block, can't catch the damn ball, terrible vision, runs into his own lineman, blames the o-line for his failure, refuses to play when mildly injured, out of shape, says stupid things, gets arrested . . .
Seriously Jason, what does he do well???
Before you read this, remember that I was once the biggest Benson hater on the board...
-blocking: He's not horrible at blocking, just alignment
-vision: I don't think his vision is bad. It looks fine when there are holes
-runs into his own linemen: This is going to happen when the OL gets blown off the ball on a regular basis
-blames the o-line: I'd like him to take the high road rather than blaming the OL, but it's understandable since the OL sucked last year, and they were easily the weakest link on the team
-playing while injured: I don't think there is irrefutable evidence that he was "mildly" injured and didn't play.
-out of shape: Where has it conclusively been stated that he has been out of shape? In order to be the downhill, bruising RB that so many on this board want, he has to have a few extra pounds to blast LBs and DBs. Personally, I prefer the homerun hitters.
I don't know if he does anything well, to be quite honest. However, I don't know that we've seen enough of CB behind a decent OL to really know what he can do.
-
Pepper spray really has nothing to do with it. I don't want to open a can of worms with this. But, cops many times use pepper spray and other means of force when they are simply scared of the guy they're trying to arrest. Pepper spray alone is no real indication. I've seen Indianapolis cops pepper spray an entire crowd that was watching a fight that didn't even start yet. They were about to fight and people were watching. Cops come in and spray the crowd.
I find the first part of this statement to be complete BS. Cops don't spray people because they are scared. More often than not, cops spray people who are:
A ) acting like dumbasses and resisting arrest
B ) in a group of people who can't be calmly controlled by the number of officers present
Your personal experience falls into group B. Benson's falls into group A.
-
Please refer to the year before last when he was healthy and the OL was not horrible for proof to refute your misinformation. I'll give you a head start:I see a reason: HE SUCKS! -
I still don't really see a reason to get rid of him...but I think JA jinxed him.
-
Like there is going to be a report where Lovie says, "Yeah, I thought Williams looked fat and slow, and Forte? Woooo...he's gonna suck. Friggin' Bennet can't catch a cold. We've got a loooooong year ahead of us for this scrub ass rookie class."
-
And, for the most part, I happen to agree with him. Lots of risks.
Williams is the right position, but many had others rated higher.
Forte could easily be seen as a reach considering the others that were there.
Bennet could easily be seen as a bad pick considering other WRs who were there.
And then the draft got into craziness.
I like the 1st and 3rd rounders, but I agree with much of his sentiments about the rest of it.
-
Touche...
Given that I work in finance I know all too well all the theories...but at the end of the day investing is just legalized gambling. Feel free to bash goold ol' Kenny all you want... But it's sound logic regardless of how you prefer to spin it and belittle my comments.
Cutting losses now is not stupid. It makes financial sense. To go to your beloved financial alnaogy...do you hold onto a stock you know will probably bottom out, or sell while you can still get some money for it?
Man, I'd like to know who you've been watching...because one or two good plays from him does not make a career. Yes, can we all agree that the OL stunk. That dead horse has been flogged so many times George Romero has passed on doing the 9th "Night of the Living Dead O-Line" sequel... I do not see a body of work from him that makes me optimistic. Apparently you do...and if that's your sotry, and you're sticking to it. then more power to you.
I am not saying cut/trade...I am saying it's worth looking into. Right now there is probably an interested suitor. If and when he sucks again or shows his injuries, interest may bottom out. Sure, he could be the next Earl Campbel. Well...no he won't be the next Campbell. He is not that good. Never will be. I feel very confident in that.
To take the finances a bit further, I think your analogy is off. Benson isn't a stock that will bottom out and cost the Bears more money; the money spent on him is already locked up. At this point he's like an equite index annuity. There's not an overly great chance at a big return, but there is no real worry of loss either. It's either great upside or meager returns from a safe floor.
As for my belief in him, that's a different issue. I am not really a Benson fan, never have been. But I'm all for what makes the Bears better, and once TJ was let go, I jumped on board the Benson bandwagon. I saw enough glimpses in on-off time two years ago to know that he's got talent. I remember watching the N.O. game thinking, "Wow, this kid might be really good." But he split time with TJ and ran behind a garbage OL the next year. I'd just like to see what he can do as the #1 RB when the Bears OL doesn't stink, a chance he didn't get last year.
No offense to Kenny Rogers.
-
Jason,
I fully follow you analogy on Bears fans and investors...however...Kenny Rodgers said it best, "you gotta know when to hold 'em, WHEN TO FOLD 'EM..."
I think it's time to fold...
While Benson could improve with an improved OL and TE play...his injury issues are a major concern. While there is debate on his current injury status..there's no doubt the guy has been plagued by injuries every single season he's been with us.
The problem isn't drafting a RB...it's drafting the wrong one.
Personally, I trust sound financial analysis over witticisms from Kenny friggin Rogers.
To cut losses now is just plain stupid. It costs more to cut him than it does to keep him. And that's not even taking into account the fact that the kid still has a lot of upside and talent, and if the OL doesn't stink to high heavens, then he trucks people in the secondary.
-
How many chances has Grossman had where he actually was put on the line and failed? As far as I can tell, most of his problems have been injury related. Thats why he was out in 04, 05, etc. Last year was the first time he was really told that he had to show significant improvement rapidly or he'd lose his job. He lost his job after a couple games, came back in after Griese got hurt, performed fairly well IIRC, and then got hurt again. His 06 campaign he performed very well for the first half of the season and was at least decent in a couple playoff games, I think it's hard to say that he lost a chance that season. I count exactly 1 chance he was given where he failed and the team deservedly benched him.
I sure as hell hope you are counting the Super Bowl in your count of "exactly 1 chance he was given where he failed".
-
It's funny to me. I HATED the Benson selection. I knew TJ was good. Unfortunately, Benson was selected at #4.
Then TJ was released, making Benson the #1 guy. I fully supported him once he was on the field, but now as the #1, I really wanted him to succeed. He did OK the first year splitting carries. Then, last year, the Bears regressed on offense because of OL sucked so badly. And, of course, Benson did poorly.
So, now, it's the same thing all over again.
I find it funny that I'm not a Benson supporter, trying to tell everyone the guy has talent if the OL would do well. When he gets an OL, he's good. Of course, the Bears drafted a RB again, which I feel is another mistake.
The Bears, and in large part the Bears' fans, are like bad investors. Some times you have to give an investment time to mature, and if you try to take money out too early, then the investment doesn't pay out like it should/would if you just allowed it to do what it's supposed to do.
It'll happen again this year. The Bears OL will improve, and Benson will look a lot better. Then the questions will come out about why the Bears drafted a RB. And I'll sit back, hope the Bears get something for whichever RB they get rid of, and get irritated about the deja vu.
-
With all the bashing of the draft picks we got and the UDFA we signed our team just got better, for this year. I'll start off with the TE pick of Davis. If you look at the year we lost Gilmore who was nothing to write home about just a blocker and could catch sometimes. We got Davis who is taller and faster.. The thinking here is that he and Olsen could be on the field at the same time creating such a mismatch against small LB'S and DB'S(advantage Bears).We then turn to the WR spot. We lost Moose and Berrian and gained Bennet,Lloyd,Booker and Monk. How many time did you see Moose and Berrian drop passes and couldn't get awsy from defenders? IMHO Monk will be a steal, biggest WR we have 6'4' 222 and a big target to throw to. Booker/Bennet will catch most everything thrown their way. Lloyd IMHO is the weak link and might not do anything. So we are good with Davis,Bennet, Booker,Bradley,Hester & Monk. This line-up gives you Speed,Hands, route running, just what our QB'S need to throw to.
Next is the O-line. We lost Miller and Brown and gained Williams, Adams, Burton. with Willams being the LT moving Tait to RT we upgrade two spots and have ST.Clair as backup. We have Burton who IMHO will be moved to guard, we have Adams/Burton/Garza/Beekman/Oakley/Metcalf/Jones/Balogh/Reed all battling for two spots with ST.Clair as a back up.
The RB spot is Between Benson and Forte enough said about that, but Qakland cut Rhodes, Seahawks cut Alexander,and a few other teams have will do the same so we could pick up some one later in the year (maybe, propably not).
QB we have Grossman and Orton who will both perform better with better blocking and a running game. And we also got Hill & Haine and lost Greise
The Defense is what win champions right? We we got better there too. We lost who Walker/Garay/Kennedy at DT no major lost there and we gained Harrison who is compared to Harris. We have Toeaina, Dvoracek, Adams, Harris, Harrison, Idonije,Oshinowo, and Faaeteete in the hunt up front
At LB we lost Ayanbadejo and gained Larocque
We also gained DE'S Baldwin,Clermound,Osborn along with Bazuin back rom IR
CB position got better with the additions of Bowman,Brown, Majors and the cut of Jimoh. We can move McBride to nickel to maybe replace RMJWe also got Steltz at S in case Brown goes down again (which I pray doesn't happen). We are looking good.
WR: It could easily be argued that the Bears regressed. However, I'll give them a constant. They didn't get better or worse. Booker and MuhMuh are a wash. The loss of Berrian hurts because he was the only one that consistently stretched the opponents' D. The other guys are unknown and unpolished.
OL: They got better, but is it enough? I don't know that it is, and I think that there was a definite need at OG that wasn't addressed soon enough.
RB: I'm not sure about this one. This could easily be subtraction by addition. Forte is an unknown, and I'll be pessimistic until he shows otherwise. Benson is moody and this could easily spell the end of his sorry career. The Forte drafting could also spell the quick end to Wolfe, who will probably not see many carries while Forte and Benson battle it out for the #1. IMHO it's somewhat upsetting, considering the fact that the OL played so miserably last year. The year before, when the OL played well, Benson did well, and looked good in his opportunities. I really think that the only thing that needed to be fixed was the OL.
QB: Same every year...
Defense: This is where I think the Bears made huge strides, but it's not necessarily because of the draft. Sure, there was Harrison, but he's a huge risk. The real impact will be made by the lack of injuries. The Bears will be returning Harris, Urlacher, PNut, Brown, Vasher, Dusty, Bazuin, and Okwo to full health/strength. I fully expect the Bears to be a top 5 D/ST if there are relatively no injuries next year.
-
All right, this is just for fun…
Here are the scenario’s:
1) Trade future picks for Brady Quinn. What would it take? Maybe a 1st and a 4th.
2) Grab a veteran FA. I’ve heard Simms potentially mentioned, but Culpepper looks to be finally healthy.
Here’s the ceiling and floor of it all. Quinn is an unknown by NFL standards, yet has the ability to become the franchise QB we have been dreaming of for decades. Pepp and Simms are damaged goods, but have the ability to become serviceable stop gaps with arguable skills possibly not adding up to Orton and Rex.
You are the GM and the clock is ticking…
Easy for me because I happen to believe your final statement is ridiculously false. Pepp may be damaged goods, but when healthy, he is a weapon far beyond Grossman or Orton.
Benson Cried
in Bearstalk
Posted
As someone who has been pepper sprayed, as well as hit with CS gas on numerous occassions, I'll back Benson up on this one.
Gas = crying
Now, if he was sobbing, then that's a different story, and he's a sissy. It sucks, and you can't help crying, but it doesn't really hurt. One positive is that it cleans out the sinuses in seconds, dropping every ounce of snot you have out onto your shoes.