Stinger226

I agree, we have a wait on see on most, but for me in 3 years you need at least 12 players that will be above average and a few stars. We both agree on 8, I think the next group should net us the extra 4.

I think we should resign K. Fuller . It is an area of need and if we go out and sign a high level vet, it will cost us an average of 13 mil based on last years signing. So is Fuller worth, 10 to 11 mil a year at 5 years with 30 mil guaranteed ? I think we have to , you figure we draft one high and at least need a young stable vet going forward. The Marcus Cooper signing was thought to be a ascending player, but fell of the edge. Prince played well but was not outstanding, so I think we keep one and Fuller is 3 years younger.

I am projecting his growth from year 2 going forward. His has shown flashes.

With all the criticize Pace has gotten lately, I still think he has given us our core for the future. Although his first round picks have had questions due to injuries, he has drafted well outside of that round. Here is my list of who I think our core will be going forward. (not in any particular order)(draft and FAs) Trubisky Shaheen Whitehair Howard Cohen Floyd Hicks Goldman Trevathan (2018 he will be 28) Bullard (has taken a step forward this year and will have a breakout season next year) N. Kwiat ( has grown as a pass defender) with Freeman gone will take over at one of the spots at ILB Amos (is one of the highest rated Ss this year on PFF) Jackson RRH ( has shown improvement from year 1 to year 2 and I predict will become a valuable 3T going forward) Bryce Callahan ( he has played well minus the injuries) Merideth ( injuries has derailed his development but think he will be a solid #2 WR going forward) I also think Sims will be better used next year and will show more value . Going forward the key to the list is blue chip players. Mine are MT, Floyd, Whitehair, Hicks, Howard, and Jackson) So lets see your list or criticism on my mine. Conclusion : I think going forward we will be in really good shape.

He is actually making less than Massie. Massie made a little over 6 mil this year, Wagner made 5.9 Next year Massie can be cut with a .5 mil dead money but his contract calls for 6.2 mil. , Wagners will be 5.9 The next 3 years Wagner will be making 11.5 a year, This will be high, but if he plays at a pro bowl level, that would have been acceptable in my opinion. He is 28 right now, so will not be over the hill. Also, in two years, i am sure the salary will be higher for a pro bowl level type RT than this year. His last year has an out of 2.8 mil so if his play dropped off would have been an acceptable out. I think that would have been an acceptable signing considering the plans to draft a QB this year. It would have solidified the line considering the injury problems at the guard position. I think by the design of the contract, that Pace would have front loaded the contract so by the third year we could have had an out. I would say the overall money would have been similar but the G. money was the difference. This year he is rated the 4th best RT by PFF if that trips your trigger. I think this would have been a good signing. In comparison to Lenos contract, the last three years of his contract will be paying him a little less than 2 mil a year, for a very average LT. The difference is we Pace has an out after 2018.

To all of you that miss A. Jeffery, look at his numbers this year: Alshon Jeffery 56 118 781 13.9 9 On a team with so many injuries and bad players,. we definitely could have used him but his numbers are pedestrian other than the TDs. those numbers are what good #2s get in the league. I will give him cudos for the 9 TDs but he was not worth a big contract. On a team that is lined up average WRs he wasnt even the best receiver on his team, a TE was. He was third in receptions. RECEIVING NAME REC TAR YDS AVG TD LONG 20+ YDS/G FUM FUML YAC 1DN Zach Ertz 72 108 800 11.1 8 53 7 61.5 1 1 210 45 Alshon Jeffery 56 118 781 13.9 9 53 8 52.1 0 0 220 44 Nelson Agholor 59 92 757 12.8 8 72 9 50.5 0 0 287 35 Torrey Smith 36 66 430 11.9 2 59 6 28.7 0 0 120 11 Trey Burton 22 28 239 10.9 5 27 2 17.1 0 0 27 14 Mack Hollins 13 17 201 15.5 1 64 3 13.4 0 0 45 8 Corey Clement

Thanks to everybody that is in this league, I am in several leagues every year, and this is one of the most competitive . Out of 5 leagues, I usually win one, am in the playoffs in 3. I wish you were all were not as good at it, but it keeps me on my toes.

I agree, I think most of your good franchises have stability at the top. NE, GB, Pitts. You cant keep changing regimes every three years and turn into a winner. They will let this play out. Pace has made some dump decisions, K, Glennon, the injured players is out of his control. He also has built a core for the future going forward. MT is the future to live or die with. If we have a top 10 QB for the next 10 years, everybody will win, it is just not something you can judge in one year, check back in 2020.

I think that works minus the 2019 pick, at 9 it just doesnt carry as much value as the top of the draft.

If we can stay in the top 10 that is the best we can hope for. I also think there is value in winning for the young players on the team. We absolutely are setup to be next years Rams.

I like speculation to but its the hand we have been dealt and you never can tell until year 3 or 4. Look at Clowney for example, he had a bad first year and is now flourishing in his third year. The most important decision this season will be who gets the HC job , that will define the development of MT. Pace makes lots of mistakes but he has drafted our core along the way, so I suspect he fills our needs, OT,WR and OLB. Still need some more CBs and depth but seems to be headed the right direction. RBs- we now have one of the better backfields in the NFL. QB- potential can be seen. TEs- I personally think Shaheen will be a probowl type, you cant teach size and athleticism and he has both. Also I think Sims will be better used as a threat once we solidify the OLine so he can get away from his blocking role. OL- IF Kyle stays healthy, Whitehair is a solid buliding block. The key this season will be upgrading the OT spots. Remember last year we went after Wagner but didnt want to match the money(stupid decision) WR- total upgrade The defensive side is in good shape with the addition of another pass rusher and cornerbacks.

out of those I see the Cards making the most logical, I have heard they like Josh Allen and he should still be there. The only thing is, I think most teams will be more likely to more up higher to make sure they get there guy.

I like the draft but have been checking out players for the last month and have only seen Walters Football that has him being picked 31 as a DT. Matt Miller doesnt have him in his top 50 and GBNDR has him ranked 56th in their top 100. It still has to play out but so far he seems more like a second round pick that a back end first rounder.

IT is easy to wish that now that we know the draft, but Watson was expected to be the first QB taken, so no one had any idea of how the draft would fall. Pace wanted MT and I suspect he would not have been there at 12 either. It is what it is and we have to look forward, woulda coulda shoulda just doesnt matter.

They would be a lot interested but I think the fact he lived here for 10 years is a plus, and I think the ownership always treated their coaches well, so we have a couple of traits he may like. Mainly like AZ stated, the defense is already primed for a good future and who the hell wants to live in Cleve or Oakland, cesspools.

I think Lovie was a good coach, but not a great one, Coaches that consistently get to the post season, defines the coach, IMO

It doesnt matter if the game has passed him by or not, this a performance based league and he hasnt won.

I listen to a Bear Report podcast today and they talked about Toub quite a bit. They talked about how he values defense, so a good chance he could talk Fangio and Donatell to hang around. I would be curious of whether he would be a conservative or aggressive offensive type.

To put a spot where we can look at all the potential future HCs.. I think Bill O'Brien might get let go this year. I think he might be a good coach going forward although his record is spotty. Another name out of left field I would like to throw in the ring is Peyton Manning. I have heard he might get into coaching but not necessary this year. Although he is unproven, he is a throbbing football brain, and I suspect would be a good influence on our QB for the future.

We have other issues to address before we worry about the S position, I just think we dont need to get one early, but another one in the pipeline going forward.

He did not have a good 2016, so having competition pushed him to be a better player. Winner winner

If we hit the top 5 , I can see us get in the position to trade back but the farther down we drop, I see less chance with a trade back of value. I agree with OT, but find OLB and then WR in our priority drafting spots. FAgency has some answers at WR so even though we will draft one I do not think it will be our first couple of picks . So I say we hit the top 5 and trade back for a 2nd and extra 3rd as you do with this order. IF we trade back in the teens, Arden Key and Clelin Ferrell are slotted as the BPA in that area so one of them. In the second round Jets have an extra 2nd so my scenario has us trading with the Jets. Slotted for the draft value in the early 2nd round, Orlando Brown and Martinas Rankin should be there. Still at WR with our other 2nd round pick, Cristian Kirk and James Washington would be value picks. In the third, There are several OTs slotted in that area of value, or also Parris Campbell the WR from OSU. So I think we grab Orlando Brown which could start at RT day one and then in the third draft a Tryell Crosby to groom at LT and take over for Leno after the 2018 season. Also a name I like that is rated lower that may change is Kolton Miller OT.

I totally agree, Bullard has not started until Unrein went down and he has 20 t and 1 sack RRH in spot minutes has 7 ts and 1 sack. With those two young guys on the roster and expected to ascend we will not be drafting a DE in the upper few rounds. I would argue that with Goldman's injury history we should think about adding depth to the nose tackle position before end.

Injuries is not an excuse but they have the mort lost time in the league for starters the last two years and it matters. Also the penalties are killing us. They just kill drives or TDs that Cohen gets. He has had more big plays called back than he has made. Pace has developed a core but has did well drafting but not very good at FAgency. The only good thing is he has front loaded contracts that allow us to cut players that dont pan out. So from a positive note, we have several building blocks going forward. Tribusky Shaheen Sims Howard Cohen Merideth Long (injuries beside) Whitehair Goldman ( barring injuries) Hicks Bullard RRH Trevathan (when not injured) Floyd Calahan Jackson I think this will be our core, and as much as I wanted us to see us win, losing gets us back to the top 5 giving us the chance to trade back and grab some extra picks. So I think if we grab a few WRs and a CB in FAgency and draft a couple of OTs and pass rushers in the draft, next year could be a LARams type of a turn around. ( at least 8-8 lookd doable) Having said all of this, the most important asset will be getting a good coach.

Actually I think that would be a good pick for the simple fact, FAgency has a lot of good CBs out there, Trumaine Johnson, or Melvin Jenkins. We are going to need to spend money and will get a couple of WRs, and with no good options in the OLine or at OLB, I think we can resign Prince or Fuller and then grab (again) a CB. Put them with 2 young safeties and Amos as depth, I think that puts us in a better spot. Also I think we may go pass rusher in the first and grab a O. Brown or Kolton Miller with the second pick. I really like what I here about Miller, mean streak and very physical. Because we signed Leno to a long term deal, I think we fill the RT spot first and then grab a OT to bring along and take Leno's spot in one or two years when cutting him would be more cap friendly. Leno is very average, but if the other 4 spots are strong can be managed on the LT spot.