Deflategate

[Alaskan Grizzly]

I don't diagree with your notion that cheating is an important issue and all forms of it are similar, but I'm telling you there is virtually no difference in one PSI, and it wouldn't have made a difference. The officials can tell when a ball is way too deflated, and they would have gotten rid of it. I've felt thousands of footballs from all various locations, teams, and levels...trust me on this.

 

As an official, I see things in terms of "advantage gained." That's why there isn't a holding call on every play. In this case, it was nothing more than a quick jersey tug...no real restriction or advantage.

 

Had this been an isolated event, perhaps. But as LL pointed out, this is not the first time that the Patriots (as a whole or members within) have been linked to some unfair advantage. If Brady went rogue and chose to influence the equipment managers to customize the footballs to his liking that could even be considered separately. But taken as a whole; with the managers obviously knowing they did it, with Brady being Ok with it, at least as the investigation portrays it, and the arrogance that Kraft exhibits by trying to demand an apology then and now is simply inexcusable. Throw in the fact that as part of the investigation Brady, through his agent, refused to turn over his cell phone (texts) to the investigator. Then after the investigation is over calls the investigation sloppy shows his arrogance has no limit.

 

As harsh as LL's recommendations may seem, I'd have to agree that they at least entertain most of his suggestions.

[ParkerBear7]

Where's the NFL culpability in all this? After all if the nfl had better procedures in handling game balls this cheating scandal would have not been possible. Major league baseball doest allow each team to supply their own game balls, the umpires approve and control all game balls. NFL should just take ownership of this and declare how they will handle game balls in the up coming season.

[madlithuanian]

Good points Alaska.

 

I think a good chunk of people are simply tired of all the little "questionable" things surrounding the Patriots. From the "Tuck Rule" to "Deflategate" and everything in between. It's not as though they've gone into Super Bowls and blown people out. These games are usually close, and maybe, if not for a lack of a fumble here or some other broken rule we're not yet aware of, they gained a slight advantage... We'll never know. A simple shadow of doubt has been cast, right or wrong.

 

To me it's sad, because so many involved are really top HOF players/coaches.

 

 

 

Had this been an isolated event, perhaps. But as LL pointed out, this is not the first time that the Patriots (as a whole or members within) have been linked to some unfair advantage. If Brady went rogue and chose to influence the equipment managers to customize the footballs to his liking that could even be considered separately. But taken as a whole; with the managers obviously knowing they did it, with Brady being Ok with it, at least as the investigation portrays it, and the arrogance that Kraft exhibits by trying to demand an apology then and now is simply inexcusable. Throw in the fact that as part of the investigation Brady, through his agent, refused to turn over his cell phone (texts) to the investigator. Then after the investigation is over calls the investigation sloppy shows his arrogance has no limit.

 

As harsh as LL's recommendations may seem, I'd have to agree that they at least entertain most of his suggestions.

 

[Alaskan Grizzly]

Good points Alaska.

 

I think a good chunk of people are simply tired of all the little "questionable" things surrounding the Patriots. From the "Tuck Rule" to "Deflategate" and everything in between. It's not as though they've gone into Super Bowls and blown people out. These games are usually close, and maybe, if not for a lack of a fumble here or some other broken rule we're not yet aware of, they gained a slight advantage... We'll never know. A simple shadow of doubt has been cast, right or wrong.

 

To me it's sad, because so many involved are really top HOF players/coaches.

 

Thanks. I might note I was able to watch a segment on ESPN about half an hour ago and the revered Bill Polian had some compelling commentary about this very thing. I'd quote it all but the segment was about 20 mins long.

 

Parker Bear: One point that was brought out in this segment was that many newer rules and policies were put into play during the 2008 season but don't seem to be fairly and equitably dealt with from the Commissioner's office. That is on Goodell and I'll be the first to tell you that the guy is ineffective. Regardless, this incident is still a bad thing and highlights the problem with teams (specifically NE) getting away with 'bending the rules' over and over.

[ParkerBear7]

Thanks. I might note I was able to watch a segment on ESPN about half an hour ago and the revered Bill Polian had some compelling commentary about this very thing. I'd quote it all but the segment was about 20 mins long.

 

Parker Bear: One point that was brought out in this segment was that many newer rules and policies were put into play during the 2008 season but don't seem to be fairly and equitably dealt with from the Commissioner's office. That is on Goodell and I'll be the first to tell you that the guy is ineffective. Regardless, this incident is still a bad thing and highlights the problem with teams (specifically NE) getting away with 'bending the rules' over and over.

 

 

That's my main point in this "deflategate" is that the NFL is most culpable for not maintaining a better protocol on handling the footballs. I'm certainly against cheating but I just don't know how the NFL can penalize any team / player for manipulating the football when the NFL is ultimately responsible for maintaining the integrity of the game. The NFL has many faults but this seems like an easy fix. Have an NFL equipment manager or small crew present at each game responsible for inspecting, footballs, player equipment for safety and hold and maintain the footballs used during the games. How many times do you see a players helmet fly off during the course of an NFL game? I have always wonder how are these guys allowed to wear helmets so loosely. During a game a coach could always ask the "NFL Official Equipment manager" to check a football or a players uniform to ensure it meets the NFL standards.

[Lucky Luciano]

I don't diagree with your notion that cheating is an important issue and all forms of it are similar, but I'm telling you there is virtually no difference in one PSI, and it wouldn't have made a difference. The officials can tell when a ball is way too deflated, and they would have gotten rid of it. I've felt thousands of footballs from all various locations, teams, and levels...trust me on this.

 

As an official, I see things in terms of "advantage gained." That's why there isn't a holding call on every play. In this case, it was nothing more than a quick jersey tug...no real restriction or advantage.

 

this is paramount: there are REASONS that there are rules in sporting events. initially there are set guidelines as to how the sport is played. other than the initial concept and standards, when problems arise in sports it is 'usually' due to problems of one team/contestant unfairly taking advantage of another OR for safety reasons. thus all teams/contestants have SET standards, rules, they MUST abide by. otherwise it is not a true sport but an exhibition of no significant importance.

 

as an official of the sport this should be of utmost importance to you or anyone else who regulates a true sporting event. in 'most' instances there are NO gray areas, or should NOT be, in how you perform your duties in this capacity. unless they are 'judgement calls' by an official there should be no debate.

 

even then the rules, if they are unclear, should be defined by the league to eliminate or at the very LEAST minimize judgement calls that can effect the outcome of play in the NFL. the perfect example is your "holding call". the NFL has at this point changed the rules and left many game changing calls like this and pass interference so vague that it leaves no set boundaries. in other words an official can be 'right OR wrong' on nearly every call thus leaving the game open for abuse by corrupt or bad officiating.

 

next: you mentioned there is no difference in a game ball that is light 1 or 2 pounds of air. although i have no official NFL football to compare i still disagree. if there is no difference then HOW were they discovered during a game by an opponent?

 

one PSI is over 8% of the total minimum inflation of an NFL regulation football standard. TWO PSI is nearly 17% deflation.

 

i also will ask you (as you have stated you are a collegiate official) what is the size and weight difference between a regulation NFL football vs. a collegiate game ball? unless there are changes in the rules lately i 'believe' the size and weight are different, the NFL ball being larger and/or heavier.

 

fact - in most instances a QB in the NFL has larger hands and much, much stronger hands than a normal person including the officials. in other words their grip is bigger and stronger and thus able to manipulate more the degree of flexibility and control. this would hold true also for a running back and a wide receiver.

 

this 1-2 lbs. difference could literally mean a lot more control for a QB in rainy weather AND especially in cold weather when the QB's hands have lost a bit of feeling and the skin tone has become slick due to the temperature. the chances of slippage or ball movement should be reduced allowing the QB to retain more accuracy and control and reduce the chances of fumbles. i think if you check the stats you may find that brady has a very good fumble ratio. could this be a factor? i believe it could make that much of a difference.

 

this formula should also include the WR who when grasping the ball (strong hands again) during a catch has more flexibility in the ball giving him a clear advantage in the reception. the same holds true for the RB who not only handles the ball but can squeeze the ball against his body more securely.

 

to test this theory take a large balloon and inflate one to it's max and another underinflate. try gripping them both and see which gives you the most control. i think you will find that even a slightly underinflated balloon will give you a lot more control than the fully inflated.

 

all said, then why is there a rule in the first place? why not let any team or player determine how hard or soft a game ball is due to inflation?

 

finally: the patriots have manipulated the rules of play to gain advantage in beating their opponents. they have cheated now at least twice, that we know of, to win 2 separate superbowls.

 

how many superbowls or even playoff games would they have won if they had played by the rules? it is now completely in doubt that the entire bellicek era may have been determined by them cheating. it's no different than the 9er's of the 90's who's superbowl string was acquired by cheating. that is why the integrity of the game is the ONLY thing going for the NFL to make it worth watching. without it it is all star wrestling.

 

that is the legacy they leave behind for any who follow the sport and can see further than the glitz and surface trappings of this era of football.

 

below are just some of the instances in regards to the inflate issues and does not include the other cheating practices that they gained by spying on opponents or who knows what else they have done...

 

==================

The 243-page report features text messages between McNally, the 48-year-old officials locker room attendant for the Patriots, and Jastremski, a 35-year-old equipment assistant, in which McNally outs himself "the deflator" and the two friends discuss Brady's angry complaints about the inflation level of game balls in an Oct. 17 game against the New York Jets.

 

McNally previously drew league scrutiny more than a decade ago, the report said, after Patriots ball boys relayed non-approved practice balls into an Oct. 25, 2004, game. There was actually no game on that day, but the Patriots beat the Jets 13-7 on Oct. 24, 2004.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/p...colts/22216585/

 

=====================

 

ESPN - 1/21/15: http://espn.go.com/boston/nfl/story/_/id/1...ampionship-game

 

The NFL has found that 11 of the New England Patriots' 12 game balls were inflated significantly below the NFL's requirements, league sources involved and familiar with the investigation of Sunday's AFC Championship Game told ESPN.

 

With the integrity of the game at stake, the NFL should come down hard on Bill Belichick and the Pats if they are proven to have underinflated footballs, writes Jackie MacMullan.

 

More info needed before judgment passed

 

The investigation found the footballs were inflated 2 pounds per square inch below what's required by NFL regulations during the Pats' 45-7 victory over the Indianapolis Colts, according to sources.

 

READ THIS: During that game, Colts safety Mike Adams twice intercepted Tom Brady and gave the balls to the Colts' equipment manager to save -- and both times there were concerns about the balls feeling underinflated, sources told Schefter.

 

Those sources said the Colts raised concerns to the league, which was aware of the issue going into this weekend's AFC title game.

 

====================

 

Only one of the 12 New England Patriots footballs used in the team's AFC Championship game win against the Indianapolis Colts was under-inflated by a full two pounds, according to NFL.com's Ian Rapoport.

 

"Several" other balls were found to be roughly one pound under-inflated, and "several more" were either right at, or barely beneath, the correct inflation mark.

 

The one football under-inflated by two pounds is in the NFL's possession for purposes of its ongoing investigation as to whether the Patriots purposefully deflated their footballs in order to gain an advantage over the Colts.

 

http://www.si.com/nfl/2015/02/01/deflatega...l-underinflated

[CrackerDog]

finally: the patriots have manipulated the rules of play to gain advantage in beating their opponents. they have cheated now at least twice, that we know of, to win 2 separate superbowls.

 

Here's where I agree with you most. If this was a team without the terrible track record on breaking the rules I might go lighter on them as Commissioner. But they've cheated since Big Bill has been HC and it's documented. Unfortunately they'll probably get away with it because:

 

1.) They're the Patriots and the Commish pisses his pants every time he deals with them

2.) The proof in this case doesn't point to Brady aside from fairly asinine texts between two idiots

 

I agree there needs to be some punishment. If the rule weren't important, why have it in the first place? And then all of the obvious lying and cover-up after the fact really does hit at the integrity of the game. We'll see how absolutely pathetic Goodell is when he makes his decision on this. It'll likely be that the footballs will end up in the same trash compactor the video tapes did.

[Lucky Luciano]

Here's where I agree with you most. If this was a team without the terrible track record on breaking the rules I might go lighter on them as Commissioner. But they've cheated since Big Bill has been HC and it's documented. Unfortunately they'll probably get away with it because:

 

1.) They're the Patriots and the Commish pisses his pants every time he deals with them

2.) The proof in this case doesn't point to Brady aside from fairly asinine texts between two idiots

 

I agree there needs to be some punishment. If the rule weren't important, why have it in the first place? And then all of the obvious lying and cover-up after the fact really does hit at the integrity of the game. We'll see how absolutely pathetic Goodell is when he makes his decision on this. It'll likely be that the footballs will end up in the same trash compactor the video tapes did.

 

agree. god-ell is a detriment. he is the bud selig of the NFL.

 

on your second point i have to disagree on. there is NO possible way any idiot ball guy is going to do that without brady or billechek's approval or their wink and a nod. if they did so without brady's approval why deflate them to those specification?

 

that said, they would virtually be hung in new england if that caused the pats to be disqualified from any game. so no possible way this could happen - NONE - unless both of them were completely insane.

 

brady is just as culpable and probably even more so, than these 'ball boys'. belichek supposedly mico manages every aspect of the patriots as he HIMSELF has stated to the press. he is the oversear and HE is culpable also. also just for $h!ts and grins, who is there OC now? hmmmmmmmmm.

 

it's the smoking gun lying on the ground next to a body and either or both standing over them when police arrive moments after hearing a shot. just because the finger prints have been wiped off the gun, they would be found guilty and hanged.

[madlithuanian]

C-Dog, I think your take here pretty much sums up my thoughts perfectly...

 

Here's where I agree with you most. If this was a team without the terrible track record on breaking the rules I might go lighter on them as Commissioner. But they've cheated since Big Bill has been HC and it's documented. Unfortunately they'll probably get away with it because:

 

1.) They're the Patriots and the Commish pisses his pants every time he deals with them

2.) The proof in this case doesn't point to Brady aside from fairly asinine texts between two idiots

 

I agree there needs to be some punishment. If the rule weren't important, why have it in the first place? And then all of the obvious lying and cover-up after the fact really does hit at the integrity of the game. We'll see how absolutely pathetic Goodell is when he makes his decision on this. It'll likely be that the footballs will end up in the same trash compactor the video tapes did.

 

[madlithuanian]

Good point.

 

Also, given that isn't going down in a court of US law, but from a private business, they don't need the same amount of evidence to feel comfortable placing blame.

 

agree. god-ell is a detriment. he is the bud selig of the NFL.

 

on your second point i have to disagree on. there is NO possible way any idiot ball guy is going to do that without brady or billechek's approval or their wink and a nod. if they did so without brady's approval why deflate them to those specification?

 

that said, they would virtually be hung in new england if that caused the pats to be disqualified from any game. so no possible way this could happen - NONE - unless both of them were completely insane.

 

brady is just as culpable and probably even more so, than these 'ball boys'. belichek supposedly mico manages every aspect of the patriots as he HIMSELF has stated to the press. he is the oversear and HE is culpable also. also just for $h!ts and grins, who is there OC now? hmmmmmmmmm.

 

it's the smoking gun lying on the ground next to a body and either or both standing over them when police arrive moments after hearing a shot. just because the finger prints have been wiped off the gun, they would be found guilty and hanged.

 

[Alaskan Grizzly]

2.) The proof in this case doesn't point to Brady aside from fairly asinine texts between two idiots

 

There are some facts that need to be considered. If this were a criminal case, which its not even close to but in some regards compared, these would be admissible.

 

1)One of the two ball-boys (technicians) McNally I believe, stated that in the 20 (or so) years he had been doing this he had never, not once, been invited/offered some sort of 'compensation' from Brady for the work that he did. As you may recall there were texts between the two ball boys (technicians) about that very thing. About how Brady was going to get one of the two some jerseys or other memorabilia.

2)Brady did not cooperate with the investigation. This is probably the most damming to him. The fact that he was asked and denied to provide his telephone and other electronic devices for investigation is very telling. And at the very least an aggravating factor.

3)Tim Hasselbeck was on Mike and Mike yesterday speaking to the credibility of one of the two technicians (Jsstremski). He said he has known him for as long as he can remember and he would never do such a thing unless he was specifically asked. Hasselbeck further said that neither he nor his brother (Matt) know of any technician anywhere that would do something like this without being told. (This point is not so much factual evidence but would be what is considered as a character reference).

 

And since we're back on topic and a little insight from the comments yesterday from Bill Polian. Something that has bugged me about this is how Brady's agent instantly came out when the report was released and lambasted its findings calling it a sham and embarrassment. He went as far as to accuse the Colts of "setting up a sting" to catch the Patriots during the game. Polian's take on this was that back in 2008 when rule changes and terminology were enhanced to the NFL rules Commissioner Goodell required all NFL executives and coaches to sign an affidavit stating that to the best of their knowledge the game was played as fair as possible and no rules were broken throughout the season (or something to that effect). Further, it was required by each coach or executive to report any infractions they discover immediately to league officials. It is up to the NFL at that point to investigate the accusations. Do you think that if Goodell were as much a 'lap dog' to Kraft as some claim he would willingly encourage an investigation for something like this when I'm sure similar complaints are rolling in daily from various sources? I'm not defending the guy, just noting the circumstance.

 

Lastly, I was also bothered by the verbiage the Wells report used in the statement: "...more probable than not..." that Brady was aware of what was going on. Seemed a little flimsy to me. Polian explained that again in 2008 the Commissioner thought that it better to come up with a pat statement when finding guilt or no guilt as a result of an internal league investigation. He wanted to differentiate the language used in criminal vs civil proceedings which refer to phrases such as "beyond a reasonable doubt" or "preponderance of evidence" and said that the phrase "more probable than not" should be introduced in report findings.

 

At the end of the day the question that is being asked all over, 'will this affect the "legacy" of Tom Brady'? Probably not. Will it make him take notice and tarnish his luster a bit? Remains to be seen.

[madlithuanian]

I think it will. It won't officially. But anyone not a fan of the Pat's or with a small amount a dislike for the team have an easy out to discount them/him in some way. At the end of the day, regardless of what the talking heads at ESPN/NFL/etc say...it's us fans and friends that really matter to us personally. It's bar talk. I care more what my buddy says than Dan Marino. And from the barstool...his legend is tarnished. To me, he's HOF, but not GOAT. Then again, I still that that title goes to Montana anyway regardless...

 

 

At the end of the day the question that is being asked all over, 'will this affect the "legacy" of Tom Brady'? Probably not. Will it make him take notice and tarnish his luster a bit? Remains to be seen.

 

[CrackerDog]

 

[CrackerDog]

on your second point i have to disagree on. there is NO possible way any idiot ball guy is going to do that without brady or billechek's approval or their wink and a nod. if they did so without brady's approval why deflate them to those specification?

 

We don't really disagree here. I didn't say Brady didn't tell those dopes exactly what to do. I absolutely think he did. But since the only evidence is them talking about it in texts, and as you admit, they aren't likely to throw Brady under the bus, this isn't going to hang him.

 

I suspect the Commish is going to have to do something. I just don't think it'll be significant.

[madlithuanian]

Ha!

 

That's me on Sunday after watching Rodgers take us apart...

 

 

 

[Lucky Luciano]

We don't really disagree here. I didn't say Brady didn't tell those dopes exactly what to do. I absolutely think he did. But since the only evidence is them talking about it in texts, and as you admit, they aren't likely to throw Brady under the bus, this isn't going to hang him.

 

I suspect the Commish is going to have to do something. I just don't think it'll be significant.

 

i knew you meant that this is probably how it will shake out and i agree with what you said. for the sake of money to the NFL he and billy are untouchables. the message this sends is if you are a star or a money maker for corporate NFL they will cover your ass until you do something to go to jail over.

 

for those who like the game of football, it is really a shame.

[Chitownhustla]

Big stink about nothing in my eyes.

 

 

Agreed. I am really shocked to see so many people so upset about it.

 

Like I said I played in high school games where we had the standard leather high school ball and the other team used a rubber ball. Had we lost that game I would never have thought to blame it on the ball.

 

 

Im not sure any ball was ever checked for psi in high school or college. Does that mean I was cheated if a team used a lower psi ball?????? I dont think so

 

 

Ill tell you this much and I think most football players would agree, Putting blame on losing a game because one team had a pound less psi in their ball would sound like a SORE LOSER.

 

 

If this wasnt the Pats this wouldnt be such a big deal.

 

 

The one game they caught doing it was the INDY game. They corrected the balls and what did Tom Brady and the Pats do in the 2nd half????

 

They blew the Colts out of the water with the 12.5 PSI footballs.........Man that psi made a huge difference.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Alaskan Grizzly]

Agreed. I am really shocked to see so many people so upset about it.

 

Like I said I played in high school games where we had the standard leather high school ball and the other team used a rubber ball. Had we lost that game I would never have thought to blame it on the ball.

 

 

Im not sure any ball was ever checked for psi in high school or college. Does that mean I was cheated if a team used a lower psi ball?????? I dont think so

 

 

Ill tell you this much and I think most football players would agree, Putting blame on losing a game because one team had a pound less psi in their ball would sound like a SORE LOSER.

 

 

If this wasnt the Pats this wouldnt be such a big deal.

 

 

The one game they caught doing it was the INDY game. They corrected the balls and what did Tom Brady and the Pats do in the 2nd half????

 

They blew the Colts out of the water with the 12.5 PSI footballs.........Man that psi made a huge difference.

 

It's unfortunate that you've totally overlooked the intelligent conversation going on about this in this thread.

 

[Chitownhustla]

It's unfortunate that you've totally overlooked the intelligent conversation going on about this in this thread.

 

 

It's unfortunate you have totally over thought this.

 

Sometimes people are not as intelligent as they think.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

It's unfortunate you have totally over thought this.

 

Sometimes people are not as intelligent as they think.

 

There's a lot more to the story than your HS football experience portrays. As someone else pointed out this puts a stain on the sport of football overall, not just whether they played with underinflated footballs. Football nowadays at the professional level is measured by seconds and sometimes millimeters. Not like it used to be. And if someone can get that advantage to better their career, and break the rules in doing it, then what's to say the next person won't try and 'one-up' them? Those of us with a traditionalist view on this are sorta pissed.

[Chitownhustla]

There's a lot more to the story than your HS football experience portrays. As someone else pointed out this puts a stain on the sport of football overall, not just whether they played with underinflated footballs. Football nowadays at the professional level is measured by seconds and sometimes millimeters. Not like it used to be. And if someone can get that advantage to better their career, and break the rules in doing it, then what's to say the next person won't try and 'one-up' them? Those of us with a traditionalist view on this are sorta pissed.

 

[Chitownhustla]

There's a lot more to the story than your HS football experience portrays. As someone else pointed out this puts a stain on the sport of football overall, not just whether they played with underinflated footballs. Football nowadays at the professional level is measured by seconds and sometimes millimeters. Not like it used to be. And if someone can get that advantage to better their career, and break the rules in doing it, then what's to say the next person won't try and 'one-up' them? Those of us with a traditionalist view on this are sorta pissed.

 

PED's puts a stain on a sport ie cycling and baseball. I think saying that the PSI infraction puts a stain on football is overboard. Its a minor infraction, hell it wasn't even that big enough of a deal to put in the rule book until 2008, whats that tell you about how important it is????

 

 

 

 

 

 

If Tom Brady used PED'S or strapped a jet pack to his throwing arm I could see it bettering his career/ winning more games. The fact is this TOM BRADY IS TOM BRADY WITH AN UNDERINFLATED, OVERINFLATED, INFLATED JUST RIGHT, BALL.

 

My point has already been proven by the second half of the INDY game and the Superbowl.

 

 

IF this was the Bears that got caught doing this I wonder how big a deal it would be to you guys that are upset about this.

 

 

Perfect example the Falcons got caught pumping music into their stadium on game day to create a louder home field advantage, do you see the media FREAKING out? Was it a stain on Football?????? This is only a big deal because its the Patriots. They have won more in the last 15 years than anyone else.

 

 

[madlithuanian]

I think you're not seeing all the circumstances where this could be an issue.

 

1. We all agree this didn't make a difference in the Indy game. Did it in the Raven's on prior? That game was really close. How about others? This wasn't a lone incident just in the Inday game.

 

2. Regardless of Brady, did the soft ball lessen the odds of Pat's turnovers? The stats seem to imply such.

 

3. Was this the Pat's first time doing something a little shady? No. The Pats have won more than anyone for a decade +. Ever wonder why? Where there's smoke, there's usually fire. If it were only this indescretion, no biggie. Plop this along with everything else, and it's hard to question it. Do you honestly think this the only thing "odd" they've done or are still doing? There appears to be a pattern.

 

4. Let's assume that the inflation of a ball matters not in the field of play. It is still a rule. The rule was broken to gain a potentially unfair advantage. Then Brday proceeded to lie about his involvement. It's the "cover up" that's always worse than the transgression. This is the point many are making.

 

5. Had Brady just come and said, yeah, I like the balls softer. "I asked the equipment guys to get them to the lowest possible. Looks like they over did it. I am sorry." This would have ended. A fine would be assessed. End of story. But no. The usual denials and demands for apologies for even thinking such came forth (especially from Kraft).

 

 

 

 

 

 

PED's puts a stain on a sport ie cycling and baseball. I think saying that the PSI infraction puts a stain on football is overboard. Its a minor infraction, hell it wasn't even that big enough of a deal to put in the rule book until 2008, whats that tell you about how important it is????

 

 

 

 

 

 

If Tom Brady used PED'S or strapped a jet pack to his throwing arm I could see it bettering his career/ winning more games. The fact is this TOM BRADY IS TOM BRADY WITH AN UNDERINFLATED, OVERINFLATED, INFLATED JUST RIGHT, BALL.

 

My point has already been proven by the second half of the INDY game and the Superbowl.

 

 

IF this was the Bears that got caught doing this I wonder how big a deal it would be to you guys that are upset about this.

 

 

Perfect example the Falcons got caught pumping music into their stadium on game day to create a louder home field advantage, do you see the media FREAKING out? Was it a stain on Football?????? This is only a big deal because its the Patriots. They have won more in the last 15 years than anyone else.

 

[Chitownhustla]

 

I think you're not seeing all the circumstances where this could be an issue.

 

1. We all agree this didn't make a difference in the Indy game. Did it in the Raven's on prior? That game was really close. How about others? This wasn't a lone incident just in the Inday game. Do you think the Pats are the only team to have underinflated balls????

 

2. Regardless of Brady, did the soft ball lessen the odds of Pat's turnovers? The stats seem to imply such. What stats? In the wells report it says that the Colts had balls that were underinflated, can weather cause a ball to become underinflated???

 

3. Was this the Pat's first time doing something a little shady? No. The Pats have won more than anyone for a decade +. Ever wonder why? Where there's smoke, there's usually fire. If it were only this indescretion, no biggie. Plop this along with everything else, and it's hard to question it. Do you honestly think this the only thing "odd" they've done or are still doing? There appears to be a pattern. Anyone that thinks the Pats are the only team doing anything "ODD" is being naive.

 

4. Let's assume that the inflation of a ball matters not in the field of play. It is still a rule. The rule was broken to gain a potentially unfair advantage. Then Brday proceeded to lie about his involvement. It's the "cover up" that's always worse than the transgression. This is the point many are making.

 

I agree, its a rule and it was broken. Should they be punished, yes. Nothing too harsh. This is not a stain on the game of football. You can choose to believe Tom lied about it. The Wells Report is full of a bunch of crap. Take a look at page 73 of the Wells report, 3 out of the 4 Colts balls were under the 12.5 psi, these readings were taken right after the game. Did the weather cause this????? Should the Colts be punished?????

 

5. Had Brady just come and said, yeah, I like the balls softer. "I asked the equipment guys to get them to the lowest possible. Looks like they over did it. I am sorry." This would have ended. A fine would be assessed. End of story. But no. The usual denials and demands for apologies for even thinking such came forth (especially from Kraft).

 

You are right, had Brady said this it probably would be over by now. If Brady really knew nothing about it then I get why he responded the way he did. Did the ball attendant take it upon himself to deflate the balls because Brady likes a softer ball? Its possible.

 

 

From reading some of the Wells Reoprt there is a lot of speculation. That's it, speculation.

 

[Chitownhustla]

 

It is more probable than not that the Patriots participated in game day rules violations and it is more probable than not that Tom Brady was generally aware of the activities.

 

That sounds like a bunch of crap to me. A bunch of speculation to me. This investigation could only come up with more probable than not and that Tom Brady was more probable than not to be generally aware.

 

 

If this investigation came out to say TOM BRADY knew and directed the game day attendants to break the rules I could see how this would be a bigger deal.

 

 

I am all for rules to be in place.

 

There seems to be 3 things being argued

1. The integrity of the game = breaking rules

2. An unfair advantage = Pats performing better with underinflated balls.

3. Lying about it= Brady and Pats denying knowing anything about it.

 

 

My thoughts on the 3 topics

 

1. A rule was broken. Cant argue that. In the Wells report the Colts also had some balls measure below the 12.5 psi rule(post game). Is it that big of deal, I dont think so. I do not believe that the outcome of the game was decided on the psi of the ball. In any game (close or blow out) can every game ball be made sure that the psi is correct 100% of the time, that answer is no.

 

2. No ball will be perfectly inflated to 12.5 100% of the time. Each team has to deal with it and play the game. There will be games played with balls underinflated and overinflated. The wells reports talks about the Pats game against the Jets, the ball attendant refers to the balls being overinflated or ballons and that Brady was upset about the quality of the balls. This is on page 77.

 

3. The report can not come to the conclusion that Tom Brady 100% knew or directed the attendant to change the ball. All it can say is Tom Brady was more probable than not to be generally aware. This is nothing about speculation from Text messages between the game day attendants. I cant go off speculation, just wont do it.