The Kevin White thread

[lemonej]

I decided to start a thread where we can discuss everyone's fantasy about what Kevin White brings to the Bears offense.The reason why I used the word fantasy is because he is being projected into a role that he has yet to to actually perform in. Projection, prediction and fantasy are all similar terms when it comes to sports(imo).

 

When the Bears picked White I was extremely happy as much as I was when Jeffrey was drafted in the second round. WTBS Jeffrey struggled in his first season with injury and conditioning and White played 1 year at division 1 before getting drafted by the Bears and the scouting reports say he was only asked to run a couple of routes. Hopefully Adam Gases offense is a little more complicated than that and if he hasn't been on the practice field to try and translate what is on his team issued tablet how can anyone know what he can do?

[bowlingtwig]

I decided to start a thread where we can discuss everyone's fantasy about what Kevin White brings to the Bears offense.The reason why I used the word fantasy is because he is being projected into a role that he has yet to to actually perform in. Projection, prediction and fantasy are all similar terms when it comes to sports(imo).

 

When the Bears picked White I was extremely happy as much as I was when Jeffrey was drafted in the second round. WTBS Jeffrey struggled in his first season with injury and conditioning and White played 1 year at division 1 before getting drafted by the Bears and the scouting reports say he was only asked to run a couple of routes. Hopefully Adam Gases offense is a little more complicated than that and if he hasn't been on the practice field to try and translate what is on his team issued tablet how can anyone know what he can do?

 

Yeah I agree with what you have been saying. No one really has a clue yet what he can do. We can all hope but to this point so far we haven't even seen him in a single practice so we can only go by what we so from him in college and hope his game translates. If nothing else I have confidence him being out there would at least help Jay have a big target to throw to in the end zone. And that has been the problem so far. He hasn't had anything big to throw to in the red zone except Bennett and for whatever reason that's when Jay gets in trouble. It could been a multitude of reasons but just laying it out there. We know what Jeffrey can do when healthy and white being a big body would then give Jay 3 good targets in the red zone.

 

[lemonej]

Yeah I agree with what you have been saying. No one really has a clue yet what he can do. We can all hope but to this point so far we haven't even seen him in a single practice so we can only go by what we so from him in college and hope his game translates. If nothing else I have confidence him being out there would at least help Jay have a big target to throw to in the end zone. And that has been the problem so far. He hasn't had anything big to throw to in the red zone except Bennett and for whatever reason that's when Jay gets in trouble. It could been a multitude of reasons but just laying it out there. We know what Jeffrey can do when healthy and white being a big body would then give Jay 3 good targets in the red zone.

 

Thank you! I felt like everyone thought I was attacking someone. When all I was pointing out is that we are trying to project what he would be. As a long time Bear fan that has never worked. Example David Terrell.

[Chitownhustla]

Thank you! I felt like everyone thought I was attacking someone. When all I was pointing out is that we are trying to project what he would be. As a long time Bear fan that has never worked. Example David Terrell.

 

 

I responded to this White topic in the OAK Thread.

 

To quickly clarify: my comment was that the offense would be totally different if ALSHON and White were healthy.

 

Add a healthy pro bowl WR in Alshon and any offense would be better. IF you cant see that I cant help you.

 

 

If you think adding White a 6'3 210 lb 4.3 forty wr that is good at jump balls would not improve the offense I cant help you either.

 

 

A team that clearly is lacking TALENT could you use an unproven rookie that clearly has TALENT, talent you cant teach. You cant teach someone to be 6'3. You cant teach a 4.3 forty. You cant teach a vertical.

 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2015/profiles/kev...hite?id=2552422

 

 

Even if he cant grasp a NFL offense you already know he can run a fly route and jump through the roof for a jump ball. Just that will have Defenses accounting for White. No defense is going to let White run deep route without any help from a Safety. If White catches one deep with man to man coverage the defense will have to keep a safety back to help, which would open things up for Alshon and Forte, Bennett and Royal.

 

Lets say the defense is loading the box with a safety to defend Forte and Cutler hits White deep on a go route. Guess what happens next........ that safety wont be in the box.

 

 

 

The Bears are in need of talent. White has talent you cant argue that. Even having not seen him take a NFL rep I think the Bears are better with him than without him. This is not some crazy statement that you are making it out to be.

[scs787]

The confusion over the confusion is really confusing. White was a top 10 pick. Of course the Bears miss him. They drafted him to be part of the offense. It's not like we drafted a QB to sit behind Cutler ala Rodgers or something.

 

 

[AZ54]

I responded to this White topic in the OAK Thread.

 

To quickly clarify: my comment was that the offense would be totally different if ALSHON and White were healthy.

 

Add a healthy pro bowl WR in Alshon and any offense would be better. IF you cant see that I cant help you.

 

 

If you think adding White a 6'3 210 lb 4.3 forty wr that is good at jump balls would not improve the offense I cant help you either.

 

 

A team that clearly is lacking TALENT could you use an unproven rookie that clearly has TALENT, talent you cant teach. You cant teach someone to be 6'3. You cant teach a 4.3 forty. You cant teach a vertical.

 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2015/profiles/kev...hite?id=2552422

 

 

Even if he cant grasp a NFL offense you already know he can run a fly route and jump through the roof for a jump ball. Just that will have Defenses accounting for White. No defense is going to let White run deep route without any help from a Safety. If White catches one deep with man to man coverage the defense will have to keep a safety back to help, which would open things up for Alshon and Forte, Bennett and Royal.

 

Lets say the defense is loading the box with a safety to defend Forte and Cutler hits White deep on a go route. Guess what happens next........ that safety wont be in the box.

 

 

 

The Bears are in need of talent. White has talent you cant argue that. Even having not seen him take a NFL rep I think the Bears are better with him than without him. This is not some crazy statement that you are making it out to be.

 

I agree with this. On a long term basis having Kevin White be productive running all types of routes is a good goal. In the short term having his physical presence out there makes a difference. Even if his route tree is limited you still have to worry about covering him deep. DeSean Jackson did quite well affecting how defenses played when he just ran routes on the outside. Not putting White in that same category of deep threat, but on the other hand White has attributes for making contested catches that Jackson can only dream about.

 

The reason I liked White a little bit better than Cooper in the draft is that he's an excellent run blocker. Not only for running plays but hustling to block for other WRs after they make the catch. It might take him a bit to get used to the game speed of the NFL but this will show up early. If you happen to have seen Marquess Wilson attempting to block someone you already know what we're missing.

[bowlingtwig]

His whole point though is strictly on the basis of how can miss someone who's never been there. All of us agree on the talent part no doubt about it he definitely has it but then again we know absolutely nothing about him except his measurables. And looking just at that all of us would be salivating however how many talented ppl have we seen completely not even be able to play at the nfl level. Sure we all want to believe that it probably will take time but he's actually "available" the truth is no one knows

[scs787]

They drafted him in the first round therefore I think it's safe to say the coaching staff had him as part of the plan this season. Thus he is missed.

 

I really don't understand the confusion here.

[Chitownhustla]

His whole point though is strictly on the basis of how can miss someone who's never been there. All of us agree on the talent part no doubt about it he definitely has it but then again we know absolutely nothing about him except his measurables. And looking just at that all of us would be salivating however how many talented ppl have we seen completely not even be able to play at the nfl level. Sure we all want to believe that it probably will take time but he's actually "available" the truth is no one knows

 

I never said I miss White. I never said the offense is not clicking because he is not playing.

 

I stated that I think the offense will and would be better with Alshon and White in the line up vs not in the line up.

 

 

Let me ask you twig, do you think the bears offense will be better :

with Alshon and White?

how about with just White?

[jason]

I agree with this. On a long term basis having Kevin White be productive running all types of routes is a good goal. In the short term having his physical presence out there makes a difference. Even if his route tree is limited you still have to worry about covering him deep. DeSean Jackson did quite well affecting how defenses played when he just ran routes on the outside. Not putting White in that same category of deep threat, but on the other hand White has attributes for making contested catches that Jackson can only dream about.

 

The reason I liked White a little bit better than Cooper in the draft is that he's an excellent run blocker. Not only for running plays but hustling to block for other WRs after they make the catch. It might take him a bit to get used to the game speed of the NFL but this will show up early. If you happen to have seen Marquess Wilson attempting to block someone you already know what we're missing.

 

Maybe, but I liked Amari Cooper more because I said his route running was so superb he'd be shitting on NFL DBs before week 4. And guess what? That's what he's been doing.

 

As for White, there have been plenty of super fast guys who have failed in the NFL. Let's just hope he's not one of them. Once we see him on the field, the whole dilemma of this thread will be answered.

[AZ54]

Maybe, but I liked Amari Cooper more because I said his route running was so superb he'd be shitting on NFL DBs before week 4. And guess what? That's what he's been doing.

 

As for White, there have been plenty of super fast guys who have failed in the NFL. Let's just hope he's not one of them. Once we see him on the field, the whole dilemma of this thread will be answered.

 

Except for Tracy Porter...to my surprise.

[bowlingtwig]

I never said I miss White. I never said the offense is not clicking because he is not playing.

 

I stated that I think the offense will and would be better with Alshon and White in the line up vs not in the line up.

 

 

Let me ask you twig, do you think the bears offense will be better :

with Alshon and White?

how about with just White?

With Alshon absolutely no doubt about it. With just white. The only thing I can truly say is "i hope so". Til white is actually available to even practice no one truly knows. It's all a complete guess based solely on measurables and what he accomplished at the college level

[scs787]

Except for Tracy Porter...to my surprise.

 

Yeah, I played Cooper in draftkings and was just waiting for him to go off. Tracy f'n Porter held him catchkess in the 2nd half. Well done on his part.

 

....

 

White isn't just a fast guy, he's also 6'3", with a huge catching radius who made a good deal off tough catches in college. A lot of spread wide receivers get poo pood on because while they may have been super productive, they were also wide open and thus didn't have to make the tough catch. That's why I think White is gonna be different than your Tavon Austin's and your Stedman Baileys, he's just a guy who seemingly can bully single coverage.

 

I also love his drive, he's hungry, he's got that chip on his shoulder. I was watching his "Too Easy" highlight video and they showed some interviews and he just comes off as a guy who will work his ass off to be the best he can be. I think this injury might even motivate him even more.

[Chitownhustla]

Maybe, but I liked Amari Cooper more because I said his route running was so superb he'd be shitting on NFL DBs before week 4. And guess what? That's what he's been doing.

 

As for White, there have been plenty of super fast guys who have failed in the NFL. Let's just hope he's not one of them. Once we see him on the field, the whole dilemma of this thread will be answered.

 

I liked Amari Cooper more as well, at first I was thinking White but then once Cooper ran the 4.4 it was a no brainer.

 

I will agree with you about many super fast guys having failed, but I wonder how many of them had the senior year highlight reel production along with size, strength, vert??

 

Normally super fast guys are missing something else, very rare to have all the traits....Perfect example is Tavon Austin(brought up by Lemon), blazing speed but short and weak strength compared to White.

 

 

[lemonej]

Maybe, but I liked Amari Cooper more because I said his route running was so superb he'd be shitting on NFL DBs before week 4. And guess what? That's what he's been doing.

 

As for White, there have been plenty of super fast guys who have failed in the NFL. Let's just hope he's not one of them. Once we see him on the field, the whole dilemma of this thread will be answered.

 

Thank You!

[lemonej]

I liked Amari Cooper more as well, at first I was thinking White but then once Cooper ran the 4.4 it was a no brainer.

 

I will agree with you about many super fast guys having failed, but I wonder how many of them had the senior year highlight reel production along with size, strength, vert??

 

Normally super fast guys are missing something else, very rare to have all the traits....Perfect example is Tavon Austin(brought up by Lemon), blazing speed but short and weak strength compared to White.

Chitown I hope you don't think I'm tryin' to bust your chops but when you look at someone's physical makeup and try to project it in the NFL its a crap shot. The operative word for Whit is IF! Again I will say that he has been in JC a couple of years before going to WVA. Kevin White IMO is a project like Darius Heyward-Bey!

 

My biggest concern is Jeffery who can throw out a first pitch at a Cub game but can't practice at Halas Hall!

[AZ54]

Chitown I hope you don't think I'm tryin' to bust your chops but when you look at someone's physical makeup and try to project it in the NFL its a crap shot. The operative word for Whit is IF! Again I will say that he has been in JC a couple of years before going to WVA. Kevin White IMO is a project like Darius Heyward-Bey!

 

My biggest concern is Jeffery who can throw out a first pitch at a Cub game but can't practice at Halas Hall!

 

I don't think Heyward-Bey and White are anywhere close to the same player coming out of college.

 

DHB

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/historical/564881

 

Positives: Exceptional straight-line speed. Opponents must account for his deep speed on every play. Too fast off the snap for most defenders to challenge him in press coverage. Long, lean athlete with long arms and strong hands. Has the agility to make plays in space. Reads the field and can follow his blocks to generate yards after the catch. Can snatch the ball out of the air. Learning to better use his height as an advantage. Good leaping ability and has become more consistent in timing his leaps.

 

Negatives: Bit of a one trick pony at this time. Might be the draft's most dangerous vertical threat, but offers little else. Long-legged and struggles to generate consistent separation out of his cuts. Not as consistently effective on jump balls as he should be, considering his natural size advantage. Too often double-clutches the ball. Questionable toughness running across the middle. Lacks strength and consistent effort as a downfield blocker.

 

White (hit the link if you want to read the full profile it is pretty long)

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players...558/kevin-white

 

IN OUR VIEW: The best receiver in this draft class at attacking the ball, White is never truly covered with his ability in jump-ball situations to track and highpoint - high success rate in contested situations. He is a much improved route runner with an understanding of how to stack defenders and work back to the ball with excellent coordination.

 

White lacked polish in 2013, but his light bulb is now at full glow - although his timed speed doesn't always translate to the field, the game doesn't move too fast for him. He doesn't have the sudden burst to instantly create separation when he wants, but White has the instincts, ballskills and competitive nature needed to be a No. 1 target in a NFL offense - one of the top-seven players in the 2015 NFL Draft.

[lemonej]

I don't think Heyward-Bey and White are anywhere close to the same player coming out of college.

 

DHB

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/historical/564881

 

Positives: Exceptional straight-line speed. Opponents must account for his deep speed on every play. Too fast off the snap for most defenders to challenge him in press coverage. Long, lean athlete with long arms and strong hands. Has the agility to make plays in space. Reads the field and can follow his blocks to generate yards after the catch. Can snatch the ball out of the air. Learning to better use his height as an advantage. Good leaping ability and has become more consistent in timing his leaps.

 

Negatives: Bit of a one trick pony at this time. Might be the draft's most dangerous vertical threat, but offers little else. Long-legged and struggles to generate consistent separation out of his cuts. Not as consistently effective on jump balls as he should be, considering his natural size advantage. Too often double-clutches the ball. Questionable toughness running across the middle. Lacks strength and consistent effort as a downfield blocker.

 

White (hit the link if you want to read the full profile it is pretty long)

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players...558/kevin-white

 

IN OUR VIEW: The best receiver in this draft class at attacking the ball, White is never truly covered with his ability in jump-ball situations to track and highpoint - high success rate in contested situations. He is a much improved route runner with an understanding of how to stack defenders and work back to the ball with excellent coordination.

 

White lacked polish in 2013, but his light bulb is now at full glow - although his timed speed doesn't always translate to the field, the game doesn't move too fast for him. He doesn't have the sudden burst to instantly create separation when he wants, but White has the instincts, ballskills and competitive nature needed to be a No. 1 target in a NFL offense - one of the top-seven players in the 2015 NFL Draft.

 

What has Heyward -Bey done in the NFL? The same as Kevin White IMO. Nothing!

[AZ54]

What has Heyward -Bey done in the NFL? The same as Kevin White IMO. Nothing!

 

You compared their pre-draft abilities. I just added some context that I think is relevant. If you want to move their pro careers, DHB has averaged 13.9 yards per catch, Kevin White 0.

[Chitownhustla]

Chitown I hope you don't think I'm tryin' to bust your chops but when you look at someone's physical makeup and try to project it in the NFL its a crap shot. The operative word for Whit is IF! Again I will say that he has been in JC a couple of years before going to WVA. Kevin White IMO is a project like Darius Heyward-Bey!

 

My biggest concern is Jeffery who can throw out a first pitch at a Cub game but can't practice at Halas Hall!

 

I agree with you, no body knows what we have with White. I made a comment that the Bears would be better with Alshon and White in the line up. Just having Alshon in that comment makes it right, he is a pro bowl WR, already NFL proven. As far as White goes, I think the Bears will be better with him vs without him. You are right tho the key phrase is "I think" or "if".

 

 

Ill take my chances with an unproven White over an unproven Wilson or Bellemay based on physical measurables and highlight tapes from college.

 

Alshon, White, Wilson, Royal looks better then Alshon, Wilson, Royal Bellemay for 4 wide sets.

 

Right now Royal is being asked to run as a number 2 wr. He is better suited to play the slot. Having Alshon and White in the lineup makes our slot wr better even if White turns out to be a bust.

 

 

This brings me back to one of my original posts, having a 6'3 210 4.3 guy lining up changes everything, even if he sucks. Royal is now in the slot where he is BETTER and DC's will have to game plan against TWO guys on the outside that can go up and get jump balls(white has already proven that he is good at high pointing jump balls, that talent does not go away just because he is in the NFL now), this opens up Royal and Bennett running in the middle of the field. Bennett and Royal are already proven NFL caliber players. DC's will have to game plan differently solely based on the perception that White will be good.