Bears next OC Poll

[adam]

With the potential to lose Adam Gase after this season with so many HC job openings projected to be available, who do you think will be the Bears next OC and why.

[jason]

I think Gase stays. I don't think he blew the doors off in Chicago. He's highly respected; we all know that, but if he were that incredible the Bears offense would have done better than 22nd in offense. In fact, most of us found several questionable tendencies in his offense, namely the WR screen that was used so often it reminded me of Crowton at times.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

I think Gase stays. I don't think he blew the doors off in Chicago. He's highly respected; we all know that, but if he were that incredible the Bears offense would have done better than 22nd in offense. In fact, most of us found several questionable tendencies in his offense, namely the WR screen that was used so often it reminded me of Crowton at times.

 

Oddly enough I agree with you. But given the improvement (however slight) Id like to see what else Gase and Cutler can do together.

[adam]

I think Gase stays. I don't think he blew the doors off in Chicago. He's highly respected; we all know that, but if he were that incredible the Bears offense would have done better than 22nd in offense. In fact, most of us found several questionable tendencies in his offense, namely the WR screen that was used so often it reminded me of Crowton at times.

You really think with all those openings that he won't get a chance? Just look at some of the recent hires over the last couple of years. He would've had the SF job if he wanted it last year. I think he is gone. Most of the other popular candidates are on playoff teams, so he will get the jump on interviews and will probably be signed before the Super Bowl.

[AZ54]

You really think with all those openings that he won't get a chance? Just look at some of the recent hires over the last couple of years. He would've had the SF job if he wanted it last year. I think he is gone. Most of the other popular candidates are on playoff teams, so he will get the jump on interviews and will probably be signed before the Super Bowl.

 

I think he stays. I'm with Jason in that he didn't blow the doors off this year. He was highly touted the year prior after working with Peyton Manning. A year later without him, and he's average. Now, we all think he's done well given a) Cutler and the injuries at WR and Oline. However, I don't think around the league the owners and GMs see that. GMs might notice what he's done this year moreso than owners but any current GM hiring a HC is likely on thin ice themselves. They must sell the new HC candidate to their owner. Grabbing a less-proven young guy who has only really had success with Peyton Manning, and who wasn't even selected as HC at his current organization (Chicago), is not likely to impress an owner.

 

Head Coach is a much different role than OC and what you need in that role is different from a skill and leadership standpoint. Add in that this is a copy cat league. Who is successful? The Belichick coaching tree has been picked over and born very little fruit but his guys are always on the list. Years ago teams wanted the up and coming young guy ala Tomlin, who had a lot of success very early. However, a month ago I read an article that indicated people felt the better way to go now was the veteran coach who had been around a variety of different situations and still found success. Your lead example in this scenario is Bruce Arians in Arizona who was basically retired before he came back to work at Indy. Toss in Pete Carroll in Seattle, something of an NFL retread when Seattle brought him in. On the flip side to that argument is Todd Bowles who is successful this year with the Jets.....but he came from Arians' organization. Gase came here with Fox after they got fired in Denver because they couldn't win it all with Peyton Manning and a lot of money put into the best FA for defense. Their replacements have taken Denver with a backup QB into the playoffs (I know Manning wasn't good early on).

 

I don't think all this puts Gase at the top of the HC candidate list. He'll get some phone calls and interviews I just think at the end of the process people will feel he's a year or two away. He's only been an OC for 3 years now which is not a lot of experience. We need to keep in mind that Gase withdrew from the 49ers search last year so he's smart enough to understand he wants to be at the right spot as a HC. To help keep him from being blacklisted for being too picky, if he's pursued by an organization he's not comfortable with I think Fox would "promote" him and change his title to Assistant HC.

 

Fangio is the guy that fits the veteran coach who has been successful at a few stops better than Gase yet apparently he's not being mentioned around the league right now. He likely needs to turn the Bears into a top defense before he'll get consideration again.

 

"Only two coaches in history have been hired off losing seasons" ....

http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2015/12/30/nfl-hea...st-black-monday

[jason]

You really think with all those openings that he won't get a chance? Just look at some of the recent hires over the last couple of years. He would've had the SF job if he wanted it last year. I think he is gone. Most of the other popular candidates are on playoff teams, so he will get the jump on interviews and will probably be signed before the Super Bowl.

 

I think it's unpredictable. I think he has a shot of going elsewhere, but it's just as possible he stays in my opinion. It'd be different if the Bears were top ten in offense. I think it'd be a guarantee that he would leave.

[jason]

Fangio is the guy that fits the veteran coach who has been successful at a few stops better than Gase yet apparently he's not being mentioned around the league right now. He likely needs to turn the Bears into a top defense before he'll get consideration again.

 

"Only two coaches in history have been hired off losing seasons" ....

http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2015/12/30/nfl-hea...st-black-monday

 

YOU SHUT YOUR MOUTH! Fangio is the main coach I don't want to see leave. Without Fangio the Bears team would likely be picking top-5 in my opinion. He turned chicken shit into edible chicken salad. If he gets a year with some defensive pickups and draft picks to fit his needs/system, I think he could easily make this defense top-10 without having to spend top-10 money.

[adam]

I think Fangio is more like Dick LaBeau, seen as a great DC, but never really seen as having great HC potential (for some reason). I agree with Jason, I would hate to lose him, especially after 1 year into a 3-4 conversion.

[adam]

I think it's unpredictable. I think he has a shot of going elsewhere, but it's just as possible he stays in my opinion. It'd be different if the Bears were top ten in offense. I think it'd be a guarantee that he would leave.

 

Eagles, Browns, Dolphins "expected" to chase Gase. The Dolphins would probably be the best option except for playing in the NFC East. The mention of Cleveland and possibly persuading Manning is hilarious. I just can't see Manning going to Cleveland, let alone with Manziel there.

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/...hase-adam-gase/

[AZ54]

YOU SHUT YOUR MOUTH! Fangio is the main coach I don't want to see leave. Without Fangio the Bears team would likely be picking top-5 in my opinion. He turned chicken shit into edible chicken salad. If he gets a year with some defensive pickups and draft picks to fit his needs/system, I think he could easily make this defense top-10 without having to spend top-10 money.

 

LOL. I'm actually with you, If I had to choose which coordinator to keep around it would be Fangio. I'm amazed at what he has done with so many changing pieces. How many players started at least one game on our defense? I don't know that answer off the top of my head but I'll bet it's north of 20. With Goldman out the last game every position along the Dline/OLB has seen different starters so that's at least 5. ILB has had at least 4, Safety too.

 

Other than Cutler finally playing within the game plan, Gase's offense hasn't done much else that I can see would make people nervous about him leaving. If Cutler's improvement was more internal to him as I think it was, then we should be able to keep an average offense on the field even if Gase leaves. Build the great D with Fangio, better Oline run blocking, and you're in the playoffs.

[Bears4Ever_34]

It's hard for me to see Gase not getting a gig next year with so many possible openings. That IND job has him written all over it.

 

I think Logains is the logical Gase replacement. Mike McCoy would be the guy if he gets fired in SD.

[CrackerDog]

Gase is a goner. No idea who replaces him.

[DABEARSDABOMB]

I think Fangio is more like Dick LaBeau, seen as a great DC, but never really seen as having great HC potential (for some reason). I agree with Jason, I would hate to lose him, especially after 1 year into a 3-4 conversion.

Okay...so understand with LaBeau, but with the success Zimmer is having in Minnesota, does that change people's perceptions of someone like Fangio. I would think it would. Either way, I fully expect the Bears to lose one of their top coordinators (if not both).

[adam]

With Gase gone, Loggains seems like the obvious successor, so we will see.

[scs787]

With Gase gone, Loggains seems like the obvious successor, so we will see.

 

Yep. Cutler has already came out and talked about how Loggains has the same "Beliefs" as Gase. So for the sake of continuity it makes too much sense to just promote him and keep that stability.

[Chitownhustla]

Yep. Cutler has already came out and talked about how Loggains has the same "Beliefs" as Gase. So for the sake of continuity it makes too much sense to just promote him and keep that stability.

 

I love the idea of the system staying the same. Loggains will add his twist to it. The big thing is his Game Day play calling. Anyone have any info on Loggains time as an OC with the Titans?

[jason]

I love the idea of the system staying the same. Loggains will add his twist to it. The big thing is his Game Day play calling. Anyone have any info on Loggains time as an OC with the Titans?

 

I live close enough to Nashville. Nearly everyone hated him. He passed way too much, neutered what was left of CJ2K, and his blocking schemes/plans (if his and not the OL coach) were poor. People often criticized him for not taking advantage of CJ2K's speed, instead running him inside, and relying too much on underperforming QBs. In short, he seemed like the opposite of what Gase did this year with Cutler.

[scs787]

I live close enough to Nashville. Nearly everyone hated him. He passed way too much, neutered what was left of CJ2K, and his blocking schemes/plans (if his and not the OL coach) were poor. People often criticized him for not taking advantage of CJ2K's speed, instead running him inside, and relying too much on underperforming QBs. In short, he seemed like the opposite of what Gase did this year with Cutler.

 

Hmmmmm... Looking at his pro football reference page, the year he was OC they were 10th in rushing attempts and 22nd in passing attempts. So it doesn't look to me like he "Passed way to much"

[adam]

I live close enough to Nashville. Nearly everyone hated him. He passed way too much, neutered what was left of CJ2K, and his blocking schemes/plans (if his and not the OL coach) were poor. People often criticized him for not taking advantage of CJ2K's speed, instead running him inside, and relying too much on underperforming QBs. In short, he seemed like the opposite of what Gase did this year with Cutler.

Johnson ran for over 2,300 yards in the 2 seasons that Loggains was OC. The problem was their defense was brutally bad in 2012 (so I would assume they were always playing from behind). In 2013, the defense was improved and their pass/run ratio was fairly balanced at 54/46. Fox already said they were not changing the scheme, so even the playcalling should be similar. I actually expect Cutler to have more control at the line this year with a full year in the system.

[jason]

Johnson ran for over 2,300 yards in the 2 seasons that Loggains was OC. The problem was their defense was brutally bad in 2012 (so I would assume they were always playing from behind). In 2013, the defense was improved and their pass/run ratio was fairly balanced at 54/46. Fox already said they were not changing the scheme, so even the playcalling should be similar. I actually expect Cutler to have more control at the line this year with a full year in the system.

 

You assume wrong. They were in all his 2012 games except the GB one.

 

2012

He took over for the Titans in 2012 before the Texans game in week 13.

281 YPG

178 PYPG

102 RYPG (a third of that in one of the five games)

*Their D gave up 337 YPG during that stretch

 

HOU - 17 Rush, 45 Pass (66% pass)

IND - 24 Rush, 35 Pass (59% pass)

NYJ - 30 Rush, 22 Pass (42% pass) -CJ2K had a 94yd TD and then Loggains went pass-heavy, skewed rush stats because of QB runs

GB - 22 Rush, 30 Pass (58% pass) -Getting crushed and still balanced

JAX - 34 Rush, 15 Pass (31% pass) - Murdered Jax, had 4 return TDs, and of course ran the ball a ton

 

So in normal games he is pass heavy. Games where CJ2K hits a home-run, he starts throwing the ball immediately thereafter. Getting crushed and he's not pass heavy. At least he understood to run a lot when they were killing Jacksonville.

 

2013

In 2013 their O and D were almost identical.

TEN - OPP

Points: 362 - 381

Yds: 5390 - 5407

YPP: 5.2 - 5.3

Pass: 3496 - 3612

Rush: 1894 - 1795

 

And CJ2K had 1077 in his only full year with Loggains. He only had 301 (60YPG) with Loggains in 2012.

[adam]

You assume wrong. They were in all his 2012 games except the GB one.

 

2012

He took over for the Titans in 2012 before the Texans game in week 13.

281 YPG

178 PYPG

102 RYPG (a third of that in one of the five games)

*Their D gave up 337 YPG during that stretch

 

HOU - 17 Rush, 45 Pass (66% pass)

IND - 24 Rush, 35 Pass (59% pass)

NYJ - 30 Rush, 22 Pass (42% pass) -CJ2K had a 94yd TD and then Loggains went pass-heavy, skewed rush stats because of QB runs

GB - 22 Rush, 30 Pass (58% pass) -Getting crushed and still balanced

JAX - 34 Rush, 15 Pass (31% pass) - Murdered Jax, had 4 return TDs, and of course ran the ball a ton

 

So in normal games he is pass heavy. Games where CJ2K hits a home-run, he starts throwing the ball immediately thereafter. Getting crushed and he's not pass heavy. At least he understood to run a lot when they were killing Jacksonville.

 

2013

In 2013 their O and D were almost identical.

TEN - OPP

Points: 362 - 381

Yds: 5390 - 5407

YPP: 5.2 - 5.3

Pass: 3496 - 3612

Rush: 1894 - 1795

 

And CJ2K had 1077 in his only full year with Loggains. He only had 301 (60YPG) with Loggains in 2012.

You said he passed way too much, which was not true at all. The only game in 2012 where they passed a lot when they were in the game was the Indy game. In the Houston game they were down 21-3 at half, so you could expect them to pass more than run, which they did. They were down 30-0 at half against GB, so again, they were playing from behind and passing more. So where did I assume wrong, in one game? The other games you listed completely supported my argument. They were balanced or even ran more than passed when they won, and passed more when they lost or were behind. Most teams do.

[scs787]

Here's some more info to throw out there in this debate...Saw this in an article..

 

 

It's easy to leap right to the idea that what we saw over the final month of the season is what we'd see next season with Loggains at the helm. That's a mistake. Loggains and Munchak both made it clear when Palmer was fired that Dowell wouldn't even attempt to implement his offense this season. His primary move was to strip down Chris Palmer's concepts. So to take those few games as a representation of what Dowell wants to run isn't fair, and almost certainly isn't accurate

 

And again, you can't ignore the fact that in his full year as OC they were 10th in rushing attempts and 23rd in passing attempts.

[AZ54]

I got this one wrong and Gase is gone. Except I did get it right that a lesser profile club (Miami) would jump toward the less experienced candidates. I don't think that's a good situation for any new HC to be in but best of luck to him. If he thought Martellus Bennett was hard to deal with wait to see him handle Suh and his $20mil/yr deal.

[AZ54]

I got this one wrong and Gase is gone. Except I did get it right that a lesser profile club (Miami) would jump toward the less experienced candidates. I don't think that's a good situation for any new HC to be in but best of luck to him. If he thought Martellus Bennett was hard to deal with wait to see him handle Suh and his $20mil/yr deal.

[Mongo3451]

I got this one wrong and Gase is gone. Except I did get it right that a lesser profile club (Miami) would jump toward the less experienced candidates. I don't think that's a good situation for any new HC to be in but best of luck to him. If he thought Martellus Bennett was hard to deal with wait to see him handle Suh and his $20mil/yr deal.

I too thought Gase would stay one more year. He must be one of those guys that can take over a room, because his body of work is not there yet. Will he be Josh Mcdaniels or Mike Tomlin?