Carson Wentz or Paxton Lynch

[DABEARSDABOMB]

I realize this is a total left field comment, but these are two QB's, who some top NFL people (Greg Gabriel being one of) have raved about. Lynch is probably off the board, but Wentz is another guy who gets high marks. Both of these guys have a ton of talent and would benefit from an organization who has a stability in the coaching ranks and ideally the ability to be patient (as they need to develop). Given that we are getting a 2nd 1st round pick this year (i.e., White's return) and have a ton of money available to make free agent signings (including the ability to poach two young players from Denver's top D where Fox has an existing connection), would this actually be the best time to pick the QB (when we don't really need it...this presumes that Pace, Fox & company all think highly of whomever the QB is)?

 

 

Two good write-ups from Greg Gabriel (former Bear front office guy...and we can gripe about him, but he has a pretty long history of success). I'd rank him significantly higher than any of the other "draftnicks" including Kiper, etc. This guy lived and breathed it over a long, successful career.

 

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/breaki...b-carson-wentz/

 

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/breaki...k-paxton-lynch/

 

 

 

[jason]

Not only no, but hell no.

 

I watched several of Lynch's games, and I don't think he is a can't miss guy. He wasn't even on the first round radar until about midseason.

 

As for Wentz, he's an FCS QB. I think he looked like a stud in the two games I saw, but he's still a FCS QB, going against FCS competition, and it's too difficult to gauge.

 

Aside from that, the most important thing is the Bears currently have a QB who, no matter how much people sometimes hate him, is top 15 in the league. On top of that, he probably has top 5 physical talent. On top of that, the team has a ton of holes elsewhere. On top of that, the team is transitioning from a 4-3 to a 3-4, and can't afford to take a rookie QB in round one.

 

To reiterate, hell no.

[Chitownhustla]

I realize this is a total left field comment, but these are two QB's, who some top NFL people (Greg Gabriel being one of) have raved about. Lynch is probably off the board, but Wentz is another guy who gets high marks. Both of these guys have a ton of talent and would benefit from an organization who has a stability in the coaching ranks and ideally the ability to be patient (as they need to develop). Given that we are getting a 2nd 1st round pick this year (i.e., White's return) and have a ton of money available to make free agent signings (including the ability to poach two young players from Denver's top D where Fox has an existing connection), would this actually be the best time to pick the QB (when we don't really need it...this presumes that Pace, Fox & company all think highly of whomever the QB is)?

 

 

Two good write-ups from Greg Gabriel (former Bear front office guy...and we can gripe about him, but he has a pretty long history of success). I'd rank him significantly higher than any of the other "draftnicks" including Kiper, etc. This guy lived and breathed it over a long, successful career.

 

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/breaki...b-carson-wentz/

 

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/breaki...k-paxton-lynch/

 

Once we see what Pace does in FA I would then be able to say what I think about this. Right now I think for the team to win now they cant go QB with the 1st, 2nd and 3rd. Hell with what Pace did in the 4th and 5th last year I would say those rounds too. Will Pace find the same caliber of players in round 4 and 5 like Langford and Amos.....I dont see it happening every year but one can hope!

 

 

As far as drafting a qb in the earlier rounds if Pace and Company feel a QB has the IT factor and they want to start preparing for the future then I get why they would do it. I love the idea of drafting a guy to groom, I just think with the talent on this roster they wont be doing it until next years draft, this one is too soon. Cutler will be 33 or 34 come next year, I think its a perfect time to get a guy and let him learn the system for two years. Cutler contract is team friendly from here on out so there is no rush. Build a young talent rich roster the next two years and by the time the new QB is ready to go the team will be in the best shape possible to win.

 

 

[scs787]

Yeah, no.

[DABEARSDABOMB]

Once we see what Pace does in FA I would then be able to say what I think about this. Right now I think for the team to win now they cant go QB with the 1st, 2nd and 3rd. Hell with what Pace did in the 4th and 5th last year I would say those rounds too. Will Pace find the same caliber of players in round 4 and 5 like Langford and Amos.....I dont see it happening every year but one can hope!

 

 

As far as drafting a qb in the earlier rounds if Pace and Company feel a QB has the IT factor and they want to start preparing for the future then I get why they would do it. I love the idea of drafting a guy to groom, I just think with the talent on this roster they wont be doing it until next years draft, this one is too soon. Cutler will be 33 or 34 come next year, I think its a perfect time to get a guy and let him learn the system for two years. Cutler contract is team friendly from here on out so there is no rush. Build a young talent rich roster the next two years and by the time the new QB is ready to go the team will be in the best shape possible to win.

The conundrum in this is, you are building to get better, so your pick will only get worse. It is rare to have these types of lower D1 talent available, who might truly be undervalued. I argue while the risk is their, the impacts make sense and now actually makes more sense than using a QB on a pick 2 years from now...at that point, you know you are in for some growing pains with the young QB and you just finished developing your team (while Jay is getting older). I say, if the right QB is their, you take him now and its even easier to do in a year where you get White back plus have massive cap room and luckily the FA market has a lot of available options at the critical positions.

 

By the way, I think if you go with Wentz, it is likely a trade down and you are looking at late teens vs. 11. Lynch probably ends up moving all the way up to #1 overall.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

I realize this is a total left field comment, but these are two QB's, who some top NFL people (Greg Gabriel being one of) have raved about. Lynch is probably off the board, but Wentz is another guy who gets high marks. Both of these guys have a ton of talent and would benefit from an organization who has a stability in the coaching ranks and ideally the ability to be patient (as they need to develop). Given that we are getting a 2nd 1st round pick this year (i.e., White's return) and have a ton of money available to make free agent signings (including the ability to poach two young players from Denver's top D where Fox has an existing connection), would this actually be the best time to pick the QB (when we don't really need it...this presumes that Pace, Fox & company all think highly of whomever the QB is)?

 

 

Two good write-ups from Greg Gabriel (former Bear front office guy...and we can gripe about him, but he has a pretty long history of success). I'd rank him significantly higher than any of the other "draftnicks" including Kiper, etc. This guy lived and breathed it over a long, successful career.

 

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/breaki...b-carson-wentz/

 

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/breaki...k-paxton-lynch/

 

First to Jason's illusion that Cutler is a 'top 15' QB. You show me top 15 (THIS YEAR- certainly not career) and I'll show you other starting QBs this year of Hoyer, Romo-Weeden-Romo-Cassel-Moore, just about anyone besides Manziel in a Browns uniform, Matt Hasselbeck, Kaepernick or what's his name in SF (I can't remember which was their starter) and about 2-3 others in Philly. On that level perhaps I'll give you 'top 15' this year.

 

On that note and with all due respect to Gabriel perhaps one of these two guys do figure into the equation...but in later rounds. As much as it pains me to agree with Jason I think our team needs to address some other positions, especially on defense and especially if we're going to give Fangio a shot at making our defense elite again. Besides that I'm still of the opinion that I'd like to see what Fales has to offer. They do have some tape to review for certain.

[Chitownhustla]

The conundrum in this is, you are building to get better, so your pick will only get worse. It is rare to have these types of lower D1 talent available, who might truly be undervalued. I argue while the risk is their, the impacts make sense and now actually makes more sense than using a QB on a pick 2 years from now...at that point, you know you are in for some growing pains with the young QB and you just finished developing your team (while Jay is getting older). I say, if the right QB is their, you take him now and its even easier to do in a year where you get White back plus have massive cap room and luckily the FA market has a lot of available options at the critical positions.

 

By the way, I think if you go with Wentz, it is likely a trade down and you are looking at late teens vs. 11. Lynch probably ends up moving all the way up to #1 overall.

 

 

I totally get what you are saying. I just dont think they go QB in first. Its just too early. I will say you never know, Pace may fall in love with a certain QB. I bet if there is a QB with the same qualities that Drew Brees (just a little taller, lol) has Pace will fall in love with him. You draft a QB early Im calling it right now, there will be a huge QB controversy in Chicago.

[adam]

Based on Pace's comments, it will be whoever is BPA at the time of our selection. If QB is the BPA, I wouldn't be shocked if he pulled the trigger. However, it is one of the few singular positions on the team. You can only have one QB on the field at a time, no other position other than Center can say that (and you can even slide them to Guard). So if there is BPA in any position other than QB, it can help us now and in long term. Going QB in the first would be a huge investment by the organization in a position we are already heavily invested in.

 

If it was me, I would not go QB this year.

[Connorbear]

Rodgers was drafted by the Pack and sat on the bench for 3 years. However, we have so many gaps in talent that drafting a QB in the first would be foolish.

 

Peace

 

[ASHKUM BEAR]

With Wentz climbing boards, and he may end up at the top, the better it gets for the Bears. If 3 QBs get selected before we pick, that I leaves 8 players dropping. If one is available at 11, maybe STL will want to trade up to build some LA hype. I would gladly trade down to 15 and take a 2nd and possibly a 2017 2nd RD pick.

1-Reggie Ragland LB

2-Cody Whitehair OG or Christian Hackenberg QB

2-Shaun Oakman DT

3-Best SS Karl Joeseph, Jeremy Cash etc

4-Lloyd Carrington CB

 

[Stinger226]

I realize this is a total left field comment, but these are two QB's, who some top NFL people (Greg Gabriel being one of) have raved about. Lynch is probably off the board, but Wentz is another guy who gets high marks. Both of these guys have a ton of talent and would benefit from an organization who has a stability in the coaching ranks and ideally the ability to be patient (as they need to develop). Given that we are getting a 2nd 1st round pick this year (i.e., White's return) and have a ton of money available to make free agent signings (including the ability to poach two young players from Denver's top D where Fox has an existing connection), would this actually be the best time to pick the QB (when we don't really need it...this presumes that Pace, Fox & company all think highly of whomever the QB is)?

 

 

Two good write-ups from Greg Gabriel (former Bear front office guy...and we can gripe about him, but he has a pretty long history of success). I'd rank him significantly higher than any of the other "draftnicks" including Kiper, etc. This guy lived and breathed it over a long, successful career.

 

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/breaki...b-carson-wentz/

 

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/breaki...k-paxton-lynch/

no freaking way, just because they might be good prospects doesnt mean we draft a QB at 11.

We have a QB that can take us to a good place, we should draft a prospect in the 5th or 6th round that we can groom for 3 or 4 years from now.

Someone like Brandon Doughty or Kevin Hogan.

[AZ54]

I don't think these QBs are that good and they are moving up simply because they are QBs. Lynch has a lot of question marks. Wentz is coming out of nowhere. We have far too many needs right now. The right time to draft the QB is when we hit the next deep QB draft and can find a decent talent in late Rd 1.

[AZ54]

First to Jason's illusion that Cutler is a 'top 15' QB. You show me top 15 (THIS YEAR- certainly not career) and I'll show you other starting QBs this year of Hoyer, Romo-Weeden-Romo-Cassel-Moore, just about anyone besides Manziel in a Browns uniform, Matt Hasselbeck, Kaepernick or what's his name in SF (I can't remember which was their starter) and about 2-3 others in Philly. On that level perhaps I'll give you 'top 15' this year.

 

On that note and with all due respect to Gabriel perhaps one of these two guys do figure into the equation...but in later rounds. As much as it pains me to agree with Jason I think our team needs to address some other positions, especially on defense and especially if we're going to give Fangio a shot at making our defense elite again. Besides that I'm still of the opinion that I'd like to see what Fales has to offer. They do have some tape to review for certain.

 

 

I happen to agree that Cutler is a top 15 QB. I guess that makes me delusional as well. I won't use QBR since we've proven that to be complete BS. Even ESPN cites it only when it "fits" the narrative.

 

Total yards: Cutler is 19th but missed most of two games, and is 250yards from the 15th spot. For comparison Aaron Rodgers is 17th with two more games played. I feel comfortable that he'd be right at 15th, or better, if we had something closer to a 2 starting WRs playing most games instead of practice squad guys being out there.

 

Comp%: Cutler is tied for 12th among qualified QBs (meaning need enough attempts) with Brady and Flacco. Notables below Cutler on this list are: Peyton Manning, Eli Manning, Palmer, Tannehill, Carr, Rodgers, Cam Newton, and Andrew Luck.

 

Yards/att: Cutler is 11th. Notables below him are: Ryan, Rivers, Bridgewater, Stafford, Carr, P. Manning, Flacco, Rodgers, and Luck.

 

INTs: hard to sort out the "qualified" QBs and actual ranking but Cutler had 11 INTs which puts him somewhere in the middle of the pack. Worse than him are: Luck, Flacco, Carr, Stafford, Rivers, Matt Ryan, Roethlisberger, Manning brothers (again). Better than him: Newton, Rodgers, Bridgewater, Wilson, and Brady

 

INT/Attempt: 20th

INT/game: 11th in the league.

 

Yds/game: Cutler is 23rd.

 

Cutler will never be Brady on the INT front but I think he can get to the same performance level the Cardinals are getting out of Carson Palmer. I've watched a lot of Carson Palmer when he was throwing more INTs than Cutler in recent years.

[jason]

I happen to agree that Cutler is a top 15 QB. I guess that makes me delusional as well. I won't use QBR since we've proven that to be complete BS. Even ESPN cites it only when it "fits" the narrative.

 

Total yards: Cutler is 19th but missed most of two games, and is 250yards from the 15th spot. For comparison Aaron Rodgers is 17th with two more games played. I feel comfortable that he'd be right at 15th, or better, if we had something closer to a 2 starting WRs playing most games instead of practice squad guys being out there.

 

Comp%: Cutler is tied for 12th among qualified QBs (meaning need enough attempts) with Brady and Flacco. Notables below Cutler on this list are: Peyton Manning, Eli Manning, Palmer, Tannehill, Carr, Rodgers, Cam Newton, and Andrew Luck.

 

Yards/att: Cutler is 11th. Notables below him are: Ryan, Rivers, Bridgewater, Stafford, Carr, P. Manning, Flacco, Rodgers, and Luck.

 

INTs: hard to sort out the "qualified" QBs and actual ranking but Cutler had 11 INTs which puts him somewhere in the middle of the pack. Worse than him are: Luck, Flacco, Carr, Stafford, Rivers, Matt Ryan, Roethlisberger, Manning brothers (again). Better than him: Newton, Rodgers, Bridgewater, Wilson, and Brady

 

INT/Attempt: 20th

INT/game: 11th in the league.

 

Yds/game: Cutler is 23rd.

 

Cutler will never be Brady on the INT front but I think he can get to the same performance level the Cardinals are getting out of Carson Palmer. I've watched a lot of Carson Palmer when he was throwing more INTs than Cutler in recent years.

 

 

Thanks. I didn't feel like it was worth the effort.

[adam]

I happen to agree that Cutler is a top 15 QB. I guess that makes me delusional as well. I won't use QBR since we've proven that to be complete BS. Even ESPN cites it only when it "fits" the narrative.

 

Total yards: Cutler is 19th but missed most of two games, and is 250yards from the 15th spot. For comparison Aaron Rodgers is 17th with two more games played. I feel comfortable that he'd be right at 15th, or better, if we had something closer to a 2 starting WRs playing most games instead of practice squad guys being out there.

 

Comp%: Cutler is tied for 12th among qualified QBs (meaning need enough attempts) with Brady and Flacco. Notables below Cutler on this list are: Peyton Manning, Eli Manning, Palmer, Tannehill, Carr, Rodgers, Cam Newton, and Andrew Luck.

 

Yards/att: Cutler is 11th. Notables below him are: Ryan, Rivers, Bridgewater, Stafford, Carr, P. Manning, Flacco, Rodgers, and Luck.

 

INTs: hard to sort out the "qualified" QBs and actual ranking but Cutler had 11 INTs which puts him somewhere in the middle of the pack. Worse than him are: Luck, Flacco, Carr, Stafford, Rivers, Matt Ryan, Roethlisberger, Manning brothers (again). Better than him: Newton, Rodgers, Bridgewater, Wilson, and Brady

 

INT/Attempt: 20th

INT/game: 11th in the league.

 

Yds/game: Cutler is 23rd.

 

Cutler will never be Brady on the INT front but I think he can get to the same performance level the Cardinals are getting out of Carson Palmer. I've watched a lot of Carson Palmer when he was throwing more INTs than Cutler in recent years.

Using DVOA (Defense-adjusted Value Over Average) which is way better than QBR as it takes the defense into account, Cutler was 9th. Also, an interesting note about Cutler, look at these QB Rating splits for sides of the field:

 

72.1 QB Rating (Wide Right)

85.9 QB Rating (Right)

109.9 QB Rating (Left)

107.2 QB Rating (Wide Left)

 

He was elite throwing to the left and mediocre/average throwing to the right. I thought that was interesting.

[ASHKUM BEAR]

Using DVOA (Defense-adjusted Value Over Average) which is way better than QBR as it takes the defense into account, Cutler was 9th. Also, an interesting note about Cutler, look at these QB Rating splits for sides of the field:

 

72.1 QB Rating (Wide Right)

85.9 QB Rating (Right)

109.9 QB Rating (Left)

107.2 QB Rating (Wide Left)

 

He was elite throwing to the left and mediocre/average throwing to the right. I thought that was interesting.

Doesn't AJ usually line up on the left? It also makes sense because he is right handed and throwing right takes extra steps to turn the body.

[Chitownhustla]

I happen to agree that Cutler is a top 15 QB. I guess that makes me delusional as well. I won't use QBR since we've proven that to be complete BS. Even ESPN cites it only when it "fits" the narrative.

 

Total yards: Cutler is 19th but missed most of two games, and is 250yards from the 15th spot. For comparison Aaron Rodgers is 17th with two more games played. I feel comfortable that he'd be right at 15th, or better, if we had something closer to a 2 starting WRs playing most games instead of practice squad guys being out there.

 

Comp%: Cutler is tied for 12th among qualified QBs (meaning need enough attempts) with Brady and Flacco. Notables below Cutler on this list are: Peyton Manning, Eli Manning, Palmer, Tannehill, Carr, Rodgers, Cam Newton, and Andrew Luck.

 

Yards/att: Cutler is 11th. Notables below him are: Ryan, Rivers, Bridgewater, Stafford, Carr, P. Manning, Flacco, Rodgers, and Luck.

 

INTs: hard to sort out the "qualified" QBs and actual ranking but Cutler had 11 INTs which puts him somewhere in the middle of the pack. Worse than him are: Luck, Flacco, Carr, Stafford, Rivers, Matt Ryan, Roethlisberger, Manning brothers (again). Better than him: Newton, Rodgers, Bridgewater, Wilson, and Brady

 

INT/Attempt: 20th

INT/game: 11th in the league.

 

Yds/game: Cutler is 23rd.

 

Cutler will never be Brady on the INT front but I think he can get to the same performance level the Cardinals are getting out of Carson Palmer. I've watched a lot of Carson Palmer when he was throwing more INTs than Cutler in recent years.

 

 

With it being the entire offenses first year in this system, oline performance and total lack of talent at WR due to injuries i think Cutlers stars are remarkable. Cutler is easily a Top 15 QB.

 

[Alaskan Grizzly]

I happen to agree that Cutler is a top 15 QB. I guess that makes me delusional as well. I won't use QBR since we've proven that to be complete BS. Even ESPN cites it only when it "fits" the narrative.

 

Total yards: Cutler is 19th but missed most of two games, and is 250yards from the 15th spot. For comparison Aaron Rodgers is 17th with two more games played. I feel comfortable that he'd be right at 15th, or better, if we had something closer to a 2 starting WRs playing most games instead of practice squad guys being out there.

 

Comp%: Cutler is tied for 12th among qualified QBs (meaning need enough attempts) with Brady and Flacco. Notables below Cutler on this list are: Peyton Manning, Eli Manning, Palmer, Tannehill, Carr, Rodgers, Cam Newton, and Andrew Luck.

 

Yards/att: Cutler is 11th. Notables below him are: Ryan, Rivers, Bridgewater, Stafford, Carr, P. Manning, Flacco, Rodgers, and Luck.

 

INTs: hard to sort out the "qualified" QBs and actual ranking but Cutler had 11 INTs which puts him somewhere in the middle of the pack. Worse than him are: Luck, Flacco, Carr, Stafford, Rivers, Matt Ryan, Roethlisberger, Manning brothers (again). Better than him: Newton, Rodgers, Bridgewater, Wilson, and Brady

 

INT/Attempt: 20th

INT/game: 11th in the league.

 

Yds/game: Cutler is 23rd.

 

Cutler will never be Brady on the INT front but I think he can get to the same performance level the Cardinals are getting out of Carson Palmer. I've watched a lot of Carson Palmer when he was throwing more INTs than Cutler in recent years.

 

I actually agreed he was probably 15th... THIS YEAR. And comparing him to the M*A*S*H units that are QBs for some teams. Half of the players that were listed under Cutler in some categories hardly played half the year. So yeah, 15th is very probable. Especially for this year. Career wise... Not so much.

[lemonej]

With the backup QB one hard sack away from being on the field, how comfortable is everyone with the backup QB? Right now its David Fales and he hasn't taken a meaningful snap and was only put on the 53 man roster because someone wanted to sign him to their 53 man roster.So for those of you who think Cutler is a top 15 talent what happens if Cutler is out for the season? That reason alone is why a QB could be an option in their first 3 picks.

[jason]

With the backup QB one hard sack away from being on the field, how comfortable is everyone with the backup QB? Right now its David Fales and he hasn't taken a meaningful snap and was only put on the 53 man roster because someone wanted to sign him to their 53 man roster.So for those of you who think Cutler is a top 15 talent what happens if Cutler is out for the season? That reason alone is why a QB could be an option in their first 3 picks.

 

If my house ends up being in a tornado, flood, or lava zone, I don't buy another house in the area as a backup plan. I buy massive insurance and hope my house doesn't crumble under the pressure.

[ASHKUM BEAR]

If my house ends up being in a tornado, flood, or lava zone, I don't buy another house in the area as a backup plan. I buy massive insurance and hope my house doesn't crumble under the pressure.

A QB in RDs 1-3 doesn't give you anymore insurance than what we have already in Fales. Fales at least has 3 years of NFL coaching. If they want a true back up plan, signing a vet would be the way to go.

 

This draft the Bears can fill some voids on defense and offensive line.

[jason]

A QB in RDs 1-3 doesn't give you anymore insurance than what we have already in Fales. Fales at least has 3 years of NFL coaching. If they want a true back up plan, signing a vet would be the way to go.

 

This draft the Bears can fill some voids on defense and offensive line.

 

You misunderstood my post. In my analogy, the insurance is OL. If someone, anyone, is worried about Cutler's health or performance, then ensuring he's never touched is the first thing to fixing those potential issues.

[ASHKUM BEAR]

You misunderstood my post. In my analogy, the insurance is OL. If someone, anyone, is worried about Cutler's health or performance, then ensuring he's never touched is the first thing to fixing those potential issues.

 

I meant to reply to Lemons message, read yours and ended up putting my post under yours.

 

He said they may take a QB in the top 3 for Cutlers back up plan. My thought is a top 3 RD pick is no more known than Fales.

 

I agree, upgrading the oline is a better investment if you are in tornado alley.

 

 

 

 

 

[Alaskan Grizzly]

If my house ends up being in a tornado, flood, or lava zone, I don't buy another house in the area as a backup plan. I buy massive insurance and hope my house doesn't crumble under the pressure.

 

Normal people try to sell or rid themselves of it. Not spend more on ridiculous premiums hoping the disaster will bypass them. You shoulda never bought the house in the first place and spent all that money. With all those potential flaws, you shoulda gotten a newer, younger and better house in a different location. ?

[scs787]

Normal people try to sell or rid themselves of it. Not spend more on ridiculous premiums hoping the disaster will bypass them. You shoulda never bought the house in the first place and spent all that money. With all those potential flaws, you shoulda gotten a newer, younger and betHouses"use in a difmarkelion. ?

 

The market is down for real estate this coming year. 2 of the too "Houses" on the market are thriving in a bad market (Wentz and Lynch didn't play top competition).

 

This to me just isn't the year to draft a QB in the first round. I liked Lynch a lot at one point but not as a first rounder. Wentz is projected so high because the QB draft class blows.

 

(Your quote got messed up due to my tablet being on the fritz)