College Championship Thoughts

[AZ54]

This was a game filled with players who will affect the draft on the first two days. I only saw the 2nd half and it's recorded so I'll likely go back and watch it all. For now...

 

Jonathan Allen: In two college playoff games I've yet to be impressed. I don't see the game wrecker I was expecting to see but he can also be holding back a bit knowing he's about to make $30 or 40mil. His stat line was good 7 tackles, 1 sack so one of these days I'll go back and watch the game and focus even more on him, unless of course our friends at Draftbreakdown cut it up.

 

DeShaun Watson: Speaking of making $30 or $40mil there is no way to watch that game and not come away thinking Watson is the first pick in the draft. On the game's biggest stage against a defense loaded with NFL talent he was spectacular in the 2nd half. He was under some intense pressure at times and took some big hits and still held onto the ball and his composure. If you're the owner of the Browns who recently suffered through the Johnny Manziel era Watson's leadership on the field as well as his answers in interviews afterward had to catch your attention. There is zero chance he's not a top 10 pick, and it's quite possible he goes first overall because he won't be there for the Brown's second 1st Rd pick.

 

 

 

[killakrzydav]

It should be interesting to see our posters flip flop to Watson at #3.

[jason]

I still don't want a QB at #3, but it does destroy my man-crush dreams of getting him in the 2nd round. I compared him to Cam Newton earlier, and that game solidified the comparison in terms of a dual-threat QB who is just dominating. He's the only QB to throw for 400+ yards in a national championship game, and he's done it twice in a row.

 

What excites me about it, however, is the thought that everyone is going to blow up Trubisky, and the draft could start QB/QB. Please gimme some of that, because Myles Garrett has been #1 all along.

[killakrzydav]

I'm curious Jason as to what position do you think he'd play here ....DE or OLB?. Also, what is it you see about him that makes him the transcendent talent that our franchise needs?

[DABEARSDABOMB]

Watson looked good. I still can't ignore his inconsistent accuracy, but he clearly has the NFL arm strength and plenty of moxy and obviously he's a good athlete. I'd still argue with Jason that he isn't Cam, I think his body & build is much more akin to Dak then say Cam. Like I have said all along, at least 2 QB's are going in those top 3 picks and I wouldn't be shocked if the top 3 picks were all QB's.

[dawhizz]

Watson played great within the offense, which you can't fault him for, but I didn't see a bunch of "NFL throws" (he did gun a couple of out routes and his best throw may have been the one Leggett dropped on 3rd down when he scrambled a bit). A lot of his throws were screens, timed back shoulder throws, and the "up for grabs" balls that Williams just went and got. Honestly, it's the same type of success we saw other running college QBs like EJ Manual succeed in. He's nowhere near the physical runner that Cam Newton was - Newton came out at 6'5" 248, Watson is 6'2" 210 - and I don't even think he's as fast as Newton was. I would have no problem with him in the 2nd (though I don't think he'll be there), but not in the first.

[jason]

I'm curious Jason as to what position do you think he'd play here ....DE or OLB?. Also, what is it you see about him that makes him the transcendent talent that our franchise needs?

 

Oh, Myles Garrett or Jonathan Allen are both 5T DEs in a 3-4. Make no mistake.

 

As for what makes him special, well, what doesn't? He's a rare combination of strength, speed, size, athleticism, agility, etc. He's a

He's double teamed all the time and still causes havoc. Check out some highlights or analysis (1B, 1C, 1D) and it's plainly apparent. I've even read where PFF (LOL) has all sorts of advanced metrics about pass rushing that makes a case for why he should have been considered for the Heisman.

 

I leave you with a great highlight video:

 

[Mongo3451]

Loved what I saw from Watson from a leadership and read/react perspective. I do have concerns with accuracy and delivery. Is what I loved seeing good enough?

[AZ54]

Oh, Myles Garrett or Jonathan Allen are both 5T DEs in a 3-4. Make no mistake. As for what makes him special, well, what doesn't? He's a rare combination of strength, speed, size, athleticism, agility, etc. He's a

He's double teamed all the time and still causes havoc. Check out some highlights or analysis (1B, 1C, 1D) and it's plainly apparent. I've even read where PFF (LOL) has all sorts of advanced metrics about pass rushing that makes a case for why he should have been considered for the Heisman. I leave you with a great highlight video:

 

No way does Garrett belong as a 5T DE, with that rare combination of explosiveness, strength and the ability to bend the edge he absolutely belongs on the outside. He does have the strength to move inside occasionally, and will be a beast on stunts with his ability to convert speed-to-power, but I don't see him making a living as a 5T. He's young and he's already tossing around OTs with his lower body strength. He will dominate his edge as well in the running game handling both gaps. McPhee also does this very well but he doesn't have the burst to convert back to a pass rush like Garrett.

 

A player like Garrett on the edge makes an OC start taking plays off the table. That right there makes the rest of the defense better. If he's there at #3 take him.

 

 

[jason]

No way does Garrett belong as a 5T DE, with that rare combination of explosiveness, strength and the ability to bend the edge he absolutely belongs on the outside. He does have the strength to move inside occasionally, and will be a beast on stunts with his ability to convert speed-to-power, but I don't see him making a living as a 5T. He's young and he's already tossing around OTs with his lower body strength. He will dominate his edge as well in the running game handling both gaps. McPhee also does this very well but he doesn't have the burst to convert back to a pass rush like Garrett.

 

A player like Garrett on the edge makes an OC start taking plays off the table. That right there makes the rest of the defense better. If he's there at #3 take him.

 

Technically, the 5T is the edge-setter, but I understand what you're saying.

 

Personally, I think he can play either 1 or 2-gap 5T. He can be the 2-gap 5T because of the strength you alluded to, which is only going to get better with NFL technique, coaching, and additional strength. His freak athleticism could put him at the 1-gap 5T. I think he could do well as an OLB in a 3-4, just like you. The Bears, however, currently need a 5T more, and since the 5T lines up outside the tackle, it's perfect for his skill set. I hate to even link it, but if he were drafted, I'd want to see a spike in the 6T or 7T usage like JJ Watt (similar size/skillset) has in this PFF breakdown.

 

[AZ54]

Technically, the 5T is the edge-setter, but I understand what you're saying.

 

Personally, I think he can play either 1 or 2-gap 5T. He can be the 2-gap 5T because of the strength you alluded to, which is only going to get better with NFL technique, coaching, and additional strength. His freak athleticism could put him at the 1-gap 5T. I think he could do well as an OLB in a 3-4, just like you. The Bears, however, currently need a 5T more, and since the 5T lines up outside the tackle, it's perfect for his skill set. I hate to even link it, but if he were drafted, I'd want to see a spike in the 6T or 7T usage like JJ Watt (similar size/skillset) has in this PFF breakdown.

 

That context is different from my understanding of the 5T which I thought was inside the OT. Outside the OT is where GArrett belongs, so we're in agreement and he absolutely has the ability to go out as far as the wide 9 although with that strength I'd keep him in closer.

 

I assume the 6T and 7T are spots over and outside the TE. I can't imagine any TE who wants to, or can, match up against Garrett especially in today's NFL where TE's are more of the move types. They are going to lose big on either power or speed which means their OT has to be occupied with Garrett as well. That leaves a nice consistent gap (meaning play after play) for the LB to cover the run or blitz into.

 

This is the NFL so most teams can cover him with double teams but we have Floyd on the other side and some beef up the middle in Goldman and Hicks that can't often be handled one on one. It's been a long time since we had a defensive front like the '85 Bears but Garrett, along with an improved Floyd and Goldman, could see a return to that kind of dominance.

[adam]

Technically, the 5T is the edge-setter, but I understand what you're saying.

 

Personally, I think he can play either 1 or 2-gap 5T. He can be the 2-gap 5T because of the strength you alluded to, which is only going to get better with NFL technique, coaching, and additional strength. His freak athleticism could put him at the 1-gap 5T. I think he could do well as an OLB in a 3-4, just like you. The Bears, however, currently need a 5T more, and since the 5T lines up outside the tackle, it's perfect for his skill set. I hate to even link it, but if he were drafted, I'd want to see a spike in the 6T or 7T usage like JJ Watt (similar size/skillset) has in this PFF breakdown.

I thought a 5T was a DE directly over the OT in a 3-4?

[killakrzydav]

A 5t lines up on the outside shoulder of the offensive tackle.

[jason]

That context is different from my understanding of the 5T which I thought was inside the OT. Outside the OT is where GArrett belongs, so we're in agreement and he absolutely has the ability to go out as far as the wide 9 although with that strength I'd keep him in closer.

 

I assume the 6T and 7T are spots over and outside the TE. I can't imagine any TE who wants to, or can, match up against Garrett especially in today's NFL where TE's are more of the move types. They are going to lose big on either power or speed which means their OT has to be occupied with Garrett as well. That leaves a nice consistent gap (meaning play after play) for the LB to cover the run or blitz into.

 

This is the NFL so most teams can cover him with double teams but we have Floyd on the other side and some beef up the middle in Goldman and Hicks that can't often be handled one on one. It's been a long time since we had a defensive front like the '85 Bears but Garrett, along with an improved Floyd and Goldman, could see a return to that kind of dominance.

 

 

I thought a 5T was a DE directly over the OT in a 3-4?

 

 

The 5T in a 3-4 formation is traditionally lined up on the outside shoulder of an OT. Nose over some call it, meaning the DE's nose is over the OT's outside shoulder. Some schemes call on that DE to blast straight into the OT, being responsible for the B-Gap and C-Gap, which I think Garrett can do. Doing that too often would be a mismanagement of his skill-set, however. A lot of time the 5T in a 3-4 is responsible for blasting the outside edge of the OT and helping to collapse the pocket. But there seems to be a growing trend in the NFL from what I've seen (I don't have data on it), that the more athletic guys in that position are being lined up a bit wider (6T=head up with the TE & 7T=D-Gap outside the TE) and being used to simply go after the QB from as wide a position possible. This collapses the pocket, and gives the DE more momentum for contact/bull-rush, but it has - what I believe is the increase - the flexibility of using the DE and the OLB interchangeably in zone-blitz packages.