What if...

[jason]

What if the Bears had just gone with the Everyone Agrees Mock, or players similar when we missed on slotting?

 

2017 EVERYONE AGREES MOCK - VER 3.2 (Post-FA)

1. Jamal Adams, FS, LSU - He'd definitely be starting.

2. DeShone Kizer, QB, Notre Dame - He'd be sitting behind Glennon, and it wouldn't feel as bad.

3. Cooper Kupp, WR, E. Wash - Several wanted a big WR. Here he is.

4. Tarik Cohen, RB, NCA&T - I think we're all happy with this one.

4. Jordan Leggett, TE, Clemson - Offensive weapon in deep draft.

5. Will Holden or Roderick Johnson, OT - Bring someone, anyone in to compete

7. Zane Gonzalez, K, AZ State - No need to bring Aguayo in. Zane is currently 100% on FGs, XPs, and 6/7 on kickoffs for touchback.

 

That's a better team, folks. And it's essentially what several of us wanted all along.

 

[DABEARSDABOMB]

If Trubisky is a franchise QB, I'd give up the entire rest of the draft if need be. While I am curious to see what comes of Shaheen, I have nothing glaring to complain about thus far when it comes to our 2017 draft. Trubisky has given me as much hope as I could ask to out of a high QB pick and Cohen has looked fantastic (albeit there was the stupid special teams play). Eddie Jackson looks like he could have a future at safety. Jury is still out on most of these guys, but obviously Shaheen hasn't shown much in limited action, but I know a lot of scouts, etc, raved about what he was doing in practice, albeit referenced the fact that he was still really raw and it was going to take him some time to learn the league.

 

Cooper Kupp would look amazing right now.

[ASHKUM BEAR]

What if the Bears had just gone with the Everyone Agrees Mock, or players similar when we missed on slotting?

 

2017 EVERYONE AGREES MOCK - VER 3.2 (Post-FA)

1. Jamal Adams, FS, LSU - He'd definitely be starting.

2. DeShone Kizer, QB, Notre Dame - He'd be sitting behind Glennon, and it wouldn't feel as bad.

3. Cooper Kupp, WR, E. Wash - Several wanted a big WR. Here he is.

4. Tarik Cohen, RB, NCA&T - I think we're all happy with this one.

4. Jordan Leggett, TE, Clemson - Offensive weapon in deep draft.

5. Will Holden or Roderick Johnson, OT - Bring someone, anyone in to compete

7. Zane Gonzalez, K, AZ State - No need to bring Aguayo in. Zane is currently 100% on FGs, XPs, and 6/7 on kickoffs for touchback.

 

That's a better team, folks. And it's essentially what several of us wanted all along.

That would work. Then Trubisky becomes the next NFL great and we kick ourselves knowing we could have had him.. Hell, we are Bears fans we will be kicking ourselves anyways. For some reason the NFL powers above have something against us.

[jason]

That would work. Then Trubisky becomes the next NFL great and we kick ourselves knowing we could have had him.. Hell, we are Bears fans we will be kicking ourselves anyways. For some reason the NFL powers above have something against us.

 

I was never sold on Trubisky to be the stud of the class. I could have been sold on watson or Kizer too, which is why the trade up hurting so much. This team still needs several pieces, and the alternate draft would have provided more starting pieces.

 

Having said that, I feel like you're right. On the Bears, he probably fails. On another team, he lights it up. Tis being a Bears fan.

[Mongo3451]

I was never sold on Trubisky to be the stud of the class. I could have been sold on watson or Kizer too, which is why the trade up hurting so much. This team still needs several pieces, and the alternate draft would have provided more starting pieces.

 

Having said that, I feel like you're right. On the Bears, he probably fails. On another team, he lights it up. Tis being a Bears fan.

I was and still am. Here's to the future!

[AZ54]

I'm sticking with Trubisky. I liked Kizer at one point but his throws into the dirt, which continued at the combine, and continue in the NFL, plus his interviews convinced me he doesn't have the ability to win long term. Watson I never liked. He's a smart guy but he's clearly overwhelmed this early in the season.

 

For the 2018 draft from what I've seen so far among the supposedly wonderful 2018 QBs I only like Darnold. He has some limitations but I think he'll be a good QB in the NFL. Rosen is a statue and makes the occasional Cutleresque throw. The only thing I see from Josh Allen is that he needed Tanner Gentry more than Gentry needed him. Nonetheless he'll be a 1st Rd pick.

[DABEARSDABOMB]

I'm sticking with Trubisky. I liked Kizer at one point but his throws into the dirt, which continued at the combine, and continue in the NFL, plus his interviews convinced me he doesn't have the ability to win long term. Watson I never liked. He's a smart guy but he's clearly overwhelmed this early in the season.

 

For the 2018 draft from what I've seen so far among the supposedly wonderful 2018 QBs I only like Darnold. He has some limitations but I think he'll be a good QB in the NFL. Rosen is a statue and makes the occasional Cutleresque throw. The only thing I see from Josh Allen is that he needed Tanner Gentry more than Gentry needed him. Nonetheless he'll be a 1st Rd pick.

"A Year from now" the class is always better. Especially when it comes to QB's. It is because they are stll far enough away you still have all the "hype" and ignore the potential warts of the players / presume existing warts will go away. A year before Watson was drafted, everyone thought he would be awesome, another year and his ability to read defenses and throw more accurately would be enhanced, but the reality was that didn't happen. Kizer had his inconsistencies. Trubisky wasn't even on anyone's radar a year ago.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

I'm sticking with Trubisky. Watson I never liked. He's a smart guy but he's clearly overwhelmed this early in the season.

 

"Overwhlemed" you say? Uhm... please elaborate.

 

And you're convinced Trubisky is still the right choice despite his not having an official start yet?

[madlithuanian]

Just because the Bears aren't playing the better QB (ie. Tru), doesn't mean AZ isn't wrong on his assessment!

 

I'm convinced Tru should be playing right now. We will know how good he really is later. But right now, I've seen far more than enough from Glennon to last a multitude of lifetimes. I'd rather see Sanchize in there... At least he has some moxie and legitimate wins under his belt in big games. Glennon just has the ability to nibble leaves off tall trees...

 

"Overwhlemed" you say? Uhm... please elaborate.

 

And you're convinced Trubisky is still the right choice despite his not having an official start yet?

 

[Pixote]

The Bears start the season against what was considered one of the toughest schedules for the opening 4 weeks. My guess is that Pace & Fox did not want to, under any circumstances, start Trubisky during that stretch of 4 games. If Glennon is still sucking hind tit after the first 4 games I would not be at all surprised to see Trubisky take over. Just my opinion, but I think the earliest we see a change is week 5 or 6.

[BearFan2000]

to early to play the what if game, just as it takes 2-3 years to truly evaluate the players you did take it's the same with the players you didn't take. We took 5 guys Trubisky's strong preseason showing gives hope that when he does take over could be the long term answer at QB we've been searching for. In the mean time Cohen has produced outside of the dumb play on that punt return he's carving out a role for himself. Jackson has shown promise at safety. Shaheen hasn't done much but it's a crowded position at TE and Morgan is a backup.

 

As for starting Trubisky if he does start an opportune time might be been week 8 & 10 using the bye week to give him an extra week with the 1s. It would mean getting his first start at home vs the Packers. But having the extra week to prepare and practice reps should help.

 

Before the season started I was in the category of hoping that Trubisky would look good in preseason and Glennon would look average or better giving us a win win to let Trubisky sit a year, and possibly having a trade piece in Glennon. So far only one of those things has come to pass. Glennon is slow, holds the ball too long, has virtually no mobility, locks onto his WR, and generally doesn't look comfortable and in control. There has been injuries to an already thin WR group, and drops but Glennon thus far doesn't instill much confidence. So far he's proven why he's held a clipboard more than he's started. No doubt if the struggles continue the pressure to start Mitch will become suffocating.

[jason]

"Overwhlemed" you say? Uhm... please elaborate.

 

And you're convinced Trubisky is still the right choice despite his not having an official start yet?

 

I'm interested in hearing why he's overwhelmed as well. Watson was the #1 guy on my list if the Bears wanted a QB, because he was a proven winner with loads of talent. And from the first game, it appears that talent translated well to the NFL.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

Just because the Bears aren't playing the better QB (ie. Tru), doesn't mean AZ isn't wrong on his assessment!

 

I'm convinced Tru should be playing right now. We will know how good he really is later. But right now, I've seen far more than enough from Glennon to last a multitude of lifetimes. I'd rather see Sanchize in there... At least he has some moxie and legitimate wins under his belt in big games. Glennon just has the ability to nibble leaves off tall trees...

 

When I asked the question about Trubisky it was more in relation to he and Watson not so much Glennon. You'll get almost no argument from me that right now (at least after last week) my gut tells me Trubisky could be the better option between he and Glennon.

 

Personally, if Glennon continues to look like garbage; I'd say we need to see Trub sooner than later. There are plenty of reasons but one of them could be that we need to see what we got in Trubisky. At this point it looks like the Bears will be drafting high again and they'll need to know whether they should start considering having to draft another QB or not.

 

[DABEARSDABOMB]

I'm interested in hearing why he's overwhelmed as well. Watson was the #1 guy on my list if the Bears wanted a QB, because he was a proven winner with loads of talent. And from the first game, it appears that talent translated well to the NFL.

I watched a different game as you. Watson has some physical gifts, but he is generally an inaccurate passer who can't read defenses and make the tight throws. Not saying the book is out on him because it is one game, but those flaws are magnified in the NFL. Not taking away anything from how great of a college QB he was, but what I saw out of Trubisky in the preseason is better then what I saw out of Watson. I could be completely wrong, but that is what I saw.

 

I also think Dak is going to have a hell of a fall this year. In two games I've seen a guy who has limited skills that won't play at the NFL level (from a pure passing perspective). He is very smart though and that is the one thing that makes me think he can get away with a lot more. We shall see but my hot take to my boss (who is a diehard Cowboy fan) was that after week 1's big win against the Giants that I thought Dak looked pretty bad and just physically lacked the skills to be an above average / elite QB.

[madlithuanian]

Gotcha...

 

The sooner we know what we have in Tru, for better or worse...is the best.

 

When I asked the question about Trubisky it was more in relation to he and Watson not so much Glennon. You'll get almost no argument from me that right now (at least after last week) my gut tells me Trubisky could be the better option between he and Glennon.

 

Personally, if Glennon continues to look like garbage; I'd say we need to see Trub sooner than later. There are plenty of reasons but one of them could be that we need to see what we got in Trubisky. At this point it looks like the Bears will be drafting high again and they'll need to know whether they should start considering having to draft another QB or not.

 

[Alaskan Grizzly]

I watched a different game as you. Watson has some physical gifts, but he is generally an inaccurate passer who can't read defenses and make the tight throws. Not saying the book is out on him because it is one game, but those flaws are magnified in the NFL. Not taking away anything from how great of a college QB he was, but what I saw out of Trubisky in the preseason is better then what I saw out of Watson. I could be completely wrong, but that is what I saw.

 

Their stats are relatively similar through the pre-season. Trubisky had the overall edge in passing with 3 TDs but Watson as the overall in rushing with 2 TDs. Neither had any turnovers (and Watson still doesn't have any in the regular season).

 

Whether or not those are 'equalized' based on pre-season stats is tough because neither really started against a complete defense during that time. The true test will be once both are playing deep into their respective seasons. Right now Watson has the edge there.

 

[AZ54]

"Overwhlemed" you say? Uhm... please elaborate.

 

And you're convinced Trubisky is still the right choice despite his not having an official start yet?

 

You want me to elaborate on someone who can make one read and run? In that sense he's better than Glennon who can just make one read. Here's one article on his week 1 performance that "earned" him the starting job.

 

http://www.espn.com/blog/houston-texans/po...tart-him-week-2

 

He has a whopping 4.8ypc but did manage to throw for 125 yards in Week 2. That compares to cement shoes Glennon's 6.5ypc career average and 301 yards last week. Glennon has one more TD and one more INT than Watson.

 

Watson is throwing to Deandre Hopkins, Will Fuller 1st Rd pick, and Braxton Miller.

 

Even though you want a comparison to Trubisky I used Glennon's numbers because he's horrible and that offers some perspective on Watson's performance as a starter. Which is what matters most.

 

---

 

I don't believe either Watson or Kizer are ready to play in the NFL. I don't believe Trubisky is either but he's getting closer. None of this changes the fact I still believe Trubisky is the best QB among them, and has a good outlook long term.

 

For all my anxiety waiting to see Glennon get benched they are doing the right thing by making sure the rookie has his playbook down, at least enough to command the huddle within the weekly game plan. He's also learning how defenses attack our offense without getting hit, and where there are plays to be made when they blitz. Beyond that, I think the throwing and pocket presence aspects of being a QB Trubisky has down far better than Glennon.

 

We aren't very far from seeing the rookie take over.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

You want me to elaborate on someone who can make one read and run? In that sense he's better than Glennon who can just make one read. Here's one article on his week 1 performance that "earned" him the starting job.

 

He has a whopping 4.8ypc but did manage to throw for 125 yards in Week 2. That compares to cement shoes Glennon's 6.5ypc career average and 301 yards last week. Glennon has one more TD and one more INT than Watson.

 

Watson is throwing to Deandre Hopkins, Will Fuller 1st Rd pick, and Braxton Miller.

 

Even though you want a comparison to Trubisky I used Glennon's numbers because he's horrible and that offers some perspective on Watson's performance as a starter. Which is what matters most.

 

I'm still not seeing where you're getting this 'overwhelmed' idea from. To me that would indicate someone with happy feet and running more than passing. In looking at highlights of specifically Watson in last week's game I don't see either. Granted his early throws were a bit off but he was clearly looking for targets and moving around as necessary. To me he doesn't seem all that different from Russell Wilson who is successful in being mobile and passing as necessary.

This 'one read and run' concept with Watson simply isn't accurate.

 

I don't believe either Watson or Kizer are ready to play in the NFL. I don't believe Trubisky is either but he's getting closer. None of this changes the fact I still believe Trubisky is the best QB among them, and has a good outlook long term.

 

I would agree to some level about this. The fact is both Kizer and Watson are 'playing in the NFL' currently, "ready" or not. But really how does one measure a QB "ready" to play? Was Manning "ready" when he started in Indy? Or Luck? Or how about Brady when he was drafted in the 6th round? He didn't start until Bledsoe went down a few weeks into the season. Hell even the great (ugh) Favre wasn't ready when Atlanta drafted him. Nothing but experience actually playing the game will make you ready to play. Coming in from college and being instantly ready is nearly impossible as a QB.

 

[lemonej]

Based on all the scouts' reports Trubisky is a project because of his lack of starting experience and not taking snaps under center. How many snaps did Glennon take the last 2 years and looks as green as a rookie. He was touted as a guy who took care of the ball and limited turnovers and in the preseason and now in the regular season he has turned the ball over repeatedly. The rookie could do that and it could be used as a teaching moment. If he is not starting by the Minnesota game, which gives the Bears from Friday 9-29 til 10-9 to get him ready and pair down the playbook to his liking, he will not play this year.

[adam]

Based on all the scouts' reports Trubisky is a project because of his lack of starting experience and not taking snaps under center. How many snaps did Glennon take the last 2 years and looks as green as a rookie. He was touted as a guy who took care of the ball and limited turnovers and in the preseason and now in the regular season he has turned the ball over repeatedly. The rookie could do that and it could be used as a teaching moment. If he is not starting by the Minnesota game, which gives the Bears from Friday 9-29 til 10-9 to get him ready and pair down the playbook to his liking, he will not play this year.

Like others have said as well, the prep has to be it. They probably don't want him dealing with the Pittsburgh defense, and then GB on a short week. So the most logical time is following the blow-out loss to GB on nationally TV. Glennon is relegated to 5th String Kickoff holder and Trubisky gets the extra days to prep, plus it is a home game against MIN on Monday Night.

 

The only way I see this not happening is if Glennon pulls something out of his you know what and wins 2 games.

[madlithuanian]

There is simply no empirical proof that letting a great QB ride the pine definitely is what made him great. And there is no evidence that guy who get eaten up and spit out would've ever amounted to anything anyway. I don't want to give this regime any more time to f things up if they are found to be bad. And by waiting, it delays that. That's why Pace wants us to wait. I'm on to you, Pace! I don't trust you! Put in Tru and give me a reason to trust again...

 

Seems to me this team is playing, coaching and managing scared. Enough. There is no perfect time. None of us gets to choose our opportunity. You simply rise to the occasion or you do not. All in. All now. Anything else is wasting everyone's time.

 

Sorry Adam, nothing you said...just venting at this whole situation and it gives more credence to the idea that this regime is about as lame as the last... The record doesn't lie...

 

Like others have said as well, the prep has to be it. They probably don't want him dealing with the Pittsburgh defense, and then GB on a short week. So the most logical time is following the blow-out loss to GB on nationally TV. Glennon is relegated to 5th String Kickoff holder and Trubisky gets the extra days to prep, plus it is a home game against MIN on Monday Night.

 

The only way I see this not happening is if Glennon pulls something out of his you know what and wins 2 games.

 

[Mongo3451]

Like others have said as well, the prep has to be it. They probably don't want him dealing with the Pittsburgh defense, and then GB on a short week. So the most logical time is following the blow-out loss to GB on nationally TV. Glennon is relegated to 5th String Kickoff holder and Trubisky gets the extra days to prep, plus it is a home game against MIN on Monday Night. The only way I see this not happening is if Glennon pulls something out of his you know what and wins 2 games.

 

Completely agree! You put him in before GB, you are asking for trouble.

 

 

[Mongo3451]

Completely agree! You put him in before GB, you are asking for trouble.

 

 

 

 

And..... At least wait for Long to get a game under his belt...

 

 

[AZ54]

In looking at highlights of specifically Watson in last week's game I don't see either.

 

I'm curious how many highlights were there of a QB who threw for 125 yds and a 5.2ypc average?

 

 

We'll just agree to disagree about what successful QB play is because I don't see a guy coming off his first read very often at all. I see a lot of inaccurate throws too and quite a few bad reads where he was very lucky he wasn't picked off. Quite often they give him a roll out with simple high low reads. We'll be doing some of the same things with Trubisky when he starts because he'll be overwhelmed at times and we'll want to simplify things for him to help get him into a comfort zone.

 

 

 

[jason]

I'm curious how many highlights were there of a QB who threw for 125 yds and a 5.2ypc average?

 

 

We'll just agree to disagree about what successful QB play is because I don't see a guy coming off his first read very often at all. I see a lot of inaccurate throws too and quite a few bad reads where he was very lucky he wasn't picked off. Quite often they give him a roll out with simple high low reads. We'll be doing some of the same things with Trubisky when he starts because he'll be overwhelmed at times and we'll want to simplify things for him to help get him into a comfort zone.

 

For shits and grins, I watched this. He looks pretty damn good.

 

1-2: The first two throws are pin-point. Maybe inches away from catches both times. No way the defender could sniff the ball.

3: Roll out, rocket, only Hopkins had a chance. Safe, smart play from the EZ.

4: Good play action roll out, smart rocket into Miller's chest for a first down.

5: Bad throw. Didn't read the LB.

6: Great elusivenesss, smart throw with only an incompletion or tough catch by his WR possible.

7: Nice rollout and throw. Simple, easy. Would have been more but the WR fell.

8: Great pocket presence, stepped up in pressure, easy checkdown throw. Smart. Didn't try to force anything.

9: DB jumped his out, and he still had enough arm strength that it wasn't picked. Just an incompletion.

10: Near his own EZ, nobody open, doesn't force it, scrambles for a few yards. Smart.

11: Poor mechanics, almost a jump-throw, but he rockets it in to a WR where only he can catch it. First down.

12: Smart checkdown to Lamar Miller for a first down. Didn't force the first read.

13: Threads the zone to Hopkins. Great throw.

14: Feels the pressure, steps forward a hair, checks down to Miller. Easy.

15: 3/15, dances in the pocket, shows great elusiveness, runs 49 yards for a TD (holds ball kind of wildly)

(NOTE: This is why he is so dangerous. He is Vick-esque, and is dangerous if the D just sits back in coverage)

16: Good pocket awareness, scrambles for a few yards

17: Quick out, fast, on the outside shoulder where only Hopkins can catch it.

18: Throws into double-coverage and gets his receiver killed

19: Good out to Hopkins, but Jones takes it away for an incompletion

20: Good rollout, smart throw

21: Play action, run to the edge. Busted play immediately.

22: Rocket to Hopkins, but the WR bobbles for less than the first down.

23: play action, rocket on the out to Hopkins. A bit high, but catchable.

24: Stands in front of pressure and throws a catchable ball.

25: Good pocket awareness, waits as long as he can and then throws it away

26: Nice throw to Hopkins on the out

27: Repeat of 26

28: Repeat of 27 but to a different WR

29: Good pocket awareness, steps forward and runs for what he can get

 

All in all, he looked pretty damn good. I'd say he made two bad decisions (5 & 18).