Grain of Salt

[Chitownhustla]

Friend of mine recently sat next to Alex Brown on a flight, they talked about the the Bears and SEC football for pretty much the whole flight...... Pace is loved by the McCaskey's.  The phrase "Pace walks on water in Halas" was used by Brown. He thinks if there is a fall guy it will be Nagy. This was before the Detroit game tho, so depending how the rest of the season goes that could change. 

[Mongo3451]

Love the inside info.  One thing that is certain is the likes of Alex Brown truly don't know what the McCaskeys are truly thinking.  When it comes to their money, only they and their accountants know.  At least, that's how is control my situation.

[adam]

Pace's status within Halas Hall is a widely known thing. I don't know what that buys him going forward after this debacle. My thought process is they will save him some pride and not fire him until after the season. That's about it.

[Lucky Luciano]

20 hours ago, adam said:

Pace's status within Halas Hall is a widely known thing. I don't know what that buys him going forward after this debacle. My thought process is they will save him some pride and not fire him until after the season. That's about it.

here's the question i have... who is out there to replace pace that is worth firing him for? any names come to mind? we don't want to fire a gm and then hire a worse one if the talent is not out there. that is a waste of yet another 5 years.

one thing for sure is that teddy boy should have been fired as pretender president of this franchise decades ago. hire someone who knows FOOTBALL to take his place. that would be a great start for turning this franchise around. then let him hire a gm and let the gm hire his own coaches. the problem is that you have to have a plan in advance to put this all in play. chicago never does.

 

 

[adam]

56 minutes ago, Lucky Luciano said:

here's the question i have... who is out there to replace pace that is worth firing him for? any names come to mind? we don't want to fire a gm and then hire a worse one if the talent is not out there. that is a waste of yet another 5 years.

one thing for sure is that teddy boy should have been fired as pretender president of this franchise decades ago. hire someone who knows FOOTBALL to take his place. that would be a great start for turning this franchise around. then let him hire a gm and let the gm hire his own coaches. the problem is that you have to have a plan in advance to put this all in play. chicago never does.

 

There are actually a lot of good GM candidates, WAAAAYYYY more qualified than Pace ever was. Here are a few:

Scott Fitterer - SEA, built the Legion of Boom
John Dorsey - helped build KC and CLE
Ed Dodds - IND
Mike Borgonzi - KC
Louis Riddick - ESPN Analyst, PHI

[DABEARSDABOMB]

4 hours ago, adam said:

There are actually a lot of good GM candidates, WAAAAYYYY more qualified than Pace ever was. Here are a few:

Scott Fitterer - SEA, built the Legion of Boom
John Dorsey - helped build KC and CLE
Ed Dodds - IND
Mike Borgonzi - KC
Louis Riddick - ESPN Analyst, PHI

And you didn't even list out Rick Smith, who built the Texans up and than had to step down due to some family health matters.  He was an excellent GM and did a really nice job building up the Texans during his time there. I'd probably say Smith is more of a president type who you would hire and he would than figure out his GM.  

[BearFan2000]

18 hours ago, DABEARSDABOMB said:

And you didn't even list out Rick Smith, who built the Texans up and than had to step down due to some family health matters.  He was an excellent GM and did a really nice job building up the Texans during his time there. I'd probably say Smith is more of a president type who you would hire and he would than figure out his GM.  

I'd be ok with this.  A guy like Smith who's been a good GM taking sweaty Teddy's place might be just the kind of change this franchise needs.  Having his experience in the hiring process for a new GM would finally give us someone who actually knows what to look for in a GM who could turn this thing around for good.  For decades now we've been changing the tires and rims on the car when the engine is faulty.  Get a good president who is a real football guy to hire a good GM, who in turn can hire a good coach, and in turn hire good coordinators and staff.  It's not like Smith isn't a GM because he was let go.  He was good at it but needed to step down for personal reasons.  Another thing I like about that is he would have a better perspective to give advice when his GM is looking at making a trade or signing, etc. 

[BearFan PHX]

4 hours ago, BearFan2000 said:

I'd be ok with this.  A guy like Smith who's been a good GM taking sweaty Teddy's place might be just the kind of change this franchise needs.  Having his experience in the hiring process for a new GM would finally give us someone who actually knows what to look for in a GM who could turn this thing around for good.  For decades now we've been changing the tires and rims on the car when the engine is faulty.  Get a good president who is a real football guy to hire a good GM, who in turn can hire a good coach, and in turn hire good coordinators and staff.  It's not like Smith isn't a GM because he was let go.  He was good at it but needed to step down for personal reasons.  Another thing I like about that is he would have a better perspective to give advice when his GM is looking at making a trade or signing, etc. 

Well remember that Ernie Accorsi picked Pace, and he has as much NFL cred as anyone.

I think the thing is, whether you're looking for a GM or a franchise QB, that there are no proven winners available. You either have to take someone who's won before but has been in decline, or you have to take someone young who has promise but hasn't proved it yet. And that means that you take a risk.

I think you take that younger guy and you give him a few years to grow, and then you find out if you found the next superstar or not.

Pace, Nagy, Trubisky, Philips - none of you is a superstar. Thanks for trying.

Let's take another swing of the bat. No one know for sure, but once youve evaluated them in the NFL for a few years THEN you do know. So I cant say who the right pick is, and we might swing and miss again, but it's time to trade in the cards we have and take new ones.

[adam]

On 12/10/2020 at 2:57 PM, DABEARSDABOMB said:

And you didn't even list out Rick Smith, who built the Texans up and than had to step down due to some family health matters.  He was an excellent GM and did a really nice job building up the Texans during his time there. I'd probably say Smith is more of a president type who you would hire and he would than figure out his GM.  

Yep, him too. There are a lot of GM candidates out there, almost hard to whiff on a good one this offseason (unless you are the Bears).

[ASHKUM BEAR]

If the Bears do decide to make a change, I am all for giving Toub his due at HC or the temptation for NW HC Fitzgerald and get a GM that holds value in the damn draft instead of constantly moving up.  A GM that knows if you don't have good tires, you cannot get traction to go fast or control your vehicle (O/D lines). Use the draft to increase that capital by trading down to teams that have conviction because most likely that slot busts in the first 4 years.  Pace has done well in places but lacks in some of the major areas and it shows. I am on board if you cannot draft a QB, OLT, DE, or CB in round one, trade down or out. 

[BearFan2000]

GM's in Chicago failing at the top of the draft and doing better later in the draft has been a theme here for years.  All with slight different philosophies.  Angelo loved to trade down, Emery was more of a stay put guy if I remember right.  Pace has always tended to trade up.  He's hit more on his mid/later rounds but has been horrific in the first round aside from Smith.  

Whoever our GM will be this coming draft his focus needs to be on solidifying both lines in particular our offensive line.  We need a GM who flexible creative and willing to move up if the risk/reward is worth it, or move down when there's more value in adding picks, and one who knows. when to stay put.  Pace has conviction albeit often misguided.  He's more a swing for the fences risk be dammed.  Other GM's know that and know he can be enticed when he's enamored with a certain player.  Good GM's understand every draft is different, and each one evolves as it goes.  They must understand where the value is at each position.  I feel like Pace goes into the draft with his plan and will press forward with it regardless of what happens.  It's annoying to watch good players fall to the Bears but we pass on them to reach for someone else.  

[BearFan2000]

On 12/11/2020 at 2:54 PM, BearFan NYC said:

Well remember that Ernie Accorsi picked Pace, and he has as much NFL cred as anyone.

I think the thing is, whether you're looking for a GM or a franchise QB, that there are no proven winners available. You either have to take someone who's won before but has been in decline, or you have to take someone young who has promise but hasn't proved it yet. And that means that you take a risk.

I think you take that younger guy and you give him a few years to grow, and then you find out if you found the next superstar or not.

Pace, Nagy, Trubisky, Philips - none of you is a superstar. Thanks for trying.

Let's take another swing of the bat. No one know for sure, but once youve evaluated them in the NFL for a few years THEN you do know. So I cant say who the right pick is, and we might swing and miss again, but it's time to trade in the cards we have and take new ones.

True, Ernie was thought to be a guru.  But there's also a difference in having to hire or consult a so called expert because your team President is an idiot.  To me it's telling that last time around we knew we couldn't leave the call solely to Phillips and needed to bring in a consultant for the hire.   At the time Pace had a lot of potential upside.  We went with the young guy and gave him time to grow and it didn't work out.  

My thinking is that if we had a Team President with actual experience running a team/managing a roster and not having to hire an outside consultant, we'd be in a better position to finally hit on the GM spot.   I feel like this could be a key to turning it around.  Ted is just a numbers guy.  My main point is having someone more qualified in that role can only help our chances of getting it right this time.

 

[Alaskan Grizzly]

9 hours ago, BearFan2000 said:

I feel like Pace goes into the draft with his plan and will press forward with it regardless of what happens.  It's annoying to watch good players fall to the Bears but we pass on them to reach for someone else.

This is the biggest issue with Pace and you’re right.  As we’ve said some years ago he’s got this air about him that he thinks his time as a scout is his golden ticket to greatness.  I can’t tell you how many D2 college prospects he “swung and missed” on.  Or even lower echelon players like Miller or even Trubiksy who I think were picked too high. 
 

You have to wonder had he instead focused more on the higher level value players than sticking with his convictions where this team would be.  

[BearFan PHX]

On 12/15/2020 at 9:03 AM, BearFan2000 said:

True, Ernie was thought to be a guru.  But there's also a difference in having to hire or consult a so called expert because your team President is an idiot.  To me it's telling that last time around we knew we couldn't leave the call solely to Phillips and needed to bring in a consultant for the hire.   At the time Pace had a lot of potential upside.  We went with the young guy and gave him time to grow and it didn't work out.  

My thinking is that if we had a Team President with actual experience running a team/managing a roster and not having to hire an outside consultant, we'd be in a better position to finally hit on the GM spot.   I feel like this could be a key to turning it around.  Ted is just a numbers guy.  My main point is having someone more qualified in that role can only help our chances of getting it right this time.

 

I agree

[jason]

On 12/15/2020 at 7:46 AM, BearFan2000 said:

Pace has conviction albeit often misguided.  He's more a swing for the fences risk be dammed.  Other GM's know that and know he can be enticed when he's enamored with a certain player.  Good GM's understand every draft is different, and each one evolves as it goes.  They must understand where the value is at each position.  I feel like Pace goes into the draft with his plan and will press forward with it regardless of what happens.  It's annoying to watch good players fall to the Bears but we pass on them to reach for someone else.  

Preach. I'm sick of the Bears having less picks than they should have because Pace thinks he's the smartest guy in the NFL.

[adam]

1 hour ago, jason said:

Preach. I'm sick of the Bears having less picks than they should have because Pace thinks he's the smartest guy in the NFL.

Our consensus mock draft we used to do would've been more successful than Pace over the same period of time. Everyone gives him credit for Jackson and Cohen, and now to an extent Mooney, but those guys don't matter when you whiff on White, Floyd, Trubisky, Shaheen, Miller, Bullard, and Grasu. Those were all top 75 picks where teams find most of their stars and perennial starters.

[jason]

On 12/20/2020 at 5:44 PM, adam said:

Our consensus mock draft we used to do would've been more successful than Pace over the same period of time. Everyone gives him credit for Jackson and Cohen, and now to an extent Mooney, but those guys don't matter when you whiff on White, Floyd, Trubisky, Shaheen, Miller, Bullard, and Grasu. Those were all top 75 picks where teams find most of their stars and perennial starters.

Agree. I've been saying that for over a decade. Sure, we'd have hits and misses, but we'd be better than Pace. It seems the Bears have such a difficult time putting together a GM who can evaluate talent, and a HC who can utilize the talent drafted.