What is Mack worth in trade?

[jason]

Easy question. What is Mack worth in trade? Some of y'all follow that type of stuff a lot more than I do. You're more keen on the salary cap implications.

The reason I ask is two-fold:

1. Denver's defense wasn't good in 2020
2. Fangio is their coach

What could the Bears get from them?

[BearFan PHX]

35 minutes ago, jason said:

Easy question. What is Mack worth in trade? Some of y'all follow that type of stuff a lot more than I do. You're more keen on the salary cap implications.

The reason I ask is two-fold:

1. Denver's defense wasn't good in 2020
2. Fangio is their coach

What could the Bears get from them?

I dunno, but the cap ramifications make it impossible unless you get a corresponding impact player who is willing to continue to play under a contract where THEIR guaranteed money stays with Denver...

If you get draft picks, then you're willing to field a terrible team in 2021 for future value, like the Cubs did for a few years. And that's a great idea honestly, but it makes it impossible for Nagy or Pace to keep their jobs.

I mean, the conspiracy theory says that McCaskey knows this, and is willing to do it, and Nagy and Pace have to just eat it as punishment, but stick around anyway because they have to or something. But McCaskey's not that smart, and Nagy and Pace would quit.

We are screwed for at least a couple years.

[Stinger226]

There is only 6 teams with over 30 mil in cap space. NE, Cinn, Jets, Colts , Washington. NE, Colts, and Washington are the only decent teams that would make a move like that. Wash has Chase Young, so they are out. NE needs a QB so they will be spending their money on a QB signing. Colts are the only team in the position to do it and they need a QB. They are not spending money on a QB and then adding a 26 mil contract on a player that isnt living up to his paycheck. 

[BearFan PHX]

20 minutes ago, Stinger226 said:

There is only 6 teams with over 30 mil in cap space. NE, Cinn, Jets, Colts , Washington. NE, Colts, and Washington are the only decent teams that would make a move like that. Wash has Chase Young, so they are out. NE needs a QB so they will be spending their money on a QB signing. Colts are the only team in the position to do it and they need a QB. They are not spending money on a QB and then adding a 26 mil contract on a player that isnt living up to his paycheck. 

yeah but Mack's guaranteed money doesnt go with him in a trade, it hits us all at once, rather than being spread out over years as it is now.

If we trade him, we must pay $37 Million on our cap this year NOT to have him.

Next year it's 12 Million, and then you can dump him then or the next year if you want to.

Now if we make him a poost June 1st "cut" then we can spread that 37 Million over the next two years, but I dont think we get to do that in a trade.

We just cant afford to trade him this year unless we are willing to burn the 2021 season to the ground to get 2022 picks. The Cubs did that for a few years and won the World Series. Im not saying it cant be done or is a bad idea, but it does nothing for Nagy and Pace who are trying to keep their jobs, so I dont think Mack can be traded under any theory.

If he has a big year next year with Goldman next to him THEN you could get something for him and afford to do it after next season. Or keep him.

[ASHKUM BEAR]

Mack is not going anywhere this year. Next year, they can shop him but still costly as his dead  cap = another great players salary. His last year if they cannot trade him, I hope they do not cut him because of the compensation pick rules. Our luck GB will sign him, it won't hurt them from their comp pool and we won't gain comp value which would be 3rd rd value most likely.  So I think he is a Bear until his contract expires unless we can trade him his last contract year.

[BearFan PHX]

4 minutes ago, ASHKUM BEAR said:

Mack is not going anywhere this year. Next year, they can shop him but still costly as his dead  cap = another great players salary. His last year if they cannot trade him, I hope they do not cut him because of the compensation pick rules. Our luck GB will sign him, it won't hurt then from their comp pool and we won't gain comp value which would be 3rd rd value most likely.  So I think he is a Bear until his contract expires unless we can trade him his last contract year.

agree, and of course the contract was designed for exactly that purpose - when a player can demand it, having upfront money guarantees the player cant get cut so easily, and will get their salary portions too.

[ASHKUM BEAR]

I do think the Bears can trade Hicks. Hate to see him go, but if he can give the Bears say 2nd round value and cap space, it helps the situation. 

[Mongo3451]

4 hours ago, jason said:

Easy question. What is Mack worth in trade? Some of y'all follow that type of stuff a lot more than I do. You're more keen on the salary cap implications.

The reason I ask is two-fold:

1. Denver's defense wasn't good in 2020
2. Fangio is their coach

What could the Bears get from them?

Von Miller was hurt all year, as well as several others like Bradley Chubb.

To answer your question, Mack is highly tradeable if we want to eat the dead cap space.  I would still say he's worth a first round pick.

[Mongo3451]

1 hour ago, Stinger226 said:

Colts are the only team in the position to do it and they need a QB. They are not spending money on a QB and then adding a 26 mil contract on a player that isnt living up to his paycheck. 

Colts are in position to do whatever they want.  They literally are good on every contract they have.  Ballard has done a fantastic job getting them into this position.  Plus Mack won't cost too much because of all the guaranteed money.  They could come up with Desean Watson, Julio Jones and Khalil Mack if they want.

[BearFan PHX]

3 minutes ago, Mongo3451 said:

Colts are in position to do whatever they want.  They literally are good on every contract they have.  Ballard has done a fantastic job getting them into this position.  Plus Mack won't cost too much because of all the guaranteed money.  They could come up with Desean Watson, Julio Jones and Khalil Mack if they want.

but why would we destroy our cap to trade Mack? It would cost us $37 Million.

The only way I see it is if we trade Mack for a first, and use at least one if not both of them on a QB in the first round the we think is the future.

Then youre paying a rookie deal for the QB, so you can think of Macks $ as what a vet QB would have cost.

[ASHKUM BEAR]

9 minutes ago, Mongo3451 said:

Von Miller was hurt all year, as well as several others like Bradley Chubb.

To answer your question, Mack is highly tradeable if we want to eat the dead cap space.  I would still say he's worth a first round pick.

I think taking on 38 million of dead cap would top the Texans for worst GM move.  The Bears would need 2 first rd picks at least for that damage.

[ASHKUM BEAR]

From www.sporttrac.com 

2021	$26,646,000	$38,100,000	($11,454,000)
2022 ?	$27,150,000	$12,000,000	$15,150,000
2023 ?	$25,500,000	$2,600,000	$22,900,000
2024 ?	$23,250,000	$0	$23,250,000

Maybe 2022, for sure 2023 or 2024. 

2021, his cap his 26.6 million, trade him it accelerates to 38.1. No savings at all, he costs the Bears more.  2022, we owe him 12 mil, but save 15. 2023 we owe 2.6 and save 22.9.  2024, we save 23.2.  I think the Mack talk should be forgotten for now. Leave that decision for the new GM next year.  We are locked with Quinn/Mack for 2021. 

[BearFan PHX]

47 minutes ago, ASHKUM BEAR said:

From www.sporttrac.com 

2021	$26,646,000	$38,100,000	($11,454,000)
2022 ?	$27,150,000	$12,000,000	$15,150,000
2023 ?	$25,500,000	$2,600,000	$22,900,000
2024 ?	$23,250,000	$0	$23,250,000

Maybe 2022, for sure 2023 or 2024. 

2021, his cap his 26.6 million, trade him it accelerates to 38.1. No savings at all, he costs the Bears more.  2022, we owe him 12 mil, but save 15. 2023 we owe 2.6 and save 22.9.  2024, we save 23.2.  I think the Mack talk should be forgotten for now. Leave that decision for the new GM next year.  We are locked with Quinn/Mack for 2021. 

I guess the only reason youd trade Mack is for high picks, and the only way you could justify all that dead money would be if you drafted a rookie QB, and figured that you werent paying his vet salary which would be similar. It's kind of like how we could afford Mack in the first place, because we had a rookie QB in Trubisky.

But in the real world, Mack is a bear for 2021.

[ASHKUM BEAR]

39 minutes ago, BearFan NYC said:

I guess the only reason youd trade Mack is for high picks, and the only way you could justify all that dead money would be if you drafted a rookie QB, and figured that you werent paying his vet salary which would be similar. It's kind of like how we could afford Mack in the first place, because we had a rookie QB in Trubisky.

But in the real world, Mack is a bear for 2021.

I understand the thought, but the Bears would have to get Lawrence or maybe Fields to justify the cost imo. I think we can talk about Hicks, Fuller, or Arob as trades.  

[Mongo3451]

11 hours ago, BearFan NYC said:

but why would we destroy our cap to trade Mack? It would cost us $37 Million.

The only way I see it is if we trade Mack for a first, and use at least one if not both of them on a QB in the first round the we think is the future.

Then youre paying a rookie deal for the QB, so you can think of Macks $ as what a vet QB would have cost.

I was simply answering the question.  38 mil is a tough pill to swallow.

[BearFan PHX]

8 hours ago, Mongo3451 said:

I was simply answering the question.  38 mil is a tough pill to swallow.

yeah we are all on the same page here - not attacking the messenger, just going over all the scenarios.