Training camp

[adam]

9 hours ago, Bill said:

Beating the dead horse again.  Sorry to  horse lovers.  We don't have anyone who has played LT in an NFL game on the roster.  Even if everyone gets healthy we still won't.  Depth is great at all positions.   Where is it at LT?   Name anyone on the roster who we should be looking forward to playing the position other than Jenkins.   And he has never taken a snap at LT in the NFL.   

Bill,

It is a concern but would be no different than if we kept Leno and drafted a CB instead of Jenkins. We would have the same exact problem if Leno was injured. I assume they will bring in some depth once rosters start to get cut. We are still a few weeks away from that.

[Bill]

1 hour ago, adam said:

Bill,

It is a concern but would be no different than if we kept Leno and drafted a CB instead of Jenkins. We would have the same exact problem if Leno was injured. I assume they will bring in some depth once rosters start to get cut. We are still a few weeks away from that.

I've read and watched all teams find ways to get around the cap to keep players. Perhaps they did everything they could to keep Leno.  But I think at the time they drafted Jenkins they felt ok letting him go.  Draft the same players they did  no reason to change that.  But to go into training camp with no one who has ever played left tackle in the NFL just doesn't make sense to me.

[Mongo3451]

1 hour ago, adam said:

Bill,

It is a concern but would be no different than if we kept Leno and drafted a CB instead of Jenkins. We would have the same exact problem if Leno was injured. I assume they will bring in some depth once rosters start to get cut. We are still a few weeks away from that.

Not even close.  Youth and strength is not equal to the experience Leno has.  Jenkins needs training camp to meet, then exceed Leno.

[BearFan PHX]

42 minutes ago, Mongo3451 said:

Not even close.  Youth and strength is not equal to the experience Leno has.  Jenkins needs training camp to meet, then exceed Leno.

true, but getting a veteran backup who wasnt good enough to be a starter doesnt give Jenkins more experience or solve the issue either.

I think we just have to grow with Jenkins, or pick up a temp vet as we go through camp. There no reason to get one right away, in fact the reps for guys like Borom will eventually pay dividends.

[Mongo3451]

4 minutes ago, BearFan NYC said:

true, but getting a veteran backup who wasnt good enough to be a starter doesnt give Jenkins more experience or solve the issue either.

I think we just have to grow with Jenkins, or pick up a temp vet as we go through camp. There no reason to get one right away, in fact the reps for guys like Borom will eventually pay dividends.

Jenkins needs reps.  If he doesn't get them, there unsigned guys out there that will absolutely be better.(also better than anyone we have)  Eventually, is next year.  If Fields is to be developed quicker,  he will need to have starts this year.  I don't want that to occur if the shit show is happening up front.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

12 hours ago, Bill said:

Beating the dead horse again.  Sorry to  horse lovers.  We don't have anyone who has played LT in an NFL game on the roster.  Even if everyone gets healthy we still won't.  Depth is great at all positions.   Where is it at LT?   Name anyone on the roster who we should be looking forward to playing the position other than Jenkins.   And he has never taken a snap at LT in the NFL.   

Your concerns aren't being lost in a vacuum.  There are players on the team that could fill the gap; Traore, Simmons and a few slated to be Guard like Eislen or Bars who played Tackle in college.  But these are not ideal solutions.  I still think the team is looking for options from preseason cuts (and there will be some) or even one or two current FAs.  Here's an article that speaks on the matter.

https://ontapsportsnet.com/2021/08/04/state-of-chicago-bears-offensive-line-potential-reinforcements/

[BearFan PHX]

4 hours ago, Mongo3451 said:

Jenkins needs reps.  If he doesn't get them, there unsigned guys out there that will absolutely be better.(also better than anyone we have)  Eventually, is next year.  If Fields is to be developed quicker,  he will need to have starts this year.  I don't want that to occur if the shit show is happening up front.

I totally agree with you, just not hitting the panic button quite yet. But every rep Jenkins misses IS a lost opportunity...

[Bill]

So I've beat the horse to death.  I read a story from Lombardi, on the Athletic, who I enjoy reading.  He's done more in his first week of his career than I have every done.  It's a good read in my option.  The main story line is should the Colts get Foles or not.  But a lot of things he says about injuries and how it affects young players who you thought were good enough to draft and then you go out and find a veteran to replace the injured player,  

"Hall of Fame coach Bill Parcells called the crying for a veteran to replace a young player “a progress stopper” because when you sign a veteran to overtake the young player, his progress toward becoming a contributor to the team vanishes." 

So I'll accept the situation as it is going forward.  I also found this interesting in the context of our QB situation and how it has been handled in the past and present.

"The worst thing any team can do is sign a player, assume debt and then still need a player at that position."

GM101 vs someone sitting on their ass at home bitching, perhaps like me?

[BearFan PHX]

1 hour ago, Bill said:

GM101 vs someone sitting on their ass at home bitching, perhaps like me?

yeah,. except it's a grey area, and maybe you both have valid points

[Mongo3451]

1 hour ago, Bill said:

Hall of Fame coach Bill Parcells called the crying for a veteran to replace a young player “a progress stopper” because when you sign a veteran to overtake the young player, his progress toward becoming a contributor to the team vanishes." 

Love Parcells, but this is out of context.  We don't need a veteran to replace Jenkins.  We need that veteran to help ensure Jenkins has the time and ability to succeed.  The last thing our team or Jenkins needs is to be placed in a position to fail when not ready.  A veteran only stabilizes a fragile situation and gives added confidence to a team that already has uncertainties.

[Bill]

22 minutes ago, Mongo3451 said:

Love Parcells, but this is out of context.  We don't need a veteran to replace Jenkins.  We need that veteran to help ensure Jenkins has the time and ability to succeed.  The last thing our team or Jenkins needs is to be placed in a position to fail when not ready.  A veteran only stabilizes a fragile situation and gives added confidence to a team that already has uncertainties.

I'm sorry, I did not put it into context, it's about replacing an injured player in training camp with a free agent vet vs young players you already have on the roster  If you access the article and read it would be much better than anything I try to say.

[Bill]

"Being able to honestly assess his talent compared to the talent available — especially when injuries occur — is one of the biggest challenges general managers face in camp. The hardest part in solving that problem occurs when a young player with no experience is next in line. Do you trust your judgment that he can handle the job? More importantly, is your judgment tainted because of a prior draft or financial investment in the player? Are the assistant coaches unwilling to work with an unproven player and beg for a veteran who knows what to do which then forces stagnation with young talent? Hall of Fame coach Bill Parcells called the crying for a veteran to replace a young player “a progress stopper” because when you sign a veteran to overtake the young player, his progress toward becoming a contributor to the team vanishes."

[Alaskan Grizzly]

Saw this earlier today…

 

[Mongo3451]

I watched NFL Network today and they were at Bears camp.  Darnell Mooney and Allen Robinson impressed the heck outta me.  Barring injury, we gotta ink Robinson to a deal.  Mooney has been breaking ankles in his routes.

[adam]

14 hours ago, Mongo3451 said:

I watched NFL Network today and they were at Bears camp.  Darnell Mooney and Allen Robinson impressed the heck outta me.  Barring injury, we gotta ink Robinson to a deal.  Mooney has been breaking ankles in his routes.

Yeah and it also looks like Monty and Kmet have improved and James is catching everything thrown his way, this offense is going to be very solid.

I think it will be on par with the Cutler-Forte-Marshall-Jeffery-Bennett season, but this time we actually have solid depth behind the starters.

[Mongo3451]

17 minutes ago, adam said:

Yeah and it also looks like Monty and Kmet have improved and James is catching everything thrown his way, this offense is going to be very solid.

I think it will be on par with the Cutler-Forte-Marshall-Jeffery-Bennett season, but this time we actually have solid depth behind the starters.

I'm looking for Graham to be a surprise cut in order to sign LT help.  Look for Okung or Peters, maybe both.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

Another guest. 
 

[BearFan PHX]

I have a guess as to what they're doing there. Everyone is freaking out that Justin Fields looks ready to start, and Nagy is asking the QB people who he knows best and trusts to help him evaluate Fields so he doesnt get too carried away with enthusiasm, or be too slow and careful, and he wants outside opinions to temper his own.

And if Dalton was looking good and Fields like a rookie, he wouldn't need it.

I am going to guess that the reason these guys are here is because Fields is looking like he might ready or close to it, and Nagy wants to make sure he makes the decision correctly.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

See that the Bears are trying out ‘troubled’ player PJ Hall (formerly of the Raiders). Beginning to wonder if there’s an issue with Goldman?  After being out all of last season and just getting back this year before getting hit with COVID I’m getting an uneasy feeling about his NFL future.  
 

https://www.profootballrumors.com/2021/08/bears-host-dt-p-j-hall

And since I’m being pessimistic, I’m not sold on Jackson being 100% either although he’s back after being out with a ‘non-football injury (hamstring)’.  
 

[BearFan PHX]

It sounds like Goldman was exposed or tested positive (and there are LOTS of false positives with these tests) and that he may not be vaccinated, so he has to sit out 10 days.

It is smart for the Bears to have a backup plan for Goldman should he test positive again. Someone to plug in for a week or two, and they probably already have that guy on the team in Khyiris Tonga so maybe theyre looking for depth.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

7 hours ago, BearFan NYC said:

t sounds like Goldman was exposed or tested positive (and there are LOTS of false positives with these tests) and that he may not be vaccinated, so he has to sit out 10 days.

Presumably he would’ve been vaccinated last year when he opted out. His rationale at the time, protecting his family.  I read somewhere he has asthma which could be an issue with COVID. 

[BearFan PHX]

8 hours ago, Alaskan Grizzly said:

Presumably he would’ve been vaccinated last year when he opted out. His rationale at the time, protecting his family.  I read somewhere he has asthma which could be an issue with COVID. 

without getting political about anything, some people think getting vaccinated protects your family and others dont? So I dont think we can assume either case?

[lemonej]

The vibe here in Chicagoland has not been as frenzied as some of the media portrays but, the cohesiveness of the O-line is tantamount to the success of the offense and that can't happen without all players available. The number one concern is availability. This is eerily like the Chris Williams saga which eventually turned into disc surgery.

[BearFan PHX]

29 minutes ago, lemonej said:

The vibe here in Chicagoland has not been as frenzied as some of the media portrays but, the cohesiveness of the O-line is tantamount to the success of the offense and that can't happen without all players available. The number one concern is availability. This is eerily like the Chris Williams saga which eventually turned into disc surgery.

No doubt. we need Jenkins back ASAP. He is missing valuable snaps. Ifedi has more experience, so it's less critical with him, but they all need to be evaluated, and get some cohesion.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

6 hours ago, BearFan NYC said:

without getting political about anything, some people think getting vaccinated protects your family and others dont? So I dont think we can assume either case?

Agreed, and hoping to continue not being political…he would’ve not opted out if given the option like he was.  

Either way, the loss of playing time last year and this current situation is concerning.