AZ54 Posted February 28, 2022 Report Share Posted February 28, 2022 3 hours ago, Mongo3451 said: Why would a scenario drafting an OT and C mean Daniels is gone? We only have three OL under contract and Daniels is better than all of them. I like that draft with keeping Daniels. That being said, Peters would still be needed to ensure stability and to be a mentor. I think they'd move Borom to RG and save the $$$. I could be wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted February 28, 2022 Report Share Posted February 28, 2022 3 hours ago, AZ54 said: I think they'd move Borom to RG and save the $$$. I could be wrong. I get the money saving part, but at what point do we start having competition and depth? If Daniels is proven, make Borom take a position from someone. (That is extremely important in building culture) We only have 3 guys under contract, so all hands on deck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ54 Posted February 28, 2022 Report Share Posted February 28, 2022 39 minutes ago, Mongo3451 said: I get the money saving part, but at what point do we start having competition and depth? If Daniels is proven, make Borom take a position from someone. (That is extremely important in building culture) We only have 3 guys under contract, so all hands on deck. I’m ok with competition for playing time but we’re paying Poles a lot of money to avoid problems like paying Daniels 8 to 10 mil per year only to see him get benched so Borom can play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted March 1, 2022 Report Share Posted March 1, 2022 4 hours ago, AZ54 said: I’m ok with competition for playing time but we’re paying Poles a lot of money to avoid problems like paying Daniels 8 to 10 mil per year only to see him get benched so Borom can play. He's not going to get to 8 mil. He's also better than Borom and Whitehair while only being 24. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ54 Posted March 1, 2022 Report Share Posted March 1, 2022 3 hours ago, Mongo3451 said: He's not going to get to 8 mil. He's also better than Borom and Whitehair while only being 24. I haven't watched all 22 in years, nor even just rewatching games where I can focus on the lines. You seem to believe that I say Borom is better than Daniels but I'm not. I'm just going through different what-if scenarios for the offseason and scouting some different players for the draft to backfill roster gaps in those scenarios. We'll have some idea within the first 48hrs of FA what Poles is thinking about our C and RG Daniels. Then to a lesser extent Borom, wherever he may end up. It is entirely possible Poles wants Daniels at C but will sign him and tell everyone he's the RG leading people to think whatever they want about Borom and Jenkins at OT during the draft. He has to get rid of Whitehair's contract at some point because I can't imagine Poles carrying that $14mil cap hit in 2023. Per OTC he's the 6th highest paid OG in the NFL and I don't see that level of play. Borom could well be his replacement at LG in 2023. If you're right that Daniels has played better than Whitehair then Poles will have an engaging time with Daniels' agent since Whitehair is making $10mil/yr. Now that contract was Pace's mistake but it's still something Poles has to deal with and there's no way an agent doesn't use that as leverage for his client. That could lead to Daniels checking out the market and giving Chicago an opportunity to match. I still say if Poles believes Borom is best fit at RG and that he'll be a better player there than Daniels then he either has to move Daniels to C/LG or let him go. It's Poles' job to accurately project where players will be in their performance down the road so he can make the best roster and salary cap decisions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted March 1, 2022 Report Share Posted March 1, 2022 I think it would be easy to say Daniels is a better player than Borom right now. The question is at 10 mil a yr, how much better? At what price can you bring in a new Oline to take the roster spot for Daniels? 10 mil is probably fair but because of the money you're paying Whitehair, oh just can't invest that much in Daniels. I always cheer when players get paid but when you look back , most the time , it doesn't look like a good contract. We have to pay Roquan because he has more impact than players like Daniels. If Daniels made a pro Bowl, then the argument is different but he didn't. I think for sake of balancing the cap , paying Brian Allen or Alex Karras 6-7 mil is a better value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted March 2, 2022 Report Share Posted March 2, 2022 20 hours ago, AZ54 said: I haven't watched all 22 in years, nor even just rewatching games where I can focus on the lines. You seem to believe that I say Borom is better than Daniels but I'm not. I'm just going through different what-if scenarios for the offseason and scouting some different players for the draft to backfill roster gaps in those scenarios. We'll have some idea within the first 48hrs of FA what Poles is thinking about our C and RG Daniels. Then to a lesser extent Borom, wherever he may end up. It is entirely possible Poles wants Daniels at C but will sign him and tell everyone he's the RG leading people to think whatever they want about Borom and Jenkins at OT during the draft. He has to get rid of Whitehair's contract at some point because I can't imagine Poles carrying that $14mil cap hit in 2023. Per OTC he's the 6th highest paid OG in the NFL and I don't see that level of play. Borom could well be his replacement at LG in 2023. If you're right that Daniels has played better than Whitehair then Poles will have an engaging time with Daniels' agent since Whitehair is making $10mil/yr. Now that contract was Pace's mistake but it's still something Poles has to deal with and there's no way an agent doesn't use that as leverage for his client. That could lead to Daniels checking out the market and giving Chicago an opportunity to match. I still say if Poles believes Borom is best fit at RG and that he'll be a better player there than Daniels then he either has to move Daniels to C/LG or let him go. It's Poles' job to accurately project where players will be in their performance down the road so he can make the best roster and salary cap decisions. Daniels will command 6.5 to 8 mil per year based on performance and similar contracts. I highly doubt some team sees him as a hidden gem and gets him to 8 figures. I would honestly do a post June 1 cap cut on Whitehair before losing Daniels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ54 Posted March 2, 2022 Report Share Posted March 2, 2022 1 hour ago, Mongo3451 said: Daniels will command 6.5 to 8 mil per year based on performance and similar contracts. I highly doubt some team sees him as a hidden gem and gets him to 8 figures. I would honestly do a post June 1 cap cut on Whitehair before losing Daniels. That is feasible if he thinks Borom/Daniels is his best OG combo for the future. Post Jun 1st dead money $4.2mil, added cap space $8.1mil which frees up the money for Daniels. Upgrading LT via FA is going to be expensive and with Poles coming out today describing the value he finds in Tier2/3 FA it doesn't seem likely he'd spend big. If the real plan is to draft a starting LT, holding onto Whitehair past the draft would smokescreen the intention somewhat. https://www.chicagobears.com/news/5-things-learned-bears-gm-poles-free-agency-draft-offensive-line-darnell-mooney (3) Poles is a big fan of the second and third waves of free agency. While some NFL teams make high-risk, high-reward big splashes on the first day or two of free agency, plenty of quality free agents remain available after the first wave. The key to maximizing the second and third waves is to keep your ear pressed to the ground and continually monitor a fluid market. "You'll start to gather that information just with contacts into that first wave and you'll get a feel based on how you value players once they start to trickle down and the price points come down a little bit," Poles said. "Because at the end of the day, you're going to overpay in free agency. That's just what it is. It's market price. So, it's really through the communication that you'll get an idea of when things settle down a little bit, but it's usually a couple days in." With 26 Bears players due to become unrestricted free agents when the new league year arrives March 16, Poles and his personnel department figure to be very active. "There are a lot of spots we've got to fill, so that volume piece is important and it really comes down to our evaluation, to make sure that we're right on there," Poles said. "And the other thing, too, that I've always loved is, usually in that volume piece, you're going to have some players that, they're motivated, they've got a chip on their shoulder and they want to get back into free agency and go at it again. So they play with a purpose. "I've mentioned this before, but it's very hard to stay super motivated. You've got to be a special human being to be in that first wave and keep going. [If] you want your name etched in the stadium, that's what kind of mentality you've got to have. So, I definitely think there's a lot of good value down there. Plus, like I said, the mentality comes with it." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParkerBear7 Posted March 8, 2022 Report Share Posted March 8, 2022 With this deep draft Poles should trade down ; probably more than once. There are a lot of fast productive WR’s that will be available later. here is my latest mock: My Selections 63 Round: 2 Christian Watson WR | North Dakota State TRADE 71 Round: 3 Jalen Tolbert WR | South Alabama 95 Round: 3 Brandon Smith LB | Penn State TRADE 101 Round: 3 Kellen Diesch OT | Arizona State TRADE 147 Round: 5 Jermaine Waller CB | Virginia Tech 149 Round: 5 Yusuf Corker S | Kentucky 157 Round: 5 Zyon McCollum CB | Sam Houston State TRADE 173 Round: 5 Danny Gray WR | SMU TRADE 186 Round: 6 Mike Rose LB | Iowa State TRADE 195 Round: 6 Quentin Lake S | UCLA TRADE 219 Round: 7 James Mitchell TE | Virginia Tech TRADE 232 Round: 7 Logan Bruss IOL | Wisconsin TRADE Round 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted March 8, 2022 Report Share Posted March 8, 2022 That would be an excellent draft but I think they would address an OL with one of the first two picks. Diesch is a good development player , but he won't be starting the first year. The first 2 picks need to be starters. Watson probably won't make it to 63 but that would be awesome.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ54 Posted March 8, 2022 Report Share Posted March 8, 2022 It’s late for now I’ll say Mike Rose would be a great fit. Might not be the most athletic but he’s an excellent football player. Fits the Kwitkoski mold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParkerBear7 Posted March 11, 2022 Report Share Posted March 11, 2022 With the Mack Trade, It’s clear now that Poles will be retooling this roster and is seeking both draft capital and cap flexibility. Even if Poles signs a veteran WR like A. Cooper, more talent is needed. This draft is supposedly deep with WRs and LBs and interior lineman. I expect a free agent OT to sure up the LOT and then move Jenkins to RT. In this mock I addressed many of the needs. Tom is listed as a OT but player there out of necessity and played Center prior to that. With the reverting back to the Tampa 4:3 defense, I see the Bears targeting bigger CB, speed at LB and versatile safeties like what Lovie had. My Selections 60 Round: 2 Christian Watson WR | North Dakota State TRADE 71 Round: 3 Jalen Tolbert WR | South Alabama 87 Round: 3 Bryan Cook S | Cincinnati TRADE 131 Round: 4 Brian Robinson Jr. RB | Alabama TRADE 147 Round: 5 Darrian Beavers LB | Cincinnati 149 Round: 5 Leo Chenal LB | Wisconsin 169 Round: 5 Jaylen Watson CB | Washington State TRADE 184 Round: 6 Zyon McCollum CB | Sam Houston State 199 Round: 6 Danny Gray WR | SMU TRADE 215 Round: 6 Zach Tom OT | Wake Forest TRADE 241 Round: 7 Jeffrey Gunter EDGE | Coastal Carolina TRADE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted March 11, 2022 Report Share Posted March 11, 2022 I liked all your picks but the RB that high was a bad choice.If we got those WRs that would be great. Speed with Watson and Grey,, Talbot would be the possession guy. Beavers and Cheap could start as rookies. Zack Tom was the only OL, it would have been better with 2, Should have taken another OL with the RB choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ54 Posted March 11, 2022 Report Share Posted March 11, 2022 4 hours ago, Stinger226 said: I liked all your picks but the RB that high was a bad choice.If we got those WRs that would be great. Speed with Watson and Grey,, Talbot would be the possession guy. Beavers and Cheap could start as rookies. Zack Tom was the only OL, it would have been better with 2, Should have taken another OL with the RB choice. In this scenario with the additional picks I think Robinson there is good value. If I made that pick I'd likely turn around and put Montgomery or Herbert on the trade block and see what I can get. That likely wouldn't be a trade until the season starts, or even mid-season to a contender but it avoids the 2nd contract issues. A trade also keeps us from having to wait another year for the potential comp pick. I'm not as high on Herbert as most seem to be because I think he still has some improvement to make between the tackles. I still like him on the roster. Until we get our passing game fixed we wouldn't be in the worst position splitting carries among Monty/Robinson for half a season with Herbert on special teams/backup role. Between the pick and cap space you improve the roster elsewhere in 2023 when Poles has a better fell for the existing talent, but admittedly it's a longer term view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ54 Posted March 11, 2022 Report Share Posted March 11, 2022 Took a shot at a mock at TDN with the new pick: 39: Olave WR 48: McCreary CB 71: Petit Frere: LT 147: Dohnovan West: C 149: Jack Sanborn: MLB 184: Zach Tom: OG I wasn't planning to go heavy Oline but the draft fell that way and I wasn't going to pass up Tom at 184. I think he'll go earlier than that on draft day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted March 11, 2022 Report Share Posted March 11, 2022 Petit Frere is capable of starting his first year. If you don't resign Daniels Tom could take Witehair replacement next year, where he is more cutable. West can compete with Musifer if no FAs brought in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted March 11, 2022 Report Share Posted March 11, 2022 Here is a draft I did on PFN, I made one trade and got 75 and 150 for pick 71. 39......Alex Pierce/WR 48.....Christian Watson/WR 75.... Tyler Smith/OT 145....Cam Jurgens/OC 148.....Mario Goodrich/CB highest rated CB on the board. 150....Nick Cross/SS. 4.34 40 time. 185... DJ Davidson/DT. 4.94 40 time at 6'3" 327 This draft gave me 2 big time WRs, 2 potential starters on Oline this yr or next and depth in he back of the defense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted March 11, 2022 Report Share Posted March 11, 2022 5 hours ago, Stinger226 said: Here is a draft I did on PFN, I made one trade and got 75 and 150 for pick 71. 39......Alex Pierce/WR 48.....Christian Watson/WR 75.... Tyler Smith/OT 145....Cam Jurgens/OC 148.....Mario Goodrich/CB highest rated CB on the board. 150....Nick Cross/SS. 4.34 40 time. 185... DJ Davidson/DT. 4.94 40 time at 6'3" 327 This draft gave me 2 big time WRs, 2 potential starters on Oline this yr or next and depth in he back of the defense. I like Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParkerBear7 Posted March 12, 2022 Report Share Posted March 12, 2022 22 hours ago, Stinger226 said: I liked all your picks but the RB that high was a bad choice.If we got those WRs that would be great. Speed with Watson and Grey,, Talbot would be the possession guy. Beavers and Cheap could start as rookies. Zack Tom was the only OL, it would have been better with 2, Should have taken another OL with the RB choice. Stinger, the way the draft fell with the trade backs Robinson was to good of value to pass on him and OT capable of starting just wasn’t there. My thought process was to get a big Derrick Henry type RB that can actually complement Monty and of course be a goal line beast. Additionally, Tom would be the starting Center and the Bears would bring in a vet LT like Cam Robinson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted March 12, 2022 Report Share Posted March 12, 2022 We go two deep at RB, definitely not a need, something else had to be there that filled a need of value. Late rounds wouldn't have bothered me but 131 could get a starter instead of e third string RB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASHKUM BEAR Posted March 12, 2022 Report Share Posted March 12, 2022 No trades down, couldn't find an OLT prospect early, but this could be a route taken. Ideally we trade down to gain a 4th or low 3rd. 1st pick Rd 2a is the 3T that can disrupt the offense. 2b is our Randy Moss. RD3 is another WR target that can play early for Fields. 5a is a good CB prospect that has a chance of starting, 5b is a nasty guard that plays with attitude. RD 6 is a raw OLT prospect. To turn this franchise around, it will take a few good drafts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted March 13, 2022 Report Share Posted March 13, 2022 I originally would rip drafts that didn't have a high OL pick but I now think they will try to do it in free agency . They will draft a IOL with one of their 5th round pick to groove to take Whitehairs place next year. That will try to get out of the 12 mil a year. With Mack gone, I see them now drafting a high pick at pass rusher. I figure next year they will try to move on from Quinn. I think getting a stud 3T will add more for the pass rusher than another high prospect in the outside. The cupboard won't be bare with Gipson having a break out year, double digit sacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ54 Posted March 13, 2022 Report Share Posted March 13, 2022 7 hours ago, ASHKUM BEAR said: No trades down, couldn't find an OLT prospect early, but this could be a route taken. Ideally we trade down to gain a 4th or low 3rd. 1st pick Rd 2a is the 3T that can disrupt the offense. 2b is our Randy Moss. RD3 is another WR target that can play early for Fields. 5a is a good CB prospect that has a chance of starting, 5b is a nasty guard that plays with attitude. RD 6 is a raw OLT prospect. To turn this franchise around, it will take a few good drafts. I grab a highlight film of DeMarvin Leal and first play I'm wondering where he is while that LB is running down the field with the INT. At 290lbs he's a really good athlete and it shows while running with the ball. He's not bringing a lot of power but he is bringing the energy and we have nobody like him on the defensive interior. I like the pick. I've been playing around with mocks and it's easy to find two good WRs with 48 and 71. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam Posted March 13, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2022 5 hours ago, AZ54 said: I grab a highlight film of DeMarvin Leal and first play I'm wondering where he is while that LB is running down the field with the INT. At 290lbs he's a really good athlete and it shows while running with the ball. He's not bringing a lot of power but he is bringing the energy and we have nobody like him on the defensive interior. I like the pick. I've been playing around with mocks and it's easy to find two good WRs with 48 and 71. Yeah the way the mocks have been going for me, there is no WR worth the 39th pick. It has been CB, LB, and IDL there. Then WR at 48. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASHKUM BEAR Posted March 13, 2022 Report Share Posted March 13, 2022 17 hours ago, Stinger226 said: I originally would rip drafts that didn't have a high OL pick but I now think they will try to do it in free agency . They will draft a IOL with one of their 5th round pick to groove to take Whitehairs place next year. That will try to get out of the 12 mil a year. With Mack gone, I see them now drafting a high pick at pass rusher. I figure next year they will try to move on from Quinn. I think getting a stud 3T will add more for the pass rusher than another high prospect in the outside. The cupboard won't be bare with Gipson having a break out year, double digit sacks. Every mock I run has no LT prospects at 39 a few decent RTs. Maybe a decent G but Zion in my mocks went at the end of Rd1. I could see them take S Cine or CB Woolen/McCreary. If Raimann is there at 39, that might be the OL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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