Braxton Jones

[adam]

I have been really impressed with this kid. For a 5th round pick, he seems like he is pretty well centered. Does this sound like a 5th round rookie:

 

[ASHKUM BEAR]

8 hours ago, adam said:

I have been really impressed with this kid. For a 5th round pick, he seems like he is pretty well centered. Does this sound like a 5th round rookie:

 

I am excited to watch him grow. I think he will have a long serviceable career as Charles Leno Jr did.  Now, since I said mentioned Leno, I didn't say they would play at the same level. I do think Jones has tools and size to be a few notches better.

[Stinger226]

We watch closely his mistakes while he was here but compared to the rest of the league, he was slightly over average. Everyone would have loved having him here  last year. 

[AZ54]

1 hour ago, Stinger226 said:

We watch closely his mistakes while he was here but compared to the rest of the league, he was slightly over average. Everyone would have loved having him here  last year. 

Not everyone.  I was good with drafting Jenkins, even pleasantly surprised by the move to replace Leno.  I had no issue with holding Leno accountable for his poor performance in the same manner I did for Gould before he left.  Gould at least admitted it after working to regain his form and then landing on his feet in SF.  

Pace went all-in to save his job and it didn't work.   The bottom line for me is that Pace and Nagy had to fail for us to arrive where we are today.  I'm sure some may still want to burn off  some fuel about why they had to fail for so long.  Regardless, keeping Leno around wasn't going to change anything even if we had a couple less sacks or a few more first downs. 

Now the new staff moves much quicker on accountability.  They won't wait a year or two.  It's easy to do when you're new and these aren't "your guys" so we'll see if that holds up in years 3 and 4.  

 

[AZ54]

"I have been really impressed with this kid. For a 5th round pick, he seems like he is pretty well centered. Does this sound like a 5th round rookie:"

I have been impressed by his maturity since his first press conference.  We had to wait and see how that turns into performance on the field but it now appears he's a fast learner.  He has a long way to go but the right mentality and approach to getting there.  

[BearFan PHX]

I think Leno was terrible. I didnt want him here last year either.

[adam]

Leno was at best average, but once he got paid, he did get a little lazy. The cut really woke him up as he has played better in Washington. He always seemed like a nice guy but man he gave up on a lot of plays. I posted some videos of him blocking air when there was an LB right in front of him on a run play, and that LB makes the tackle. 

I think Jones has the potential to be much better than Leno. From the actual practices and press conferences, he is already way ahead of the pace of a 5th round pick out of a smaller school. 

 

Here are some of weaknesses from NFL Draft profile, with my comments:

Weaknesses

• Inaccurate hand placement in run game. -  Seems like a technique issue that is fixable.
• Below-average acceleration to second-level landmarks. - Monty has been getting hit at the first level for several years, so I am not worried about the 2nd level yet.
• Can't generate lower-body anger as drive blocker. - Seems like a technique issue that is fixable.
• Rarely ever low man at the point of attack. - Seems like a technique issue that is fixable.
• Inconsistent bringing feet through completion of the block. - Seems like a technique issue that is fixable.
• Lethargic hands with spotty punch timing. - Seems like a technique issue that is fixable.
• Platform instability leads to imbalance in punch contact. - Weight room and trainer as well as technique can fix this.
• Needs to eliminate his outside-in pass-setting approach.  - Seems like a technique issue that is fixable.
• Beaten inside throughout the game by Arizona State rushers. - It was one game lol.

If that is all his weaknesses, sign me up, he can have half of those cleaned up by Week 1. 

[Stinger226]

14 hours ago, AZ54 said:

Not everyone.  I was good with drafting Jenkins, even pleasantly surprised by the move to replace Leno.  I had no issue with holding Leno accountable for his poor performance in the same manner I did for Gould before he left.  Gould at least admitted it after working to regain his form and then landing on his feet in SF.  

Pace went all-in to save his job and it didn't work.   The bottom line for me is that Pace and Nagy had to fail for us to arrive where we are today.  I'm sure some may still want to burn off  some fuel about why they had to fail for so long.  Regardless, keeping Leno around wasn't going to change anything even if we had a couple less sacks or a few more first downs. 

Now the new staff moves much quicker on accountability.  They won't wait a year or two.  It's easy to do when you're new and these aren't "your guys" so we'll see if that holds up in years 3 and 4.  

 

I was happy we drafted OL and was trying to change the line, but looking back, Leno started day one in Washington. got a descent rating. Last year he had one penalty and gave up 6 sacks out of 1121 snaps. Rieff had 4 sacks in 711 snaps last year. Leno is the definition of average but that is always better than bad. Last year Orlando Brown had 9 penalties 4 sacks out of 1121 snaps. Trent Williams had 7 penalties and 1 sack in 937 snaps. 

[ASHKUM BEAR]

5 hours ago, Stinger226 said:

I was happy we drafted OL and was trying to change the line, but looking back, Leno started day one in Washington. got a descent rating. Last year he had one penalty and gave up 6 sacks out of 1121 snaps. Rieff had 4 sacks in 711 snaps last year. Leno is the definition of average but that is always better than bad. Last year Orlando Brown had 9 penalties 4 sacks out of 1121 snaps. Trent Williams had 7 penalties and 1 sack in 937 snaps. 

Pace put the Bears in a pinch and Fuller and Leno were the casualties.  They signed E Jackson, Tagged  ARob, signed Dalton with Foles signed still, converted Mack money, resigned Graham TE, converted some Whitehair money. Extended Santos.  

Some moves didn't help.  I would have thought 1 extra year of Leno would have been great for Fields bit we were "contending".

 

[Mongo3451]

14 hours ago, adam said:

Leno was at best average, but once he got paid, he did get a little lazy. The cut really woke him up as he has played better in Washington. He always seemed like a nice guy but man he gave up on a lot of plays. I posted some videos of him blocking air when there was an LB right in front of him on a run play, and that LB makes the tackle. 

I think Jones has the potential to be much better than Leno. From the actual practices and press conferences, he is already way ahead of the pace of a 5th round pick out of a smaller school. 

 

Here are some of weaknesses from NFL Draft profile, with my comments:

Weaknesses

• Inaccurate hand placement in run game. -  Seems like a technique issue that is fixable.
• Below-average acceleration to second-level landmarks. - Monty has been getting hit at the first level for several years, so I am not worried about the 2nd level yet.
• Can't generate lower-body anger as drive blocker. - Seems like a technique issue that is fixable.
• Rarely ever low man at the point of attack. - Seems like a technique issue that is fixable.
• Inconsistent bringing feet through completion of the block. - Seems like a technique issue that is fixable.
• Lethargic hands with spotty punch timing. - Seems like a technique issue that is fixable.
• Platform instability leads to imbalance in punch contact. - Weight room and trainer as well as technique can fix this.
• Needs to eliminate his outside-in pass-setting approach.  - Seems like a technique issue that is fixable.
• Beaten inside throughout the game by Arizona State rushers. - It was one game lol.

If that is all his weaknesses, sign me up, he can have half of those cleaned up by Week 1. 

That's not a crap ton of weaknesses,  it's a shit ton.  Coming from a smaller program means they didn't have the resources to coach him up.  That's a good sign that he's still very in the rough.  My expectations are very low for this season, with a very high ceiling dependent on his work ethic.  Learning to play low with leverage is hardest trench skill in football, so he will have to overcome his greatest weakness to succeed.  He's showing a great attitude for starters and that a great start.

[AZ54]

8 minutes ago, Mongo3451 said:

That's not a crap ton of weaknesses,  it's a shit ton.  Coming from a smaller program means they didn't have the resources to coach him up.  That's a good sign that he's still very in the rough.  My expectations are very low for this season, with a very high ceiling dependent on his work ethic.  Learning to play low with leverage is hardest trench skill in football, so he will have to overcome his greatest weakness to succeed.  He's showing a great attitude for starters and that a great start.

Maybe but 3,4, and 5 all seems like the same issue that just manifests into a different bad results.   

1, 6 seem like similar issues with arm/hand use.  Granted it's likely different for pass pro vs. run blocking but this is also a ZBS so I have to think engaging with defensive players on the move has some similarities even if the target area might be different.   He has already admitted he's learned a ton about how much his arms can help him and every press conference he brings it up as something he's prioritizing.  Doesn't guarantee a result but admitting or accepting what is wrong is the first step to fixing it.   

2 could be a problem but during his private workouts with the team they were happy with his movement skills and his RAS score 8.44 indicates he has some decent athleticism.  I think this is a correctable issue but at NFL game speed it could easily take him a full year to get acclimated.  https://ras.football/ras-information/?PlayerID=21105.    Reiff in contrast had a RAS  of 5.91.  Since I'm at the site FWIW Borom RAS 8.65 but as compared to OG.   Jenkins a 9.73. 

8 and 9 outside setting against pass rush could simply be how he was coached to play the position.  Coaches/scouts should know that answer from his interview or workout sessions.  

 7 platform instability.  could be fixed with strength training and coaching or it could be endemic to how he plays.   For whatever reason some big men just never get it.  

My guess is the bold items are the biggest risks this year if we have to rely on him, followed by his hand usage.  Building strength doesn't happen overnight especially for a rookie and all the life changes they go through with the draft process, moving to a new city, new job, etc.  Learning to use leverage means getting rid of years of bad physical habits if it happens at all.  OTs like Julien Davenport have been around for years but still play like they're wearing cement shoes.   

 

[Mongo3451]

1 hour ago, AZ54 said:

Learning to use leverage means getting rid of years of bad physical habits if it happens at all.  OTs like Julien Davenport have been around for years but still play like they're wearing cement shoes.  

It's the hardest thing for a big man to overcome.  He'll have to retrain a lifetime of instinctual body behavior.  It can be done.  To do it he'll need to dedicate his life to it.  Without it he can still be a good player.  With it, the sky is the limit.  Butt down, chest up is harder than it looks when shit hits the fan.

[BearFan PHX]

Not to beat a dead horse, but I dont know where the stats youre posting on Leno come from. What I saw, looking at film each week, time and time again was Leno hitting some defender that another OL was already engaged with, and not blocking a free man at ALL. That's a blown assignment, and it was like at least 10 of them every game. Maybe they dont credit the sack against you if you dont actually put your body on the guy who made the sack, but thats a problem with the stats then, not a defense of Leno. Maybe the QB threw the ball away, or incomplete because he was rushed. Just because he doesnt go down with a sack, doesnt mean the LOT was good on that play.

Leno was awful, terrible, and a complete detriment. He was not a middle of the pack guy no matter what PFF says.

[Stinger226]

I don't  think anyone is saying he is good, I think he is like 15 other LTs starting in the league. Stays healthy and gets you by until you can upgrade. Washington has him starting so everyone is not on the same page of bad. If we got to watch other starting LTs in the league, the majority makes mistakes. Orlando Brown is rated high , last year 9 penalties and 4 sacks. Its about perspective.

[adam]

Leno got paid, got married, then had a baby. He got other priorities. You could tell the difference, just like Goldman and Jackson. Pre-big contract and post-big contract. Two completely different players. Jackson's occurred after the knee injury against GB. He has never fully recovered. 

[BearFan PHX]

I think the scheme changed, and Leno was unable to learn which defender he was supposed to block. at that point, it doesnt even matter how good you are against your opponent, if you're not even trying to block them.

[ASHKUM BEAR]

6 hours ago, adam said:

Leno got paid, got married, then had a baby. He got other priorities. You could i tell the difference, just like Goldman and Jackson. Pre-big contract and post-big contract. Two completely different players. Jackson's occurred after the knee injury against GB. He has never fully recovered. 

I think some of the Bear defensive vets quit on the team the past few years and it wore off on the group.  It seemed there were times it came from the top, Mack and Hicks.  I kinda don't blame them either, wasting their all-pro health/talent on a D when the offense will go 3 and out.  It was even called out by Jaylon Johnson on the air once too.

[Stinger226]

They had injuries . Those type of players don't take plays off. That's how they got so good. Max effort all the time. ( Mack and Hicks). The rest for sure.

[AZ54]

4 hours ago, Stinger226 said:

They had injuries . Those type of players don't take plays off. That's how they got so good. Max effort all the time. ( Mack and Hicks). The rest for sure.

True but there were also games where it was obvious they were exhausted in the 4th quarter.   They'd get off the field and then the offense would go 3 and out.    

[Stinger226]

5 hours ago, AZ54 said:

True but there were also games where it was obvious they were exhausted in the 4th quarter.   They'd get off the field and then the offense would go 3 and out.    

Very true but that isn't a take plays off scenario. Our offense will be more time dominated with a good running game.

[Bill]

On 8/3/2022 at 10:34 PM, Mongo3451 said:

It's the hardest thing for a big man to overcome.  He'll have to retrain a lifetime of instinctual body behavior.  It can be done.  To do it he'll need to dedicate his life to it.  Without it he can still be a good player.  With it, the sky is the limit.  Butt down, chest up is harder than it looks when shit hits the fan.

Never played OFline but try doing a kettel ball workout correctly and you will find out what that means.  Stick you ass against a wall and try with just your core.

[adam]

The difference is if he was never coached to do things or was and couldn't/didn't.

It now seems like he has all the tools and making of an NFL starting LT, which is impressive. If he played at a bigger school, he would've went several rounds earlier.