The Bears are Who We Thought They Are

[Mongo3451]

Now that we all know, let's fix it.

The great rebuild is what we thought it would be.  Painful.  While I'm good with the pain, I'm not good with how it's being dispensed.  I get the feeling that Poles and Eberflus are using this season to evaluate Fields instead of develop him. That being said, they are probably trying to see what he's good and bad at, so they can put the appropriate talent around him to succeed.  What I want them to do is gameplan around what he does best for him to succeed.  It's a subtle difference that can have a happy medium.

This off season is going to be a monster and Poles has to be licking his chops.  Don't doubt for a second that Fields is going to be anything but our QB ends next year will be about him thriving.  My full expectation is a complete upgrade of our skill positions and OL.  Adam has already stated that the WR FA class is weak, so we'll have to rely on finding a couple studs through the draft or trade.  I'm also looking for a true center, because the two on our depth chart will be lucky to have a job.  Then, top it off with another running back.  The rest of the OL will be better due to time and experience, which builds the continuity they need.  On defense, it starts up front.  A pass rushing 3T would be huge, along with a space eater.  We could also stand to improve the LB corps.

There is a lot of work to do.  But it can get done.  I personally can't wait to start making mock drafts after the season.  As for now, if we can eliminate the mistakes, there is a chance for some wins.

[BearFan PHX]

I think youre right in terms of how we built this roster - that they dont want to be better this year at the expense of the future - thats the mistake the last several administrations have made here.

But I dont see the difference between evaluating Fields and developing Fields. It5's the same thing, other than whether they spent long term money on better recievers and linemen. But they didnt have the cap room, so wed have t take future dollars to do it, rather than build in the draft, and thats how we found ourselves in this mess in the first place.

So they are evaluating AND developing Fields right now, but the roster is very poor, I agree and that makes it hard to do either.

This is year zero, not year one. Its very frustrating. But it has been frustrating for a long time and this approach gives us a chance of fixing that in a permanent way.

[lemonej]

11 minutes ago, Mongo3451 said:

Now that we all know, let's fix it.

The great rebuild is what we thought it would be.  Painful.  While I'm good with the pain, I'm not good with how it's being dispensed.  I get the feeling that Poles and Eberflus are using this season to evaluate Fields instead of develop him. That being said, they are probably trying to see what he's good and bad at, so they can put the appropriate talent around him to succeed.  What I want them to do is gameplan around what he does best for him to succeed.  It's a subtle difference that can have a happy medium.

This off season is going to be a monster and Poles has to be licking his chops.  Don't doubt for a second that Fields is going to be anything but our QB ends next year will be about him thriving.  My full expectation is a complete upgrade of our skill positions and OL.  Adam has already stated that the WR FA class is weak, so we'll have to rely on finding a couple studs through the draft or trade.  I'm also looking for a true center, because the two on our depth chart will be lucky to have a job.  Then, top it off with another running back.  The rest of the OL will be better due to time and experience, which builds the continuity they need.  On defense, it starts up front.  A pass rushing 3T would be huge, along with a space eater.  We could also stand to improve the LB corps.

There is a lot of work to do.  But it can get done.  I personally can't wait to start making mock drafts after the season.  As for now, if we can eliminate the mistakes, there is a chance for some wins.

Agreed and I'm already eyeballing Clemson DT Bryan Bresee. This guy is a stud to me.

[DABEARSDABOMB]

I kind of think about it as - this off-season has to be about getting the roster better and starting to find young talent (and hopefully adding it with talent on this roster that emerges, including current draft picks + other guys).  But they probably won't address QB this off-season (unless Fields is a total disaster) because they have so many holes that they have to basically give Fields one more year and begin the better part.

If Fields isn't it - than after next year, they will still have a high draft pick and can figure out what to do at QB, but at that point - hopefully the cupboard is far more full than empty.  So this year is really about growth for Fields, with the limitations (ideally he surprises us and has some wow games, even with limited personal by the end of the year and his lows & high's both keep getting better).  

But the rest of this year is long - and I'm really interested in seeing how he performs in the back half of the season 

[ChileBear]

27 minutes ago, DABEARSDABOMB said:

So this year is really about growth for Fields, with the limitations (ideally he surprises us and has some wow games, even with limited personal by the end of the year and his lows & high's both keep getting better).  

But the rest of this year is long - and I'm really interested in seeing how he performs in the back half of the season 

If the OL doesn't get him killed first. I saw it last night and he had very little time to do anything. Yes, he holds the ball too long, misses seeing wide open targets, but he will have a hard time getting rid of those habits if he is constantly getting pressure when he drops back. My hope is that he can survive the beating he keeps taking AND progresses.

[BearFan PHX]

Im hoping (and it might well be a total fantasy) that Leatherwood will bring something. I really hope so.

There is only one really bad outcome to this season - if Fields gets injured and we can't develop or evaluate him. To that end, the OL is a serious problem. But not one that's easily fixed. This is football hell. Thanks Pace and Nagy!

[AZ54]

4 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:

Im hoping (and it might well be a total fantasy) that Leatherwood will bring something. I really hope so.

There is only one really bad outcome to this season - if Fields gets injured and we can't develop or evaluate him. To that end, the OL is a serious problem. But not one that's easily fixed. This is football hell. Thanks Pace and Nagy!

If the 2nd half of the season can unearth another diamond in the rough on the Oline it's a huge win for us.  Leatherwood has the best chance of being that guy.   He won't get a shot at RG and I've been happy with Whitehair at LG.   I wanted to cut him after last year but like Eddie Jackson he's reinvigorated and playing well.  We have a lot of money and a lot of gaps to fill on the roster so I don't see a reason to create another gap especially one we have to spend money to fill.   Cutting Whitehair has dead money of $8.3mil and saves just $5.3mil in cap space.   

RT seems like the logical choice for Leatherwood since Borom has limitations there.  OTOH I wish he hadn't been on NFI when Whitehair went down because it would have been interesting to see if he got a shot at LG.    Maybe that still happens we'll see if we can get rumors about where he's practicing.  

[BearFan PHX]

24 minutes ago, AZ54 said:

If the 2nd half of the season can unearth another diamond in the rough on the Oline it's a huge win for us.  Leatherwood has the best chance of being that guy.   He won't get a shot at RG and I've been happy with Whitehair at LG.   I wanted to cut him after last year but like Eddie Jackson he's reinvigorated and playing well.  We have a lot of money and a lot of gaps to fill on the roster so I don't see a reason to create another gap especially one we have to spend money to fill.   Cutting Whitehair has dead money of $8.3mil and saves just $5.3mil in cap space.   

RT seems like the logical choice for Leatherwood since Borom has limitations there.  OTOH I wish he hadn't been on NFI when Whitehair went down because it would have been interesting to see if he got a shot at LG.    Maybe that still happens we'll see if we can get rumors about where he's practicing.  

Yeah I do hope a few of these guys develop. Leatherwood, Eislen, Harry, and the DT from Minnesota come to mind. I'd love to see some of them succeed. But next year, you gotta play well to keep your job.

[AZ54]

9 hours ago, Mongo3451 said:

Now that we all know, let's fix it.

The great rebuild is what we thought it would be.  Painful.  While I'm good with the pain, I'm not good with how it's being dispensed.  I get the feeling that Poles and Eberflus are using this season to evaluate Fields instead of develop him. That being said, they are probably trying to see what he's good and bad at, so they can put the appropriate talent around him to succeed.  What I want them to do is gameplan around what he does best for him to succeed.  It's a subtle difference that can have a happy medium.

This off season is going to be a monster and Poles has to be licking his chops.  Don't doubt for a second that Fields is going to be anything but our QB ends next year will be about him thriving.  My full expectation is a complete upgrade of our skill positions and OL.  Adam has already stated that the WR FA class is weak, so we'll have to rely on finding a couple studs through the draft or trade.  I'm also looking for a true center, because the two on our depth chart will be lucky to have a job.  Then, top it off with another running back.  The rest of the OL will be better due to time and experience, which builds the continuity they need.  On defense, it starts up front.  A pass rushing 3T would be huge, along with a space eater.  We could also stand to improve the LB corps.

There is a lot of work to do.  But it can get done.  I personally can't wait to start making mock drafts after the season.  As for now, if we can eliminate the mistakes, there is a chance for some wins.

I'm 100% with you on the rebuild and what we see on the field so far.   I agree less on the use of Fields.  I'd rather he learn the details of being a pocket QB and I consider putting him in the pocket as developing him.  Letting him do what he does best isn't likely to improve what he's bad at.  He needs one WR who can win early.   I don't see that player at the top of the draft.  Mooney can win but it's usually late on routes at the top of the stem.   We might have to just add another good piece.  

That brings us back to the Oline because he'll need time for those WRs to get open.  I agree here... fix the Center position.  If we had a good Center right now it would make a world of difference for Fields even with Patrick at LG.   Finding one in FA isn't likely so that leaves the draft.   I have no doubt this is already a top assignment for our scouting department.  

I'd bring back Montgomery hopefully on a reasonable deal.  I don't trust Herbert to start and with our needs I wouldn't use anything but a day 3 pick on a RB if we went there.  Keep Monty, Herbert, and Ebner for next year.  I'd like to see Ebner take Herberts place long term. 

At this point I'm considering letting Roquan walk away.  I simply don't see a player worth $20mil/yr.  I might tag him and see if I could get a day 2 pick in a trade but that $20mil could help in a lot of other places.  Would I rather pay Jaylon Johnson or Roquan?  Despite his injury issues Jaylon contributes more to the D and he'd be more difficult to replace.  Hopefully the 2nd half of the season is better for Roquan but right now I'd bet Poles is feeling like he dodged a bullet.    

 

[BearFan PHX]

23 minutes ago, AZ54 said:

I'm 100% with you on the rebuild and what we see on the field so far.   I agree less on the use of Fields.  I'd rather he learn the details of being a pocket QB and I consider putting him in the pocket as developing him.  Letting him do what he does best isn't likely to improve what he's bad at.  He needs one WR who can win early.   I don't see that player at the top of the draft.  Mooney can win but it's usually late on routes at the top of the stem.   We might have to just add another good piece.  

That brings us back to the Oline because he'll need time for those WRs to get open.  I agree here... fix the Center position.  If we had a good Center right now it would make a world of difference for Fields even with Patrick at LG.   Finding one in FA isn't likely so that leaves the draft.   I have no doubt this is already a top assignment for our scouting department.  

I'd bring back Montgomery hopefully on a reasonable deal.  I don't trust Herbert to start and with our needs I wouldn't use anything but a day 3 pick on a RB if we went there.  Keep Monty, Herbert, and Ebner for next year.  I'd like to see Ebner take Herberts place long term. 

At this point I'm considering letting Roquan walk away.  I simply don't see a player worth $20mil/yr.  I might tag him and see if I could get a day 2 pick in a trade but that $20mil could help in a lot of other places.  Would I rather pay Jaylon Johnson or Roquan?  Despite his injury issues Jaylon contributes more to the D and he'd be more difficult to replace.  Hopefully the 2nd half of the season is better for Roquan but right now I'd bet Poles is feeling like he dodged a bullet.    

 

100% all of this.

[adam]

8 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:

Im hoping (and it might well be a total fantasy) that Leatherwood will bring something. I really hope so.

There is only one really bad outcome to this season - if Fields gets injured and we can't develop or evaluate him. To that end, the OL is a serious problem. But not one that's easily fixed. This is football hell. Thanks Pace and Nagy!

The injury thing is such a high possibility with that O-Line and him holding onto the ball too long. He already got hit low at the knees a few times. I don't know how many more of those he can take. It just looks like he is in a no-win situation. 

[Stinger226]

Poles came in last yr with a huge job trying to fix our roster with limited cap space and draft picks. His philosophy was build thru the draft and sign club friendly FAs. In the draft he took the best player available. 

WR: All the best WRs were either tagged or traded. You had Kirk, A-Rob, JuJu, D J Chark, MVS, Landry. There was no way we could afford to pay Kirk 17 mil a yr., or JuJu 10 mil. The only one that may have worked out was Jarvis Landry but at 29 was not in the youth movement ideology. 

Drafting a WR: at 39, Pickens, Pierce, Sky Moore were available. At 71 instead of V Jones our choices were David Bell, Jalen Tolbert, Danny Gray. We had so many weaknesses, would we be better off taking Pickens or Pierce or David Bell or Tolbert instead of Jones, only time will tell. 

OL: We tried to get Brian Allen, Joe Noteboom and Ryan Bates. We struck out on all of them but we didnt have the money to get in a bidding war. Bengals signed, Cappa, Karras, and Le'ul Collins. In 2019 they had a first round pick Johan Williams. There OL is not very good. With limited space we werent going to get the better OL players. We could have brought Daniels back but was he worth 9 mil a yr?

DL: We tried to get Ogunjobi but he is doing anything in Pitt at 8 mil this yr. The other best choices got paid big contracts. 

Poles is clearing going with development of the two young OTs instead of Rieff or Schofield. So we are stuck with their learning curve. Whitehair and Patrick injuries have disrupted the IOL. Whitehair is our best OLmen and I think we dont have any options till he gets back in 3 weeks. I think Jones, Whitehair, Patrick, Jenkins and Borom are the best options we have. In 2023 I think we keep Whitehair, Jones, and Jenkins. Borom gets upgraded and we find a new OC. Jones will play out to see if we need to upgrade LT. 

In 2023  RTs choices are Eigton Jenkins, Conklin, or McGlinchey. OC choices are Mitch Morse, Quessenberry, or Bradley Bozeman. WRs: JuJu, Lazard, Agholor, Chark, Jacobi Meyers, and Landry. 

They is no #1s WRs in FA so we will have to draft one but can upgrade our WR room with JuJu and a Jackobi Meyers. In FAgency I would like to sign Jenkins and Morse, and if LT doesnt work out , draft one. 

I think Poles tried to fix the OL , how different would it be if we got Brian Allen and Ryan Bates. Hard to compete with the Rams and Bills for those players. 

I think we stick with developing Fields because with a high draft pick we would try to draft a QB that has the same traits that Fields have, just commit to Fields.