Preseason is meaningless

[AZ54]

Just now, Mongo3451 said:

Gotta tell you, he looked really good.  Relaxed and delivered good play fakes.  Passes were on the money in tight places.  PJ Walker looked like hot garbage.  We left after the halftime show, so not sure how he finished.

As weak armed QBs go he looked really good.  We will get exactly what the Colts got with Minshew.  There are too many passes out to the sidelines that just hang in the air and starting CBs are going to jump those routes.  

[DABEARSDABOMB]

1 hour ago, Mongo3451 said:

Gotta tell you, he looked really good.  Relaxed and delivered good play fakes.  Passes were on the money in tight places.  PJ Walker looked like hot garbage.  We left after the halftime show, so not sure how he finished.

Pj Walker should be cut. He is trash and they need to find a better backup. 

[AZ54]

3 hours ago, DABEARSDABOMB said:

Pj Walker should be cut. He is trash and they need to find a better backup. 

I agree.  He was bad in the Panthers game I watched last year and he's the same inconsistent QB in Chicago.   Walker has the strongest arm among the backups but when he throws it's always a surprise to see where the ball ends up.   We gave him $1mil guaranteed and would carry $2mil in dead cap this year.  That's be worth it because it frees up $2mil next year and I won't have to watch him in a Bears uniform.    

Among the backups Bagent has looked the best so I think game 3 is the deciding factor.  Bagent at least looks the part when he's in the pocket, with the exception of when he ran straight forward into a sack.  He has better size than Peterman and similar athleticism plus he sees the field well (at least in this game but having 2 days of practice against the Colts helps).  He might have a little bit better arm than Peterman.  There's no reason the Bears couldn't keep read-option plays in the plan with Bagent but the deep routes won't happen

People are fast with these cutouts. 

   

[Lucky Luciano]

i thought the kid looked very good. i know it's preseason and all but bagent had quick reads and the ball was out like a laser. he was also very very accurate. great composure and ran the huddle well.

this kid looked like a 5 year vet out their instead of a tier 2 walk on. if what i saw tonight keeps up in pre season this kid is a keeper and might be hard to keep on the practice squad before someone takes him.

[Stinger226]

3 hours ago, AZ54 said:

I agree.  He was bad in the Panthers game I watched last year and he's the same inconsistent QB in Chicago.   Walker has the strongest arm among the backups but when he throws it's always a surprise to see where the ball ends up.   We gave him $1mil guaranteed and would carry $2mil in dead cap this year.  That's be worth it because it frees up $2mil next year and I won't have to watch him in a Bears uniform.    

Among the backups Bagent has looked the best so I think game 3 is the deciding factor.  Bagent at least looks the part when he's in the pocket, with the exception of when he ran straight forward into a sack.  He has better size than Peterman and similar athleticism plus he sees the field well (at least in this game but having 2 days of practice against the Colts helps).  He might have a little bit better arm than Peterman.  There's no reason the Bears couldn't keep read-option plays in the plan with Bagent but the deep routes won't happen

People are fast with these cutouts. 

   

I think P J Walker is going to have a mysterious injury very soon. Clearly is not playing well, Bagent would not clear waivers to put on the PS. Just do it. 

Who does R. Johnson remind you of as a runner? If you watch Matt Forte tape ?

[AZ54]

3 hours ago, Stinger226 said:

I think P J Walker is going to have a mysterious injury very soon. Clearly is not playing well, Bagent would not clear waivers to put on the PS. Just do it. 

Who does R. Johnson remind you of as a runner? If you watch Matt Forte tape ?

Roschon brings a lot more power to the contact point than Forte ever did.  DBs are not going to want to tackle him for an entire game.  The running style is similar to Forte.  

[Mongo3451]

9 hours ago, AZ54 said:

Roschon brings a lot more power to the contact point than Forte ever did.  DBs are not going to want to tackle him for an entire game.  The running style is similar to Forte.  

Agreed.  The patient style is there.  After that, it's quick feet and violence.

[Mongo3451]

After revisiting Saturday's game, I went from saying Bagent looked good, too now saying he looked really good.  The kid has won everywhere he's been.  There are knocks on his arm and footwork on the scouting sites, but I saw none of it.  His release is very fast and Saturday he was pinpoint accurate.  I'd like to see him early in the last pre season game to gauge how he looks against starters.  As of now, his debut looked Brock Purdy-esque.

[AZ54]

2 hours ago, Mongo3451 said:

After revisiting Saturday's game, I went from saying Bagent looked good, too now saying he looked really good.  The kid has won everywhere he's been.  There are knocks on his arm and footwork on the scouting sites, but I saw none of it.  His release is very fast and Saturday he was pinpoint accurate.  I'd like to see him early in the last pre season game to gauge how he looks against starters.  As of now, his debut looked Brock Purdy-esque.

He was mostly good but there were a few miscues.  Overall he looked like an NFL QB which is great for a UDFA.  I watched his press conference.   He’s just a humble kid enjoying the ride.  In an unusual twist he didn’t elaborate on all the studying he’s had to do or the work ethic.   Listening to him you get the sense he understands that it’s just the basic expectation for the job.  

Where most people would make his situation of dealing with 3 different OCs and offense designs as a negative, or even an excuse.  He looked at it as a positive getting to learn different ways of attacking a defense.  

Then he got to meet and play for Getsy in the Senior Bowl.  I have to believe that’s a big reason why he’s here.  

On one of the sports talk shows someone asked the question if we’d really be comfortable with Bagent in a real game versus PJ Walker who has experience.   IMO that’s the wrong question.  Would I be comfortable with Walker in a real game?  That answer is a definite no.  
 

As for the money on Walker I look at it like this:  We spent $3 or $4mil to find a backup QB.   If we’ve done that, regardless of who it is, it is very reasonable in today’s NFL. There’s no reason to throw good money after bad.  

[Alaskan Grizzly]

3 hours ago, Mongo3451 said:

His release is very fast and Saturday he was pinpoint accurate.  I'd like to see him early in the last pre season game to gauge how he looks against starters.  As of now, his debut looked Brock Purdy-esque.

Yeah that was my takeaway too.  I was hoping that Walker would be more of a Fields like player and be the primary backup, but after Bagent’s performance this last week it would appear he’s making the case.  And oddly enough he seems more a pure pocket passer than Justin does . But again I have to limit my expectations due to Bagent playing against 2nd and 3rd stringer defenses. Maybe he gets more time this coming weekend to get more “tape” but for now he’s making a compelling case to at least be on the 53-man .   

[AZ54]

59 minutes ago, Alaskan Grizzly said:

Yeah that was my takeaway too.  I was hoping that Walker would be more of a Fields like player and be the primary backup, but after Bagent’s performance this last week it would appear he’s making the case.  And oddly enough he seems more a pure pocket passer than Justin does . But again I have to limit my expectations due to Bagent playing against 2nd and 3rd stringer defenses. Maybe he gets more time this coming weekend to get more “tape” but for now he’s making a compelling case to at least be on the 53-man .   

Keep in mind defenses are not yet scheming based on what a QB can and cannot do.  It’s why players like Gardner Minshew get four weeks of fame when they take over as a starter.   The Bears played to Minshew’s strength at times by blitzing and leaving the slot open.   In a real game you’re going to try to force him to throw outside the numbers more often (at least I would).    
 

We still have unknowns but at least Bagent has some strengths to his game.  I can’t find any with Walker.  

[Mongo3451]

14 minutes ago, AZ54 said:

We still have unknowns but at least Bagent has some strengths to his game.  I can’t find any with Walker.  

I called in to the Waddle and Silvey show today to talk about Bagent.  I made a case for him to be the number 2 based on the poise and execution.  The reasoning for why, was that he has the best chance to make Justin better, because what he does best is what Justin does worst.  It would give Justin a chance to see it more if Bagent was getting the #2 reps.  To my shock, Waddle called my comment "astute".  Bagent has been a winner everywhere he's been.  He was also getting recruited through the transfer portal and turned it down to finish his career at the school that gave him the chance.  He ended up throwing for over 17000 yards and was the Division II Athlete of the Year.

[ASHKUM BEAR]

29 minutes ago, Mongo3451 said:

I called in to the Waddle and Silvey show today to talk about Bagent.  I made a case for him to be the number 2 based on the poise and execution.  The reasoning for why, was that he has the best chance to make Justin better, because what he does best is what Justin does worst.  It would give Justin a chance to see it more if Bagent was getting the #2 reps.  To my shock, Waddle called my comment "astute".  Bagent has been a winner everywhere he's been.  He was also getting recruited through the transfer portal and turned it down to finish his career at the school that gave him the chance.  He ended up throwing for over 17000 yards and was the Division II Athlete of the Year.

I belive I heard you on my ride home!  

[BearFan PHX]

37 minutes ago, Mongo3451 said:

I called in to the Waddle and Silvey show today to talk about Bagent.  I made a case for him to be the number 2 based on the poise and execution.  The reasoning for why, was that he has the best chance to make Justin better, because what he does best is what Justin does worst.  It would give Justin a chance to see it more if Bagent was getting the #2 reps.  To my shock, Waddle called my comment "astute".  Bagent has been a winner everywhere he's been.  He was also getting recruited through the transfer portal and turned it down to finish his career at the school that gave him the chance.  He ended up throwing for over 17000 yards and was the Division II Athlete of the Year.

awesome!

[Mongo3451]

1 hour ago, ASHKUM BEAR said:

I belive I heard you on my ride home!  

So cool!

[AZ54]

3 hours ago, Mongo3451 said:

I called in to the Waddle and Silvey show today to talk about Bagent.  I made a case for him to be the number 2 based on the poise and execution.  The reasoning for why, was that he has the best chance to make Justin better, because what he does best is what Justin does worst.  It would give Justin a chance to see it more if Bagent was getting the #2 reps.  To my shock, Waddle called my comment "astute".  Bagent has been a winner everywhere he's been.  He was also getting recruited through the transfer portal and turned it down to finish his career at the school that gave him the chance.  He ended up throwing for over 17000 yards and was the Division II Athlete of the Year.

I agree with your astute comment.  

[Mongo3451]

12 hours ago, AZ54 said:

I agree with your astute comment.  

Thank you sir.

[AZ54]

One other note from watching the game:  D'Anthony Jones is surprisingly quick and fast but he's in horrible shape.  He burst onto the scene for a couple plays and then was gassed for the rest of the drive I focused on him.   There might be enough potential there to keep him on the practice squad but this is the biggest job interview of his life.  If he can't get in shape for that it's hard to imagine much will change in the future.  

[Stinger226]

I think he had a injury at the end of his college career which may  have affected his training. OR I  may have mixed that story up with another player.

[killakrzydav]

Bagent will be our starter going forward if Justin fails.

[BearFan PHX]

2 hours ago, killakrzydav said:

Bagent will be our starter going forward if Justin fails.

nah if Justin fails, we will draft Caleb Williams or someone - Bagent is a REALLY good QB, but he doesnt have the long ball, and if defenses can bring a safety up on every down, youre screwed.

[AZ54]

 

[BearFan PHX]

I was JUST watching this as you posted it!

It's about as a good a job of QBing as you can have. I don't think he has a long ball though. Hes a great option as QB2, but if he had a stronger arm, he'd be a top NFL QB immediately.

I will be rooting for him to find a way to show us that if you make your decisions fast enough, rainbows can beat defenses. Or maybe to show more arm than Ive seen from him yet. But the only reason Im even saying this, is because if it wasnt for that, this guy is amazing even as a 5 year starter. You just dont see QBs make the right choices so consistently and so fast.

Like Mongo said, maybe some of it will rub off on Fields. He's got to be a competitive guy, and to see someone in your room killin g it like that is gonna light a fire, and inspire Fields too.

Is he too young and limited for QB2? I dunno, I'd throw the dice with him.

[Stinger226]

4 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:

I was JUST watching this as you posted it!

It's about as a good a job of QBing as you can have. I don't think he has a long ball though. Hes a great option as QB2, but if he had a stronger arm, he'd be a top NFL QB immediately.

I will be rooting for him to find a way to show us that if you make your decisions fast enough, rainbows can beat defenses. Or maybe to show more arm than Ive seen from him yet. But the only reason Im even saying this, is because if it wasnt for that, this guy is amazing even as a 5 year starter. You just dont see QBs make the right choices so consistently and so fast.

Like Mongo said, maybe some of it will rub off on Fields. He's got to be a competitive guy, and to see someone in your room killin g it like that is gonna light a fire, and inspire Fields too.

Is he too young and limited for QB2? I dunno, I'd throw the dice with him.

Not to compare but they said that about Tom Brady when he came out. That is why he dropped so low. We just dont know until we see more tape. He's calm, makes quick decisions, and has a strong arm, we just havent seen the long pass yet.

[Lucky Luciano]

6 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:

It's about as a good a job of QBing as you can have. I don't think he has a long ball though. Hes a great option as QB2, but if he had a stronger arm, he'd be a top NFL QB immediately.

i don't have access to rewatch the game but from memory this is what i saw...

very quick reads and very quick release. he knew where the ball was supposed to go and put it there without hesitation on target. that tells me he is processing information at high caliber nfl quarterback speed (SUPER important if you are going to become an elite qb). the ball came out like a laser with plenty of zip to targets that were 8-12 yards downfield. that says to me he has at least a reasonably strong arm.

his accuracy was absolutely exceptional. if i remember right he threaded the needle on a play over the middle with two defenders closing on the receiver.

if there is concern over throwing downfield, i am not sure that is a problem. IF it is... with quick reads, release and accuracy he could tap a receiver in stride at the 10-20 yards downfield mark for big gains. the safeties would HAVE to compensate for the quick throws to speedy receivers thus not stacking the box.

for hail mary's? how many do you throw in a season that would make it worthwhile to put a starting caliber qb on the bench? even then if the world knows you are throwing one put in your backup with the arm and let him throw the hail mary.

again, this is conjecture on my part at this early stage. there is not enough data 'yet' but from as little time as this kid has had to practice with this team and coaches and top that off with only two games under his belt against nfl quality players i am currently very impressed. he must absorb information at a high level and be very coachable to even play this well against 2nd string D's.

IF he continues to shine he could be pushing fields for a starting position in a year.

as stinger mentioned, could this turn out to be our tom brady of the future? a very good comparison.

Is he too young and limited for QB2? I dunno, I'd throw the dice with him.

i am with you on this. physically he is the perfect height and weight for an nfl qb.

i don't think this guy stays or even makes it to the practice squad if he continues to play as he has. i would take my chances on him rather than the cannon fodder we have shown in the past. every other team will be thinking of SF and their rookie last season to jump on board with this guy.