Mongo3451 Posted February 7 Report Share Posted February 7 8 hours ago, Stinger226 said: He gets inside information and a first would be great but this time of year a lot of crab floating out there. Second is the reasonable answer. What GM is going to tell any reporter what he's going to do this early , the process is just starting, it's not a week from the draft. Speculation or false reporting are options to. Most new coaches are from teams needing QBs, you think new hires already have their plans finished? Again, you know better. He is NOT in the business of bull-shitting. He is TRUSTED. If he weren't trusted, they wouldn't give information. Is it gospel? No. But, it's more credible than EVERY other source out there. It's NEVER mere speculation on his part. His journalistic integrity is everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted February 7 Report Share Posted February 7 1 hour ago, Mongo3451 said: Again, you know better. He is NOT in the business of bull-shitting. He is TRUSTED. If he weren't trusted, they wouldn't give information. Is it gospel? No. But, it's more credible than EVERY other source out there. It's NEVER mere speculation on his part. His journalistic integrity is everything. Read it how you like, he didnt say anything we dont already know (2nd round pick maybe a first) I seen the video. He wasnt specific about anything. The chance that Poles takes Williams is high He didnt lie about anything, he didnt provide inside information. I would love to get a first but he talks about hypotheticals. What in this video am that I"m missing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted February 7 Report Share Posted February 7 17 minutes ago, Stinger226 said: Read it how you like, he didnt say anything we dont already know (2nd round pick maybe a first) I seen the video. He wasnt specific about anything. The chance that Poles takes Williams is high He didnt lie about anything, he didnt provide inside information. I would love to get a first but he talks about hypotheticals. What in this video am that I"m missing? What you are missing is, you keep saying dumb stuff like, he didn't name sources. And in the context of your sentence structure, it comes off as the person you were conversing with is wrong or misspoken and you are setting it straight. Then, when pressed on the issue, you don't reflect on it, you double down on the same rhetoric. If I had a dollar for every time you end your opinion with, "we don't know what Poles will do". No shit. That's how we all feel. We all know, that we don't know. Even Schefter says the same. That's why we're here. You initial response about Sheffter, was that we don't know his sources. Well, you never will. That's why he gets paid and remains employed. So, why the counter comments when, essentially, we agree? Asking for a few friends... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted February 7 Report Share Posted February 7 31 minutes ago, Mongo3451 said: What you are missing is, you keep saying dumb stuff like, he didn't name sources. And in the context of your sentence structure, it comes off as the person you were conversing with is wrong or misspoken and you are setting it straight. Then, when pressed on the issue, you don't reflect on it, you double down on the same rhetoric. If I had a dollar for every time you end your opinion with, "we don't know what Poles will do". No shit. That's how we all feel. We all know, that we don't know. Even Schefter says the same. That's why we're here. You initial response about Sheffter, was that we don't know his sources. Well, you never will. That's why he gets paid and remains employed. So, why the counter comments when, essentially, we agree? Asking for a few friends... There is nothing in that video that tells anything new, people act like we learned some secret news . Watch the video in the first minute and a half and at 4:30 to 5:25 I never said Scheftner is full of crap its just( this is nothing). If you see something different so be it. They are just having a conversation, he's not reporting a news flash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan Grizzly Posted February 7 Report Share Posted February 7 12 hours ago, BearFan PHX said: Somewhere there are coaches that think they can break him of that habit. Interesting.... 12 hours ago, BearFan PHX said: But Nagy couldn't unlock him and lost his job. Getsy couldn't unlock him and did lose his job. Because they're great coordinators or?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted February 7 Author Report Share Posted February 7 51 minutes ago, Alaskan Grizzly said: Interesting.... Because they're great coordinators or?? it feels like youre trying to say that youve caught me in some inconsistency. But this is the same thing Ive been saying all along. It is POSSIBLE that a new coach will unlock Fields, he has talent, but based on years of film going back to college, he continually displays a huge hole in his game which is a fatal flaw so I dont believe it is LIKELY. Thats not a contradiction. it's just the truth of the matter. But more to the point, why are we trying to prove each other wrong, rather than discussing football? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted February 7 Report Share Posted February 7 2 hours ago, Stinger226 said: There is nothing in that video that tells anything new, people act like we learned some secret news . Watch the video in the first minute and a half and at 4:30 to 5:25 I never said Scheftner is full of crap its just( this is nothing). If you see something different so be it. They are just having a conversation, he's not reporting a news flash. Yet it dominated the news today. It was on Greeney, Kap and J Hood and Carmen and Jurko. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted February 7 Author Report Share Posted February 7 A scientist gathers data and draws conclusions. A lawyer starts from a conclusion and then looks for data to support it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan Grizzly Posted February 7 Report Share Posted February 7 2 hours ago, BearFan PHX said: It is POSSIBLE that a new coach will unlock Fields, he has talent, but based on years of film going back to college, he continually displays a huge hole in his game which is a fatal flaw so I don't believe it is LIKELY. Not trying to catch you in a contradiction at all. Just that if there are other coaches/GMs out there that would be willing to relinquish a #1 pick because they could fix him, what's to say Waldron couldn't? Would you have said the same about Geno Smith two years ago? Speaking of, Geno is a big question mark now in Seattle with both Pete Carrol and Waldron gone (according to some reading I did recently). We'll see if his performance was more his own or Waldron's doing. Assuming he makes it to the roster there next season. As far as my questions about Nagy and Getsy losing their jobs. You said they both lost their jobs BECAUSE of Justin. I only ask is it because they were great coordinators that couldn't make Justin work or not? Of the two, Nagy had better success than Getsy...IMHO. Regardless, I personally wouldn't rate them as two of the greatest offensive minded coaches in the league (strategically speaking). I' am keeping our conversation about football. There are a myriad of other subjects I could drone on about, but not football stuff. FWIW, I noticed that you have recently mentioned the idea of keeping Justin and drafting a QB to compete with him. That idea I like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted February 7 Report Share Posted February 7 1 hour ago, BearFan PHX said: A scientist gathers data and draws conclusions. A lawyer starts from a conclusion and then looks for data to support it. Next time I see( maybe) and (chances are) used in legal documents or sciientific papers, I'll come on and say how I screwed that up. I swear you said that my posts are so stupid that you lost all respect for mu opinions and weren't responding to me anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted February 7 Author Report Share Posted February 7 2 hours ago, Alaskan Grizzly said: Not trying to catch you in a contradiction at all. Just that if there are other coaches/GMs out there that would be willing to relinquish a #1 pick because they could fix him, what's to say Waldron couldn't? Would you have said the same about Geno Smith two years ago? Speaking of, Geno is a big question mark now in Seattle with both Pete Carrol and Waldron gone (according to some reading I did recently). We'll see if his performance was more his own or Waldron's doing. Assuming he makes it to the roster there next season. As far as my questions about Nagy and Getsy losing their jobs. You said they both lost their jobs BECAUSE of Justin. I only ask is it because they were great coordinators that couldn't make Justin work or not? Of the two, Nagy had better success than Getsy...IMHO. Regardless, I personally wouldn't rate them as two of the greatest offensive minded coaches in the league (strategically speaking). I' am keeping our conversation about football. There are a myriad of other subjects I could drone on about, but not football stuff. FWIW, I noticed that you have recently mentioned the idea of keeping Justin and drafting a QB to compete with him. That idea I like. Ah, ok Im hearing you more clearly now. I would assume that if Waldron thinks he can unlock Justin, that we might well be keeping Fields. Of course i think that'd be a mistake, but your point is a fair one. If there are teams that would take a flyer on Fields, then why couldnt Poles do that too. And for sure i am not really in the business of predicting what Poles WILL do, just what I think he SHOULD do. I dont claim a crystal ball at all. I do think I can guess at Fields' ceiling now, but not at Poles' choice. So we dont disagree about that point you made. Also, to the point of drafting a QB and keeping Justin, I'm not a fan (I'll say why in a sec), but I realize that if they do that, and even if Im right about Fields, the damage isn't fatal. We'd still have our rookie, and we'd move ahead on schedule. So to me the critical move is to get the rookie. keeping Fields would only be a small problem in my opinion. To me, you take the rookie QB and then you have a vet who mentors the rookie, and keeps the seat warm until the rookie is ready. We've done that with Mike Glennon and Andy Dalton. i think people didnt realize that their role was to be replaceable. We paid them a lot of money, but if you want to pay a fighter to go down int he 3rd round, that costs, and these guys knew their roles. But I dont see Fields as filling that role at all. First off hes not a master of reading NFL defenses, so he cant really mentor the rookie. He doesnt model discipline in structure. Also there is a question of the offensive scheme. Some say that the key to getting the most out of Fields is to make an offense just for him. But if you do that, is it the same offense youre asking the rookie to learn? Will it be the best offense for them to thrive? So, for example, if you take Maye, youre probably building a pocket passing offense. So if we keep Fields to run that offense until the rookie is ready, it seems like it's gonna be messy. And if you tailor the offense to Fields, then what is Maye learning? But as long as we get a rookie QB who is projected to be a starter for us, so a top candidate, we can survive whatever goes on with Fields. So I started leaving that scenario in my comments because my fear is really about skipping getting a rookie QB. Poles could "make a mistake" in my opinion and keep Fields, but if he drafts a rookie QB too, then it's not a fatal mistake. But I believe that if we dont take a top rookie QB, and stick with Fields, it'll kill the window we created with the 2022 tank season and it all falls apart in a couple years when these defensive players all come up for new contracts. To the point about Geno Smith, I'd just say that if it was common for reclamation QB projects to work out, wed see a lot more of it. If something is only 5% likely, it means you can find examples to cite, but 19 times out of 20 you lose the bet. It's that POSSIBLE vs LIKELY thing again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan Grizzly Posted February 7 Report Share Posted February 7 (edited) 9 hours ago, Stinger226 said: Read it how you like, he didnt say anything we dont already know (2nd round pick maybe a first) I seen the video. He wasnt specific about anything. The chance that Poles takes Williams is high He didnt lie about anything, he didnt provide inside information. I would love to get a first but he talks about hypotheticals. What in this video am that I"m missing? Evidently his “tell” is when he says “what he’s hearing” vs “what he thinks”. Exhibit A (from August of 2022): Edited February 8 by Alaskan Grizzly Update date of image Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted February 8 Report Share Posted February 8 I wonder if Jenkins asked for this, thinking he's still a tackle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan Grizzly Posted February 8 Report Share Posted February 8 23 minutes ago, Mongo3451 said: I wonder if Jenkins asked for this, thinking he's still a tackle. Sorry, should have added this was from August of '22. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemonej Posted February 13 Report Share Posted February 13 I didn't bother trying to read every comment so please forgive me but, my choice is to trade the first pick and get extra picks decline Fields 5th year option and draft Jordon Travis who may have to sit most of or all of his first year. A mid round pick may do it, like what Detroit did with Hendon Hooker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted February 14 Report Share Posted February 14 I think it is clear that Poles never lets information out, no one has figured what he did the last two years and aren't going to know until he makes his choices. A lot of people say they have inside information, totally don't believe it. It's all projections from their opinions. We can give our opinion or what we think he might do. At this stage, it's all guessing on what I think he's going to do. As for now I think he trades the first pick, keeps Fields, and drafts a QB. Where he drafts that is anyone's guess. It Williams excels, that could change but the process will dictate that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason Posted February 17 Report Share Posted February 17 On 2/5/2024 at 12:58 PM, Mongo3451 said: The rumors are already swirling, since Washington hired Stinksberry. We get a haul for the number one and draft our dynasty. ?????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daventry Posted February 17 Report Share Posted February 17 This story gives a decent overview of Williams: https://apple.news/AZQjDEFyBS2-IS3CJSmPRvQ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted February 17 Report Share Posted February 17 Nice story, Williams has a high ceiling for a QB prospect and in Evan's eyes he can't miss. Is he a former scout? Curious of his background. Nevermind, I seen his bio, college senior at NCC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixote Posted February 17 Report Share Posted February 17 3 hours ago, Daventry said: This story gives a decent overview of Williams: https://apple.news/AZQjDEFyBS2-IS3CJSmPRvQ I enjoyed the article by the young man. He has a good future. Obviously, he's a fan of Williams, but he gave us an article with good points to be made, both positive and negative. Thanks for sharing the link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan Grizzly Posted February 17 Report Share Posted February 17 On 2/12/2024 at 6:07 PM, lemonej said: I didn't bother trying to read every comment so please forgive me but, my choice is to trade the first pick and get extra picks decline Fields 5th year option and draft Jordon Travis who may have to sit most of or all of his first year. A mid round pick may do it, like what Detroit did with Hendon Hooker. Like your line of thinking Lemon. Except I would hope the team wouldn’t have to decline Justin’s fifth year. ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted February 18 Report Share Posted February 18 8 hours ago, Alaskan Grizzly said: Like your line of thinking Lemon. Except I would hope the team wouldn’t have to decline Justin’s fifth year. ?? The 5th year option is 23 mil , two years of Justin cost 15.5 mil a year, is cheap for a starting QB in the League. Technically you could tag him for a third year at below market cost. Next year I expect us to a be winning team, would that happen if we draft Williams? Rarely do rookies have the Stroud year, somewhere between Young and Stroud. Williams was thrown into the ( generational ring) because of his great junior year. This year he regressed from that tag but had a good college year. So did MT, Trey Lance, Zach Wilson, point being, it's about how they translate to the NFL. Williams is not guaranteed, so is Justin getting better this year, not either but Poles knows what he has with Justin who is being paid 8.3 mil this year. No matter where he takes a QB , he has Justin one more year. Williams is a character issue away being being Jalen Carter of which Poles passed on. No matter what your opinion of QBs , Poles will decide who gives him the best chance to win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted February 18 Author Report Share Posted February 18 Franchising Justin does not save you money. It gives him a salary equal to the average of the top 5 salaries. That means it would be more (because new players get signed to higher contracts) than $51.8M a year for Justin. It basically makes him the third highest paid player in the league. That's a very foolish idea to pay Justin that no matter how much someone loves him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixote Posted February 18 Report Share Posted February 18 There are so many mock drafts out there; it seems endless. This one, I think, would please many, although I personally have doubts about the trade they propose taking place. It shows how the Bears could draft both Caleb Williams and MHJ. Three-round 2024 NFL mock draft: Patriots deal for Justin Fields in one of five first-round trades Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted February 18 Author Report Share Posted February 18 20 minutes ago, Pixote said: There are so many mock drafts out there; it seems endless. This one, I think, would please many, although I personally have doubts about the trade they propose taking place. It shows how the Bears could draft both Caleb Williams and MHJ. Three-round 2024 NFL mock draft: Patriots deal for Justin Fields in one of five first-round trades Well you want to make sure you have some picks for other positions, but Williams, Moore and Harrison Jr would be a dream scenario for sure. Can you imagine? We'd be amazing. It's interesting that this is an NFL mock, and not a Chicago-centric one too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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