adam Posted March 20 Report Share Posted March 20 It is amazing how the media is handling MHJ literally skipping all public workouts but when Williams skipped working out at the combine, it was the biggest news for weeks. I bet this will be a growing trend and the norm in years to come. The top guy in each position group has more to lose than to gain by doing any of these workouts, and possibly get injured. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted March 20 Report Share Posted March 20 3 minutes ago, adam said: It is amazing how the media is handling MHJ literally skipping all public workouts but when Williams skipped working out at the combine, it was the biggest news for weeks. I bet this will be a growing trend and the norm in years to come. The top guy in each position group has more to lose than to gain by doing any of these workouts, and possibly get injured. There's been gaining traction that MHJ is not as twitchy as some believe. If you look at post combine rankings, it shows Malik Nabors as the top receiver. Maybe his camp is saying hold tight for now. Or it's just they simply know he's going to be the first taken and have no reason to work out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killakrzydav Posted March 20 Report Share Posted March 20 Yea, that's the rumor. IMO, it should be bigger deal for/against MHJ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted March 20 Report Share Posted March 20 did MHJr do any physicals? I feel like based on what Caleb did, the league should make the Combine physicals mandatory, if you want to come into the league. Participating in drills and the rest, having a pro day, thats all up to the player in my opinion, but if you want in the league, you should have to do a physical? Caleb says he only wants to do physicals for teams that could really draft him. But what about a dark horse team that wants to trade up? Do they have to alert the entire league that they are planning that in order to get a physical? Seems wrong? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixote Posted March 20 Report Share Posted March 20 26 minutes ago, BearFan PHX said: did MHJr do any physicals? I feel like based on what Caleb did, the league should make the Combine physicals mandatory, if you want to come into the league. Participating in drills and the rest, having a pro day, thats all up to the player in my opinion, but if you want in the league, you should have to do a physical? Caleb says he only wants to do physicals for teams that could really draft him. But what about a dark horse team that wants to trade up? Do they have to alert the entire league that they are planning that in order to get a physical? Seems wrong? I totally agree. Every player who accepts an invitation to the combine should agree to a complete medical evaluation. No medical evaluation, then leave. (If for no other reason than the liability of having a player participate in the combine with a medical condition that could compromise his well-being.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam Posted March 21 Author Report Share Posted March 21 46 minutes ago, BearFan PHX said: did MHJr do any physicals? I feel like based on what Caleb did, the league should make the Combine physicals mandatory, if you want to come into the league. Participating in drills and the rest, having a pro day, thats all up to the player in my opinion, but if you want in the league, you should have to do a physical? Caleb says he only wants to do physicals for teams that could really draft him. But what about a dark horse team that wants to trade up? Do they have to alert the entire league that they are planning that in order to get a physical? Seems wrong? Yeah, the NFL or the Players Union need to do something. Technically a player can determine which teams he can play for just by withholding medicals. What about visits? Are they mandatory? Can Caleb Williams turn down a Top 30 visit? I am fine with players having freedom do to what they want for personal reasons (like I said before - player has an embarrassing medical condition unrelated to football performance and doesn't want it disclosed), but it should not impact league balancing and parity. Otherwise, bad teams will get screwed out of the best players who just bypass them in order to get selected by a better team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan Grizzly Posted March 21 Report Share Posted March 21 35 minutes ago, Pixote said: I totally agree. Every player who accepts an invitation to the combine should agree to a complete medical evaluation. I agree x2. Think this was brought up elsewhere that all teams should have access to the records because as PHX points out, what's to say a team that we never thought of can't pass on Caleb (for example) and will offer everything to get him? And they don't have the medical report to go off. Plus, like in the military (and many other jobs) you need to have a physical to determine whether you can do the job as well as be a 'mean' for where you started versus what may have accumulated over your playing career. (If that makes sense). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted March 21 Report Share Posted March 21 51 minutes ago, Alaskan Grizzly said: I agree x2 x3. Hiring requirements are usually a piss test in normal life. The least a player could do is provide proof of health. The NFL could also manage the release of info only to those that require it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted March 21 Report Share Posted March 21 1 hour ago, Pixote said: I totally agree. Every player who accepts an invitation to the combine should agree to a complete medical evaluation. No medical evaluation, then leave. (If for no other reason than the liability of having a player participate in the combine with a medical condition that could compromise his well-being.) 100% - hopefully they will seal up this loophole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ54 Posted March 21 Report Share Posted March 21 This is a big red flag for me regarding MHJ. I'll just never understand an athlete not wanting to compete. Bowl games and injuries I can understand moreso but we're just talking about running and jumping. Apparently there are rumors that several teams have Nabors as WR1 in this draft. Some of that can be need on individual teams too. None of that matters now since there is almost no way either Nabors or MHJ will be on the board when we draft at 9. In any case I still think the value play is DE at 9. This WR draft is so deep you can get a WR in Rd 3 who has 2nd Rd grade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASHKUM BEAR Posted March 21 Report Share Posted March 21 12 hours ago, AZ54 said: This is a big red flag for me regarding MHJ. I'll just never understand an athlete not wanting to compete. Bowl games and injuries I can understand moreso but we're just talking about running and jumping. Apparently there are rumors that several teams have Nabors as WR1 in this draft. Some of that can be need on individual teams too. None of that matters now since there is almost no way either Nabors or MHJ will be on the board when we draft at 9. In any case I still think the value play is DE at 9. This WR draft is so deep you can get a WR in Rd 3 who has 2nd Rd grade. Depends on what teams are looking for. Nabers = Tyreek Hill, MHJ= Randy Moss. If a team needs a big X, MHJ is the man. If they want an explosive XYZ guy, then Nabers. I don't think you can go wrong with either, but the Bears need the X to nail their Corp down Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted March 21 Report Share Posted March 21 1 hour ago, ASHKUM BEAR said: Depends on what teams are looking for. Nabers = Tyreek Hill, MHJ= Randy Moss. If a team needs a big X, MHJ is the man. If they want an explosive XYZ guy, then Nabers. I don't think you can go wrong with either, but the Bears need the X to nail their Corp down for sure. There are scenarios where QBs go 1234, and the Bears trade up to 5 to get MHJr. That would be insane - unlikely, but awesome. Because youre totally right, Moore is like Steve Smith, but MHJr is like Randy Moss. More of an X. Was it you that posted earlier about Allen in the slot? Saying this same logic might also mean a trade down from 9 to 15th-ish to take LSUs Thomas as an X? I keep thinking on that, and it makes a lot of sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixote Posted March 21 Report Share Posted March 21 Unfortunately, there is no guarantee that Allen will be here for more than one year. Let's hope Poles gets him to sign a reasonable extension. He wanted to remain a Charger but left because he would not renegotiate his contract. I can't see him giving us a discount. SO if Allen leaves after this year, we have to work on getting DJ extended, and if that fails, where are we? With such a potentially great WR class, I wouldn't mind seeing us draft 2 to develop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted March 21 Report Share Posted March 21 18 minutes ago, Pixote said: Unfortunately, there is no guarantee that Allen will be here for more than one year. Let's hope Poles gets him to sign a reasonable extension. He wanted to remain a Charger but left because he would not renegotiate his contract. I can't see him giving us a discount. SO if Allen leaves after this year, we have to work on getting DJ extended, and if that fails, where are we? With such a potentially great WR class, I wouldn't mind seeing us draft 2 to develop. for sure, and Allen is getting older too, even if it's not another team that takes him away. DJ Moore is gonna be a Bear for a long time I think. He is worth what we pay him. And you need two good WRs to make an offense work. This is why drafting a WR is so important this year. Allen is more than a placeholder, hes a multiplier to mentor the rookie, and the rookie will come on as Allen fades. Plus paying DJ Moore, youre gonna need that other WR on a rookie deal. The more I think about what I read here (was it ASHKUM?) the more I think that if MHJr, Odunze and Nabers are not available to us, we could trade down from 9 to like 15 and take Thomas, the other LSU WR there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 Will they take BPA at 9? That will either be Alt or Dallas Turner. Allen isn't signing a lesser contract to be a Bear when he wouldn't restructure a contract for a place he wanted to be. At his age teams aren't giving him top dollar at the WR position. The only thing that comes into play is much he wants to play with Caleb , the brain is hard to figure out. Poles taking him as a one and done makes sense if they take a WR with is second pick. He helps Caleb as a rookie plus train his replacement. Because of the rookie deal at QB he could tag him for one year if we have SB aspirations. The WR room is deep to where they may target one at 75. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dawhizz Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 5 hours ago, BearFan PHX said: for sure, and Allen is getting older too, even if it's not another team that takes him away. DJ Moore is gonna be a Bear for a long time I think. He is worth what we pay him. And you need two good WRs to make an offense work. This is why drafting a WR is so important this year. Allen is more than a placeholder, hes a multiplier to mentor the rookie, and the rookie will come on as Allen fades. Plus paying DJ Moore, youre gonna need that other WR on a rookie deal. The more I think about what I read here (was it ASHKUM?) the more I think that if MHJr, Odunze and Nabers are not available to us, we could trade down from 9 to like 15 and take Thomas, the other LSU WR there. I have to say, the more I watch, I think I actually like Thomas more than Odunze anyway. All I see from Odunze is a guy who is constantly in contested catch situations (and, to his credit, usually comes up with the catch) and then immediately gets tackled. Thomas plays bigger to me, gets separation consistently and is noticeably faster. If we can trade down and get him I’d be thrilled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 1 hour ago, dawhizz said: I have to say, the more I watch, I think I actually like Thomas more than Odunze anyway. All I see from Odunze is a guy who is constantly in contested catch situations (and, to his credit, usually comes up with the catch) and then immediately gets tackled. Thomas plays bigger to me, gets separation consistently and is noticeably faster. If we can trade down and get him I’d be thrilled. I need to watch film on him, but this is good to hear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 9 hours ago, dawhizz said: I have to say, the more I watch, I think I actually like Thomas more than Odunze anyway. All I see from Odunze is a guy who is constantly in contested catch situations (and, to his credit, usually comes up with the catch) and then immediately gets tackled. Thomas plays bigger to me, gets separation consistently and is noticeably faster. If we can trade down and get him I’d be thrilled. I think there both going to be very good. I have no problem with any of the top 4 WRs. Lots of other talented WRs in the draft also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASHKUM BEAR Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 22 hours ago, BearFan PHX said: for sure. There are scenarios where QBs go 1234, and the Bears trade up to 5 to get MHJr. That would be insane - unlikely, but awesome. Because youre totally right, Moore is like Steve Smith, but MHJr is like Randy Moss. More of an X. Was it you that posted earlier about Allen in the slot? Saying this same logic might also mean a trade down from 9 to 15th-ish to take LSUs Thomas as an X? I keep thinking on that, and it makes a lot of sense. That was my last little mock I slid in the Keenan Allen thread. I know Allen doesn't particular like the slot, so him and Moore should be interchangeable there. Thomas would be nice fit if they cannot get MHJ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 On 3/21/2024 at 6:18 AM, BearFan PHX said: did MHJr do any physicals? I feel like based on what Caleb did, the league should make the Combine physicals mandatory, if you want to come into the league. Participating in drills and the rest, having a pro day, thats all up to the player in my opinion, but if you want in the league, you should have to do a physical? Caleb says he only wants to do physicals for teams that could really draft him. But what about a dark horse team that wants to trade up? Do they have to alert the entire league that they are planning that in order to get a physical? Seems wrong? I think he did or it would have been made a larger story. One story I read said Williams was the only player since the Combine started that didn't do his physical. It was an ESPN writer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixote Posted March 22 Report Share Posted March 22 1 hour ago, Stinger226 said: I think he did or it would have been made a larger story. One story I read said Williams was the only player since the Combine started that didn't do his physical. It was an ESPN writer. He could be right, but I swear that I remember other instances where a player refused to do the physical. But I could be wrong. GASP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam Posted March 23 Author Report Share Posted March 23 3 hours ago, Stinger226 said: I think he did or it would have been made a larger story. One story I read said Williams was the only player since the Combine started that didn't do his physical. It was an ESPN writer. Did MHJ even show up at the combine? I thought he was a no-show from Day 1? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted March 23 Report Share Posted March 23 20 minutes ago, adam said: Did MHJ even show up at the combine? I thought he was a no-show from Day 1? Yes he did skip the combine. The story related only to people that attended the combine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted March 23 Report Share Posted March 23 so Caleb is the only one that ever refused to do a medical while at the combine, but others have skipped it all together? Interesting. Id rather a guy show up at least than not show up, so maybe Caleb was being cooler than players who skip it entirely, including not doing a physical. I mean each player is going to take a hit for doing this, but if they know they are the #1 pick in spite of it, then they dont really worry about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted March 23 Report Share Posted March 23 2 hours ago, BearFan PHX said: so Caleb is the only one that ever refused to do a medical while at the combine, but others have skipped it all together? Interesting. Id rather a guy show up at least than not show up, so maybe Caleb was being cooler than players who skip it entirely, including not doing a physical. I mean each player is going to take a hit for doing this, but if they know they are the #1 pick in spite of it, then they dont really worry about it. I didn't write the story, I just posted it's content. I don't even know if that's true, I expect a ESPN story to probably be accurate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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