Draft questions

[ASHKUM BEAR]

5 hours ago, Stinger226 said:

He drafted a OT at 10 last year plus added D J Moore plus Tyler Scott in  the draft. Signed Nate Davis at OG.  

What does the third year in a row thing mean? 

The o line had weaknesses and they basically had only one WR that could be counted on besides Kmet.  When the oline consistently gets pushed into the pocket, the QB is pressured and scrambled. Is Center addressed with Bates an Co., we will see. Can the LT take on strength and bull rushes, we will see.  Is Keenen Allen enough to give the QB 2 targets for the season... 

[Stinger226]

4 hours ago, ASHKUM BEAR said:

The o line had weaknesses and they basically had only one WR that could be counted on besides Kmet.  When the oline consistently gets pushed into the pocket, the QB is pressured and scrambled. Is Center addressed with Bates an Co., we will see. Can the LT take on strength and bull rushes, we will see.  Is Keenen Allen enough to give the QB 2 targets for the season... 

I for sure think he has questions with people he added at OC and whether Braxton takes another step but he added Allen and will draft a WR. You can't have first round picks at every position when you are only in year 3 of a rebuild. 

With Nate Davis playing bad last year was fully related to his mom dying who was living with him. He had to move cities and then mom died, he wasn't ready to play. I fully expect him to have an above average season.

I think Bates is the sleeper acquisition that Poles has given us at OC that still has questions but he trusts him to do well. We will see. I expect him to add a drafted player at that position. ( not sure how he will do that). 

Wright and Braxton takes steps forward that becomes our strengths of the line. Jenkins needs to stay healthy but he has more depth added. 

I think one of our 4 picks will be a young OT. They seem very interested in Kiran Amedgadjie from Yale and I see Poles targeting him in the third round. 

[Stinger226]

On 4/9/2024 at 7:08 PM, ASHKUM BEAR said:

The o line had weaknesses and they basically had only one WR that could be counted on besides Kmet.  When the oline consistently gets pushed into the pocket, the QB is pressured and scrambled. Is Center addressed with Bates an Co., we will see. Can the LT take on strength and bull rushes, we will see.  Is Keenen Allen enough to give the QB 2 targets for the season... 

I get the questions, but rookies have questions to when drafted. Free agents aren't always winnable moves. He has to just keep rolling the dice and hope it's not craps.

The top 3 OCs are coming in for visits. JPJ will probably be first round but Barton and Frazier are legit 2 ND round picks. He has to have a plan on trading down to get the chance to draft them.

So if we get Williams, WR, DE and a center prospect , I'll be happy with this draft. 

On 3/18/2024 at 9:34 AM, dawhizz said:

If I was going to pick my own no trades draft (and I’m assuming Nabors and Odunze are likely gone), I would go:

1a) Caleb

1b) Verse

3) Brenden Rice (was Caleb’s safety valve in college and one of the most predictive WRs on 3rd and 4th down)

4) Either someone with C/G flexibility (Bortolini/Limmer) or potential 3T DT (Wingo/Harris/Hall)

 

[jason]

On 4/9/2024 at 12:13 AM, Stinger226 said:

He drafted a OT at 10 last year plus added D J Moore plus Tyler Scott in  the draft. Signed Nate Davis at OG.  

What does the third year in a row thing mean? 

Third “time” in a row.

They didn’t go all in with Trubisky, and Trubisky was a bust.

They didn’t focus on offense with Fields, and he never reached potential.

If they don’t transform the organization from a defensive-minded franchise to an offensive-minded franchise, where they focus on offense like Lovie focused on his drafting safeties, then Williams or any other rookie QB will be a bust.

[jason]

On 4/9/2024 at 6:08 AM, ASHKUM BEAR said:

The o line had weaknesses and they basically had only one WR that could be counted on besides Kmet.  When the oline consistently gets pushed into the pocket, the QB is pressured and scrambled. Is Center addressed with Bates an Co., we will see. Can the LT take on strength and bull rushes, we will see.  Is Keenen Allen enough to give the QB 2 targets for the season... 

Preach. The OL sucked and there was only one pro WR. I’m tired of people acting like one move is enough for the offense to succeed. There needs to be a perpetual, yearly attempt to improve on offense, to make the franchise player as comfortable as possible, to give him the best OL and WRs in the NFL.

Anything else is putting donut tires on a Lambo.

[Stinger226]

I think I keep forgetting something about this draft. Great QBS make players around them better. 

Was GBs OL we always good or did Arron Rodgers make them look good? 

If we have a great QB, isn't his ability to sidestep pressure and quick throws going to make the line better? We added Bates who will be better than the mess we had there last year. Davis is a year past his tradegy that affected his play. Jenkins will probably be hurt a few games so we have Shelton as a better backup. Wright and Braxton will progress with another year of NFL indoctrination. I suspect we draft one or two more to help with depth. 

As far as weapons, we have 2 #1 WRs already on the team. Caleb should make Kmet a top 5 TE. Evvertt is a perfect #2. Tyler Scott, Venus Jones and Dante Pettis should all look better with Caleb throwing to them. We will add one in the draft, does it need to be at pick 9 ? 

With Caleb at QB, teams will never be able to load the box.

What say you?

[Pixote]

8 minutes ago, Stinger226 said:

If we have a great QB, isn't his ability to sidestep pressure and quick throws going to make the line better?

NO! LOL

Statistically, yes. Anyone looking at the in-depth game stats will see an improvement in the number of sacks/hits/pressures allowed. However, stats can be misleading. Remember when, according to the 'stats,' Leno was a top-tier OLT instead of a turnstile for any speed rusher opposite him?

While having CW on our side will undoubtedly make life easier for the OL, it's crucial for them to demonstrate their potential and strive to be a top-10 OL. This is the key to unlocking the full explosive potential of our offense, which we all eagerly anticipate.

 

[BearFan PHX]

1 hour ago, Pixote said:

NO! LOL

Statistically, yes. Anyone looking at the in-depth game stats will see an improvement in the number of sacks/hits/pressures allowed. However, stats can be misleading. Remember when, according to the 'stats,' Leno was a top-tier OLT instead of a turnstile for any speed rusher opposite him?

While having CW on our side will undoubtedly make life easier for the OL, it's crucial for them to demonstrate their potential and strive to be a top-10 OL. This is the key to unlocking the full explosive potential of our offense, which we all eagerly anticipate.

 

I agree with all of this!

Leno was a nightmare. PFF told us he was gold. LOL That's when I really soured on PFF. Like all of us, we watched the games, and saw how absolutely awful he was, and they were praising him as a top LT. It was probably the beginning of needing to see my own film.

I also agree that having a QB like Williams who moves in the pocket in ways to help the OL will make things better, but I also know how a top 10 OL helps you win games, and close them out. If you can make first downs on the ground, there is no need to punt and play prevent defense.

Imagine having Caleb as a top QB, and being able to still lean heavily on the run? That's how you win playoff games.

[Stinger226]

On 4/19/2024 at 2:52 AM, BearFan PHX said:

I agree with all of this!

Leno was a nightmare. PFF told us he was gold. LOL That's when I really soured on PFF. Like all of us, we watched the games, and saw how absolutely awful he was, and they were praising him as a top LT. It was probably the beginning of needing to see my own film.

I also agree that having a QB like Williams who moves in the pocket in ways to help the OL will make things better, but I also know how a top 10 OL helps you win games, and close them out. If you can make first downs on the ground, there is no need to punt and play prevent defense.

Imagine having Caleb as a top QB, and being able to still lean heavily on the run? That's how you win playoff games.

That's what we have. Caleb + run game

[Stinger226]

I keep reading where experts say we need to draft another #1 WR?

We are in a unique situation, 2 #1s, top 10 TE, top 15 #2 TE, quality receiving RB.

Minn) Jefferson-Addison-Hockenson 

 Philly)  A J Brown-D Smith-Goddert

SF) Kittle- Ayuck-Samuel

We are already top 5-10 receiving team in the league.

No team has 3 #1s and quality TEs.

Allen may be one and done, but will have the money to tag him keeping one more year. I think we can get a quality #2 or 3 WR at pick 75. 

DJ Moore 96--1364--8

Keenan Allen--108--1243--8

Cole Kmet--73--719--6

Gerald Everett--51--411--3

D. Swift 39--214--1

 

[BearFan PHX]

I think the idea is you want to give Caleb his signature guy to develop ESP with - that kind of communication because you grew up in the offense together, and you already know what the other guy is thinking.

In the 70s and 80s there was always that stud receiver paired with the star QB for multiple seasons.

If Poles is looking long term, then he loves Keenan Allen for giving Caleb a jump start, but he looks at that position as a hole long term.

So this is our last top ten draft draft for a while. You want to use it on an impact position, which is QB (already done), Pass Rusher (including 3T), OT or WR. So you ask yourself not just what does the roster need this year, but who are my pillars for the next 10 years.

If you think one of the WRs is a game changer, you take them regardless of Allen being on the roster.

If you think there is a pass rusher who will take over games, you take him.

If you think there is a left tackle that will keep Caleb clean for the next 12 years, you take him.

So rather than looking at position and this years roster, ask instead, of the D linemen, WRs and OTs, which player is truly a difference maker. If you think Jared Verse is an edge rusher that can take over games and make Montez Sweat DE2, then you grab him. But if he isnt that, but some OT is, then you gotta go with the most talented game changer regardless of position.

Maybe thats an argument for Bowers, or for trading up. Or maybe someone thinks Fashanu or Turner or whoever is that guy.

But that's the point - whos the best impact player you can get, not what fills a roster hole in 2024 a little better?

[Stinger226]

20 minutes ago, BearFan PHX said:

I think the idea is you want to give Caleb his signature guy to develop ESP with - that kind of communication because you grew up in the offense together, and you already know what the other guy is thinking.

In the 70s and 80s there was always that stud receiver paired with the star QB for multiple seasons.

If Poles is looking long term, then he loves Keenan Allen for giving Caleb a jump start, but he looks at that position as a hole long term.

So this is our last top ten draft draft for a while. You want to use it on an impact position, which is QB (already done), Pass Rusher (including 3T), OT or WR. So you ask yourself not just what does the roster need this year, but who are my pillars for the next 10 years.

If you think one of the WRs is a game changer, you take them regardless of Allen being on the roster.

If you think there is a pass rusher who will take over games, you take him.

If you think there is a left tackle that will keep Caleb clean for the next 12 years, you take him.

So rather than looking at position and this years roster, ask instead, of the D linemen, WRs and OTs, which player is truly a difference maker. If you think Jared Verse is an edge rusher that can take over games and make Montez Sweat DE2, then you grab him. But if he isnt that, but some OT is, then you gotta go with the most talented game changer regardless of position.

Maybe thats an argument for Bowers, or for trading up. Or maybe someone thinks Fashanu or Turner or whoever is that guy.

But that's the point - whos the best impact player you can get, not what fills a roster hole in 2024 a little better?

That's exactly how I look at what has the most impact for the short and long term. 

TBH they can't go wrong with anyone they pick. OT, WR, Edge, DT and I will throw in JPJ will have an impact on the now and future.

We should just buy popcorn and sit back and enjoy the conversation after the draft.

Guarantee we add more picks somewhere even pick if its 9 for 13 and 44 

 If its 75 for 87 and 103.

 if its 122 for 130 and 160. ( random numbers). 

[BearFan PHX]

of WR, DL and OL - best player available.