Week 4 Official Game Thread - LAR @CHI, 9/29, 12pm, CHI -3, FOX

[Stinger226]

29 minutes ago, adam said:

Here is the throw to DJ for the TD. He was looking left the entire time, looks back to the right and throws it to the back line at the hashes, exactly where DJ needed to be. That was pretty good anticipation. The one to Kmet up the seam was amazing, he dropped it in the bucket between several defenders.

I wasnt saying it was all the time but some plays he holds the ball to long. I remember 3 where he double clutuched the ball. I give praise when he deserves it and notice things he needs to improve on. I think he going to be a top 5 QB but he is not that now. Rookies have growing pins. He didnt have any TOs yesterday that was a big deal. 

 

[BearFan PHX]

I think that's an old narrative that Caleb holds the ball too long.

To make the claim, you need to see the  all 22 film, decode the progression and then see if Caleb is getting through his reads. When no one is open, the QB isnt supposed to throw it anyway.

I think when you watch the game on TV, its normal to give credit to the QB for everything good that happens, and blame them for everything bad that happens, but thats kind of like blaming a poker player for the cards they got dealt in a particular hand.

You cant make guys get open, but if you play enough hands, the good players do usually end up at the final table. But they dont win every hand, just like QBs sometimes hold the ball because no one is open. Other times its because they just hold the ball too long. But again, you gotta take that play by play in the context of the all 22.

Otherwise its just a leftover narrative from pre draft time.

I think a lot of times media narratives, real or imagined, make a filter we see everything through, and sometimes it's totally off base.

[DABEARSDABOMB]

1 hour ago, BearFan PHX said:

I think that's an old narrative that Caleb holds the ball too long.

To make the claim, you need to see the  all 22 film, decode the progression and then see if Caleb is getting through his reads. When no one is open, the QB isnt supposed to throw it anyway.

I think when you watch the game on TV, its normal to give credit to the QB for everything good that happens, and blame them for everything bad that happens, but thats kind of like blaming a poker player for the cards they got dealt in a particular hand.

You cant make guys get open, but if you play enough hands, the good players do usually end up at the final table. But they dont win every hand, just like QBs sometimes hold the ball because no one is open. Other times its because they just hold the ball too long. But again, you gotta take that play by play in the context of the all 22.

Otherwise its just a leftover narrative from pre draft time.

I think a lot of times media narratives, real or imagined, make a filter we see everything through, and sometimes it's totally off base.

I actually think he wasn't as good getting the reads out on time in this game vs. the week before. But with that said - there was a sequence early in 1H where he was sacked on like back to back plays, I think both might have been holding penalties on the defense.  On those plays - I wondered if he held long because of the "holding" but those were some times where it looked like he was double clutching vs. get to the back of his drop and let it fire.

At same time - the TD pass and the pass to Kmet over the middle of the field were both beautiful reads as well as throws.  And he used his check down's well.  I think in the Colts game, 2nd half when they got rolling with tempo, I liked that there were a lot of throws where he was back of his drop and firing.  

Either way - I do think he is the type of QB who can handle the "Peyton Manning" treatment they are putting him throw. It is clear they are giving him the key(s) and the rope and letting him learn the complex system out of the gate vs. babying this thing along.  

I also think Daniels could be great or even better - none of that matters anymore as a Bears fan and Daniel(s) success or struggle(s) have no bearing on what Caleb accomplishes (or doesn't accomplish). Thus far though through 4 weeks he's looked different than any rookie QB I have seen the Bears have (and I say that in a good way - clearly a LOT to still go - but for where he is - he's definitely better than the past...and hopefully he keeps building week after week and ends up being the greatest QB of all time for the Bears (and more broadly).  

[DABEARSDABOMB]

1 hour ago, BearFan PHX said:

I think that's an old narrative that Caleb holds the ball too long.

To make the claim, you need to see the  all 22 film, decode the progression and then see if Caleb is getting through his reads. When no one is open, the QB isnt supposed to throw it anyway.

I think when you watch the game on TV, its normal to give credit to the QB for everything good that happens, and blame them for everything bad that happens, but thats kind of like blaming a poker player for the cards they got dealt in a particular hand.

You cant make guys get open, but if you play enough hands, the good players do usually end up at the final table. But they dont win every hand, just like QBs sometimes hold the ball because no one is open. Other times its because they just hold the ball too long. But again, you gotta take that play by play in the context of the all 22.

Otherwise its just a leftover narrative from pre draft time.

I think a lot of times media narratives, real or imagined, make a filter we see everything through, and sometimes it's totally off base.

On the hold's too long - I think he was top 7 through 3 games in NFL in terms of average time to throw...so he has not been holding it long. Not sure where he falls after week 4.  

[adam]

He has had only one turnover worthy play in 2 games, one of the INTs against IND. The other INT wasn't even considered his fault as it hit Odunze in the hands. That is on 75 passing attempts. So that is a great trend over that many passing attempts.

[BearFan PHX]

5 hours ago, DABEARSDABOMB said:

I actually think he wasn't as good getting the reads out on time in this game vs. the week before. But with that said - there was a sequence early in 1H where he was sacked on like back to back plays, I think both might have been holding penalties on the defense.  On those plays - I wondered if he held long because of the "holding" but those were some times where it looked like he was double clutching vs. get to the back of his drop and let it fire.

At same time - the TD pass and the pass to Kmet over the middle of the field were both beautiful reads as well as throws.  And he used his check down's well.  I think in the Colts game, 2nd half when they got rolling with tempo, I liked that there were a lot of throws where he was back of his drop and firing.  

Either way - I do think he is the type of QB who can handle the "Peyton Manning" treatment they are putting him throw. It is clear they are giving him the key(s) and the rope and letting him learn the complex system out of the gate vs. babying this thing along.  

I also think Daniels could be great or even better - none of that matters anymore as a Bears fan and Daniel(s) success or struggle(s) have no bearing on what Caleb accomplishes (or doesn't accomplish). Thus far though through 4 weeks he's looked different than any rookie QB I have seen the Bears have (and I say that in a good way - clearly a LOT to still go - but for where he is - he's definitely better than the past...and hopefully he keeps building week after week and ends up being the greatest QB of all time for the Bears (and more broadly).  

for sure he isnt perfect, and there have been some plays where he held the ball, but Im not sure that wasnt the right thing to do in that case. I do know that in general hes been a good pocket QB like weve never seen before, or maybe since Cutler or Kramer. But obviously CWs ceiling is better.

Im on the record disagreeing about Daniles, but we will see in time whether he can be the kind of QB that can take a team to the superbowl.

He definitely has amazing athletic skills, but I think they are giving him one read, just like in college, and he isnt getting the "Payton Manning treatment" as you say. And I agree with you - they are throwing him into the deep end. And I would bet heavily that he gets it and will start to really swim