Week 9 - Official Game Thread - Bears at Cardinals, Sun, Nov 3, 3:05 PM CST On CBS, Bears +1, O/U 44.5

[BearFan PHX]

2 hours ago, ASHKUM BEAR said:

As much a Ben Johnson intrigues me, I am skeptical about staying on the same cycle we've been on. I don't know why they didn't just go all in on Harbaugh, but my inclination is he was out of our price range and too strong of an ego. 

The reason why I am skeptical of going with an OC is because they will have a learning curve like Eberflus, Nagy, Trestman..  I want a HC that knows the ins and outs for all aspects of the game and is not afraid to hold his coaches and players accountable. Knowing that establishing the run and sticking to it helps the whole team.   

Maybe Johnson or Klingsbury can learn fast, but I dont think the Bears can risk signing a new coach for 2 to 3 years to find out.  

If a guy is organized, has leadership skills, and isn't a moron, he can be a head coach. The job isn't THAT hard. I mean just the head coaching part. If you've come up the NFL ranks, and you're a natural leader. We all know the rules and techniques about timeouts, end game, challenge flags, when to go for it etc.

And if youre already a coordinator who has shown leadership, then you can do the team leading stuff too.

The harder part is adding value to at least one side of the ball. That's hard. And we end up with a lot of nerds, like Flus, Trestman and Nagy, who are considered modern and innovative. And I get it, that's really hard to be good at. But it seems like they're choosing that stuff over the requisite leadership talent.

For example, guys like Wannstedt, Jauron and Fox were tougher as leaders, but probably not as inventive in schemes.

We need a smart modern offensive coordinator with a chip on his shoulder. Someone who isnt scared of losing the players.

Ive been saying for a couple of years that Flus' body language in social situations seems very weak. Then i see him yelling on the practice field, and i think "ok, hes tough when hes actually coaching, but more beta when people are standing around talking." But then i see the state of discipline on this team, and i wonder.

And all that not including the long list of stupid coaching decisions that most of us and any pee wee coach would know to avoid.

I dont want him fired today. But I cant imagine Poles keeping him next year. And if were going to do that, why didnt we do it this past offseason?! I mean, a bunch of us were screaming about it at the time. Its not like this is hindsight. Flus had shown all these issues the past two years too. The first year we knew was a teardown. BUt didnt he lose THREE games last year where we had the lead with not much time to go, and coached them away to improbable losses?

This isnt a mistake, its a pattern!

 

[adam]

9 hours ago, Stinger226 said:

PFFs top 15 rookies this season: 1. Brock Bowers 2. Evan Williams 3. Jayden Daniels 4. Jared Verse 5. Zach Frazier 6. Bucky Irving 7. BTJ 8. Malik Nabers 9. MHJ 10. Andru Philips 11. Joe Alt 12. Dominick Puni 13. Ladd McConkey 14. Tyke Smith 15. Jarrian Jones

The fact that Tory Taylor is not on this list invalidates it completely. 

[Stinger226]

9 hours ago, ASHKUM BEAR said:

As much a Ben Johnson intrigues me, I am skeptical about staying on the same cycle we've been on. I don't know why they didn't just go all in on Harbaugh, but my inclination is he was out of our price range and too strong of an ego. 

The reason why I am skeptical of going with an OC is because they will have a learning curve like Eberflus, Nagy, Trestman..  I want a HC that knows the ins and outs for all aspects of the game and is not afraid to hold his coaches and players accountable. Knowing that establishing the run and sticking to it helps the whole team.   

Maybe Johnson or Klingsbury can learn fast, but I dont think the Bears can risk signing a new coach for 2 to 3 years to find out.  

Agree we cant use OC as the main criteria. Quinn was a defensive coach, Demeco Ryan was a defensive coach. One with a lot of experience would make more sense.

[adam]

Cole Kmet is now tied with Dick Gordon for 14th in franchise history with 238 receptions. He needs 4 to tie Desmond Clark for 13th (and 2nd best for TE).

Tory Taylor is already the franchise leader in punting average at 48.5, 2.4 yards ahead of Trenton Gill (who ironically was the leader). His 45.5% of punts inside the 20 are also a franchise best ahead of Pat O'Donnell at 35.5%.

[Mongo3451]

10 hours ago, ASHKUM BEAR said:

As much a Ben Johnson intrigues me, I am skeptical about staying on the same cycle we've been on. I don't know why they didn't just go all in on Harbaugh, but my inclination is he was out of our price range and too strong of an ego. 

I spoke to Harbaugh at the combine.  His direct quote was, "they didn't want me".

[BearFan PHX]

3 hours ago, Mongo3451 said:

I spoke to Harbaugh at the combine.  His direct quote was, "they didn't want me".

the McCaskeys need to sell this team

[ChileBear]

3 hours ago, Mongo3451 said:

I spoke to Harbaugh at the combine.  His direct quote was, "they didn't want me".

Warren knew him well from the Big Ten and they were not buds.

[Mongo3451]

58 minutes ago, BearFan PHX said:

the McCaskeys need to sell this team

🎯 They've turned the franchise into a woke corporate Harvard business model.  It started with Virginia getting rid of the Honey Bears.  Then Mikey started his penny pinching with hiring of GM's and coaches with minimal experience, along with hiring an accountant to be team president.  Now, we have the curious George crusade.  No cussing, no porn, no questionable character players, no toxic masculinity.  This is a high testosterone, toxic masculinity sport damnit!  Coaches and players should be in a controlled rage stage while at work.  You want animals in the weight room.  You want alphas in the meeting room.  You want men that are willing to smack some sense into someone else in the locker room. You want stone cold killers on game day.  I'm tired of the choirboy shit.  Darnell Wright and Tevin Jenkins used to be Dawgs, but now act neutered.  Don't get me wrong, but give me Brisker, Gordon and Stephenson attitudes all day long. (Fan taunting excluded).  I'm tired of soft football.

[BearFan PHX]

12 minutes ago, Mongo3451 said:

🎯 They've turned the franchise into a woke corporate Harvard business model.  It started with Virginia getting rid of the Honey Bears.  Then Mikey started his penny pinching with hiring of GM's and coaches with minimal experience, along with hiring an accountant to be team president.  Now, we have the curious George crusade.  No cussing, no porn, no questionable character players, no toxic masculinity.  This is a high testosterone, toxic masculinity sport damnit!  Coaches and players should be in a controlled rage stage while at work.  You want animals in the weight room.  You want alphas in the meeting room.  You want men that are willing to smack some sense into someone else in the locker room. You want stone cold killers on game day.  I'm tired of the choirboy shit.  Darnell Wright and Tevin Jenkins used to be Dawgs, but now act neutered.  Don't get me wrong, but give me Brisker, Gordon and Stephenson attitudes all day long. (Fan taunting excluded).  I'm tired of soft football.

yes yes yes yes yes yes yes

absolutely yes. its freakin football not a tampon commercial.

[Mongo3451]

52 minutes ago, BearFan PHX said:

yes yes yes yes yes yes yes

absolutely yes. its freakin football not a tampon commercial.

I thought you were Meg Ryan for a second...😝💪

[BearFan PHX]

1 hour ago, Mongo3451 said:

I thought you were Meg Ryan for a second...😝💪

hahahaha

"Ill have what the rest of the league is having" LOL

[Stinger226]

[Stinger226]

[BearFan PHX]

images arent posting unfortunately

[adam]

Lose = Fire Flus

[Stinger226]

14 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:

images arent posting unfortunately

I pulled off X, maybe it only shows if you have a X account. They are just the last two injury reports. 3 people ruled out for game are  Kiran, Brisker, and Jones.

[BearFan PHX]

3 minutes ago, Stinger226 said:

I pulled off X, maybe it only shows if you have a X account. They are just the last two injury reports. 3 people ruled out for game are  Kiran, Brisker, and Jones.

thank you

I guess we get Borom, or we get Pryor and that means Nate Davis plays. Ugh either way.

I have lost all faith in Davis, but maybe Borom will redeem himself and there will be a bright spot.

[ASHKUM BEAR]

56 minutes ago, BearFan PHX said:

thank you

I guess we get Borom, or we get Pryor and that means Nate Davis plays. Ugh either way.

I have lost all faith in Davis, but maybe Borom will redeem himself and there will be a bright spot.

Borum is ready to go. Jenkins will give it a shot. Davis better put in some good tape if he wants another job. 

Bears need to establish the run to help the line and give CW balanced looks.

[BearFan PHX]

10 minutes ago, ASHKUM BEAR said:

Borum is ready to go. Jenkins will give it a shot. Davis better put in some good tape if he wants another job. 

Bears need to establish the run to help the line and give CW balanced looks.

The only way Davis gets on the field is if we need Pryor at LT.

I think we either get

Borom - Jenkins (with Kramer as BU) - Shelton - Pryor - Wright

OR

Pryor - Jenkins (with Kramer as BU) - Shelton - Davis - Wright

So I guess it comes down to who is worse, Borom or Davis. My GUESS is that they start with Borom.

Also, I suppose there is some chance we could see Bates at Center too, but I doubt it this week. Maybe next week.

[ASHKUM BEAR]

3 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:

The only way Davis gets on the field is if we need Pryor at LT.

I think we either get

Borom - Jenkins (with Kramer as BU) - Shelton - Pryor - Wright

OR

Pryor - Jenkins (with Kramer as BU) - Shelton - Davis - Wright

So I guess it comes down to who is worse, Borom or Davis. My GUESS is that they start with Borom.

Also, I suppose there is some chance we could see Bates at Center too, but I doubt it this week. Maybe next week.

Then I'd say Davis is riding the pine. Everything I heard (the Score) is Borum is ready and they will play him. 

[BearFan PHX]

16 minutes ago, ASHKUM BEAR said:

Then I'd say Davis is riding the pine. Everything I heard (the Score) is Borum is ready and they will play him. 

I think that's most likely as well.

It will be good to see what he's got. Maybe not a truly fair audition, off of IR and right into the fire, but it will certainly be his chance to show something. The team needs players on the line, and if he shows well, he can earn himself a more extended audition.

I didn't like what Id seen from him in the past, but hopefully he can take this opportunity and make something great out of it.

Also, none of this should be construed to imply that I want Davis in there if at all possible.

Let's go Borom!

[BearFan PHX]

OK they had re-signed Jake Curhan a while back to the practice squad, and elevated him to the active roster. So we do have SOME options before wed have to move Pryor over and go with Davis. I assume Kramer is in the pipeline at OG too.

[Stinger226]

Who is the best 5 that are able to play? 

Borom was bad last year but can get us thru a game. Just because we havent seen him we seem to forget. Had he not got hurt, I think he would have never made the 53 man roster.

I think moving Pryor is our best option.

Jenkins will start but thinking he doesnt play the whole game. If Bates isnt ready I think Kramer may take some snaps there.

Hopefully Shelton stays healthy he has been more consistent than in his first few games. 

Unfortunitely Davis will need to play. If he wants to stay in the NFL, he needs to put good snaps on film. If Bates is ready, maybe here.

Wright should be fine but the new roster Jack  Curham will have to back him up or Borom if not starting on the left side. 

With all the negativity we went thru this week, we were one play away from hearing none of this. Fingers pointed every where but  I think it was on Stevenson celebrating to early.( lost his focus), Heard one narrator say that had he been in the right position, ,Brown was his man, the ball would have been in front of him and he would have knocked it down. Instead of runnung from the side angle to the ball of which he tipped it up. 

[BearFan PHX]

3 hours ago, Stinger226 said:

With all the negativity we went thru this week, we were one play away from hearing none of this. Fingers pointed every where but  I think it was on Stevenson celebrating to early.( lost his focus), Heard one narrator say that had he been in the right position, ,Brown was his man, the ball would have been in front of him and he would have knocked it down. Instead of runnung from the side angle to the ball of which he tipped it up. 

It doesnt matter. You win or lose games as a head coach based on the decisions you make. If your players pull out a win anyway, it doesnt mean you made the right choices. And if you have a pattern of making wrong choices, then you are setting your team up to lose games even if you win some too.

I think there is a difference between rooting for your team to do well, and making excuses for their mistakes. The key to winning is accountability - that's waht makes people get better and learn from their mistakes.

As for being one play away from not hearing this, I disagree again. I've been pointing out his errors in games we won too.

And again, losing when you get beat is fine. It's part of football. You don't win every game. But making unforced errors, continued mismanagement of the clock, challenges, and situational football is a problem that will lose us more games in the future too.

Had Eberflus defended the sideline on the second to last play like he should have, and had he had his team in position to properly defend the hail mary, and had he taken a timeout to get everyone set, and then a miracle had happened and the Commanders got the TD anyway, this would be a very different conversation.

Had he given the ball to Roschon Johnson instead of Kramer, and had he punted instead of going for it on 4th and 1 from his own 20 in the 2nd qtr down 6, a hail mary wouldnt have won the game for the Commanders. His early mistakes set up his late ones, and they all added together to take a win away from us, and make a playoff berth much more difficult to achieve.

It's OK to get beaten. It's not OK to give games away. The head coach is supposed to help you WIN games. At worst they should be neutral. But if they are helping you lose games, they should not be head coach.

[Stinger226]

2 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:

It doesnt matter. You win or lose games as a head coach based on the decisions you make. If your players pull out a win anyway, it doesnt mean you made the right choices. And if you have a pattern of making wrong choices, then you are setting your team up to lose games even if you win some too.

I think there is a difference between rooting for your team to do well, and making excuses for their mistakes. The key to winning is accountability - that's waht makes people get better and learn from their mistakes.

As for being one play away from not hearing this, I disagree again. I've been pointing out his errors in games we won too.

And again, losing when you get beat is fine. It's part of football. You don't win every game. But making unforced errors, continued mismanagement of the clock, challenges, and situational football is a problem that will lose us more games in the future too.

Had Eberflus defended the sideline on the second to last play like he should have, and had he had his team in position to properly defend the hail mary, and had he taken a timeout to get everyone set, and then a miracle had happened and the Commanders got the TD anyway, this would be a very different conversation.

Had he given the ball to Roschon Johnson instead of Kramer, and had he punted instead of going for it on 4th and 1 from his own 20 in the 2nd qtr down 6, a hail mary wouldnt have won the game for the Commanders. His early mistakes set up his late ones, and they all added together to take a win away from us, and make a playoff berth much more difficult to achieve.

It's OK to get beaten. It's not OK to give games away. The head coach is supposed to help you WIN games. At worst they should be neutral. But if they are helping you lose games, they should not be head coach.

You said it best when you said Flus doesnt give you a winning edge in a game.

So if we won that game , you're saying everyone would still be talking about Flus game decisions? 

First of all the not calling a TO at the end of the game wont have been into play. He allowed Waldron to call the goaline play, that is on him but the team came right back and scored on their next series. Not sure that would be a large talking point. 

Now you always critisize Flus, Im saying that Bear fandom would not be obsessing with these plays in a negative way last last week was. 

Im not trying to make excuses for him, he still is our HC and  just not calling for his job.