Senior Bowl

[Mongo3451]

 

[Stinger226]

Doesn't anyone know he's been healthy at his current weight?

[Mongo3451]

I'm watching Kyle Williams out of Washington State.  I'm not seeing him show up on the rankings, but he had good production.  His release of the line is excellent.  May be a decent pick up for the slot.

[BearFan PHX]

This is a good article, that kind of nails Poles' failure on the OL. I agree with Stinger that a lot of what this guy writes is trash, but I agree with him on this one.

https://www.sportsmockery.com/chicago-bears/the-actual-reason-ryan-poles-keeps-failing-on-the-offensive-line/

EDIT: for high round picks. Once you get into the 3rd round, it's a different story. So maybe the problem is just that we haven't spent higher round picks on the OL (Wright excepted of course, and he's our best OL player)

For curiosity's sake, here are our OL draft picks from the last 8 years.

2024 Kiran Amagadje Yale 3rd round

2023 Darnell Wright Tennessee 1st round

2022 Braxton Jones Southern Utah 5th round
          Zachary Thomas San Diego St 6th round
          Doug Kramer Illinois 6th round
          Ja'Tyre Carter Southern 7th round

2021 Tevin Jenkins Oklahoma St. 2nd round
         Larry Borom Missouri 5th round

2020 Arlington Hambright Colorado 7th round
          Lachavious Simmons Tennessee St 7th round

2019 none taken

2018 James Daniels Iowa 2nd round

2017 Jordan Morgan Kutztown 5th round

[AZ54]

9 hours ago, Mongo3451 said:

I'm watching Kyle Williams out of Washington State.  I'm not seeing him show up on the rankings, but he had good production.  His release of the line is excellent.  May be a decent pick up for the slot.

This route doesn't seem very impressive.   That's a horrible pass too but he doesn't accelerate away from the DB.  

[Mongo3451]

30 minutes ago, AZ54 said:

This route doesn't seem very impressive.   That's a horrible pass too but he doesn't accelerate away from the DB.  

That's a tough route to win.  The percentage of the field goes to the defender.  He was killing on inside routes, which a slot tends to run.

[jason]

On 1/28/2025 at 6:23 PM, AZ54 said:

I prefer to fix Oline in FA then add to it via the draft.  Caleb doesn’t need a bunch of rookies in front of him while he is learning a new offense.  Dline  has the talent in the first go get a good one.  

The problem with that is that top tier OL isn’t available in FA. At best the second tier guys are available. Which leads to gambling on players who used to be good and may have a few years left, or players with “potential.”

[BearFan PHX]

12 minutes ago, jason said:

The problem with that is that top tier OL isn’t available in FA. At best the second tier guys are available. Which leads to gambling on players who used to be good and may have a few years left, or players with “potential.”

I know this must be like Christmas for you Jason, everyone is so OL focused now. Let's hope we can get it right, because with the right OL (and DL), this team could go far.

And I can hear you saying "ANY team could go far with good lines!"

[jason]

15 minutes ago, BearFan PHX said:

I know this must be like Christmas for you Jason, everyone is so OL focused now. Let's hope we can get it right, because with the right OL (and DL), this team could go far.

And I can hear you saying "ANY team could go far with good lines!"

I love that it’s FINALLY GETTING FOCUS. It only happens every 20 years or so. I just wish this franchise would learn that average skill players benefit far more from great OLs than the reverse. Give ANY QB in the NFL a secure pocket and time, and there is guaranteed offensive success. 

[BearFan PHX]

38 minutes ago, jason said:

I love that it’s FINALLY GETTING FOCUS. It only happens every 20 years or so. I just wish this franchise would learn that average skill players benefit far more from great OLs than the reverse. Give ANY QB in the NFL a secure pocket and time, and there is guaranteed offensive success. 

I agree that if you can give any backup QB in the league 5 clean seconds on every play, they would be All Pro, but of course the DL has something to say about that too. It's hard to be consistently dominant on the OL, even if you allot a ton of resources there.

But that's not an argument for how we've been either. Completely ignoring the OL is a recipe for failure for sure.

Between those two extremes, you are right - a good OL elevates mediocre players. And of course thats why a good DL can win games too!

[Stinger226]

10 hours ago, BearFan PHX said:

I agree that if you can give any backup QB in the league 5 clean seconds on every play, they would be All Pro, but of course the DL has something to say about that too. It's hard to be consistently dominant on the OL, even if you allot a ton of resources there.

But that's not an argument for how we've been either. Completely ignoring the OL is a recipe for failure for sure.

Between those two extremes, you are right - a good OL elevates mediocre players. And of course thats why a good DL can win games too!

Poles didn't completely ignore the OL. Wright was a high pick.

 

He signed Davis last year that was above average but after the death of his mother, he didn't care anymore.

Jenkins played well and he was giving him the last year to prove he could stay healthy. ( He didn't)

Drafting Braxton Jones was a risk he took and thought he succeeded but he didn't get better this year. Drafted a future prospect in Kiran to develop if Braxton failed. Needed him this year but wasn't ready.

Patrick and Whitehair failed last year so double dipped with Bates and Shelton at center. Bates was to injured and Shelton actually did okay. 

I think because he was a marginal player when he tried the NFL, he thought he could build a OL with some marginal free agents and Wright and Braxton. Several failures doomed the OL coming into the year.

They are a few IOL that would be upgrades but will not come cheap. Trey Smith, Becton, and Dave Dalman.I think he tries to get one, resigns Shelton, Pryor and Bill Murray. Drafts a starting OT or OG( both ?) depending on how the draft falls. A center prospect to seat behind Shelton until he's ready. 

Example: Kelvin Banks - moves Kiran to LG- Shelton and a rookie - Trey Smith- Wright.

Braxton, Pryor, Murray and 2 rookies for backups. 

Problem solved.

[AZ54]

15 hours ago, Mongo3451 said:

That's a tough route to win.  The percentage of the field goes to the defender.  He was killing on inside routes, which a slot tends to run.

That can be.  He sure didn’t look comfortable running that route against press coverage.  

[AZ54]

14 hours ago, jason said:

The problem with that is that top tier OL isn’t available in FA. At best the second tier guys are available. Which leads to gambling on players who used to be good and may have a few years left, or players with “potential.”

The entire draft is a gamble.  Any vet FA has a better known floor than the majority of rookies.   When I see experts like Brandon Thorn say the OTs at the top (Campbell.  Banks) belong inside at the NFL level then they aren’t top 10 picks.   Then you’re adding a player having to learn a new position which doesn’t always go well early on.  The value at 10 fits the Dline far better than Oline.   Rounds 2 and 3 are where we should address the IOL.  Or a trade back out of 10. 

[BearFan PHX]

3 hours ago, Stinger226 said:

Poles didn't completely ignore the OL. Wright was a high pick.

 

He signed Davis last year that was above average but after the death of his mother, he didn't care anymore.

Jenkins played well and he was giving him the last year to prove he could stay healthy. ( He didn't)

Drafting Braxton Jones was a risk he took and thought he succeeded but he didn't get better this year. Drafted a future prospect in Kiran to develop if Braxton failed. Needed him this year but wasn't ready.

Patrick and Whitehair failed last year so double dipped with Bates and Shelton at center. Bates was to injured and Shelton actually did okay. 

I think because he was a marginal player when he tried the NFL, he thought he could build a OL with some marginal free agents and Wright and Braxton. Several failures doomed the OL coming into the year.

They are a few IOL that would be upgrades but will not come cheap. Trey Smith, Becton, and Dave Dalman.I think he tries to get one, resigns Shelton, Pryor and Bill Murray. Drafts a starting OT or OG( both ?) depending on how the draft falls. A center prospect to seat behind Shelton until he's ready. 

Example: Kelvin Banks - moves Kiran to LG- Shelton and a rookie - Trey Smith- Wright.

Braxton, Pryor, Murray and 2 rookies for backups. 

Problem solved.

I should have said has been completely ineffective building the OL, all but ignoring that group in the draft.

I agree Wright is good. But the rest, I just don't share your enthusiasm for what we have. i think we well could see four new starters on the OL.

I agree we will be players in free agency ont he OL, but that's always a gamble too, and unfortunately, given our situation, one we have to take. I hope it works out for us.

As for Davis, there were articles at the time we signed him that he refused to practice and was lazy and not team oriented. So I dont think it was the death of his grandmother that was the underlying issue. His tape looked good, but the red flags were there.

Tevin Jenkins is always injured, and we knew that too going into last year. He is a good player, but he isn't reliable.

Bates was supposed to start at OC, but again, we threw our hopes into a guy who was injured, and never really saw the field.

 

[jason]

5 hours ago, AZ54 said:

The entire draft is a gamble.  Any vet FA has a better known floor than the majority of rookies.   When I see experts like Brandon Thorn say the OTs at the top (Campbell.  Banks) belong inside at the NFL level then they aren’t top 10 picks.   Then you’re adding a player having to learn a new position which doesn’t always go well early on.  The value at 10 fits the Dline far better than Oline.   Rounds 2 and 3 are where we should address the IOL.  Or a trade back out of 10. 

Given the gamble, I don’t care what dudes named Brandon Thorn say about the draft. I care more about dudes who look like grizzly bears with quick feet who earned their battle scars in big time college football.

As for moving inside, so be it. Give me ten year studs at any OL Position.

Lastly, if we went DL, OL, OL, I’d be fine with that.

[jason]

8 hours ago, Stinger226 said:

Poles didn't completely ignore the OL. Wright was a high pick.

 

He signed Davis last year that was above average but after the death of his mother, he didn't care anymore.

Jenkins played well and he was giving him the last year to prove he could stay healthy. ( He didn't)

Drafting Braxton Jones was a risk he took and thought he succeeded but he didn't get better this year. Drafted a future prospect in Kiran to develop if Braxton failed. Needed him this year but wasn't ready.

Patrick and Whitehair failed last year so double dipped with Bates and Shelton at center. Bates was to injured and Shelton actually did okay. 

I think because he was a marginal player when he tried the NFL, he thought he could build a OL with some marginal free agents and Wright and Braxton. Several failures doomed the OL coming into the year.

They are a few IOL that would be upgrades but will not come cheap. Trey Smith, Becton, and Dave Dalman.I think he tries to get one, resigns Shelton, Pryor and Bill Murray. Drafts a starting OT or OG( both ?) depending on how the draft falls. A center prospect to seat behind Shelton until he's ready. 

Example: Kelvin Banks - moves Kiran to LG- Shelton and a rookie - Trey Smith- Wright.

Braxton, Pryor, Murray and 2 rookies for backups. 

Problem solved.

I don’t believe that is problem solved. It’s 2 out of 5. It’s still a ragtag unit. A rookie LT, nuff said. Kiran at LG is a huge risk. Shelton is two years removed from practice squad, so he’s far from good. Trey Smith would be a great addition. Wright is proving to be solid.
 

[Stinger226]

13 minutes ago, jason said:

I don’t believe that is problem solved. It’s 2 out of 5. It’s still a ragtag unit. A rookie LT, nuff said. Kiran at LG is a huge risk. Shelton is two years removed from practice squad, so he’s far from good. Trey Smith would be a great addition. Wright is proving to be solid.
 

True but we don't have 4 first round picks to apply to the OL so getting a high end free agent replaces that void.

No centers are high rated in the draft unless you get a position change player. 

If they don't draft a pick 10 OT we will have to place trust in Braxton playing better. A blue chip rookie could be the LG but that would have some growing pains.

I think with the new blood injected in the process, we will get better results from however they put it together. We're not going to 25th to 5 th in one year no matter how they put it together.

[Mongo3451]

2 hours ago, Stinger226 said:

True but we don't have 4 first round picks to apply to the OL so getting a high end free agent replaces that void.

No centers are high rated in the draft unless you get a position change player. 

If they don't draft a pick 10 OT we will have to place trust in Braxton playing better. A blue chip rookie could be the LG but that would have some growing pains.

I think with the new blood injected in the process, we will get better results from however they put it together. We're not going to 25th to 5 th in one year no matter how they put it together.

We don't need 4 first round picks to fix the OL.  Elite OL prospects go in the first round, while solid starters go in rounds 2-4.  If you live there, you win there.  We have the QB on a rookie deal for the next few years.  It's time to invest in the trenches.  Thayer mentioned weights and conditioning.  What does he know that hasn't come out?  He's definitely an insider. Maybe the boys haven't put in the work.

[DABEARSDABOMB]

3 hours ago, jason said:

Given the gamble, I don’t care what dudes named Brandon Thorn say about the draft. I care more about dudes who look like grizzly bears with quick feet who earned their battle scars in big time college football.

As for moving inside, so be it. Give me ten year studs at any OL Position.

Lastly, if we went DL, OL, OL, I’d be fine with that.

I am good with that too - plus a free agent dline and than I probably grab RB and Te after those first 3 picks - would be fine if bears moved down 5-7 slots to pick up an extra 2nd and 4th too. Would be perfect given depth at guard, RB and TE in the draft and you still have a quality first rounder to add a first round dlinemen (I’m thinking interior is good spot unless they think an edge worth getting is there - if an edge isn’t there, take a DT to pair with  Dexter - go 2yrs with Chase Young (was pretty good with Dennis Allen this past year and is still real young). 
 

Very good RB and are draft in terms of depth so I think taking those guys between rd 2-4 makes sense too (along with 3 linemen - 2 offense, 1 defense).

[Stinger226]

If Banks or Campbell are there at 10 I think they take him and play with the second picks to get a stud DL. I wouldn't mind if they took Zabel with a second round pick either. Hopefully they move back and still get good value with extra picks. 

What they get in free agency will also determine who they pick high.

 

[BearFan PHX]

1 hour ago, Stinger226 said:

What they get in free agency will also determine who they pick high.

 

for sure