BearFan PHX Posted February 26 Report Share Posted February 26 Apparently the Bears scheduled a meeting with Ashton Jeanty right out of the gate. Some may read this to mean that we are very interested in drafting him, and we probably are. Doesn't mean we would pick him over other players we'd also be interested in drafting at that spot. But I also take it to mean that it increases the idea of someone trading up to get him if he is on the board when our pick comes, seeing that we have interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted February 26 Author Report Share Posted February 26 Lying season begins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted February 26 Report Share Posted February 26 Like you stated, make the league think you're interested for trading value. Of course he would be nice to draft but with that pick you need trenches,best OL or DL, a difference maker. Carter, Mason, or Campbell. Go for it but Jeanty could be BPA at 10. Which I would try to trade back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASHKUM BEAR Posted February 26 Report Share Posted February 26 3 hours ago, BearFan PHX said: Lying season begins The Bears need to have an established oline first in my opinion before spending your big coin (1st) on a RB. I can see Rd 2 or 3 if there is a bpa. Like you said, he may draw a trade and maybe Dallas bites. How much does trading 12 for 10 get us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted February 26 Report Share Posted February 26 Not sure but 2 Spots should at least get a 4th and 6th? Don't know where to grab the value formula. I think they get 2 vets on the OL and then draft a starter type Campbell -Cooper -Donovan Jackson. Then get a OL that can play multiple positions for the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASHKUM BEAR Posted February 26 Report Share Posted February 26 Drafttek I believe uses a newer version. https://www.drafttek.com/nfl-trade-value-chart.asp 100 points= a 3rd(in the compensation slots which is pick 100) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted February 26 Report Share Posted February 26 6 hours ago, ASHKUM BEAR said: The Bears need to have an established oline first in my opinion before spending your big coin (1st) on a RB. I can see Rd 2 or 3 if there is a bpa. Like you said, he may draw a trade and maybe Dallas bites. How much does trading 12 for 10 get us. Starter IOL are thick in rounds 2-4. All depends on free agency. Building a new offense with young OL, their number one friend is a great running back... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASHKUM BEAR Posted February 26 Report Share Posted February 26 31 minutes ago, Mongo3451 said: Starter IOL are thick in rounds 2-4. All depends on free agency. Building a new offense with young OL, their number one friend is a great running back... For sure, Poles and Johnson talked to Jentry right away. I just see that #1 pick going to D or Oline, or trade down. Jentry would be a great pick next year if the oline is established. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted February 26 Author Report Share Posted February 26 I absolutely agree that we have to fix the OL and get an edge rusher. That said I am not sure that we couldnt pick Jeanty with the #10 pick either. Not predicting it, but i think it's one option. Probably depdns on free agency and how the rest of the draft looks to us in rounds 2 and 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 2 hours ago, BearFan PHX said: I absolutely agree that we have to fix the OL and get an edge rusher. That said I am not sure that we couldnt pick Jeanty with the #10 pick either. Not predicting it, but i think it's one option. Probably depdns on free agency and how the rest of the draft looks to us in rounds 2 and 3 First I think people under value Swift. In a Ben Johnson offense, he can make big plays but we definitely need a power back of which lots of choices in 3rd and beyond. I want the first 4 picks to be 2 DL and 2 OL , drafted at where their value is. My ideal situation would be trade back, get an extra 3rd, take Mike Green - Jack Sawyer - prince Umanmielen. Then in the second Johan Savaiinaea and Grey Zabel. At 72 - Joshua Farmer ( 10 sacks -20 TFL- 74 tackles. 4.85 speed.) he is the 120th overall ranked player so may be gotten with an extra 3rd round pick. Draft Ollis Gordon, 6-1 233 4.45 speed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted February 27 Author Report Share Posted February 27 1 hour ago, Stinger226 said: First I think people under value Swift. In a Ben Johnson offense, he can make big plays but we definitely need a power back of which lots of choices in 3rd and beyond. I want the first 4 picks to be 2 DL and 2 OL , drafted at where their value is. My ideal situation would be trade back, get an extra 3rd, take Mike Green - Jack Sawyer - prince Umanmielen. Then in the second Johan Savaiinaea and Grey Zabel. At 72 - Joshua Farmer ( 10 sacks -20 TFL- 74 tackles. 4.85 speed.) he is the 120th overall ranked player so may be gotten with an extra 3rd round pick. Draft Ollis Gordon, 6-1 233 4.45 speed The Lions traded Swift away when Johnson was the OC, so there's that. That said, we are in a better position to cut or trade him next year capwise. So he may stick around for money reasons. But I still think there is some chance we could draft Jeanty just because he is next level. 2nd and 3rd round backs arent next level, in fact most RBs arent next level, most are inferior to Swift. But if we did pick Jeanty it would have to be in the context of a real plan to upgrade the OL of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 1 hour ago, BearFan PHX said: The Lions traded Swift away when Johnson was the OC, so there's that. Thank you. All said, if Jeanty is deemed the dude that can help the new OL and Caleb succeed, I'm in. Swift would be a good third down back, with Roschon being the third back. That would be solid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ54 Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 52 minutes ago, BearFan PHX said: The Lions traded Swift away when Johnson was the OC, so there's that. That said, we are in a better position to cut or trade him next year capwise. So he may stick around for money reasons. But I still think there is some chance we could draft Jeanty just because he is next level. 2nd and 3rd round backs arent next level, in fact most RBs arent next level, most are inferior to Swift. But if we did pick Jeanty it would have to be in the context of a real plan to upgrade the OL of course. As The World Turns:  "The Lions traded Swift away " ...and promptly signed our "meh" RB for less money than the $10m Swift wanted at the time. Then they went and drafted another lightweight RB to replace the outside burst they lost when Swift left. Swift had injury issues during his time in Detroit so I don't think it was a big deal moving away from him, plus they needed someone tougher for the short yardage situations. Now we need someone better than Roschon to be our tough inside runner.  It's always interesting to see former Bears players be successful elsewhere. Almost makes you think coaching makes a difference.  I was curious about Jeanty last year but after seeing him in a bowl game he doesn't look special. He looks good and with the right line in front of him he'll destroy some DBs who are trying to tackle him. RBs who have to make a living off broken tackles don't usually make it for very long in the NFL.  I expect he'll have a very good first 4-5 years.  At the end of the day we all know what matters most is who is blocking for the RBs.   Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 2 hours ago, AZ54 said: I was curious about Jeanty last year but after seeing him in a bowl game he doesn't look special. He looks good and with the right line in front of him he'll destroy some DBs who are trying to tackle him. Agree to disagree. Jeanty may have the best contact balance I've seen in a long time. Possibly since Walter... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted February 27 Author Report Share Posted February 27 2 hours ago, AZ54 said: As The World Turns:  "The Lions traded Swift away " ...and promptly signed our "meh" RB for less money than the $10m Swift wanted at the time. Then they went and drafted another lightweight RB to replace the outside burst they lost when Swift left. Swift had injury issues during his time in Detroit so I don't think it was a big deal moving away from him, plus they needed someone tougher for the short yardage situations. Now we need someone better than Roschon to be our tough inside runner. I read that to mean that they didnt think Swift was the long term answer, and they signed Montgomery as a stop gap measure until they could find the guy they really wanted to feature, which they eventually did. So will Johnson think Swift is the long term answer? I doubt it, but i wouldnt be shocked if he kept him this year and replaced him next year? or replaced him this year is an option too, but it doesnt need to be for him to know Swift isnt the long term answer he's looking for?  2 hours ago, AZ54 said: It's always interesting to see former Bears players be successful elsewhere. Almost makes you think coaching makes a difference. For sure! The scheme and coaching is a big part of is and so is...  2 hours ago, AZ54 said: At the end of the day we all know what matters most is who is blocking for the RBs.   Absolutely. Dont tell me Emmitt Smith was a better back than Payton. He just had that line.  2 hours ago, AZ54 said: I was curious about Jeanty last year but after seeing him in a bowl game he doesn't look special. He looks good and with the right line in front of him he'll destroy some DBs who are trying to tackle him. RBs who have to make a living off broken tackles don't usually make it for very long in the NFL.  I expect he'll have a very good first 4-5 years. The RB position as a marquis player is an antiquated idea. Then again, everything old is new again, as evidenced by defenses keeping a second safety back more to counter the passing game, and then the Lions and Eagles showing the league how to defeat that with a strong running game again. But 4-5 years, sounds about right, and of course that's on a rookie contract so you arent overpaying him with cap room, just draft capital if you draft him early-ish. But yeah, the days of backs usually getting that big second contract are probably over. There may be a few exceptions, but in general I agree with all of this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted February 27 Author Report Share Posted February 27 19 minutes ago, Mongo3451 said: Agree to disagree. Jeanty may have the best contact balance I've seen in a long time. Possibly since Walter... I'm not taking any positions on this yet. What Ive seen tells me he's a stud. But I haven't done enough homework yet to know if Id take him at #10 over, say, Will Campbell. Or trade down. But if Jeanty is as Ive read him to be, and 5 good minutes of YouTube film tell me he is (lol) then I think he's in the conversation at #10. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 4 hours ago, Mongo3451 said: Thank you. All said, if Jeanty is deemed the dude that can help the new OL and Caleb succeed, I'm in. Swift would be a good third down back, with Roschon being the third back. That would be solid. I’m not. If that is deemed, then I guaran-damn-tee it shouldn’t have been. Picking a RB in the first would be a classically stupid Bears move with so many other holes. I’ve even had friends call and laugh about this, like when we drafted Benson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 12 hours ago, BearFan PHX said: The Lions traded Swift away when Johnson was the OC, so there's that. That said, we are in a better position to cut or trade him next year capwise. So he may stick around for money reasons. But I still think there is some chance we could draft Jeanty just because he is next level. 2nd and 3rd round backs arent next level, in fact most RBs arent next level, most are inferior to Swift. But if we did pick Jeanty it would have to be in the context of a real plan to upgrade the OL of course. Johnson was asked about that and he said he had no input into that decision. If you goggle it, you will find the reasons he was traded was not because of performance. He was going into his last year of his contract and had missed games every year due to injuries and Brad Holmes decided to draft a RB ( 2 1st round picks) and let Swift play out his contract. He wasn't going to pay him. After they drafted Gibbs, and signed David Montgomery, Swift went to Holmes and requested a trade. 2022 / 99 carries/ 542/ 5.5/5 TDs.      48 receptions/389/8.1/3 TDs   Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 6 hours ago, jason said: I’m not. If that is deemed, then I guaran-damn-tee it shouldn’t have been. Picking a RB in the first would be a classically stupid Bears move with so many other holes. I’ve even had friends call and laugh about this, like when we drafted Benson. As much as Jeanty is going to be a stud in the NFL, the bears won't be drafting him. Johnson clearly relies on a 2 back system, if you draft a #1 it will change the dynamic of a team trying to feature a QB. Johnson came here because of Caleb. They will draft a RB to upgrade the power game, Swift will do well under Johnson as the scat back. The bad OL also affected the running game as well as the passing game. Johnson talked about impact players also on defense as well as offense. Caleb - DJ- Odunze - Kmet and a combo RBs. The first pick will be an impact player, probably D, Campbell seems to be the only top 10 OL player. If not there, I think they draft a DE or DT. Banks, Simmons, are the only true LT in the draft and so far haven't been evaluated to top OL pick values. All the other high rated OL seemed destined to RT or move inside. They may deem them that and change the # 10 pick evaluation. IOL has great depth and can be gotten with 39-41 if that's where they choose to draft them. IMO, I think the first player will be a DL pick, 39-41 OL and 72 open. I think they bring in 2 starters on the OL and 1 of 2 DL . News today at the combine is Abdul Carter has a stress factor in his foot, probably surgery. If he drops to 10, would you take him knowing he will miss the beginning of the season? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 8 hours ago, jason said: I’m not. If that is deemed, then I guaran-damn-tee it shouldn’t have been. Picking a RB in the first would be a classically stupid Bears move with so many other holes. I’ve even had friends call and laugh about this, like when we drafted Benson. It's not my recommendation due to me being ALL IN on the trenches. But, I do see where a guy like him could be a chain mover. If we have three new guys on the IOL, he's their best chance to succeed as a unit. Big picture may be there too. Is it my plan, no. But I didn't hate it either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted February 27 Author Report Share Posted February 27 4 hours ago, Stinger226 said: Johnson was asked about that and he said he had no input into that decision. If you goggle it, you will find the reasons he was traded was not because of performance. He was going into his last year of his contract and had missed games every year due to injuries and Brad Holmes decided to draft a RB ( 2 1st round picks) and let Swift play out his contract. He wasn't going to pay him. After they drafted Gibbs, and signed David Montgomery, Swift went to Holmes and requested a trade. 2022 / 99 carries/ 542/ 5.5/5 TDs.      48 receptions/389/8.1/3 TDs   but Johnson was all in on drafting Gibbs, and signing Montgomery. That means he didnt have faith in Swift for his offense. Im not saying we will cut or trade Swift this year, but I am saying I dont think he is our long term solution, so it will happen this year or next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ54 Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 1 hour ago, BearFan PHX said: but Johnson was all in on drafting Gibbs, and signing Montgomery. That means he didnt have faith in Swift for his offense. Im not saying we will cut or trade Swift this year, but I am saying I dont think he is our long term solution, so it will happen this year or next year. Correct.  I’d say Swift has one more year as a Bear.   Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 1 hour ago, BearFan PHX said: but Johnson was all in on drafting Gibbs, and signing Montgomery. That means he didnt have faith in Swift for his offense. This! It's because Gibbs was a huge upgrade over Swift. Whenever you can see an upgrade that you can truly weaponize, do it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearFan PHX Posted February 27 Author Report Share Posted February 27 Look at how teams do after cutting or trading Swift: The Eagles won the Superbowl. The Lions won the division, had their best offensive season ever and were in the discussion for the Superbowl. Therefore, logically, the sooner we cut or trade Swift, the sooner we will win a Superbowl! LOL yes Im kidding, but Im not kidding that Swift isnt good enough. Id even rather have Montgomery than Swift. Having a home run hitter is great, but having someone who routinely threatens to get 4+ yards a carry even if they never break big gains will bring those safeties down into the box, and open up play action and the deep passing game. I wonder if Roschon Johnson will have a resurgence. I thought he was a tough runner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 2 hours ago, BearFan PHX said: but Johnson was all in on drafting Gibbs, and signing Montgomery. That means he didnt have faith in Swift for his offense. Im not saying we will cut or trade Swift this year, but I am saying I dont think he is our long term solution, so it will happen this year or next year. Brad Holmes, the GM made those decisions , when asked Ben said he had nothing to do with it. I'm not trying to say Swift is great but he's not chump change either. Swift went to the pro bowl the year he played in Philly, he was only there on a one year deal. Would you rather sign Barkley or resign Swift? That's not brain surgery. Barkley wasn't available the yr before. I agree he probably won't be here after next year but he had production every place he played until he came here. So by your logic, we should be in the SB after we cut Swift. Got it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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