adam Posted April 30, 2008 Report Share Posted April 30, 2008 The one problem I see about changing draft picks, is from that point on, there is a chance that almost every other pick would change as well. So you cannot even determine what the team would look like if we grabbed McNabb or Palmer. Also, if we gave away future draft picks, then did not play well those following years, we would not even be able to use the high draft picks to rebuild. That reminds me of what SF did. They trade away their 1st to New England to move into the 28th slot of the 1st Round in 2007. Then they have a bad year and Joe Staley could've been Sedrick Ellis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucky Luciano Posted April 30, 2008 Report Share Posted April 30, 2008 While I understand, and agree, at the same time I have to say that it still has to depend on what the other team(s) asked in trade. As I said before, thre is a point where aggressive moves become suicide. Ditka gave away two years worth of drafts in order to get Ricky. Suicide. I also blame that trade for our inability to get McNabb. As I recall, we did in fact show interest in moving up, but NO wanted a kings ransom. Ironically, we asked for the same ransom when NE and Jax wanted to move up for Enis, and ended up taking him ourselves. ditka is an idiot. he was looking for his new payton and should have been looking for his new mcmahon. Regarding Palmer. I am not sure there has been a QB I have been higher on since I started really following the draft. I so wanted to get him. Problem is, you can want all you want, but you need two to trade. Cincy had the top pick, and were locked in from nearly the get-go w/ Palmer. As I recall, they even signed him prior to the draft. It is difficult enough to trade up for a player, and another to get a team who has been sold on that player to give him up. I would have given a lot for him, but w/o knowing what it would have taken, I just am not sure how smart of a move it would have been. i realize that MAYBE you don't get him cause they just won't trade. that is in every case in every draft. i also think if you gave up 2 firsts and a few other picks they would have dealt. i have to ask... if palmer is what you REALLY believe is to be a franchise 10 year qb, how much is he worth to you? to me without any doubt it's 2 firsts plus others. how long have we done nothing in this area and how many superbowls has it cost us in the past? you do like the colts did and take payton manning and build a team around him. qb's are so few and far between good ones you have to take your shot at the ones you believe in. as far as the walter jones 2 firsts... don't you think then that a rookie franchise QB prospect is worth that gamble rather than a LOT? That is what is so frustrating about this year. We had a QB, who I feel is going to be a franchise QB, fall into our laps, and we passed. Worse, then GB takes him. Now I have to hope I am totally wrong, knowing the crow I will have to eat, because if I am right, GB could be a power for the next decade. couldn't agree more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
butkusrules Posted April 30, 2008 Report Share Posted April 30, 2008 A video is out on ESPN.com with Mel Kiper and Todd McShay discussing the draft. Surprisingly, Kiper picked the Bears as the team that helped itself the most for this year. He also said we had the best UDFA signing in Caleb Hanie, saying he has an NFL arm and could be a quality starter in the future. You know me, I could give a crap what Kiper says, but it was nice to see the good pub. Neevr imagnined I'd be typing this but I have really grown to respect Kiper of the years. McShay on the other hand is disrespectful blowhard. During their exchanges he literally laughs at Kiper all the time. I dont know how Kiper keeps his calm. McShay annoys me. More important then McShay's antics , is that he seems like he is just regurgitating everything I read in the mainstream. Kiper always has info on dudes I have never heard of, the players that JA drafts well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrunkBomber Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 So QB is why we lost the Super Bowl, shows how much I know, I thought it was the run defense... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 So QB is why we lost the Super Bowl, shows how much I know, I thought it was the run defense... Ouch. At least now we can get the RB who torched us (Rhodes). The 2 INTs and fumble by Grossman didn't help either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azbearsfan Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 So QB is why we lost the Super Bowl, shows how much I know, I thought it was the run defense... lol I thought it was the D. Manning lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrunkBomber Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 Ouch. At least now we can get the RB who torched us (Rhodes). The 2 INTs and fumble by Grossman didn't help either. Lots of things went wrong. I just dont think that Grossman shoulders any more blame than anyone else. Bensons fumble was bad. The fumble on the kick off, Reid I think was bad. Missing Tommie and Mike Brown destroyed our run defense. Either way, I think it was simply Mannings year to win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Hochuli 3:16 Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 Lots of things went wrong. I just dont think that Grossman shoulders any more blame than anyone else. Bensons fumble was bad. The fumble on the kick off, Reid I think was bad. Missing Tommie and Mike Brown destroyed our run defense. Either way, I think it was simply Mannings year to win. And the coaching was horses***. 2nd and 1 and we're runnin' PAs, which eventually led to a Rex fumble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ54 Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 With all the talk about how we can't draft a QB, please tell me who can? I can think of one guy I'd trust about selecting a QB and that was Bill Walsh, and he's no longer an option. The entire NFL is littered with draft busts at the QB position in all rounds and UDFA's like Romo (who was signed because he made a good impression throwing the ball at the scouting combine) and Warner show up out of nowhere. NFL teams spend millions of dollars on the scouting process yet still fail at this. Why? I think the reasons go beyond just being able to pick a QB in the draft. You have to pick a QB who fits your system. These days teams change head coaches every 3, ,4, or 5 years. With that comes a new system. Or in our case Lovie has changed his OC bringing in a totally different system from what he started with. All that is going on behind the scenes of a job where the learning curve is widely recognized as being at least 3 years and possibly 4. Look at the Steelers and their approach to head coaches. They've had a lot of success with this model over the years. In a copy cat league why isn't this more common? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongo3451 Posted May 1, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 With all the talk about how we can't draft a QB, please tell me who can? I can think of one guy I'd trust about selecting a QB and that was Bill Walsh, and he's no longer an option. The entire NFL is littered with draft busts at the QB position in all rounds and UDFA's like Romo (who was signed because he made a good impression throwing the ball at the scouting combine) and Warner show up out of nowhere. NFL teams spend millions of dollars on the scouting process yet still fail at this. Why? I think the reasons go beyond just being able to pick a QB in the draft. You have to pick a QB who fits your system. These days teams change head coaches every 3, ,4, or 5 years. With that comes a new system. Or in our case Lovie has changed his OC bringing in a totally different system from what he started with. All that is going on behind the scenes of a job where the learning curve is widely recognized as being at least 3 years and possibly 4. Look at the Steelers and their approach to head coaches. They've had a lot of success with this model over the years. In a copy cat league why isn't this more common? Totally agree! There are hanful of QB's out there that are great on their own. Outside of that, they need help. It usually starts with a good to great OL, running game and a good defense. The QB's, TE's and WR's will become better as the sum of all parts are better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azbearsfan Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 Totally agree! There are hanful of QB's out there that are great on their own. Outside of that, they need help. It usually starts with a good to great OL, running game and a good defense. The QB's, TE's and WR's will become better as the sum of all parts are better. Great points. I wonder if Rothlesberger would have done as well if he wouldn't have slipped down to Pittsburg who already had a great running attack and defense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Da Bears 88 Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 With all the talk about how we can't draft a QB, please tell me who can? I can think of one guy I'd trust about selecting a QB and that was Bill Walsh, and he's no longer an option. The entire NFL is littered with draft busts at the QB position in all rounds and UDFA's like Romo (who was signed because he made a good impression throwing the ball at the scouting combine) and Warner show up out of nowhere. NFL teams spend millions of dollars on the scouting process yet still fail at this. Why? I think the reasons go beyond just being able to pick a QB in the draft. You have to pick a QB who fits your system. These days teams change head coaches every 3, ,4, or 5 years. With that comes a new system. Or in our case Lovie has changed his OC bringing in a totally different system from what he started with. All that is going on behind the scenes of a job where the learning curve is widely recognized as being at least 3 years and possibly 4. Guys like Romo don't come around after every draft you know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrunkBomber Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 It can go either way. There isnt really any science to it. For every Romo/Warner/Brady theres a Manning/Manning/Rothlesburger. Theres also lots of guys like Alex Smith, Leinart, VY who are young and still have a lot to prove after being highly regarded out of college. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ54 Posted May 2, 2008 Report Share Posted May 2, 2008 Guys like Romo don't come around every draft...no kidding but first round busts come around all the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearSox Posted May 3, 2008 Report Share Posted May 3, 2008 Although, it is a lot less likely that an UDFA will become a contributing or starting QB in the NFL. I bet you there are more UDFA QB's in the league who have made more contributions on their teams then there are 4th round QB's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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