Benson's done????

[nfoligno]

Madman,

 

I have asked this before, but will again. What does cutting Benson gain?

 

Often, very often, teams see a RB of theirs go down w/ injury during camp. W/ Benson on the roster, we have 4 and losing one to injury does not create an issue. If we cut Benson, and then lose a player to injury, we will be left scrambling to find a RB to add to the roster.

 

Every year, fans are high on their draft picks, and this year is no exception. Hey, I am high on Forte too, but he has yet to sign a contract, much less go through a legit practice, much less pre-season game, much less regular game. I think you get the point. While most are assuming Forte is the next great RB, similar assumptions in the past have been proven false. Why not first see if Forte is the stud everyone believes before making a roster move.

 

I am sure some will throw out Rhodes, as for some reason fans seem to be in love w/ this guy, but he was a joke w/ Oakland, when he wasn't suspended for roids, and wasn't that great for Indy his last year or two (SB being the exception). If he could not look good/great w/ an offense like Indy's, why do fans think he would look great in ours?

 

I just do not see the argument for cutting/trading him now. It just seems like letting him go to camp and step up or step out seems the best option. If Forte steps up, Benson's odds of sticking are that much less. If Forte struggles or goes down w/ injury, we are better off w/ Benson that w/ most of the trash on the market. Further, what if Benson himself steps up?

 

I have no issue w/ dumping Benson in/after camp if he doesn't come to camp in shape and "show up", but I simply do not understand the argument for dumping him today.

[balta1701-A]

I am sure some will throw out Rhodes, as for some reason fans seem to be in love w/ this guy, but he was a joke w/ Oakland, when he wasn't suspended for roids, and wasn't that great for Indy his last year or two (SB being the exception). If he could not look good/great w/ an offense like Indy's, why do fans think he would look great in ours?

I believe it was the Substance abuse policy, not specifically PED's.

[Da Bears 88]

Um, you do know that Rhodes played behind Edgerrin James for awhile.

[madlithuanian]

nfo,

 

I'm happy to answer again.

 

However, I think you may be mis-construing what I'm getting at. yes, I know well enough the financial situation,etc...but if this incident pans out in a certain direct, I think it is in the Bears' best interest to rid themselves of yet another blemish. I do not want to become the Illinois version of Cincy... If Benson is a drunk miscreant, I want him off the team. If what he says is true, then I'm OK with waiting to see what he can do on the field before letting him go next season. Bottom line, we can get Rhodes and have a decent vet helping Forte, or we can putz around this Benson. Maybe we have to wait until next year to restructire a few contracts,etc...but I look at the cots as negligibel compared to the baqd press and ill will.

 

But, now to answer your question....

 

Cutting Benson, under these circumstances gains the Bears some modicum of respect not dealing with bad characters... Odds are we can find a cast off that will produce as good as Benson could. If he can produce at all.

 

I follow your logic, but the question is different now that this circumstance has arisen.

 

You really don't dump him today, you dump him after you find what really happened...or you just wait til camp and dump him there and pick up someone else in the meantime. Rhodes, Shmodes, or etc...we can find a bum like Benson rather easily...

 

 

 

 

 

Madman,

 

I have asked this before, but will again. What does cutting Benson gain?

 

Often, very often, teams see a RB of theirs go down w/ injury during camp. W/ Benson on the roster, we have 4 and losing one to injury does not create an issue. If we cut Benson, and then lose a player to injury, we will be left scrambling to find a RB to add to the roster.

 

Every year, fans are high on their draft picks, and this year is no exception. Hey, I am high on Forte too, but he has yet to sign a contract, much less go through a legit practice, much less pre-season game, much less regular game. I think you get the point. While most are assuming Forte is the next great RB, similar assumptions in the past have been proven false. Why not first see if Forte is the stud everyone believes before making a roster move.

 

I am sure some will throw out Rhodes, as for some reason fans seem to be in love w/ this guy, but he was a joke w/ Oakland, when he wasn't suspended for roids, and wasn't that great for Indy his last year or two (SB being the exception). If he could not look good/great w/ an offense like Indy's, why do fans think he would look great in ours?

 

I just do not see the argument for cutting/trading him now. It just seems like letting him go to camp and step up or step out seems the best option. If Forte steps up, Benson's odds of sticking are that much less. If Forte struggles or goes down w/ injury, we are better off w/ Benson that w/ most of the trash on the market. Further, what if Benson himself steps up?

 

I have no issue w/ dumping Benson in/after camp if he doesn't come to camp in shape and "show up", but I simply do not understand the argument for dumping him today.

[nfoligno]

One. Do you not think it a tad hyprotical to cut Benson for this, then turn around and sign Rhodes, who was suspended 4 games for drugs, whatever drugs they were. I am not clear on that. Point is, Rhodes was suspended 4 games for violation of NFL policy, and you sign him after cutting Benson for getting a pair of Class B misdemeanors?

 

Two. You talk about not becoming Cincy and making a statement and all that, but again, to me it comes off as hyprocritical. Briggs smashes his car and runs away to avoid trouble, and we do nothing. So I guess the statement we teach is run from the cops and don't get caught, your cool. Okay, lets say Briggs, Tank and others are in the past, and we are turning over a new leaf. Um, how about that draft w/ a couple character red flags taken, including Harrison as high as the 3rd round.

 

No, sorry. I just don't buy this one.

 

Three. You say you dump him when the facts sort out, but the reality is, that will not happen until after camp. The "fact" do not really come out until trial, and that can take a while to happen. There will be reports, comments and hearings, but I think it unlikely the "facts" will come out before a trial, if ever.

 

Honestly, I still do not see the argument that cutting him before camp makes sense. If you are looking to cut him for character, then I feel the team is holding themselves out as hypocrites. If you are cutting him for injury, then why would you not wait to see how healthy he is at camp. If you are cutting him for play, again, why would you not wait until camp. And the more I hear about Rhodes the more I feel there is a level of hypocricy. Rhodes has received a 4 game suspension, more than Benson has ever gotten, and another hit against Rhodes would be for a year. Further, I question whether Rhodes brings anything more than Benson.

 

I really want more info to come out on this. While "facts" will be taken w/ a grain of salt, I would like to here what witnesses say. While I do not fully believe either side, I simply find the officer's version a bit hard to accept. His reasoning for using pepper spray seems more than odd.

 

Also, did you hear what our WR coach (Drake) had to say. He made a comment about wanting to get all the facts, and then mentioned "I know how they are there" referring to the LCRA police organization. Drake is a former Texas coach, and may know about reputations here.

[nfoligno]

Thanks, but I am not sure that makes the case for Rhodes any better. If he was nailed for "drugs", would that not be a red flag too?

 

Also, if he has already received a 4 game suspension, that means another hit would be for a year, right?

[balta1701-A]

Thanks, but I am not sure that makes the case for Rhodes any better. If he was nailed for "drugs", would that not be a red flag too?

 

Also, if he has already received a 4 game suspension, that means another hit would be for a year, right?

Yes and Yes. Wasn't trying to disagree, just clarify. He also seems to have a domestic violence issue in his past according to the linked piece.

[nfoligno]

Gracias. That is why it is killing me that so many bears fans are saying we should cut Benson due to this incident, and then sign Rhode.

 

The only upgrade I see is in rap sheet.

[madlithuanian]

True. I forgot about Rhodes' past...I do not want him.

 

Did I want Briggs? No. I was hoping to trade him for McIntosh and a draft pick. Didn't happen. Now, we've got him. And while his activity is suspect...it's not domestic abuse, etc... It's leaving the scene. Granted, bad...but horrid.

 

There's no way the Bears are going to be squeaky clean, as no team will. But at least they can try. And as I said, we hold off until more facts come out.

 

Bottom line, I think Benson is a bum. This is yet one more reason he should be out, preferably by trade.

 

You may be right about more fact coming out after camp... let's be honest. If he were gaining 10 YPC, then it's a little boating fun gone wrong. But this is a bum guy, with this added on. It's not the end all, it's in theory the straw that could break the camel's back.

 

All we can do is read what is reported. We know there is police abuse. We also know NFL players have been know to be bad guys. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle.

 

Drake is going to stick of for a Longhorn and a team player regardless. His comment, while interesting doesn't make me feel one way or another.

 

 

One. Do you not think it a tad hyprotical to cut Benson for this, then turn around and sign Rhodes, who was suspended 4 games for drugs, whatever drugs they were. I am not clear on that. Point is, Rhodes was suspended 4 games for violation of NFL policy, and you sign him after cutting Benson for getting a pair of Class B misdemeanors?

 

Two. You talk about not becoming Cincy and making a statement and all that, but again, to me it comes off as hyprocritical. Briggs smashes his car and runs away to avoid trouble, and we do nothing. So I guess the statement we teach is run from the cops and don't get caught, your cool. Okay, lets say Briggs, Tank and others are in the past, and we are turning over a new leaf. Um, how about that draft w/ a couple character red flags taken, including Harrison as high as the 3rd round.

 

No, sorry. I just don't buy this one.

 

Three. You say you dump him when the facts sort out, but the reality is, that will not happen until after camp. The "fact" do not really come out until trial, and that can take a while to happen. There will be reports, comments and hearings, but I think it unlikely the "facts" will come out before a trial, if ever.

 

Honestly, I still do not see the argument that cutting him before camp makes sense. If you are looking to cut him for character, then I feel the team is holding themselves out as hypocrites. If you are cutting him for injury, then why would you not wait to see how healthy he is at camp. If you are cutting him for play, again, why would you not wait until camp. And the more I hear about Rhodes the more I feel there is a level of hypocricy. Rhodes has received a 4 game suspension, more than Benson has ever gotten, and another hit against Rhodes would be for a year. Further, I question whether Rhodes brings anything more than Benson.

 

I really want more info to come out on this. While "facts" will be taken w/ a grain of salt, I would like to here what witnesses say. While I do not fully believe either side, I simply find the officer's version a bit hard to accept. His reasoning for using pepper spray seems more than odd.

 

Also, did you hear what our WR coach (Drake) had to say. He made a comment about wanting to get all the facts, and then mentioned "I know how they are there" referring to the LCRA police organization. Drake is a former Texas coach, and may know about reputations here.

[Da Bears 88]

Who cares about Rhodes past? I'm looking at the present.

 

The guy is a solid RB. Ced has 10 rushing TD's compared to Rhodes 20 rushing TD's. (career)

 

Rhodes > Benson.

[nfoligno]

There's no way the Bears are going to be squeaky clean, as no team will. But at least they can try.

 

I have no problem w/ a team trying. At the same time, we took some character flags in the draft, which just happened. That is why I again have to call out the staff if they cut Benson due to this incident. If you want to erase troubled past, and cut ties w/ Benson, fine. But drafting character flags a week earlier? Sort of mixed messages there.

 

The truth is probably somewhere in the middle.

 

Agree 100%. I do not buy 100% Benson's angelic story. I would have much preferred if he came out and said he was drinking, and may have been intoxicated, but had a designated driver, which is all too possible w/ a bunch of family on the boat. To say he wasn't drunk, after refusing a breath test, and saying he was soooo polite the entire time is a bit much for me. At the same time, it also seems like the police were a little too quick to take it to an un-necessary level.

 

Drake is going to stick of for a Longhorn and a team player regardless. His comment, while interesting doesn't make me feel one way or another.

 

I don't know about this one. While I can see Drake sticking up for Benson, at the same time, he alluded to the LCRA police having a potential reputation/history, which is totally un-necessary to simply stand up for Benson. That isn't defensive, but offenseive. I have no reason to disbelieve him if he makes that statement.

[madlithuanian]

Personally, I don't like the draft choices that had character issues. You, it is a mixed message. But at least it's in the right direction... To say we're inconsistant in management would be correct.

 

I know what you mean... Hwoever, as I've been reading more and more...it looks as thought this kind of "abuse" may be more common than thought. I will try to give the guy a bit of the benefit of doubt. But, as you say, I don't believe the entire angelic story either.

 

YEah, Drake's comments do appear to have merit as I've been reading around...

 

I have no problem w/ a team trying. At the same time, we took some character flags in the draft, which just happened. That is why I again have to call out the staff if they cut Benson due to this incident. If you want to erase troubled past, and cut ties w/ Benson, fine. But drafting character flags a week earlier? Sort of mixed messages there.

 

 

 

Agree 100%. I do not buy 100% Benson's angelic story. I would have much preferred if he came out and said he was drinking, and may have been intoxicated, but had a designated driver, which is all too possible w/ a bunch of family on the boat. To say he wasn't drunk, after refusing a breath test, and saying he was soooo polite the entire time is a bit much for me. At the same time, it also seems like the police were a little too quick to take it to an un-necessary level.

 

 

 

I don't know about this one. While I can see Drake sticking up for Benson, at the same time, he alluded to the LCRA police having a potential reputation/history, which is totally un-necessary to simply stand up for Benson. That isn't defensive, but offenseive. I have no reason to disbelieve him if he makes that statement.

[jason]

Who cares about Rhodes past? I'm looking at the present.

 

The guy is a solid RB. Ced has 10 rushing TD's compared to Rhodes 20 rushing TD's. (career)

 

Rhodes > Benson.

 

Scott Williams has 1+ NBA Championship Rings, Karl Malone has 0

 

Scott Williams > Karl Malone

[bradjock]

I just do not see the argument for cutting/trading him now. It just seems like letting him go to camp and step up or step out seems the best option. If Forte steps up, Benson's odds of sticking are that much less. If Forte struggles or goes down w/ injury, we are better off w/ Benson that w/ most of the trash on the market. Further, what if Benson himself steps up?

 

I have no issue w/ dumping Benson in/after camp if he doesn't come to camp in shape and "show up", but I simply do not understand the argument for dumping him today.

 

I threw out the "why now" argument when we dumped David Terrell after the season ended. My thought was, "Why not wait until training camp."

 

The obvious answer to my question is that he wasn't going to get any better, so it's better to move on. After 3 seasons, the thought that Cedric will all of a sudden be able to catch the ball, not miss blocking assignments, and do all the intangibles we demand from a RB, is flat out ridiculous. Year 1 he was bad because he was a rookie, year 2 was TJ's fault, and year 3 was the line's fault. Cedric's out of excuses.

 

Cut ties and move on. I wonder if he's cleared his physical yet?

[nfoligno]

Couple points.

 

Terrell had 4 years w/ the Bears to Benson's three. Terrell also had two full seasons as a starter, to Benson's one.

 

Not every player breaks out right away. In fact, the GREAT Thomas Jones was labeled a total bust after his first three years. Think Az would like to have his services back.

 

While not a success story, Rex hasn't seem to "get it" after 5 years, and yet the team is giving him yet another chance.

 

Bradley has had two years and shown even less than Benson, and is not only getting another shot, but the staff even talked about him as a starter.

 

Point is, I think is wrong to simply assume a player has no shot because he didn't earn his stripes sooner.

 

Finally, I think you sort of avoid the point. Maybe he will not get better, but as mentioned above, some players do get better and our staff seems all about continuing to give players a chance to prove themselves. I just do not see the point in not waiting a couple more months to find out. If he doesn't "cut it" at camp, then you cut him. No questions asked. But I just do not see the point is cutting him now.

 

Again, as said before, you need more than just 3 RBs heading into camp. Too often a player gets injured, and you need that 4th RB. Also, as we have too often seen, that well hyped rookie doesn't turn into the stud fans expected. Give Benson the rope to hang himself. If he sucks and will always suck, as you say, then he is gone. So one but Benson is hurt. But if he does step up, or Forte doesn't, then we have a solid option still on the roster, rather than hoping to find scraps off the waiver wire to fill out the roster.

[azbearsfan]

Who cares about Rhodes past? I'm looking at the present.

The guy is a solid RB. Ced has 10 rushing TD's compared to Rhodes 20 rushing TD's. (career)

 

Rhodes > Benson.

 

 

And presently he is garbage.

 

When James left Rhodes was so great they drafted Addai to become the start.

 

No thanks. I'd rather let Forte have it.

[jason]

Couple points.

 

Terrell had 4 years w/ the Bears to Benson's three. Terrell also had two full seasons as a starter, to Benson's one.

 

Not every player breaks out right away. In fact, the GREAT Thomas Jones was labeled a total bust after his first three years. Think Az would like to have his services back.

 

While not a success story, Rex hasn't seem to "get it" after 5 years, and yet the team is giving him yet another chance.

 

Bradley has had two years and shown even less than Benson, and is not only getting another shot, but the staff even talked about him as a starter.

 

Point is, I think is wrong to simply assume a player has no shot because he didn't earn his stripes sooner.

 

Finally, I think you sort of avoid the point. Maybe he will not get better, but as mentioned above, some players do get better and our staff seems all about continuing to give players a chance to prove themselves. I just do not see the point in not waiting a couple more months to find out. If he doesn't "cut it" at camp, then you cut him. No questions asked. But I just do not see the point is cutting him now.

 

Again, as said before, you need more than just 3 RBs heading into camp. Too often a player gets injured, and you need that 4th RB. Also, as we have too often seen, that well hyped rookie doesn't turn into the stud fans expected. Give Benson the rope to hang himself. If he sucks and will always suck, as you say, then he is gone. So one but Benson is hurt. But if he does step up, or Forte doesn't, then we have a solid option still on the roster, rather than hoping to find scraps off the waiver wire to fill out the roster.

 

I agree that the past history of the Bears (Rex, Bradley, etc.) seems to say that Benson will get another chance. I would like to note, however, that Terrell was only the full-time starter for one year. He had to split starts with Dez "Stone Hands" White at other times.

[nfoligno]

I agree that the past history of the Bears (Rex, Bradley, etc.) seems to say that Benson will get another chance. I would like to note, however, that Terrell was only the full-time starter for one year. He had to split starts with Dez "Stone Hands" White at other times.

 

I wasn't 100% on the starts, but point is still he had 4 years to Benson's two, and IMHO, DT had more opportunites to step up. We were desperate for a WR back then, and there was no one standing in his way but himself. Like you said, he was sharing time w/ Dez White. Benson on the other hand came to a team w/ a solid RB. When he finally got his chance, he ran behind a garbage OL.

 

To be honest, I am surprised in your take on this. You were never a big Benson fan, but prior to the draft, you were adamant that you believe upgrading the OL would see a big boost in Benson's play. You said that by upgrading the OL, you believe Benson could be a very good RB.

 

So while many others already wanted to just cut Benson, and see this as another reason to do so, you (I don't believe) were in that camp, and yet you feel we should cut ties, or am I misunderstanding.

 

Even if everything the police said is true, I am still not in favor of releasing him. He would be way in the wrong, but at the same time, is what he did really that much worse than what some others did. I still view Briggs issue as worse, though I admit that is w/o evidence. In my eyes, the only reason for Briggs to flee the scene was he was drunk. Driving drunk is FAR worse in my eyes than Benson partying w/ his family. Even the police issue, when did he put the public or anyone in harms way, as did Briggs IMHO. Now if Benson were in fact driving the boat drunk, then my tune would be different.

[bradjock]

Christ almighty you should be a politician! That was a great non-answer.

 

First and foremost, as for the Thomas jones, he was let go by two different teams (if Tampa really wanted him, they'd have found the cap space). Based on that theory, Cedric will be good after he's dumped by 2 teams. Great.

 

You're still avoiding my main point: We dumped David Terrell because we recognized he sucked. Period. We gave Michael Haynes a 4th season, how did that work? A turd is a turd. Maybe Cedric's not that bad of a blocker, but for whatever reason, after 3 years, we dont' trust him. If it hasn't happened in 3 years, it's not going to happen. Not to mention his hands will not get any better.

 

I won't even mention how there always seems to be bullshit surrounding Cedric.

 

Either way, we drafted his replacement and he's done here in Chicago IMO. He might as well move on now.

 

Couple points.

 

Terrell had 4 years w/ the Bears to Benson's three. Terrell also had two full seasons as a starter, to Benson's one.

 

Not every player breaks out right away. In fact, the GREAT Thomas Jones was labeled a total bust after his first three years. Think Az would like to have his services back.

 

While not a success story, Rex hasn't seem to "get it" after 5 years, and yet the team is giving him yet another chance.

 

Bradley has had two years and shown even less than Benson, and is not only getting another shot, but the staff even talked about him as a starter.

 

Point is, I think is wrong to simply assume a player has no shot because he didn't earn his stripes sooner.

 

Finally, I think you sort of avoid the point. Maybe he will not get better, but as mentioned above, some players do get better and our staff seems all about continuing to give players a chance to prove themselves. I just do not see the point in not waiting a couple more months to find out. If he doesn't "cut it" at camp, then you cut him. No questions asked. But I just do not see the point is cutting him now.

 

Again, as said before, you need more than just 3 RBs heading into camp. Too often a player gets injured, and you need that 4th RB. Also, as we have too often seen, that well hyped rookie doesn't turn into the stud fans expected. Give Benson the rope to hang himself. If he sucks and will always suck, as you say, then he is gone. So one but Benson is hurt. But if he does step up, or Forte doesn't, then we have a solid option still on the roster, rather than hoping to find scraps off the waiver wire to fill out the roster.

[nfoligno]

How am I avoiding the point. We gave those players you mention 4 years. Benson has had three.

 

You say you just know after how ever many years, but they continue to give Rex chances.

 

Sometimes you just know, but other times you suspect, but also still think there is a chance the player turns around, which I think may be the case w/ Benson. You are assuming drafting Forte automatically means the staff has given up on Benson, but w/ his injury, it is also just as possible they are drafting a player who is insurance if (a) his injury doesn't allow him to continue and ( injury aside, Benson doesn't step up.

 

Further, the staff may feel that Forte could provide the team the competition and 1-2 punch we had w/ TJ/Benson. You assume Forte is simply an indictment on Benson, but it may just as easily be an admission they made a mistake trading TJ last year.