Cheating in the NBA

[jason]

There has been a lot of talk for years about crooked refs, and fixed games in the NBA. I have believed the hype for quite some time, especially considering I hate some of the teams that have won. I have varied thoughts on this, but basically I see Donaghey like Canseco.

 

Both were called cheats.

Both were proven cheats.

Both said that others were involved.

Both were dismissed as liars.

Both were proven true.

 

The only difference I see right now is that Canseco has much more proof than Donaghey, who only has the words of Van Gundy (who is now trying to deny those words) to back him up.

 

Do you think it's happening? Do you think it's just the refs, or is it the league? What led to it all?

[madlithuanian]

I see how you're trying to connect the dots...but I don't think you can quite compare. I do think there is a cheating difference. One, an individual takes performing enhancing drugs that will skew only his numbers...and still may or may not make a difference in the outcome of a game. Albeit still cheating... Then there's refs who literally do or do not make calls to truly determine the outcome of a game. One is a far more blatant and despicable form of cheating... that is the refs. It's also because they are placed in such a trust position. Players, in some eyes, just need to do whatever it is to win. Ref's are supposed to be objective.

 

I do think it's happening to some degree. What that degree is, I can't say... But, there just seems like there is too much fishy-ness in the NBA. I'd like to think that home teams just get better calls, as is the case in most sports. But some of the allegations just seem to spot on to believe it's pure coinicidence. I really don't think the league is in on it. Or maybe at least the top brass. Maybe a lower tier league official is doing it to get a bonus,etc... Greed led to it regardless. If a ref is doing it on his own, he's getting paid. If the league is doing it, it's to generate more revenue. It's always about money.

 

There has been a lot of talk for years about crooked refs, and fixed games in the NBA. I have believed the hype for quite some time, especially considering I hate some of the teams that have won. I have varied thoughts on this, but basically I see Donaghey like Canseco.

 

Both were called cheats.

Both were proven cheats.

Both said that others were involved.

Both were dismissed as liars.

Both were proven true.

 

The only difference I see right now is that Canseco has much more proof than Donaghey, who only has the words of Van Gundy (who is now trying to deny those words) to back him up.

 

Do you think it's happening? Do you think it's just the refs, or is it the league? What led to it all?

[balta1701-A]

I totally buy the Canseco comparison, because it's entirely possible he's telling the truth, and because it's virtually impossible to trust him.

 

But 2 points. First, if you watched the infamous Lakers/Sacto game 6, did you not think that the fix was in?

 

And second, if you were a crooked ref trying to make up a story to cover your tail, and you had watched that game 6, wouldn't you pick that game to point to as one that had been fixed because it was such a one sided game with the officiating, whether or not you knew anything about it?

[madlithuanian]

I now am looking at the comparison differently...and it makes sense now.

 

Yeah, I watched that game...and thought it was fixed. But I also thought I was too involved rooting for Arvydas Sabonis (who happens to be Lithuanian). My thoughts are now back to it being fixed.

 

Yep...the problem with the NBA is they don't make the ref's transparent...you can't ask them questions really. Nor have you seen a huge mandate come from Stern saying star players won't be treated differently, games will be called the same whether it's the 1st minute or last minute of a game, etc... It leaves too much to be contemplated by conspiracy theorists... Especially when the results seem to point to ratings favorites,etc...

 

I totally buy the Canseco comparison, because it's entirely possible he's telling the truth, and because it's virtually impossible to trust him.

 

But 2 points. First, if you watched the infamous Lakers/Sacto game 6, did you not think that the fix was in?

 

And second, if you were a crooked ref trying to make up a story to cover your tail, and you had watched that game 6, wouldn't you pick that game to point to as one that had been fixed because it was such a one sided game with the officiating, whether or not you knew anything about it?

[jason]

I totally buy the Canseco comparison, because it's entirely possible he's telling the truth, and because it's virtually impossible to trust him.

 

But 2 points. First, if you watched the infamous Lakers/Sacto game 6, did you not think that the fix was in?

 

And second, if you were a crooked ref trying to make up a story to cover your tail, and you had watched that game 6, wouldn't you pick that game to point to as one that had been fixed because it was such a one sided game with the officiating, whether or not you knew anything about it?

 

Not only did I watch that game, I was on the phone with a friend of mine the entire game. I KNOW that game was fixed, and nobody can convince me otherwise. Whether or not it can be pinned on anyone else, or connected to league officials, is inconsequential in my opinion. It happened, and has happened several other times since then.

 

As for the second question, if I were Donaghey, you are absolutely right I would point to that game. I'd blow the whistle and take every interview. If anyone has credibility about inside knowledge, then it's Donaghey. He may not be a trusted source, but he was nonetheless immersed in the culture, and would have received the very "advice" that other refs have been given to steer games.

 

Put it another way...did any intelligent person in the world actually think that the Celtics would win and the Lakers would lose Game 3? Was there any doubt that Kobe would shoot a ton of free throws? Was it a surprise that the Lakers had more free throws, and for quite some time they were ahead by a large margin? Exactly.

[DrunkBomber]

I definitely see the comparison but the motives are so different. Donaghey is doing it to help him legally. Hes looking at time in federal prison and him giving up other people will help his cause but it also might be a reason for him to embellish to make it seem like hes only a pawn in the grand scheme of things so maybe he can share the blame with others.

 

Canseco did it strictly for money. He wasnt in jeopardy of getting in trouble. So even though he benefited financially from it, it also made him hated by a lot of people.

[Ed Hochuli 3:16]

All I have to say is- I can't find the link, but I remember awhile back that Donaghy admitted to fixing a win for the Knicks. Well, damn him, because that could have been the difference between getting Oden or Durant. Instead, we got Noah.

 

So f*** Tim Donaghy.

[jason]

I definitely see the comparison but the motives are so different. Donaghey is doing it to help him legally. Hes looking at time in federal prison and him giving up other people will help his cause but it also might be a reason for him to embellish to make it seem like hes only a pawn in the grand scheme of things so maybe he can share the blame with others.

 

Canseco did it strictly for money. He wasnt in jeopardy of getting in trouble. So even though he benefited financially from it, it also made him hated by a lot of people.

 

If I'm not mistaken, Canseco was facing legal problems as well, and he gave up information to alleviate pressure just like Donaghey. I believe he had something close to illegally possessing a firearm and some sort of probation violation. And, on top of that (and probably the biggest motivator), Canseco has done what he has done because he wants to get back at the leauge and the game that he feels has screwed him over. He feels he was pushed out of baseball in some sort of collusion (I agree to a certain extent), and he's angry about it.