Encouraging

[CrackerDog]

I've got to believe this D will come around. I refuse to believe they got old and can't do it. They looked that way last night as they made J.T. look like Elway. I expect they'll bring it when the season starts.

 

With that said, the O looked like they could be at least "average" this season. The equation to me is:

 

Average O + Solid D + Super ST = Playoffs

 

Obviously everything rests on staying healthy.

 

To truly understand how impressive the O was putting up 20 points, protecting the QB and total offense last night, take a look at what happened to those poor bastard Packers just last week against the same 49er's team. LINK

 

I've always been hopeful but now I don't feel like this team will make a fool of me for being that way.

[Pixote]

I've got to believe this D will come around. I refuse to believe they got old and can't do it. They looked that way last night as they made J.T. look like Elway. I expect they'll bring it when the season starts.

 

With that said, the O looked like they could be at least "average" this season. The equation to me is:

 

Average O + Solid D + Super ST = Playoffs

 

Obviously everything rests on staying healthy.

 

To truly understand how impressive the O was putting up 20 points, protecting the QB and total offense last night, take a look at what happened to those poor bastard Packers just last week against the same 49er's team. LINK

 

I've always been hopeful but now I don't feel like this team will make a fool of me for being that way.

 

I agree, SFO defense is a strong Defense and our offense did very good last night. This is indeed very encouraging.

[madlithuanian]

Not to squelch the fire...but as I'm in the fantasy league this evening, most tankings have the SF D as dirt bottom #32... I do like their LB corps, but I'm honestly not sure exactly how good they really are.

 

Regardless, the O did what they had to and looked exceptional.

 

 

 

I've got to believe this D will come around. I refuse to believe they got old and can't do it. They looked that way last night as they made J.T. look like Elway. I expect they'll bring it when the season starts.

 

With that said, the O looked like they could be at least "average" this season. The equation to me is:

 

Average O + Solid D + Super ST = Playoffs

 

Obviously everything rests on staying healthy.

 

To truly understand how impressive the O was putting up 20 points, protecting the QB and total offense last night, take a look at what happened to those poor bastard Packers just last week against the same 49er's team. LINK

 

I've always been hopeful but now I don't feel like this team will make a fool of me for being that way.

[CrackerDog]

Not to squelch the fire...but as I'm in the fantasy league this evening, most tankings have the SF D as dirt bottom #32... I do like their LB corps, but I'm honestly not sure exactly how good they really are.

 

Regardless, the O did what they had to and looked exceptional.

 

I give no credence to FF projections in this category. Everything would be based totally on last year as there is so little expertise on FF sites for Defense. I've got years of experience in this area. I typically pick up a team based on the rankings I have from the site or sites I frequent and then invariably I dump them 3 weeks into the season for the real performers.

 

Thus far in the preseason SF ranks:

 

Fourth in D for Passing. LINK

 

First in Sacks. LINK

 

Second in forced fumbles. LINK

 

Sixth in yardage. LINK

 

Sure, some of these are a bit skewed by the fact that they've played 3 games now but we were the team that hurt them statistically thus far. Sure, this is all preseason and probably doesn't mean much. But, all I'm saying is, I wouldn't discount what we saw last night because FF sites don't give them any respect.

 

And they have Mike "God Made ME Greater Than You" Singletary running the D there. I think he's done a fine job.

[nfoligno]

I would put it this way.

 

SF may not have a great D, but they have a legit NFL defense. While we will face better during the season, we will also face worse, so playing well against them does mean something.

 

For me, I came away from this more impressed by Orton than any other aspect. As I have said elsewhere, I was not that impressed w/ the OL. I am NOT trashing them, but I think their play was not that good, but for once, QB play hid OL defeciences. How often has that been the case?

 

But Orton looked great. He moved up and around in the pocket to guy and extra second, and found open receivers. He didn't seem to be staring down his receivers, and went through his reads, rather than look at the #1 read then dump it off. He was looking downfield, and taking more risks than most expected. His passes were not always 100% perfectly placed, but I would argue he made the right decisions, and put the ball in a place for the WRs to make a play on it.

 

Davis would come in a close 2nd on the impressive scale. I think there is still a lot of issues on offense, but I do also think Orton "right now" seems like a player who can give us a chance.

[nfoligno]

You expect pessimism from me, so I don't want to disappoint you:)

 

First, before you just trash me for not being capable of enjoying anything, I have really been praising Orton, and other aspects of the offense. The offense was a shining light. But....

 

I've got to believe this D will come around. I refuse to believe they got old and can't do it. They looked that way last night as they made J.T. look like Elway. I expect they'll bring it when the season starts.

 

First, I would say no one is saying our D suddenly got old. The issue on the D is nothing close to the OL.

 

W/ that said, how many of the problems we are seeing are the same ones we have seen for some time, and the same some of us have been talking about for a while now?

 

- Rivera/Babich - We can blame injuries for last year, but the one other significant change between 2006 and 2007 was the change at DC. Many here choose to believe our problems on D were just about injuries, and coaching was not a factor. Some felt it was. But now we are healthy, and through 3 preseason games, our D has not looked good. Not only are our backups, who we all consider starter quality, getting beaten, but our starters are getting hammered like a nail. Worse, backups are hammering our starters. In Seattle, I don't recall Hasselbeck being in the game. And O'Sullivan? This defense is healthy, and I think it is time to start wondering if the problems are not greater than simply health.

 

- tackling - Even the broadcaster talked about this last night. Our tackling is getting pathetic. Now they also talked about how hard it is to work on at this level, but I think the true point is, this is such an issue that it is seen in every game, and being called out on a weekly basis. It isn't just the young players, but the veterans as well. For the 3rd game in a row, veterans like Briggs, urlacher and even Mike Brown have been looking quite poor in tackling. Missed tackles are really hurting us as we are allowing a would be 2 or 3 yard gain to become a 12 or 13 yard gain and first down. This is a big reason why our defense is allowing sustained drives through 3 preseason games.

 

- Cover 2 - I have seen arguments both ways, but has our cover 2 simply been figured out? Yes, I realize a few other teams use the cover 2, but do they use exactly as we do? Do they not mix it up more, like we did back when Rivera was our DC? Last night, I watched our zone coverage getting picked apart. No name WRs were finding HUGE holes in the zone, and a no name QB was easily hitting them.

 

What scares me even more is how quickly it seemed they were able to find these holes. Its one thing when a QB sits in the pocket and has all day. But WRs seemed like they were very quickly finding and getting into holes in our zone. Our DL was getting pretty solid push/penetration last night, but WRs were getting open too quickly, and though our DL was capable of getting pressure, they were not able to finish as the QB had openings to throw the ball.

 

- Tillman - Man, he has looked pretty bad. His coverage this preseason has been just bad. He did make one GREAT play against the run on the goal line, but also was partially the cause of a TD. Do you all remember when he blitzed, and was chasing Sullivan toward the sideline? Then Tillman either dove or tripped. Once Sully no longer had Tillman chasing, he stopped and was able to step into a pass downfield for a score. If Tillman keeps his feet, there is absolutely no chance Sullivan can pull up and step into his throw as he did. Maybe he can try to sling it downfield, but he would have to do it on the run and throwing sideways.

 

- Thus far, our safeties suck in coverage, and that included Mike Brown. W/ Brown, I still have some blind hope, but McGowan is freaking awful. On that one TD, McGowan was standing in the back of the endzone, and I couldn't figure out what the hell he was doing. From where he was standing, it was just too easy for a receiver to run to the goal line and turn for the catch. McGowan was simply out of position to make a play on most any route run, and was also late in running to the receiver that did enter the endzone. We may have veterans in the secondary, but right now, they are looking pretty darn bad.

 

- Once again, we are getting gashed by cut back runs, as well as the QB moving outside the pocket. This just doesn't make sense to me as we always seem to harp on staying in your lanes and gap control, but it seems like we are exposing ourselves to cut backs and roll outs every down.

 

Look, there is no question we are loaded w/ talent on defense. I have said this before, but if we go off the depth chart on paper, we have maybe the #1 D in the league. But what i have seen thus far, and I have to think its Babich/Lovie, this is not a top defense and may not be much better than above average.

[madlithuanian]

I saw them play Minny in person last year in the bay area, and the D looked pretty good.

 

And as much as we all know both fantasy and pre-season rankings,stats can be mis-leading... I just want to temper my excitement a little. Kind of like how many people tempered Hanie's performances... We need to take all this with a grain of salt.

 

But, as I mentioned, when given the opportunity, they made the most of it and the O looked good. That's all we can ask for.

 

I basically have cautious optimism.

 

PS - Why the Samurai Mike hate? Did I miss something?

 

I give no credence to FF projections in this category. Everything would be based totally on last year as there is so little expertise on FF sites for Defense. I've got years of experience in this area. I typically pick up a team based on the rankings I have from the site or sites I frequent and then invariably I dump them 3 weeks into the season for the real performers.

 

Thus far in the preseason SF ranks:

 

Fourth in D for Passing. LINK

 

First in Sacks. LINK

 

Second in forced fumbles. LINK

 

Sixth in yardage. LINK

 

Sure, some of these are a bit skewed by the fact that they've played 3 games now but we were the team that hurt them statistically thus far. Sure, this is all preseason and probably doesn't mean much. But, all I'm saying is, I wouldn't discount what we saw last night because FF sites don't give them any respect.

 

And they have Mike "God Made ME Greater Than You" Singletary running the D there. I think he's done a fine job.

[CrackerDog]

PS - Why the Samurai Mike hate? Did I miss something?

 

No, he just seems a little self righteous to me. I think he's probably an excellent coach and I really loved the way he played football.

[CrackerDog]

You expect pessimism from me, so I don't want to disappoint you:)

 

Your post is too long and I don't feel like getting bummed out today. I skimmed it and can see your logic. I won't bother arguing, I just hope for the best. What we've seen from the D thus far in PS hasn't been very inspiring.

[madlithuanian]

He seems to walk the walk...so I won't begrudge him that.

 

I've heard only good about his coaching. ...and we all know his playing!

 

No, he just seems a little self righteous to me. I think he's probably an excellent coach and I really loved the way he played football.

[DaBearSox]

No, he just seems a little self righteous to me. I think he's probably an excellent coach and I really loved the way he played football.

 

 

My buddy shared a driveway with him at thier summer houses in South Haven, MI. And you are correct with your assumption...

 

oh except for the time he got his boat stuck on the sand bar and my friend's dad took the jetski out there to go help him out...got Samuri's Bears seats for a game

[BearFan2000]

I've got to believe this D will come around. I refuse to believe they got old and can't do it. They looked that way last night as they made J.T. look like Elway. I expect they'll bring it when the season starts.

 

With that said, the O looked like they could be at least "average" this season. The equation to me is:

 

Average O + Solid D + Super ST = Playoffs

 

Obviously everything rests on staying healthy.

 

To truly understand how impressive the O was putting up 20 points, protecting the QB and total offense last night, take a look at what happened to those poor bastard Packers just last week against the same 49er's team. LINK

 

I've always been hopeful but now I don't feel like this team will make a fool of me for being that way.

 

Watching that video a few things jumped out at me.

 

-sure is weird watching clips of the Packer offense with Rodgers and boy did he look hesitant. A couple of those sack he just sat there and looked and looked and looked. Favre would have taken off or scrambled to try and find someone, it also means his receivers weren't helping him out either.

 

- They will miss Favre far more than they realize. Fans will not be happy. This will be entertaining.

 

- Without Favre teams will be less fearful of the Packers offense and I believe more willing to attack them, knowing Rodgers isn't as mobile or as talented as Brett. When Brett was with the packers often times their offense was most dangerous when plays broke down, you had no idea what Favre would do. Probably one of the best improvisational QB's to play the game. Rodgers does not yet possess that kind of skill. He will likely react in a more traditional way when plays break down.

 

- That hit by Lee was nice. Even if it's another team you have to appreciate a hit like that.

 

- The Packers Defense allowed the noners to do what ever they wanted. Those two goal line TDs that they showed, both should have been stopped.

 

- Is it possible that the noners actually have a decent offense? J.T. Osulivan has been around the league and perhaps finally found a team and system that suits him.

[BearSox]

People must remember not to put too much stock into preseason games...

[adam]

The preseason is one of the most misleading periods in football.

 

For the defense, they could've been trying new schemes or packages for the first time and guys were out of position. There can be endless reasons on why some units succeed and others do not in the preseason. I am sure some of the veterans don't want to get injured in meaningless games, so a missed tackle here or there is not that big of a deal as long as they are ready to go in Week 1.

 

There is very little correlation between the preseason and regular season records. I once read an article that showed that 2 preseason wins, on average, produced the best regular season records. NE is 0-3 and the Colts are 1-2. Cleveland is also winless, so take the records for what they are worth.

[jason]

Average O + Solid D + Super ST = Playoffs

 

That's pretty much the reason why I have optimism, and why I tell people that the Bears will be back. They got severely discounted last year because of the injuries on defense, and nobody seems to be aware of that. Without the injuries, they should be a top defense again, will have the top ST again, and with a semi-competent offense, they'll be a tough team.

 

I hope people keep doubting...

[BearSox]

The preseason is one of the most misleading periods in football.

 

For the defense, they could've been trying new schemes or packages for the first time and guys were out of position. There can be endless reasons on why some units succeed and others do not in the preseason. I am sure some of the veterans don't want to get injured in meaningless games, so a missed tackle here or there is not that big of a deal as long as they are ready to go in Week 1.

 

There is very little correlation between the preseason and regular season records. I once read an article that showed that 2 preseason wins, on average, produced the best regular season records. NE is 0-3 and the Colts are 1-2. Cleveland is also winless, so take the records for what they are worth.

It has always seemed to me that the bad teams always have good records in preseason and the good teams bad-mediocre records in preseason.

[AZ54]

Bad teams want to win games to build momentum and optimism while good teams just want to stay healthy. I don't care about wins or losses in preseason but blatant missed plays (i.e. easy tackles, dropped passes) bothers me a lot.

[adam]

At least our QBs didnt look like this after a preseason game:

 

[lemonej]

You expect pessimism from me, so I don't want to disappoint you:)

 

First, before you just trash me for not being capable of enjoying anything, I have really been praising Orton, and other aspects of the offense. The offense was a shining light. But....

 

I've got to believe this D will come around. I refuse to believe they got old and can't do it. They looked that way last night as they made J.T. look like Elway. I expect they'll bring it when the season starts.

 

First, I would say no one is saying our D suddenly got old. The issue on the D is nothing close to the OL.

 

W/ that said, how many of the problems we are seeing are the same ones we have seen for some time, and the same some of us have been talking about for a while now?

 

- Rivera/Babich - We can blame injuries for last year, but the one other significant change between 2006 and 2007 was the change at DC. Many here choose to believe our problems on D were just about injuries, and coaching was not a factor. Some felt it was. But now we are healthy, and through 3 preseason games, our D has not looked good. Not only are our backups, who we all consider starter quality, getting beaten, but our starters are getting hammered like a nail. Worse, backups are hammering our starters. In Seattle, I don't recall Hasselbeck being in the game. And O'Sullivan? This defense is healthy, and I think it is time to start wondering if the problems are not greater than simply health.

 

- tackling - Even the broadcaster talked about this last night. Our tackling is getting pathetic. Now they also talked about how hard it is to work on at this level, but I think the true point is, this is such an issue that it is seen in every game, and being called out on a weekly basis. It isn't just the young players, but the veterans as well. For the 3rd game in a row, veterans like Briggs, urlacher and even Mike Brown have been looking quite poor in tackling. Missed tackles are really hurting us as we are allowing a would be 2 or 3 yard gain to become a 12 or 13 yard gain and first down. This is a big reason why our defense is allowing sustained drives through 3 preseason games.

 

- Cover 2 - I have seen arguments both ways, but has our cover 2 simply been figured out? Yes, I realize a few other teams use the cover 2, but do they use exactly as we do? Do they not mix it up more, like we did back when Rivera was our DC? Last night, I watched our zone coverage getting picked apart. No name WRs were finding HUGE holes in the zone, and a no name QB was easily hitting them.

 

What scares me even more is how quickly it seemed they were able to find these holes. Its one thing when a QB sits in the pocket and has all day. But WRs seemed like they were very quickly finding and getting into holes in our zone. Our DL was getting pretty solid push/penetration last night, but WRs were getting open too quickly, and though our DL was capable of getting pressure, they were not able to finish as the QB had openings to throw the ball.

 

- Tillman - Man, he has looked pretty bad. His coverage this preseason has been just bad. He did make one GREAT play against the run on the goal line, but also was partially the cause of a TD. Do you all remember when he blitzed, and was chasing Sullivan toward the sideline? Then Tillman either dove or tripped. Once Sully no longer had Tillman chasing, he stopped and was able to step into a pass downfield for a score. If Tillman keeps his feet, there is absolutely no chance Sullivan can pull up and step into his throw as he did. Maybe he can try to sling it downfield, but he would have to do it on the run and throwing sideways.

 

- Thus far, our safeties suck in coverage, and that included Mike Brown. W/ Brown, I still have some blind hope, but McGowan is freaking awful. On that one TD, McGowan was standing in the back of the endzone, and I couldn't figure out what the hell he was doing. From where he was standing, it was just too easy for a receiver to run to the goal line and turn for the catch. McGowan was simply out of position to make a play on most any route run, and was also late in running to the receiver that did enter the endzone. We may have veterans in the secondary, but right now, they are looking pretty darn bad.

 

- Once again, we are getting gashed by cut back runs, as well as the QB moving outside the pocket. This just doesn't make sense to me as we always seem to harp on staying in your lanes and gap control, but it seems like we are exposing ourselves to cut backs and roll outs every down.

 

Look, there is no question we are loaded w/ talent on defense. I have said this before, but if we go off the depth chart on paper, we have maybe the #1 D in the league. But what i have seen thus far, and I have to think its Babich/Lovie, this is not a top defense and may not be much better than above average.

Nfo I agree that the main problem with this defense is poor tackling and the safeties constantly being out of position.When I visited TC one thing that was eveident to me was that they weren't tackling.Now I don't believe they should be pounding each other into the ground but,I do recall in the past when Rivera ran the D Urlacher and Mike Brown put Benson out of commission with some tough hits in TC.Now the practices seem to be glorified walk throughs.How can you get acclimated to the physical nature of this game without tackling a little.

As for McGowan and Brown at safety,they both may be able to knock your block off if they are in the right position but that has been the problem.They have been fooled a few times already.Nate Vasher has also looked medioctre.The only guy who has looked decent in the secondary is Tillman and of the backups Corey Graham.

[AZ54]

Tillman had many mistakes against the 49ers. Perhaps the one guy who was playing well was DManning since nobody is even talking about him. He either disappeared or he quietly did his job as it should be done.

[lemonej]

I've watched every PS game and the only impact D.Manning has had has been in the return game.He is supposedly being tried at the Nickel which I haven't seen him on the field much in that capacity.For that matter I haven't seen Ricky Manning Jr. that much either.The back ups at safety have been Payne and Steltz. What I meant about Tillman was prior to the Niner game he looked decent with a pick and a couple of pass breakups in two games.He also seems to be doing the best job of tackling of anyone on defense IMO.Its really troublesome when the best tackle of the PS was made by your starting RB(Forte) on an INT return.

[nfoligno]

Tillman had many mistakes against the 49ers. Perhaps the one guy who was playing well was DManning since nobody is even talking about him. He either disappeared or he quietly did his job as it should be done.

 

Nice idea, but....

 

(a) I saw a lot of Hunter, so we may not have been playing a ton of nickel, which means DM may not have been on the field a ton.

 

( When your starting CB is struggling so much, that means the QB doesn't need to go past his 1st read, much less get down to his 3rd or 4th, which would be DM.

[CrackerDog]

Nice idea, but....

 

(a) I saw a lot of Hunter, so we may not have been playing a ton of nickel, which means DM may not have been on the field a ton.

 

( When your starting CB is struggling so much, that means the QB doesn't need to go past his 1st read, much less get down to his 3rd or 4th, which would be DM.

 

In a rare show of support for NFO, I offer this...

 

When your D in general is giving up lots of yardage on the ground, teams aren't passing much on 3rd down. Hence, little need for nickle.

[AZ54]

Actually DM had a couple good plays but you are right, Hunter was on the field much more as the 49ers stayed in a 2 TE set often. My point wasn't so much that DManning played well but rather that nobody has been complaining about him, not nearly as much as other players. You, as lead DManning/JA/Ron Turner/Babich/Lovie/(insert name here) basher, should recognized this void.

 

 

Tillman wasn't all bad. Yes he had a couple penalties and flopped on the ground while chasing JT but he made a some good plays as well. He had a key tackle for a loss on one of the goal line stands. Had great coverage on another corner route in the end zone. He ran all the way across the field to tackle Gore who would have gone another 20-30 yards without that effort. (Mike Brown was running away from the play...explain that). He had several other good plays as well. I think he'll be alright by the time the season starts.

[DrunkBomber]

The preseason is one of the most misleading periods in football.

 

For the defense, they could've been trying new schemes or packages for the first time and guys were out of position. There can be endless reasons on why some units succeed and others do not in the preseason. I am sure some of the veterans don't want to get injured in meaningless games, so a missed tackle here or there is not that big of a deal as long as they are ready to go in Week 1.

 

There is very little correlation between the preseason and regular season records. I once read an article that showed that 2 preseason wins, on average, produced the best regular season records. NE is 0-3 and the Colts are 1-2. Cleveland is also winless, so take the records for what they are worth.

I agree. I think back to the Super Bowl year towards the end of the season when the Bears were trying different defenses and everyone thought their defense was in trouble and then they turned it on in the post season. For a veteran defense like the Bears the preseason is about staying healthy and getting into playing shape. Theres no reason to try and win the games. It might actually be an advantage to have teams think youre vulnerable.