PFW: Vasher, Dvoracek are primary culprits in defense's demise

[artbest]

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/NFL/N.../wwhi112008.htm

 

“He’s gotten really soft, leaving big cushions and whiffing on most of his tackles,” one team insider said of Vasher. “He at least used to throw his body around and provide some run support. Worse than that, he’s no longer making any plays to speak of (with only one interception).”

 

Another declining defender who was particularly exposed against the Packers is NT Dusty Dvoracek, who we hear could be losing more than a little playing time to Anthony Adams, who many close to the team believe should be on the field a lot more after being inactive is seven of the 10 games this season.

 

Said one daily team observer of Dvoracek: “If the Bears had a nose tackle who could stay on his feet, (MLB) Brian Urlacher might be able to do his job. (Dvoracek) is getting knocked off the ball like I’ve never seen.”

[madlithuanian]

Thanks for the post!

 

Damn shame...

 

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/NFL/N.../wwhi112008.htm

 

“He’s gotten really soft, leaving big cushions and whiffing on most of his tackles,” one team insider said of Vasher. “He at least used to throw his body around and provide some run support. Worse than that, he’s no longer making any plays to speak of (with only one interception).”

 

Another declining defender who was particularly exposed against the Packers is NT Dusty Dvoracek, who we hear could be losing more than a little playing time to Anthony Adams, who many close to the team believe should be on the field a lot more after being inactive is seven of the 10 games this season.

 

Said one daily team observer of Dvoracek: “If the Bears had a nose tackle who could stay on his feet, (MLB) Brian Urlacher might be able to do his job. (Dvoracek) is getting knocked off the ball like I’ve never seen.”

[Iguana]

wish Toenia would get some snaps. start him and Harrison

[Mongo3451]

Again, I am going to harp on the coaching staff. It seems as if Vasher has lost his motivation to earn his paycheck. If he's my player, he gets a private meeting in the office. If that doesn't work... PINE! If that doesn't work... Traded or cut! Dusty is a different story. I've complained about this before, but our staff usually rides a horse until it's dead. Dusty could use a break to get his legs back. If the staff knew how to spell players during the game, it would go a long way. Fresh legs of Adams, Harrison and Idonije can go a long way. I'll also add that they are grinding Forte into the dirt. There is no reason why Jones and Wolfe rarely see the field. The Forte situation is really a shame, because his career will be cut short due to over-use.

 

We are tied for 1st place, but would have a 2 game cushion if the coaching staff knew it's collective ass from a hole in the ground.

[madlithuanian]

You and I are sadly on the same page.

 

The coaches make morons look smart.

 

Again, I am going to harp on the coaching staff. It seems as if Vasher has lost his motivation to earn his paycheck. If he's my player, he gets a private meeting in the office. If that doesn't work... PINE! If that doesn't work... Traded or cut! Dusty is a different story. I've complained about this before, but our staff usually rides a horse until it's dead. Dusty could use a break to get his legs back. If the staff knew how to spell players during the game, it would go a long way. Fresh legs of Adams, Harrison and Idonije can go a long way. I'll also add that they are grinding Forte into the dirt. There is no reason why Jones and Wolfe rarely see the field. The Forte situation is really a shame, because his career will be cut short due to over-use.

 

We are tied for 1st place, but would have a 2 game cushion if the coaching staff knew it's collective ass from a hole in the ground.

[Iguana]

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/NFL/N.../wwhi112008.htm

 

"He's gotten really soft, leaving big cushions and whiffing on most of his tackles," one team insider said of Vasher. "He at least used to throw his body around and provide some run support. Worse than that, he's no longer making any plays to speak of (with only one interception)."

 

Another declining defender who was particularly exposed against the Packers is NT Dusty Dvoracek, who we hear could be losing more than a little playing time to Anthony Adams, who many close to the team believe should be on the field a lot more after being inactive is seven of the 10 games this season.

 

Said one daily team observer of Dvoracek: "If the Bears had a nose tackle who could stay on his feet, (MLB) Brian Urlacher might be able to do his job. (Dvoracek) is getting knocked off the ball like I've never seen."

 

Art! good too see ya. didnt realize it was you that posted this. lol.

[Connorbear]

Changes that need to happen:

 

1 - Adams needs to start. It is clear that Dusty needs to regroup.

2 - Graham needs to start. Vasher needs to know that money will not dictate a starting role.

3 - Manning takes over kick returns.

4 - Jones takes at least 5 carries a game.

5 - Booker needs to sit until healthy. Bennett should get his reps.

6 - Beuning or Metcalf take over for Garza. He is the weakest link on the O-line.

7 - Roach gets one more game. If he fails, go back to Hillenmeyer.

8 - Lloyd and Davis are starting WRs with Hester as the #3.

 

Discuss.

 

Peace

[Iguana]

You and I are sadly on the same page.

 

The coaches make morons look smart.

 

 

Tanks! I depreciate da continent!!

[selection7]

I was wondering who on the D is secretly having injury issues (it seems we always find out in the offseason that people on the team had long-term issues during the season that weren't reported), but you may be right as well about not keeping guys fresh. I'm under the impression that DT rotation is part of lovie's philosophy, so I dont' know about that. Forte's not exactly getting 35 carries a game, so it could be worse, but I'm always more in favor of using the backups than most people--especially if starters are injured--so I don't disagree that Forte could stand to be relieved more often so he doesn't hit himself a rookie wall. It also stunts the development of our other runners, who we'll need if Forte goes down. Additionally, we need to evaluate Kevin Jones. He's had so few carries, I dont' care how he's looked, you can't judge potential starting quality runner on that little.

[AZ54]

I'll be part of the minority but I'd actually like to see Wolfe get some carries during a game. I don't mind Jones getting a few carries as well but he is similar to Forte in that he's a big back and has less shiftiness than Forte. Wolfe on the other hand is something completely different with his quickness. Forte gets a lot of touches between runs and passes and we could sneak Wolfe in for 5-7 plays a game.

[artbest]

Hey Iggy - nice to see you too...CBFANS seems to be on the fritz...OR, perhaps Cinci banned me b/c he's a Babich-o-file.

 

 

Art! good too see ya. didnt realize it was you that posted this. lol.

[artbest]

Agreed...I'd take a few other steps...

 

1. Dvoracek AND Tommie Harris should be in street clothes for AT LEAST one game. The DT rotation should be Idonije, Harrison, Adams and Toieanna.

 

2. No more games for Nick Roach. He's useless.

 

3. Mark Anderson needs to be in street clothes. Give his reps to Baldwin

 

4. Manning - yes on kick returns, no on ANY role on defense. He's an absolutely brutal defensive back and, save for his kick return duties, another rancid draft pick by Jerry Angelo.

 

5. Kevin Payne - one more game to prove he belongs.

 

6. Booker? Don't just sit him - CUT him.

 

7. Vasher? Street clothes. IMHO, Trumaine McBride is a no-talent "try-hard guy" - while he can't cover anyone 1:1, he's going to give the effort that Vasher refuses to give.

 

8. IF, heaven forbid, the Bears lose to the Rams - a team that has packed it in for the year - Babich, Haley and Wilks should be launched immediately. They can get by with what they have for the remainder of the season, which will be over if they flop in St. Louis.

 

 

 

 

 

Changes that need to happen:

 

1 - Adams needs to start. It is clear that Dusty needs to regroup.

2 - Graham needs to start. Vasher needs to know that money will not dictate a starting role.

3 - Manning takes over kick returns.

4 - Jones takes at least 5 carries a game.

5 - Booker needs to sit until healthy. Bennett should get his reps.

6 - Beuning or Metcalf take over for Garza. He is the weakest link on the O-line.

7 - Roach gets one more game. If he fails, go back to Hillenmeyer.

8 - Lloyd and Davis are starting WRs with Hester as the #3.

 

Discuss.

 

Peace

[Iguana]

Hey Iggy - nice to see you too...CBFANS seems to be on the fritz...OR, perhaps Cinci banned me b/c he's a Babich-o-file.

 

yea, it seems toasted. wasram and I cant get there either.

[madlithuanian]

Maybe, but you can't use that as an excuse. Numerous teams have injury issues and aren't as putrid as our D.

 

I was wondering who on the D is secretly having injury issues (it seems we always find out in the offseason that people on the team had long-term issues during the season that weren't reported), but you may be right as well about not keeping guys fresh. I'm under the impression that DT rotation is part of lovie's philosophy, so I dont' know about that. Forte's not exactly getting 35 carries a game, so it could be worse, but I'm always more in favor of using the backups than most people--especially if starters are injured--so I don't disagree that Forte could stand to be relieved more often so he doesn't hit himself a rookie wall. It also stunts the development of our other runners, who we'll need if Forte goes down. Additionally, we need to evaluate Kevin Jones. He's had so few carries, I dont' care how he's looked, you can't judge potential starting quality runner on that little.

[madlithuanian]

Count me in your minority club...

 

I don't get why he isn't utilized. He actually may be better than some of the WR's we have!

 

I'll be part of the minority but I'd actually like to see Wolfe get some carries during a game. I don't mind Jones getting a few carries as well but he is similar to Forte in that he's a big back and has less shiftiness than Forte. Wolfe on the other hand is something completely different with his quickness. Forte gets a lot of touches between runs and passes and we could sneak Wolfe in for 5-7 plays a game.

[nfoligno]

Changes that need to happen:

1 - Adams needs to start. It is clear that Dusty needs to regroup.

 

I have NO issue w/ Adams starting, but wonder why Harrison is not considered here. Harrison impressed me what I have seen him in there. He has seemed to get more penetration, and further, Harris seems to play better w/ Harrison in there. As the pass rush is so inept, why not start Harrison. W/ that said, it isn't like our run d is very good w/o stacking the box, so I can see the reason to start Scott. If we start Scott though, I want to sub Harrison in a lot more on passing downs.

 

I think there is a VERY good chance we see this starting this week.

 

2 - Graham needs to start. Vasher needs to know that money will not dictate a starting role.

 

It is really incredible how Vasher has fallen. Whether it is Vasher, Babich, scheme, or whatever, Vasher has not been effective and must sit. I think the staff actually see this as well, as we saw a lot more of Graham at CB last week. That could take the next step very soon. I would add though, I would like to see Vasher move over to nickel rather than simply ride the pine. Sorry, but DM is flat out worthless, and frankly, none of our safeties can play coverage. Vasher was a damn good nickel for us, so I would like to see if he can play at nickel again before I flat out bench him.

 

I think there is a very good chance we see Graham start at CB this week, especially w/ Vasher running off at the mouth to go along w/ his poor play. I do not expect to see my follow-up desire though (Vasher to nickel), as I think we will see Vasher move to CB and Graham work nickel, or DM plays nickel w/ Graham at CB.

 

3 - Manning takes over kick returns.

 

No question, and the papers indicate that will start this week. It will be interesting to see how much change there is. While I agree Hester is struggling, I also think our special teams as a whole is not playing well this year.

 

DM already announced to return kickoffs this week.

 

4 - Jones takes at least 5 carries a game.

 

Agreed. Not because I think he offers so much, but because I think we need to run the ball more and further, don't need to feed Forte the ball 30 times, particularly as he is one of our top receivers as well.

 

I think we could see KJ getting more reps, but this one is not as known.

 

5 - Booker needs to sit until healthy. Bennett should get his reps.

 

I think I would make Booker a 3rd down receiver. I am not sure I would play Bennett though. I am not against getting him some looks, but don't think he should be inserted just because. I just have no idea how he looks in practice. In camp though, he looked pretty poor, so that is all I have to go off. I think we should simply focus more on Lloyd, Davis and our TEs.

 

Unfortunately, I am not sure we will see this move as Lloyd is in the staff's dog house and the staff doesn't seem to see the problems w/ Booker.

 

6 - Beuning or Metcalf take over for Garza. He is the weakest link on the O-line.

 

I agree Garza has not been good, but I have never seen anything to lead me to believe Metcalf would be an upgrade. Beuning? No idea.

 

I think we see no change w/ Garza. The only change I think might occur is on the other side, w/ Williams playing LT and St. Clair moving inside to LG, as Beekman sits. I would rather play Beekman over Garza, or move St. Clair to the RG spot, but I just don't see the staff benching Garza.

 

7 - Roach gets one more game. If he fails, go back to Hillenmeyer.

 

Agreed. Hunter is not a great cover guy, but personally, I think the issue is our staff trying to make him one. In the ideal situation, our 3rd LB takes a seat and a DB comes in for nickel downs, but our nickel DB situation has been so bad, Hunter was forced to play those nickel situations. I would like to return Hunter to the starting role, as I think he is a better run defender, and simply not have a 3rd LB in for nickel downs.

 

I think you might get your wish. Roach has gotten his shot, and just hasn't done enough w/ it. I think Hunter will return to the starting lineup this week or next.

 

8 - Lloyd and Davis are starting WRs with Hester as the #3.

 

This is how it should be, but I think Lloyd is deep in the coaches dog house.

 

I don't see this, due to the dog house element. I think we will continue to see Hester and Booker start, while Davis plays a lot of slot. Lloyd will get in the game, but is simply not going to get the same level of action prior to his "I won't play if I am not 100%" comment.

 

 

Peace

[nfoligno]

Agreed...I'd take a few other steps...

1. Dvoracek AND Tommie Harris should be in street clothes for AT LEAST one game. The DT rotation should be Idonije, Harrison, Adams and Toieanna.

 

I would not bench Harris. According to all who have watched tape and talked about the team, Harris is working hard, but seems like the only one on the DL, and thus can't get it done. I would also not put Dusty in street clothes. While he has not done well, he always appears to be giving it his all, and thus I can't "punish" him. I can remove him from the lineup, but I can't see fit to punishing a guy when he is giving it his all. His all doesn't appear to be enough, but that should not warrant putting him in street clothes.

 

2. No more games for Nick Roach. He's useless.

 

Agreed. Hunter needs to be back in the mix.

 

3. Mark Anderson needs to be in street clothes. Give his reps to Baldwin

 

Disagree. I would take Anderson out of the normal rotation, and make him a pure pass rush specialist. Anderson should never been in the game if the other team even has a chance to run the ball. Again, like w/ Dusty, I have not seen the lack of effort, but simply the lack of results.

 

4. Manning - yes on kick returns, no on ANY role on defense. He's an absolutely brutal defensive back and, save for his kick return duties, another rancid draft pick by Jerry Angelo.

 

AGREED!

 

5. Kevin Payne - one more game to prove he belongs.

 

Agree and disagree. Two problems. One, we have few alternatives. Steltz has looked as lost, or more so, than Payne at FS. You have already said you don't want DM at FS. Who does that leave? Personally, as well as he has played, I think it was a mistake to move Brown to SS. I think Payne or Steltz would do well enough at SS, particularly in the box, but at the same time, feel Brown would offer more from the FS spot.

 

6. Booker? Don't just sit him - CUT him.

 

While I would not cut him, I would not play him so much. Unlike Dusty and Anderson, I do believe there has been a lack of effort w/ Booker, which surprises me.

 

7. Vasher? Street clothes. IMHO, Trumaine McBride is a no-talent "try-hard guy" - while he can't cover anyone 1:1, he's going to give the effort that Vasher refuses to give.

 

I would not go "street clothes" but I would demote him. I still think Vasher may be our answer at nickel. That demotion may be enough of a slap in the face. If he fails there, fine, but at least try him out there. Our lack of a nickel DB is killing us. While Graham and McBride have done well enough at times at CB, neither are really good fits for the nickel. Vasher is, and was once a very good nickel. I would move him to nickel, and allow Graham to start.

 

8. IF, heaven forbid, the Bears lose to the Rams - a team that has packed it in for the year - Babich, Haley and Wilks should be launched immediately. They can get by with what they have for the remainder of the season, which will be over if they flop in St. Louis.

 

No problem w/ this, but Lovie is more loyal to his guys than Jauron was to Shoop, so I don't see this happening.

[nfoligno]

I think the key is blitz pickup and pass protection. I think KJ is simply a better blocker than Wolfe. I personally do not think our OL is good. Forte has been great in protection. If we sit him and put in Wolfe, we could be leaving Orton exposed. I think that is a key reason many would prefer to see KJ.

 

I have no problem getting Wolfe some carries, but see him more in a specialist/situational role, rather than as a RB who gives Forte a rest.

 

I do believe we need to get Forte off the field more. While he may not be getting 35 carries, he is one of our top receivers, and that increases his hits. So I would absolutely like to see us use both KJ and Wolfe more, but think it is KJ who needs to be getting the bulk of the 2nd RB carries.

 

I'll be part of the minority but I'd actually like to see Wolfe get some carries during a game. I don't mind Jones getting a few carries as well but he is similar to Forte in that he's a big back and has less shiftiness than Forte. Wolfe on the other hand is something completely different with his quickness. Forte gets a lot of touches between runs and passes and we could sneak Wolfe in for 5-7 plays a game.

[madlithuanian]

Agreed.

 

Bottom line, I think Wolfe has a place as a contributor...and right now, there seems to be no effort in getting him any touches of any kind. Especially when we're struggling...

 

 

 

I think the key is blitz pickup and pass protection. I think KJ is simply a better blocker than Wolfe. I personally do not think our OL is good. Forte has been great in protection. If we sit him and put in Wolfe, we could be leaving Orton exposed. I think that is a key reason many would prefer to see KJ.

 

I have no problem getting Wolfe some carries, but see him more in a specialist/situational role, rather than as a RB who gives Forte a rest.

 

I do believe we need to get Forte off the field more. While he may not be getting 35 carries, he is one of our top receivers, and that increases his hits. So I would absolutely like to see us use both KJ and Wolfe more, but think it is KJ who needs to be getting the bulk of the 2nd RB carries.

[flea]

Count me in your minority club...

 

I don't get why he isn't utilized. He actually may be better than some of the WR's we have!

 

 

Thats 3 of us so.

 

What was AP getting carries in last weeks game for??? We know what we have in him & the game was long over

[madlithuanian]

I swear, if I had a penny for every baffling decision this coaching staff made, I'd be able to bail out GM myself...

 

AP getting carries over Wolfe in that situation was just mind boggling.

 

Thats 3 of us so.

 

What was AP getting carries in last weeks game for??? We know what we have in him & the game was long over

[Butkus]

Hmmm, who was it that was saying Dvoracek was a beast and was heading to the Pro Bowl??? Who needs to eat some CROW?????

[BearSox]

Hmmm, who was it that was saying Dvoracek was a beast and was heading to the Pro Bowl??? Who needs to eat some CROW?????

I was saying that I thought he was a very good player, but not to the extent you listed.

 

DD has shown flashes, but he is obviously not an everydown lineman.

 

A big problem with our Dline is the lack of a good rotation, IMO.

[Connorbear]

Thats 3 of us so.

 

What was AP getting carries in last weeks game for??? We know what we have in him & the game was long over

AP has been a good soldier for yrs. The game was over and Lovie was simply throwing him a bone. There are much bigger issues to discuss. This is not an issue to me.

 

Peace

[madlithuanian]

I do agree that Peterson's been the consumate team player. But this was a game out of reach. Peterson should be utilized if we needed some real production. In a situation like last week, it's time to let some other guys show what they have. Guys like Wolfe... I respect giving Peterson touches,etc on some level. But, I'm sorry. This is an issue. It's just another of far too many examples of why this coaching staff is failing the club.

 

AP has been a good soldier for yrs. The game was over and Lovie was simply throwing him a bone. There are much bigger issues to discuss. This is not an issue to me.

 

Peace