Is Angelo sabotaging Lovie?

[nfoligno]

Okay, conspiracy theory in me here.

 

Some years back, Angelo had a coach he didn't want. At that time, think back on how active we were in FA. Something between little and nothing was added in FA. Angelo did VERY little to upgrade this team during that time, and it showed in how weak our personnel was.

 

Then Jauron is gone, and he gets the coach he wants in Lovie. Nearly immediately, he begins to be a player in FA. We then see him making some big moves like adding Tait, Wale and Moose, among others.

 

Now look at this offseaosn. It starts out w/ all the talk from Lovie indicating he believes the team has the talent, and only coaching has held them back. Many articles are written about how Angelo shined a big spotlight on Lovie, and seemed to put him on the hot seat. Then FA begins, and Angelo is looking like the GM from the Jauron days.

 

Many have argued whether Lovie and Angelo are tied together, but I wonder if Angelo feels he has another coaching hire in him, and is already looking beyond Lovie. Does anyone but Angelo believe this team is really so "close" or that we have the talent? That has been what he has been saying, and now his actions seem to backup his words. If we tank this season, will he say he had the talent but the staff failed?

 

Just wondering, but it just seems like Angelo's actions today reflect how he handled the team under Jauron, rather than how he handled it under Lovie earlier on. It just has not seemed like Lovie and Angelo have been on the same page, and more and more I am wondering if Angelo has not already given up on Lovie.

[ParkerBear7]

Okay, conspiracy theory in me here.

 

Some years back, Angelo had a coach he didn't want. At that time, think back on how active we were in FA. Something between little and nothing was added in FA. Angelo did VERY little to upgrade this team during that time, and it showed in how weak our personnel was.

 

Then Jauron is gone, and he gets the coach he wants in Lovie. Nearly immediately, he begins to be a player in FA. We then see him making some big moves like adding Tait, Wale and Moose, among others.

 

Now look at this offseaosn. It starts out w/ all the talk from Lovie indicating he believes the team has the talent, and only coaching has held them back. Many articles are written about how Angelo shined a big spotlight on Lovie, and seemed to put him on the hot seat. Then FA begins, and Angelo is looking like the GM from the Jauron days.

 

Many have argued whether Lovie and Angelo are tied together, but I wonder if Angelo feels he has another coaching hire in him, and is already looking beyond Lovie. Does anyone but Angelo believe this team is really so "close" or that we have the talent? That has been what he has been saying, and now his actions seem to backup his words. If we tank this season, will he say he had the talent but the staff failed?

 

Just wondering, but it just seems like Angelo's actions today reflect how he handled the team under Jauron, rather than how he handled it under Lovie earlier on. It just has not seemed like Lovie and Angelo have been on the same page, and more and more I am wondering if Angelo has not already given up on Lovie.

 

 

NFO - I see your point and I would only say that no since he would probably be fired as well especially if Culter is avaible and he is unable to secure him.

[Chitownhustla]

NFO - I see your point and I would only say that no since he would probably be fired as well especially if Culter is avaible and he is unable to secure him.

 

NFO,

 

yesterday i was thinking why the F are the Bears doing nothing at all in FA? It's pretty clear we need upgrades in a few spots badly(if not experienced bodies for depth). Imagine if Orton goes down, we have no one on the roster that has started a Nfl game to sub in????? Something must be up! It makes no sense at all. I thought there were a good amount of Oline FA's out there that could have been picked up to secure our line. At least if that was done we wouldnt have had to address it in the first 3 rounds of the draft. Then we could have gone after a WR or S early on. Shit even a QB. I'm surprised that there is not more outrage on here.

[Mongo3451]

NFO,

 

yesterday i was thinking why the F are the Bears doing nothing at all in FA? It's pretty clear we need upgrades in a few spots badly(if not experienced bodies for depth). Imagine if Orton goes down, we have no one on the roster that has started a Nfl game to sub in????? Something must be up! It makes no sense at all. I thought there were a good amount of Oline FA's out there that could have been picked up to secure our line. At least if that was done we wouldnt have had to address it in the first 3 rounds of the draft. Then we could have gone after a WR or S early on. Shit even a QB. I'm surprised that there is not more outrage on here.

 

I'm not outraged yet. I'm kinda numb though. With the huge amount of money at JA's disposal and no significant FA's to sign, we've done relatively nothing to shore our weakest areas. I'm still holding out for a slew of signings to provide more talent and depth at key positions. The draft will not suffice. At this rate, the surplus will be huge and if JA starts handing out early extensions to our current roster I will go postal. Add to that JA will have affectively closed the window on this team. We are NOT close as Lovie speculated. Everybody knows that.

[jason]

I'm not outraged yet. I'm kinda numb though. With the huge amount of money at JA's disposal and no significant FA's to sign, we've done relatively nothing to shore our weakest areas. I'm still holding out for a slew of signings to provide more talent and depth at key positions. The draft will not suffice. At this rate, the surplus will be huge and if JA starts handing out early extensions to our current roster I will go postal. Add to that JA will have affectively closed the window on this team. We are NOT close as Lovie speculated. Everybody knows that.

 

Actually, I disagree. I think the Bears ARE close. I think that coaches and coaching philosophy have held them back. Hell, they barely missed the playoffs last year, and that's with coaching that is widely regarded on this board as insufficient - I think it's worse than that still.

 

So, if they missed the playoffs with horrible coaching, it's safe to say they would have made it with competent coaching. Add in the fact that there were a few injuries, and the Bears got nearly NO good breaks as far as turnovers are concerned, and it's not difficult to see them taking another step forward and being a solid team with deep playoff aspirations.

[nfoligno]

Few comments for ya Jason.

 

One. While you point to our record last year, I think many would say that we could have been a 5/6 win team just as easy as a 9/10 win team. Such is the state when your team is as mediocre as we are.

 

Two. You say we are close, but close to what? The playoffs? Okay fine. But in the NFL today, is the same not true of most every team. Each year, you have a small group of teams (like Oakland or Det) who can not even say they are close to being .500, much less playoffs, but I would argue the vast majority of the NFL can argue they are close to being a playoff team. That is how it is in the more balanced NFL of today. But so what. I don't want to be "close" to being a playoff team. I want to be close to being a SB team, and you think we are that? I think AZ would have humiliated us last year. We might have been able to sneak into the backdoor of the playoffs, but we were not "close" to being a legit SB team. That should be what we are trying to be. Not close to being a playoff team.

 

Three. You say we didn't get any good breaks as far as turnovers are concerned, but I would disagree. I saw many potential offensive turnovers end up in our favor, as a DB would drop and easy pick, or we would recover our own fumble. I'm sure you were referring to defense, but offense counts too. As for defense, you make your own breaks, When a potential pick bounces off our players hands, you don't say we didn't catch break. The Defender just blew the play.

 

Four. Despite our record, I have a difficult time understanding how we are so close when our laundry list of needs is so long. Positions that I think are question marks (and I am not even counting positions that I feel were question marks due to coaching) QB, LT, RT, OG, OG, C, FB, WR, CB, FS, SS. That doesn't even factor depth chart. That is a long list.

 

Five. You say, "it's not difficult to see them taking another step forward", but I can just as easily see a major step backward. You are among the few who have screamed to focus on the OL w/ me over the years, and yet so little has been done. I am not sure we have upgraded our OL thus far, and I can just as easily see our offense taking a step backward this year if we do not do more on the OL. What happens to this team if Orton or Forte go down w/ injury? On defense, I think we will be better due to coaching changes, but right now, my key concern is offense, and I just see little reason for expectation of "taking another step forward".

 

Actually, I disagree. I think the Bears ARE close. I think that coaches and coaching philosophy have held them back. Hell, they barely missed the playoffs last year, and that's with coaching that is widely regarded on this board as insufficient - I think it's worse than that still.

 

So, if they missed the playoffs with horrible coaching, it's safe to say they would have made it with competent coaching. Add in the fact that there were a few injuries, and the Bears got nearly NO good breaks as far as turnovers are concerned, and it's not difficult to see them taking another step forward and being a solid team with deep playoff aspirations.

[chwtom]

I think there is something to this. Angelo is signed through 2013, so he isn't going anywhere. If Angelo dumps Lovie after this season, they likely wouldn't fire him before his contract was up, so his fate would be tied to his next coach, who would probably get 3 years to prove he's the right guy.

 

I don't know if it's so much that Angelo is sabatoging Lovie, but he might not want to make huge investments into players who only fit Lovie's scheme, when Lovie might not make it past this season if there is no turnaround.

 

FWIW, reading between the lines of Angelo's statements, I think he is highly ticked off about the Rivera/Babich replacement, and that is part of why he made Angelo take over the DC position, and kind of tied his fate to being able to turn the D around.

[akshaz]

I've been very surprised that JA has been so quiet in free agency. I never expected us to break the bank and bring in one of the premier talents. But, you couldn't have told me in January that we wouldn't have another QB by now.

 

In Kurt Warner and Cutler, you have both extremes. You have the old veteran with only a year or two left. Then you have the young QB with a rocket arm and years to go in this league (barring injury of course). One of these guys needs to be our guy. Orton does not deserve to go into next season as the unquestioned starter. We have to bring in some serious competition in FA or find a way to get a premier signal caller in the draft.

 

Now, I don't think that JA is sabotaging Lovie. I think their fates are inter-twined. If we have a bad year in 2009, they are both gone.

[ChileBear]

Actually, I disagree. I think the Bears ARE close. I think that coaches and coaching philosophy have held them back. Hell, they barely missed the playoffs last year, and that's with coaching that is widely regarded on this board as insufficient - I think it's worse than that still.

 

So, if they missed the playoffs with horrible coaching, it's safe to say they would have made it with competent coaching. Add in the fact that there were a few injuries, and the Bears got nearly NO good breaks as far as turnovers are concerned, and it's not difficult to see them taking another step forward and being a solid team with deep playoff aspirations.

I like conspiracy theories as much as the next guy, but I tend to agree with you jason. I think it's more about coaching than players for us. Yes, we still need OL help, WRs that can get open, a replacement for Brown at S and a backup QB. So, I think JA is looking to sign someone for those spots at a bargain price (which I disagree with) and then look at the draft.

I'm hoping that we can get over the hump next season and feel that JA is too.

[chitownman]

Akshaz, I am not able to see both Angelo and Smith being gone if the team fails to make the playoffs next year because Virginia and company would not approve eating both salaries and starting over from scratch with a new GM and new HC.

 

Nfoligno I am able to see how you are able to come up with this thought and want to remind everyone about one key divisional game that makes me still believe Smith is no longer the man to lead this franchise. Go back to Sunday night November 30th. In a span of about 60 seconds, we went from First and Goal from roughly the one to giving up a 99 yard touchdown pass that was caught by our former receiver. You look at the sidelines after that play was completed and you look at the team and there mannerisms and see such dejection that it appears that the coaching staff has lost its team.

 

So if there is a conspiracy going on it is keeping a coach who does not have the confidence of his team. A GM who is stuck right now because there is still too much money to eat on the HC's contract to eat and making minor coaching changes are not going to improve this team. There is a need for major over-hauls at pretty much every position on this team and not a damn thing is being done. It is not acceptable and we as fans should not be willing to accept mediocrity as a right of passage for this team or any team that we may all follow. It is unacceptable and should not be tolerated. Think about it in your own job. If you were not meeting or exceeding expectations of the company you were working for, you would be given a short time to turn it around and if you still did not you would be fired in a heart beat. The same standards should be held for all pro franchises and unfortunately they are not and we are all blinded to a degree not to hit the owners where it would really hurt, in their profits. Either way in my view both Angelo and Smith need to go however, Angelo will be here a bit longer than Smith will be at this point.

[madlithuanian]

I see deja vu...

 

I guess the big question is whether JA is making the moves or if Ted is pulling the strings.

 

Hearing the the lack of doing anything from JA, really makes me wonder how he's getting such a free pass. Telling us that he explores FA "last year" w/ Lloyd and Booker is like calling every fan a complete an utter dumbass. It makes no logical sense.

 

A. That was last year, this year has a different group of FA's

B. Those guys were far from impact players. Even before their hit our camp. We all had hoped Booker would regain some form and Lloyd would come into his own. But there's not a soul who felt it would definitley happen. Wheareas, I think most agree that Housh would be a significant upgrade.

 

I think maybe JA does have it in for Lovie. He put him on the hot seat for the D and isn't givng him any more weapons on O or D really. He can't justify canning him without one more failure... I just find it a chame that if Smith goes, Angelo will probably stay. And I think he's just as guilty as Smith for our status as doormat. No one in the league has any fear of us what-so-ever. In fact I think they relish playing us like most do the Lions. That's what I get from other fans here in L.A.... Wrong or right, that is the perception.

 

 

Okay, conspiracy theory in me here.

 

Some years back, Angelo had a coach he didn't want. At that time, think back on how active we were in FA. Something between little and nothing was added in FA. Angelo did VERY little to upgrade this team during that time, and it showed in how weak our personnel was.

 

Then Jauron is gone, and he gets the coach he wants in Lovie. Nearly immediately, he begins to be a player in FA. We then see him making some big moves like adding Tait, Wale and Moose, among others.

 

Now look at this offseaosn. It starts out w/ all the talk from Lovie indicating he believes the team has the talent, and only coaching has held them back. Many articles are written about how Angelo shined a big spotlight on Lovie, and seemed to put him on the hot seat. Then FA begins, and Angelo is looking like the GM from the Jauron days.

 

Many have argued whether Lovie and Angelo are tied together, but I wonder if Angelo feels he has another coaching hire in him, and is already looking beyond Lovie. Does anyone but Angelo believe this team is really so "close" or that we have the talent? That has been what he has been saying, and now his actions seem to backup his words. If we tank this season, will he say he had the talent but the staff failed?

 

Just wondering, but it just seems like Angelo's actions today reflect how he handled the team under Jauron, rather than how he handled it under Lovie earlier on. It just has not seemed like Lovie and Angelo have been on the same page, and more and more I am wondering if Angelo has not already given up on Lovie.

[madlithuanian]

Agreed chitownman!

 

Akshaz, I am not able to see both Angelo and Smith being gone if the team fails to make the playoffs next year because Virginia and company would not approve eating both salaries and starting over from scratch with a new GM and new HC.

 

Nfoligno I am able to see how you are able to come up with this thought and want to remind everyone about one key divisional game that makes me still believe Smith is no longer the man to lead this franchise. Go back to Sunday night November 30th. In a span of about 60 seconds, we went from First and Goal from roughly the one to giving up a 99 yard touchdown pass that was caught by our former receiver. You look at the sidelines after that play was completed and you look at the team and there mannerisms and see such dejection that it appears that the coaching staff has lost its team.

 

So if there is a conspiracy going on it is keeping a coach who does not have the confidence of his team. A GM who is stuck right now because there is still too much money to eat on the HC's contract to eat and making minor coaching changes are not going to improve this team. There is a need for major over-hauls at pretty much every position on this team and not a damn thing is being done. It is not acceptable and we as fans should not be willing to accept mediocrity as a right of passage for this team or any team that we may all follow. It is unacceptable and should not be tolerated. Think about it in your own job. If you were not meeting or exceeding expectations of the company you were working for, you would be given a short time to turn it around and if you still did not you would be fired in a heart beat. The same standards should be held for all pro franchises and unfortunately they are not and we are all blinded to a degree not to hit the owners where it would really hurt, in their profits. Either way in my view both Angelo and Smith need to go however, Angelo will be here a bit longer than Smith will be at this point.

[nfoligno]

Understand, I am not saying Angelo is wringing his hands w/ an evil laugh as he plots to bring down Lovie. It is more likely similar to what milwaukeebear said. Angelo believes he has time on his side, and has lost his belief in Lovie. Angelo see's Lovie as likely being gone after this year, and thus is not willing to spend big in FA because he doesn't want to bring in talent that suits one coach but may not another coach

 

I believe we have simply seen this before. I think it is well enough documented that Jauron was not Angelo's guy. During those years, I think Clark was the biggest, most expensive FA Angelo signed. Think about that for a moment. Clark got, I think in the 3yr/$15m range and was the biggest FA addition for Jauron. Almost as soon as Jauron is out and Lovie is in, we are suddenly big players in the offseason making moves for players like Wale, Tait and Moose, not to mention others like RMJ, Archuleta and others. That isn't even counting when we made big offers to players like Kearse and Randel El, though we did not ultimately get them.

 

It just feels like he is treating the offseason now far more similar to how he did when Jauron was the coach. Basically, Jauron had to win w/ whatever he had, and develop whoever was drafted, but could not rely on FA to add any significant level of talent to the team. Seems like what Lovie should now expect.

 

No argument it is a joke that Angelo has a good chance to stick for a 3rd coaching hiring, but I think that is the way it is. I would say though it is pretty common. Coaches have a FAR shorter life span w/ teams than the GMs do.

 

I see deja vu...

 

I guess the big question is whether JA is making the moves or if Ted is pulling the strings.

 

Hearing the the lack of doing anything from JA, really makes me wonder how he's getting such a free pass. Telling us that he explores FA "last year" w/ Lloyd and Booker is like calling every fan a complete an utter dumbass. It makes no logical sense.

 

A. That was last year, this year has a different group of FA's

B. Those guys were far from impact players. Even before their hit our camp. We all had hoped Booker would regain some form and Lloyd would come into his own. But there's not a soul who felt it would definitley happen. Wheareas, I think most agree that Housh would be a significant upgrade.

 

I think maybe JA does have it in for Lovie. He put him on the hot seat for the D and isn't givng him any more weapons on O or D really. He can't justify canning him without one more failure... I just find it a chame that if Smith goes, Angelo will probably stay. And I think he's just as guilty as Smith for our status as doormat. No one in the league has any fear of us what-so-ever. In fact I think they relish playing us like most do the Lions. That's what I get from other fans here in L.A.... Wrong or right, that is the perception.

[Mongo3451]

Understand, I am not saying Angelo is wringing his hands w/ an evil laugh as he plots to bring down Lovie. It is more likely similar to what milwaukeebear said. Angelo believes he has time on his side, and has lost his belief in Lovie. Angelo see's Lovie as likely being gone after this year, and thus is not willing to spend big in FA because he doesn't want to bring in talent that suits one coach but may not another coach

 

It just feels like he is treating the offseason now far more similar to how he did when Jauron was the coach. Basically, Jauron had to win w/ whatever he had, and develop whoever was drafted, but could not rely on FA to add any significant level of talent to the team. Seems like what Lovie should now expect.

 

No argument it is a joke that Angelo has a good chance to stick for a 3rd coaching hiring, but I think that is the way it is. I would say though it is pretty common. Coaches have a FAR shorter life span w/ teams than the GMs do.

I just don't see it. I guess it's simply because I am not wired that way. IMO - The job of a GM is competetive in nature. That being said, Angelo in no way would have the mental make up to sabotage Lovie, knowing he's tanking on purpose.

 

On the other hand, I can see a conversation that would make the whole scenario unfold. Phillips calls Angelo into the office and says something like, " Jerry, the family is a little concerned that their return on investment wasn't what they thought they were going to see. You assured us we were a playoff team and although we almost made it, there were scenarios that had to unfold to even put us in position. Now you and Lovie have assured us, that we are close. Define close. OK, go out and prove it. If not, we'll be using our extra money to show a new coach and GM the kind of money we have to immediately re-build this team. Have a nice day." <_>

 

This is why I feel it runs deeper than Angelo. Position coaches run the day to day. Coordinators run the week the week. Head coach runs the season. The GM runs the season to future seasons. That tells me Angelo is just as much a victim as Lovie. On the other hand, Phillips and above are looking past this season to the next generation. That tells me it has to be Phillips or higher. GM's simply don't have a high enough calling to cause pain on that scale for the "greater good" of the franchise.

[nfoligno]

You say your not wired that way, but I think you are. The only difference is, you see the "conspiracy" coming from higher up than I do, and see different motives for that conspiracy. For the record, I say conspiracy and sabotage, but in my posts and explanations, I state that I am not truly suggesting such great concepts.

 

You say GMs do not have a high enough calling to cause pain on that scale for the franchise, but I would argue they do, and we have seen it many times over the years. Plenty often there is a "perceived" rift between GM and coach, and often the two are not on the same page. Heck, I would even argue the job of the two often force such issues, as the GM is expected to think long term while the coach more often is thinking only as far ahead as the next game. A recent publicized spat was scene in SD.

 

For us bear fans, I think we saw this between Angelo and Jauron. You honestly believe Angelo provided full and total support to Jauron? Angelo sat on his hands in FA. Often the players added were not of the style that fit Jauron's scheme. Some believed Jauron even pushed back by benching or even cutting some Angelo drafted players. But can you say you don't see the difference in how Angelo dealt w/ the offseason under Jauron and Lovie. We went from no FA bigger than Desmond Clark to a group of veterans getting over $10m in bonus money.

 

Now, more recently, it seems Angelo is back to sitting back and letting the coaching staff be the fall guys. I mean, do you think we are so, "close"? The way Angelo has seemingly gone out of his way to call out our coaching staff and imply our personnel is set is eye popping. While I have no issue calling out our staff, it is not something we often hear from Angelo. And who out there believes our talent level is ready to compete for the SB?

 

Conspiracy and sabotage are strong words, but I do think Angelo is somewhat setting Lovie up here. If we do well, Lovie will get tons of credit. But if we do not do well, then Angelo has set himself up to say it was on the coach and not him.

 

I just don't see it. I guess it's simply because I am not wired that way. IMO - The job of a GM is competetive in nature. That being said, Angelo in no way would have the mental make up to sabotage Lovie, knowing he's tanking on purpose.

 

On the other hand, I can see a conversation that would make the whole scenario unfold. Phillips calls Angelo into the office and says something like, " Jerry, the family is a little concerned that their return on investment wasn't what they thought they were going to see. You assured us we were a playoff team and although we almost made it, there were scenarios that had to unfold to even put us in position. Now you and Lovie have assured us, that we are close. Define close. OK, go out and prove it. If not, we'll be using our extra money to show a new coach and GM the kind of money we have to immediately re-build this team. Have a nice day." <_>

 

This is why I feel it runs deeper than Angelo. Position coaches run the day to day. Coordinators run the week the week. Head coach runs the season. The GM runs the season to future seasons. That tells me Angelo is just as much a victim as Lovie. On the other hand, Phillips and above are looking past this season to the next generation. That tells me it has to be Phillips or higher. GM's simply don't have a high enough calling to cause pain on that scale for the "greater good" of the franchise.

[azbearsfan]

I would hope not, but who knows.

[madlithuanian]

No, I follow what you were getting at. I simply added my thoughts on top of that.

 

...and assuming we're somewhat right, that's a horrible way to be a GM.

 

Understand, I am not saying Angelo is wringing his hands w/ an evil laugh as he plots to bring down Lovie. It is more likely similar to what milwaukeebear said. Angelo believes he has time on his side, and has lost his belief in Lovie. Angelo see's Lovie as likely being gone after this year, and thus is not willing to spend big in FA because he doesn't want to bring in talent that suits one coach but may not another coach

 

I believe we have simply seen this before. I think it is well enough documented that Jauron was not Angelo's guy. During those years, I think Clark was the biggest, most expensive FA Angelo signed. Think about that for a moment. Clark got, I think in the 3yr/$15m range and was the biggest FA addition for Jauron. Almost as soon as Jauron is out and Lovie is in, we are suddenly big players in the offseason making moves for players like Wale, Tait and Moose, not to mention others like RMJ, Archuleta and others. That isn't even counting when we made big offers to players like Kearse and Randel El, though we did not ultimately get them.

 

It just feels like he is treating the offseason now far more similar to how he did when Jauron was the coach. Basically, Jauron had to win w/ whatever he had, and develop whoever was drafted, but could not rely on FA to add any significant level of talent to the team. Seems like what Lovie should now expect.

 

No argument it is a joke that Angelo has a good chance to stick for a 3rd coaching hiring, but I think that is the way it is. I would say though it is pretty common. Coaches have a FAR shorter life span w/ teams than the GMs do.

[Connorbear]

I've been very surprised that JA has been so quiet in free agency. I never expected us to break the bank and bring in one of the premier talents. But, you couldn't have told me in January that we wouldn't have another QB by now.

 

In Kurt Warner and Cutler, you have both extremes. You have the old veteran with only a year or two left. Then you have the young QB with a rocket arm and years to go in this league (barring injury of course). One of these guys needs to be our guy. Orton does not deserve to go into next season as the unquestioned starter. We have to bring in some serious competition in FA or find a way to get a premier signal caller in the draft.

 

Now, I don't think that JA is sabotaging Lovie. I think their fates are inter-twined. If we have a bad year in 2009, they are both gone.

No way we are going to get Culter or Warner - period.

 

Peace

[madlithuanian]

You are correct.

 

No way we are going to get Culter or Warner - period.

 

Peace

[Connorbear]

No way we are going to get Culter or Warner - period.

 

Peace

We are less than a week into FA and, because we have signed 1 FA, Angelo is sabotaging Lovie???? Give me a break.

 

Here's my thoughts. JA believes in concensus building - everyone discussing and then making a decision. They decided at the end of the yr that the defensive coaching staff was a major problem. What did they do? They made big, big changes to the defensive coaching staff. They also decided they are not going to throw huge gobs of money at FA based on past failures most specifically Moose. Look at what they did last yr other than extending current players. Booker and Lloyd were the 2 big name signings I can think of and they were both signed for peanuts.

 

You may agree or disagree with the strategy they currently have implemented. However, it would be career suicide for Angelo to sabotage his head coach. If he did and it was found out, he would be done in the business.

 

Peace

[Pixote]

No way we are going to get Culter or Warner - period.

 

Peace

 

Anyone love the AFLAC commercial where Yogi Berra in the Barber Shop completely confuses the AFLAC bird? It is one of my favorites.

 

On the score today on the way home two things came up on one call that made me feel as confused as the bird on that ad that had me shaking my head in disbelief.

 

The caller suggested we trade Forte in a package deal with some picks to get Cutler. This is one of the dumbest things I think I have ever heard.

 

Then, the radio host says he does not think it would ever happen because, for one reason, other teams would not consider Forte as an elite RB that they would want to trade for??????

 

DUMB DUMB DUMB, AND DUMBER!

[madlithuanian]

I do a gree that sabotage, etc is on the extreme. And it's a sign that us fans are frustrated.

 

However, we are for good reason. Consensus building? You mean our shoddy picks are a consensus of all involved? Isn't that an indictment on the lack of skill we have judging talent accross the board? Connor, do you honestly believe Booker and Lloyd were big names last off-season? Seriously. They are names we've actually heard, but not big. In fact, many posters here voiced extreme concern especially over Booker. I was one of the optimistic ones! We only know of Booker because he was once good with us back in the day and that Lloyd played in college for our OC and failed everywhere else.

 

Moose wasn't a complete failure...he wasn't great, but he was a legit starter for a few years. To vow out of FA because of Moose, Booker and Lloyd is silliness. That is straight giving up and folding in the face of adversity. And w/ Moose, it's not like we didn't have the loot! We paid a lot, but we had money to burn!

 

I do agree that purposefully sabotaging Smith would be beyond silly. But I think it's a grasp at a straw to instill some brain-power in Angelo thinking he's more diabolical than plain stupid. It's looking more like plain stupid...

 

We are less than a week into FA and, because we have signed 1 FA, Angelo is sabotaging Lovie???? Give me a break.

 

Here's my thoughts. JA believes in concensus building - everyone discussing and then making a decision. They decided at the end of the yr that the defensive coaching staff was a major problem. What did they do? They made big, big changes to the defensive coaching staff. They also decided they are not going to throw huge gobs of money at FA based on past failures most specifically Moose. Look at what they did last yr other than extending current players. Booker and Lloyd were the 2 big name signings I can think of and they were both signed for peanuts.

 

You may agree or disagree with the strategy they currently have implemented. However, it would be career suicide for Angelo to sabotage his head coach. If he did and it was found out, he would be done in the business.

 

Peace

[azbearsfan]

I also think that the "boards" tend to be a bit dramatic towards the negative.

I mean, if you didn't know any better, you would think that we were the Lions.

 

However, we had a winning record and ended up barely missing the playoffs. So I tend to agree with jason when he says we are "close". Close to what? Being a playoff team every year.

[madlithuanian]

Oh agreed. it's like the news. You don't see stories about the guy who donated hours to help the elderly, you see murder and mayhem... And people tend to get more riled up in dislike than like.

 

I just don't see that "closeness" you and Jason speak of. Yep, we were close last year to sniffing a playoff seed. Last year. Not the year before...or this year for that matter. To me, that's not a sign of consistency.

 

 

I also think that the "boards" tend to be a bit dramatic towards the negative.

I mean, if you didn't know any better, you would think that we were the Lions.

 

However, we had a winning record and ended up barely missing the playoffs. So I tend to agree with jason when he says we are "close". Close to what? Being a playoff team every year.

[BearFan PHX]

Guys, we do this every year.

 

We get impatient, while Angelo waits for value. He is a good poker player. He takes risks when he feels it's a good idea, and certainly, he has lost his share of those gambles too. But when it comes to value - be it trading down, or later round picks, Angelo has shown to be a shrewd character.

 

Wait until camp starts, then look at the roster he built. There's no need to go out and make a big money splash if you don't believe fully in the talent that's there, and can wait for something similar at a lesser price.

 

From the cheap lurking seats...