Why did we expect JA to move quickly???

[bradjock]

1. Angelo said he expected to make no immediate splash. I can understand why some considered this to be a smoke-screen, but I bought it.

2. When was the last time we EVER signed a significant player on free agent weekend that wasn't our own??? I'm thinking Thomas Jones in 2004. So it's been 5 years since it's happened.

 

Other guys like Moose we're signed before free agency, and other players we signed, in most cases, weeks after it began. This includes: Tait, Fred Miller, Reuben Brown, Brian Griese, Brandon Lloyd, RMJ, Kevin Jones . . .

 

We also, much later in each case, traded for guys like Archuletta, Darwin Walker, and Wale.

 

Am I forgetting anybody? Seriously. I was shocked we signed Frank Amiyale that quickly.

 

If Angelo says he's not going to sign anyone quickly, and he has a history of doing so, it's nuts to think he'd do anything different.

 

There's still a lot of players out there who can still start for this team next season. It might be we're waiting to nab one of the restricted guys (which is much easier to do after teams have spent their money).

 

I'm optimistic that we're just getting started.

[ASHKUM BEAR]

1. Angelo said he expected to make no immediate splash. I can understand why some considered this to be a smoke-screen, but I bought it.

2. When was the last time we EVER signed a significant player on free agent weekend that wasn't our own??? I'm thinking Thomas Jones in 2004. So it's been 5 years since it's happened.

 

Other guys like Moose we're signed before free agency, and other players we signed, in most cases, weeks after it began. This includes: Tait, Fred Miller, Reuben Brown, Brian Griese, Brandon Lloyd, RMJ, Kevin Jones . . .

 

We also, much later in each case, traded for guys like Archuletta, Darwin Walker, and Wale.

 

Am I forgetting anybody? Seriously. I was shocked we signed Frank Amiyale that quickly.

 

If Angelo says he's not going to sign anyone quickly, and he has a history of doing so, it's nuts to think he'd do anything different.

 

There's still a lot of players out there who can still start for this team next season. It might be we're waiting to nab one of the restricted guys (which is much easier to do after teams have spent their money).

 

I'm optimistic that we're just getting started.

 

Your right, we don't move too fast b/c we got ourselves at 30 mil plus cap space by not buying into the FA hype and letting things settle a bit. We look for contributors that will keep us finanically healthy and build our core through the draft.

 

Also, I think whatever JA and the Bears do, they will be criticized one way or the other. For instance we need a franchise QB. If the Bears brought in Warner, there would be negative statements like he's too old, can't play in cold/wind, won't have Fitz/Bolden or Holt/Bruce as WR. If we brought in Housmanzadeh we would get: he's too old, only a pos WR, always a #2, played in Cincy who almost always had to pass to catch up. So I'm ok on bringing in lesser names like we have in the past (R. Brown, R. Garza, F. Miller, K Jones, etc.)

[AZ54]

I wasn't expecting a big splash but I was expecting more interest in some the FA OTs. I still expect St Clair to come back to the Bears because that is likely his best option for getting playing time either at OG or OT. He already knows the system and we have needs. Yet waiting on him to accept that offer without even talking to any of the others is unsettling to me.

[Ed Hochuli 3:16]

I was told all his comments about the other positions not being that big of needs were smoke-screens.

['TD']

I wasn't expecting a big splash but I was expecting more interest in some the FA OTs. I still expect St Clair to come back to the Bears because that is likely his best option for getting playing time either at OG or OT. He already knows the system and we have needs. Yet waiting on him to accept that offer without even talking to any of the others is unsettling to me.

 

Plus the Bears are offering him more then what he is worth in a market where he doesn't seem in demand. Has he had any visits yet?

[madlithuanian]

Agreed...

 

I know the beast we are dealing with. But with so many glaring holes and so many warm bodies to fill those holes, logic would seem to dictate we go after a few more solid prospects than a 1 gamer bench guy from CAR...

 

I didn't expect JA to do anything. But, it doesn't make it any less frustrating.

 

I wasn't expecting a big splash but I was expecting more interest in some the FA OTs. I still expect St Clair to come back to the Bears because that is likely his best option for getting playing time either at OG or OT. He already knows the system and we have needs. Yet waiting on him to accept that offer without even talking to any of the others is unsettling to me.

[nfoligno]

But when were we in a situation like this year.

 

This year, we entered FA w/ as much as $34m in cap space. I can not ever recall us beig close to that figure. Further, for a change, we have little to nothing on the roster that we needed to dedicate a large amount of cap space for, either in our own UFAs or players not yet FAs, but who we wanted to extend.

 

In past years, there were always players who we needed to (a) re-sign or ( extend, which eat up large portions of our cap space. That is not the case this year. For a change, we entered FA w/ a ton of cap space and VERY LITTLE in-house personnel we needed to allocate that space toward.

 

That is why I had hope this year would see a change. We, for once, truly had $34m in cap space to dedicate to FAs. While in the past, we were basically forced to be a little more frugal and conservative in FA, this year we were in a position to take more risk and be more aggressive.

 

1. Angelo said he expected to make no immediate splash. I can understand why some considered this to be a smoke-screen, but I bought it.

2. When was the last time we EVER signed a significant player on free agent weekend that wasn't our own??? I'm thinking Thomas Jones in 2004. So it's been 5 years since it's happened.

 

Other guys like Moose we're signed before free agency, and other players we signed, in most cases, weeks after it began. This includes: Tait, Fred Miller, Reuben Brown, Brian Griese, Brandon Lloyd, RMJ, Kevin Jones . . .

 

We also, much later in each case, traded for guys like Archuletta, Darwin Walker, and Wale.

 

Am I forgetting anybody? Seriously. I was shocked we signed Frank Amiyale that quickly.

 

If Angelo says he's not going to sign anyone quickly, and he has a history of doing so, it's nuts to think he'd do anything different.

 

There's still a lot of players out there who can still start for this team next season. It might be we're waiting to nab one of the restricted guys (which is much easier to do after teams have spent their money).

 

I'm optimistic that we're just getting started.

['TD']

I agree. One thing you left out was that he could have been franchised. It would have fit well under the cap.

 

The money could have been used in better areas such as getting into the Faneca hunt instead of bringing back Fred Miller to help with the depleted OLine.

 

It could have been used to bring in a number of players to fill many gaps the team had. Instead it was just saved. It may have been the little bit the Bears needed to get over the hump and into the play offs.

[Connorbear]

But when were we in a situation like this year.

 

This year, we entered FA w/ as much as $34m in cap space. I can not ever recall us beig close to that figure. Further, for a change, we have little to nothing on the roster that we needed to dedicate a large amount of cap space for, either in our own UFAs or players not yet FAs, but who we wanted to extend.

 

In past years, there were always players who we needed to (a) re-sign or ( extend, which eat up large portions of our cap space. That is not the case this year. For a change, we entered FA w/ a ton of cap space and VERY LITTLE in-house personnel we needed to allocate that space toward.

 

That is why I had hope this year would see a change. We, for once, truly had $34m in cap space to dedicate to FAs. While in the past, we were basically forced to be a little more frugal and conservative in FA, this year we were in a position to take more risk and be more aggressive.

Actually we have several players who will be FA after next yr. JA has a pattern of trying to lock those players up the year before. Obviously there are some that we are still waiting to see improvement before giving them money, however, they do have until somewhere around the end of October to use this yrs cap space.

 

Players who are FA after next yr:

 

- Ogy

- Manning Jr

- Anderson

- Orton

- Idoneje

 

You will most likely see 2 or 3 of these players extended with front loaded contracts if we do not use up most of the cap space by then.

 

The question I would ask you ask you: why spend money on FA just to spend it? Maybe JA and staff took a look at the FA and felt that none of the top players were worth the cost (i.e. the benefit from obtaining the players would not be worth the cost).

 

I know this based on their past behavior - the Bears will spend up to the cap. How they do that is the question.

 

Peace

[chwtom]

I think Moose signed just after FA opened. That's the only one I can remember.

[Connorbear]

I think Moose signed just after FA opened. That's the only one I can remember.

Moose was cut before FA and we signed him right away. He did not have to wait until FA since he had been waived.

 

We signed Jones and Clark on the first day of FA. Those are the only 2, other than Omiyale, that I can remember.

 

Peace

[madlithuanian]

Manning Jr? I thought he was shown the door? Do you mean Daniel Manning?

 

I think Ogun and Idonije are gone

 

D. Manning may get re-upped if he does well this year. Same with Orton and Anderson.

 

JA's probably done just that. But I do not trust his decision making.

 

 

 

 

 

Actually we have several players who will be FA after next yr. JA has a pattern of trying to lock those players up the year before. Obviously there are some that we are still waiting to see improvement before giving them money, however, they do have until somewhere around the end of October to use this yrs cap space.

 

Players who are FA after next yr:

 

- Ogy

- Manning Jr

- Anderson

- Orton

- Idoneje

 

You will most likely see 2 or 3 of these players extended with front loaded contracts if we do not use up most of the cap space by then.

 

The question I would ask you ask you: why spend money on FA just to spend it? Maybe JA and staff took a look at the FA and felt that none of the top players were worth the cost (i.e. the benefit from obtaining the players would not be worth the cost).

 

I know this based on their past behavior - the Bears will spend up to the cap. How they do that is the question.

 

Peace

[Connorbear]

Manning Jr? I thought he was shown the door? Do you mean Daniel Manning?

 

I think Ogun and Idonije are gone

 

D. Manning may get re-upped if he does well this year. Same with Orton and Anderson.

 

JA's probably done just that. But I do not trust his decision making.

Yeah, I meant Daniel Manning - thanks.

 

I think Idonije stays and Ogun is gone. Idonije has shown he has tons of value on ST and as a fill in all over the line.

 

Peace

[madlithuanian]

Re Idonije, I just don't think we'll fork over money for basically a back-up. Unless he's willing to work with the team.

 

Yeah, I meant Daniel Manning - thanks.

 

I think Idonije stays and Ogun is gone. Idonije has shown he has tons of value on ST and as a fill in all over the line.

 

Peace

[nfoligno]

Seriously, look at your own list. Are these players you really plan your offseason around? It is one thing when you have the likes of Briggs, Harris and/or players of similar caliber due to hit FA. But in this list, what do you have?

 

Wale - Here is a player who has under-performed. One of our worst aspects on defense has been our lack of pass rush, and Wale is part of the problem. From all reports, we are more looking to replace/upgrade here rather than try and re-sign or extend him.

 

DM - Looked solid as a nickel, but is he really a player you plan your offseason around? More to the point, is he a player you go conservative now because he will be a FA later? And is he really a player who will command a contract large enough to be a major hinderance today?

 

Anderson - Great rookie year, and then two flops seasons. He is a depth chart guy right now. Heck, I would argue he is not even a lock to make this years roster, much less be a player we reserve cap space looking at his future FA period.

 

Idonije - Another depth chart/reserve guy. If things go right, how much does he even see the field? IMHO, Idonije's main contribution comes into play if others fail. He is likely our #4/5 DT. As a DE, I am not sure where he really even fits in. Again, this is not a player we hold back on our current cap space for.

 

Orton - Here is the only example of a player we may have serious consideration for. I am not saying we will not re-sign any of the others, but I just do not think any of them are of such a level that we really factor today their future FA status. Orton is the exception, but is even he a player we have to reserve so much cap space as to go so conservative today when we have $34m in cap space?

 

You act like we are tight against the cap, and need to be conservative today in order to sign a bunch of our own players tomorrow. I would argue that (a) we have so much cap space today that we should not be so concerned w/ tomorrow and ( none of the players you list, especially those after Orton, are of such a level as to merit such consideration. You act like we have Briggs, Harris, Hester and Tillman hitting FA next year, but the reality is, we have so so so much less in terms of talent hitting FA next year.

 

As for your question, no, you don't spend money just to spend it. At the same time, I ask you. Are the FAs who are signing deals right now really so bad? You really don't think any of the FAs signing deals elsewhere could offer upgrades to this team?

 

Actually we have several players who will be FA after next yr. JA has a pattern of trying to lock those players up the year before. Obviously there are some that we are still waiting to see improvement before giving them money, however, they do have until somewhere around the end of October to use this yrs cap space.

 

Players who are FA after next yr:

 

- Ogy

- Manning Jr

- Anderson

- Orton

- Idoneje

 

You will most likely see 2 or 3 of these players extended with front loaded contracts if we do not use up most of the cap space by then.

 

The question I would ask you ask you: why spend money on FA just to spend it? Maybe JA and staff took a look at the FA and felt that none of the top players were worth the cost (i.e. the benefit from obtaining the players would not be worth the cost).

 

I know this based on their past behavior - the Bears will spend up to the cap. How they do that is the question.

 

Peace

[Connorbear]

You act like we are tight against the cap, and need to be conservative today in order to sign a bunch of our own players tomorrow. I would argue that (a) we have so much cap space today that we should not be so concerned w/ tomorrow and ( none of the players you list, especially those after Orton, are of such a level as to merit such consideration. You act like we have Briggs, Harris, Hester and Tillman hitting FA next year, but the reality is, we have so so so much less in terms of talent hitting FA next year.

 

As for your question, no, you don't spend money just to spend it. At the same time, I ask you. Are the FAs who are signing deals right now really so bad? You really don't think any of the FAs signing deals elsewhere could offer upgrades to this team?

 

First, I am not acting like anything. I am simply stating we do have free agents to consider. In the end, I see them extending Manning, Idonje, and Orton.

 

Sure I believe some of the FAs that are being signed could help the team. But my opinion doesn't matter here.

 

FA is fluid. Like I stated earlier, the market changed. 15 players were tagged and several others were signed before the market opened. Maybe Angelo was going to spend big money on one of those players. We will never know for sure.

 

Peace

[madlithuanian]

Connor, that's what this whole site is about! Your opinion matters!

 

But my opinion doesn't matter here.

[nfoligno]

First, I am not acting like anything. I am simply stating we do have free agents to consider. In the end, I see them extending Manning, Idonje, and Orton.

 

Hey, I can see us extending all three as well, but seriously, how much would all three combine to hit our cap? That's my point. Not that all mentioned players are as good as gone, but simply that they are not going to command the sort of money you need to really reserve future cap space for.

 

Sure I believe some of the FAs that are being signed could help the team. But my opinion doesn't matter here.

 

Actually, here is the only place your opinion does matter.

 

FA is fluid. Like I stated earlier, the market changed. 15 players were tagged and several others were signed before the market opened. Maybe Angelo was going to spend big money on one of those players. We will never know for sure.

 

As I have argued, the more shallow the pool gets, the less it makes sense to sit back and wait for the water to drain.

[Connorbear]

Sure I believe some of the FAs that are being signed could help the team. But my opinion doesn't matter here.

 

Actually, here is the only place your opinion does matter.

To clarify, I meant that the only opinion that really matters is that of Angelo and his staff.

 

Peace

[nfoligno]

I think we all know that, but what would be the value of this board if we all simply sat back and went along w/ (w/o question) whatever the staff did?

 

Lets go back a bit to an example of a coach few would support. Would you want a board that didn't allow fans to question the playcalling of John Shoop? It can easily be argued that our opinions didn't matter, and only the opinion of our staff did/does, but that would make for one boring message board.

 

A more recent example. Have you not questioned the lack of playing time given to Bennett? If your opinion doesn't matter, and ony the opinion of the staff does, what is the point of questioning his lack of playing time.

 

That was Mad's and my point. While in the real world, I think we all know our opinion doesn't matter, but that is the beauty of this board. here, at least we can pretend it does Here, we are all elite General Managers, talent evaluators and coaches.

 

To clarify, I meant that the only opinion that really matters is that of Angelo and his staff.

 

Peace

[madlithuanian]

 

 

 

I think we all know that, but what would be the value of this board if we all simply sat back and went along w/ (w/o question) whatever the staff did?

 

Lets go back a bit to an example of a coach few would support. Would you want a board that didn't allow fans to question the playcalling of John Shoop? It can easily be argued that our opinions didn't matter, and only the opinion of our staff did/does, but that would make for one boring message board.

 

A more recent example. Have you not questioned the lack of playing time given to Bennett? If your opinion doesn't matter, and ony the opinion of the staff does, what is the point of questioning his lack of playing time.

 

That was Mad's and my point. While in the real world, I think we all know our opinion doesn't matter, but that is the beauty of this board. here, at least we can pretend it does Here, we are all elite General Managers, talent evaluators and coaches.