DABEARSDABOMB Posted March 18, 2009 Report Share Posted March 18, 2009 Now that St. Clair is gone it looks like Omilaye will be the new starting right tackle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dawhizz Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 Just so I'm clear on the chain of events here: -The Bears offer John St. Clair, their starting LT the previous year and who has started 19 straight games, a three-year, $4.5 million contract to return to play RT and make it relatively clear he is their offseason priority. -St. Clair makes a counter offer. The Bears refuse to address it, allowing him to enter free agency. -The moment FA opens, the Bears sign Frank Omiyale, a former LT, to a contract which is worth between $11-14 million, with a $1.8 million signing bonus, a $6.3 million first year figure, and worth about $1.5-1.85 million in the subsequent years. The Bears immediately indicate he will play guard, that they are still pursing John St. Clair, and would have actually liked to sign St. Clair first, presumably because then moving Omiyale to guard makes more sense. This seems to indicate the Bears believe St. Clair to be a better RT than Omiyale. Angelo specifically says they don't want to hand Omiyale the starting job at tackle. -Several other starting-caliber free agent options at guard and tackle sign. The Bears appear to show no interest in a single one. -Mini-camp begins and despite the fact that St. Clair has shown no willingness to sign the Bears contract that has been hanging out there forever, the Bears line up Omiyale (who is making over $6 million this year) at SECOND TEAM LG. Your starting RT is Cody Balough. Says Omiyale, "I feel comfortable at tackle, but today I was a guard and it felt pretty good." Lovie Smith talks about the importance of letting guys "lock in" to a position. John St. Clair heads to Cleveland. -The next day, St. Clair visits and signs with the Browns for $9 million, a $2.85 million figure in the first year, and $1.25 million guaranteed, roughly double the contract the Bears initially offered (which it appears was never improved), and yet much less (at least initially) than the contract Omiyale signed. -One day later, the Bears announce that Omiyale will be moving to RT. "Tackle is more what I'm used to" says Omiyale. "We're trying to lock guys in," says Lovie. "It's hard enough learning a new system playing one position, so we'll lock him in there for a while and go." IMO, there's two ways to look at this: 1) The Bears are paying more money to a guy in Omiyale they view as a worse RT than St. Clair. What they said when they signed Omiyale was that they were putting him at guard because they anticipated St. Clair being back. Since we already know St. Clair can play and start at guard (he's done it before), if they thought Omiyale was the better RT, why not just sign him, say he's the starting RT, and say you want to bring in St. Clair to compete at guard and back up at the tackle positions? 2) The Bears were trying to screw St. Clair. Here's the diabolical plan: The Bears sign Omiyale and say he's locked in at LG to get St. Clair to return at RT by saying he gets a starting position. They induce St. Clair to sign a well-below-market contract for a starting RT, but he signs because he wants to start. Shortly thereafter, the Bears announce Omiyale "seems like a better fit at RT" and will compete with St. Clair. Omiyale wins the job (as they hoped he would) and St. Clair returns to a spot starter for spot starter salary he signed under the impression he would be a full-time starter at RT. Do I have that all right? I'm not necessarily saying how things worked out was horrible for the Bears (I thought Omiyale made much more sense at RT from the get-go). It just seems either dumb or shady. Maybe I'm just in a mood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearSox Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 This isn't really that big of a deal. We aren't going to go through all of minicamp with Balogh (sp???) as the starting RT. We're moving Omiyale to RT to get a better look from the OLine, and we'll adjust after the draft. THIS IS ONLY MINICAMP! Nothing is set into stone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Connorbear Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 This isn't really that big of a deal. We aren't going to go through all of minicamp with Balogh (sp???) as the starting RT. We're moving Omiyale to RT to get a better look from the OLine, and we'll adjust after the draft. THIS IS ONLY MINICAMP! Nothing is set into stone. Agreed. We are going to add some bodies in the draft. We'll see how this all shakes out by training camp. Peace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfoligno Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 History is essentially right, but I think there is another aspect of this. Angelo said all along we wanted St. Clair back, but did he ever say the starting RT job was simply his? I don't recall that. IMHO, what the contract we offered St. Clair reflects is that we do not view him as a legit or solid starter. He is a good backup, and that is the sort of money we offered him, but not the guy you want to enter the season as your starter. IMHO, our offer to St. clair makes me believe more than ever RT was also a high priority in the draft for Angelo, regardless of the St. Clair signing. If you want to gripe about the money given to Omiyale. Fine. If you want to gripe about our lack of interest in other OL FAs, get in line. But I just do not get the uproar over the loss of St. Clair. I swear to you that I wanted to blow the entire OL up. Kreutz included. It was never going to happen, but I have hope it will come damn close. Williams and Omiyale now on the left side (Omiyale was moved to RT for a mini-camp. Don't read too much into that). Kreutz will still play center. We will have a new RT (I want a 1st round rookie) and while Garza is the probably the favorite, he could find himself in a greater competition to keep the job. We most likely will have 3 new starters on the OL, and could have 4. I like that. The status quo stunk, and we needed major change. Just so I'm clear on the chain of events here: -The Bears offer John St. Clair, their starting LT the previous year and who has started 19 straight games, a three-year, $4.5 million contract to return to play RT and make it relatively clear he is their offseason priority. -St. Clair makes a counter offer. The Bears refuse to address it, allowing him to enter free agency. -The moment FA opens, the Bears sign Frank Omiyale, a former LT, to a contract which is worth between $11-14 million, with a $1.8 million signing bonus, a $6.3 million first year figure, and worth about $1.5-1.85 million in the subsequent years. The Bears immediately indicate he will play guard, that they are still pursing John St. Clair, and would have actually liked to sign St. Clair first, presumably because then moving Omiyale to guard makes more sense. This seems to indicate the Bears believe St. Clair to be a better RT than Omiyale. Angelo specifically says they don't want to hand Omiyale the starting job at tackle. -Several other starting-caliber free agent options at guard and tackle sign. The Bears appear to show no interest in a single one. -Mini-camp begins and despite the fact that St. Clair has shown no willingness to sign the Bears contract that has been hanging out there forever, the Bears line up Omiyale (who is making over $6 million this year) at SECOND TEAM LG. Your starting RT is Cody Balough. Says Omiyale, "I feel comfortable at tackle, but today I was a guard and it felt pretty good." Lovie Smith talks about the importance of letting guys "lock in" to a position. John St. Clair heads to Cleveland. -The next day, St. Clair visits and signs with the Browns for $9 million, a $2.85 million figure in the first year, and $1.25 million guaranteed, roughly double the contract the Bears initially offered (which it appears was never improved), and yet much less (at least initially) than the contract Omiyale signed. -One day later, the Bears announce that Omiyale will be moving to RT. "Tackle is more what I'm used to" says Omiyale. "We're trying to lock guys in," says Lovie. "It's hard enough learning a new system playing one position, so we'll lock him in there for a while and go." IMO, there's two ways to look at this: 1) The Bears are paying more money to a guy in Omiyale they view as a worse RT than St. Clair. What they said when they signed Omiyale was that they were putting him at guard because they anticipated St. Clair being back. Since we already know St. Clair can play and start at guard (he's done it before), if they thought Omiyale was the better RT, why not just sign him, say he's the starting RT, and say you want to bring in St. Clair to compete at guard and back up at the tackle positions? 2) The Bears were trying to screw St. Clair. Here's the diabolical plan: The Bears sign Omiyale and say he's locked in at LG to get St. Clair to return at RT by saying he gets a starting position. They induce St. Clair to sign a well-below-market contract for a starting RT, but he signs because he wants to start. Shortly thereafter, the Bears announce Omiyale "seems like a better fit at RT" and will compete with St. Clair. Omiyale wins the job (as they hoped he would) and St. Clair returns to a spot starter for spot starter salary he signed under the impression he would be a full-time starter at RT. Do I have that all right? I'm not necessarily saying how things worked out was horrible for the Bears (I thought Omiyale made much more sense at RT from the get-go). It just seems either dumb or shady. Maybe I'm just in a mood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradjock Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 I can't argue. Let me ask you this: Is there any better value at #18 then offensive-tackle? There is no safety, DE, or QB that is likely to be available worth drafting at that spot (although, can you imagine how pissed Bear fans will be if Sanchez is on the board and we pass???) As far as need goes, that leaves us taking an offensive-tackle or WR. If the o-line sucks, the WR's will also. So while Angelo said he didn't want to be forced into drafting an OT, for the 2nd year in a row, he's forced into drafting an OT. What are the odds of drafting two OT's in consecutive years that aren't busts? History is essentially right, but I think there is another aspect of this. Angelo said all along we wanted St. Clair back, but did he ever say the starting RT job was simply his? I don't recall that. IMHO, what the contract we offered St. Clair reflects is that we do not view him as a legit or solid starter. He is a good backup, and that is the sort of money we offered him, but not the guy you want to enter the season as your starter. IMHO, our offer to St. clair makes me believe more than ever RT was also a high priority in the draft for Angelo, regardless of the St. Clair signing. If you want to gripe about the money given to Omiyale. Fine. If you want to gripe about our lack of interest in other OL FAs, get in line. But I just do not get the uproar over the loss of St. Clair. I swear to you that I wanted to blow the entire OL up. Kreutz included. It was never going to happen, but I have hope it will come damn close. Williams and Omiyale now on the left side (Omiyale was moved to RT for a mini-camp. Don't read too much into that). Kreutz will still play center. We will have a new RT (I want a 1st round rookie) and while Garza is the probably the favorite, he could find himself in a greater competition to keep the job. We most likely will have 3 new starters on the OL, and could have 4. I like that. The status quo stunk, and we needed major change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfoligno Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 I can't argue. Let me ask you this: Is there any better value at #18 then offensive-tackle? There is no safety, DE, or QB that is likely to be available worth drafting at that spot (although, can you imagine how pissed Bear fans will be if Sanchez is on the board and we pass???) If that question is to me, I would say it is OT followed by WR. If that question is to Angelo, I am sure there will be some small school DE he likes Honestly though, at this point, I am having a very hard time seeing us walk away from the first w/o one of: Oher, Britton, DHB, Nicks. There may be value at other positions, but none are high needs. Some might argue CB, but Angelo said a reason we were moving Bowman to FS was for a greater chance to make the roster due to the depth we have. So I just feel it has to be OT/WR, and find it hard to see one of the above four not being the pick. And while I think there is a chance for a WR, I still think it has to be RT. Like you say below. If your OL sucks, your WRs are not going to do much. Turner flat out said he was forced to limit Orton to 3 step drops last year to keep him from getting killed. Um, how great can a WR be when the QB has pressure nearly immediate? As far as need goes, that leaves us taking an offensive-tackle or WR. If the o-line sucks, the WR's will also. So while Angelo said he didn't want to be forced into drafting an OT, for the 2nd year in a row, he's forced into drafting an OT. Honestly, this is my dream scenario. I was hoping we would not re-sign SC, and got my wish. W/ SC, I just feared we would drop OL on our need list, but that would be a pure mirage. W/ or w/o SC, OL was a massive need. Now, w/ the weakness we have at RT and the OL as a whole, I think it very likely we draft a RT in the 1st, and we might even follow that up w/ another OL by the 4th. What are the odds of drafting two OT's in consecutive years that aren't busts? I don't even want to think about that, but (a) as pointed out before, the odds are better w/ OT than most any other position and ( what are the odds the WR Angelo drafts develops into a star? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'TD' Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 If we thought last years line was going to be bad, I'm scared of the thought of next years. It's likely that 3 basically rookies could be starting on the line in Williams, Omiyale, and the rookie that's likely going to be drafted. It's also possible Garza will lose his job, rightfully so imho, so that's possibley 4 starters with little to no experience at the professional level. It's sucks for Orton in a contract year, Forte, and the fans that the OL is in the state it is in, no matter how necessary the change is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Connorbear Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 If we thought last years line was going to be bad, I'm scared of the thought of next years. It's likely that 3 basically rookies could be starting on the line in Williams, Omiyale, and the rookie that's likely going to be drafted. It's also possible Garza will lose his job, rightfully so imho, so that's possibley 4 starters with little to no experience at the professional level. It's sucks for Orton in a contract year, Forte, and the fans that the OL is in the state it is in, no matter how necessary the change is. You're right - this could be bad. However, our o-line was getting old and we needed to rebuild it. Would have helped if Tait would have played one more yr but it is what it is. Peace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wesson44 Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 You're right - this could be bad. However, our o-line was getting old and we needed to rebuild it. Would have helped if Tait would have played one more yr but it is what it is. Peace Its not going to be as bad as you think. Williams will be the LT, Kruetz at C and the fight is on between Garza and Buening at RG(note Garza sucked last year)Ominyale will be either LG or RT and if we get a FA RT and draft one we will be fine. LT Williams LG Ominyale/Beekman C Kruetz/Beekman RG Buening/Garza RT Ominyale/FA/Draft pick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'TD' Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 Its not going to be as bad as you think. Williams will be the LT, Kruetz at C and the fight is on between Garza and Buening at RG(note Garza sucked last year)Ominyale will be either LG or RT and if we get a FA RT and draft one we will be fine. LT Williams LG Ominyale/Beekman C Kruetz/Beekman RG Buening/Garza RT Ominyale/FA/Draft pick It might end up being alright, but it has major potential for disaster. I really don't think there is a FA RT (fart) available that will be much of a factor. I would think they would most likely have been scooped up by now. Williams, Ominayale, and who ever is being brought in as a rookie(s) will all be huge unknowns and still learning the game as they play. Buening is coming off a major injury that has had him sidelined for quite a while. He has one years experience and the spot duty he had for the Bears for last year. Beekman is subpar and is still young. It seems the team decided to plan around him, instead of starting him with the addition of Ominyale. Garza just sucks. I'm not saying it will fail, it's just a possible recipe for disaster. The team really failed in their preperation for the line. It's hard for any line to do an almost complete overhaul in a year or 2. Players need time to gel together and there's alot of inexperience likely starting for the team. LT Williams (Rookie) LG Ominyale/Bruening(Basically rookie/ basically 2nd year player due to injury that hasn't played much in 3 years) C Kruetz/Beekman (best OL on the team most likely/only matters here if Kruetz is injured) RG Bruenning/Garza(see above/ a player that needs replaced) RT Ominyale/unnamed FA/1st or 2nd round draftee(basically a rookie/probably junk/ a rookie) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfoligno Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 I think we can expect our OL to go through some struggles early on, but improve as the season goes along, and we may even see solid play by the end. I think this is what happened w/ GB a few years ago when they were loaded w/ youth and inexperience on the OL. Not a good start, but a great finish. W/ that said, this could be a year Kreutz earns his money. He may not be the player he was, but he is still an unquestioned leader. Further, you can bet the younger OL will truly look up to him and follow his lead. It might end up being alright, but it has major potential for disaster. I really don't think there is a FA RT (fart) available that will be much of a factor. I would think they would most likely have been scooped up by now. Williams, Ominayale, and who ever is being brought in as a rookie(s) will all be huge unknowns and still learning the game as they play. Buening is coming off a major injury that has had him sidelined for quite a while. He has one years experience and the spot duty he had for the Bears for last year. Beekman is subpar and is still young. It seems the team decided to plan around him, instead of starting him with the addition of Ominyale. Garza just sucks. I'm not saying it will fail, it's just a possible recipe for disaster. The team really failed in their preperation for the line. It's hard for any line to do an almost complete overhaul in a year or 2. Players need time to gel together and there's alot of inexperience likely starting for the team. LT Williams (Rookie) LG Ominyale/Bruening(Basically rookie/ basically 2nd year player due to injury that hasn't played much in 3 years) C Kruetz/Beekman (best OL on the team most likely/only matters here if Kruetz is injured) RG Bruenning/Garza(see above/ a player that needs replaced) RT Ominyale/unnamed FA/1st or 2nd round draftee(basically a rookie/probably junk/ a rookie) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger226 Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 Just so I'm clear on the chain of events here: -The Bears offer John St. Clair, their starting LT the previous year and who has started 19 straight games, a three-year, $4.5 million contract to return to play RT and make it relatively clear he is their offseason priority. -St. Clair makes a counter offer. The Bears refuse to address it, allowing him to enter free agency. -The moment FA opens, the Bears sign Frank Omiyale, a former LT, to a contract which is worth between $11-14 million, with a $1.8 million signing bonus, a $6.3 million first year figure, and worth about $1.5-1.85 million in the subsequent years. The Bears immediately indicate he will play guard, that they are still pursing John St. Clair, and would have actually liked to sign St. Clair first, presumably because then moving Omiyale to guard makes more sense. This seems to indicate the Bears believe St. Clair to be a better RT than Omiyale. Angelo specifically says they don't want to hand Omiyale the starting job at tackle. -Several other starting-caliber free agent options at guard and tackle sign. The Bears appear to show no interest in a single one. -Mini-camp begins and despite the fact that St. Clair has shown no willingness to sign the Bears contract that has been hanging out there forever, the Bears line up Omiyale (who is making over $6 million this year) at SECOND TEAM LG. Your starting RT is Cody Balough. Says Omiyale, "I feel comfortable at tackle, but today I was a guard and it felt pretty good." Lovie Smith talks about the importance of letting guys "lock in" to a position. John St. Clair heads to Cleveland. -The next day, St. Clair visits and signs with the Browns for $9 million, a $2.85 million figure in the first year, and $1.25 million guaranteed, roughly double the contract the Bears initially offered (which it appears was never improved), and yet much less (at least initially) than the contract Omiyale signed. -One day later, the Bears announce that Omiyale will be moving to RT. "Tackle is more what I'm used to" says Omiyale. "We're trying to lock guys in," says Lovie. "It's hard enough learning a new system playing one position, so we'll lock him in there for a while and go." IMO, there's two ways to look at this: 1) The Bears are paying more money to a guy in Omiyale they view as a worse RT than St. Clair. What they said when they signed Omiyale was that they were putting him at guard because they anticipated St. Clair being back. Since we already know St. Clair can play and start at guard (he's done it before), if they thought Omiyale was the better RT, why not just sign him, say he's the starting RT, and say you want to bring in St. Clair to compete at guard and back up at the tackle positions? 2) The Bears were trying to screw St. Clair. Here's the diabolical plan: The Bears sign Omiyale and say he's locked in at LG to get St. Clair to return at RT by saying he gets a starting position. They induce St. Clair to sign a well-below-market contract for a starting RT, but he signs because he wants to start. Shortly thereafter, the Bears announce Omiyale "seems like a better fit at RT" and will compete with St. Clair. Omiyale wins the job (as they hoped he would) and St. Clair returns to a spot starter for spot starter salary he signed under the impression he would be a full-time starter at RT. Do I have that all right? I'm not necessarily saying how things worked out was horrible for the Bears (I thought Omiyale made much more sense at RT from the get-go). It just seems either dumb or shady. Maybe I'm just in a mood. My take on all of this they view Omilyale as a starter and put him at LG in case Williams doesnt pan out. Kind of a insurance policy for LT. They will bring in another guy to play RT and also draft one. There are a lot of mistakes this regime has made with personal but think they scored on Omilyale and only need this year so we know that was a good pick. They planned on using SC as the starter this year and draft a RT and then the next two years SC was our swing tackle. Its all ok, I wanted him back but they will find someone and still draft a guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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