Hester

[Ed Hochuli 3:16]

Besides everything, he looked fantastic. IIRC, he caught every pass thrown his way. 4 catches for 90 yards + a TD is mighty impressive. Also, he didn't look confused. If he stays healthy, he's going to top 1100 yards and 7 TD's.

[adam]

I thought he looked great. He had a nice one on one move against Woodson that was sweet. I am just wondering if it would be better if he just stopped doing returns altogether.

[bowlingtwig]

I thought he looked great. He had a nice one on one move against Woodson that was sweet. I am just wondering if it would be better if he just stopped doing returns altogether.

I even saw an improvement though with him returning kicks. Yes he is still dancing around and trying to make something out of nothing, however he never actually lost yards, which is an improvement.

[SuperFan34]

Besides everything, he looked fantastic. IIRC, he caught every pass thrown his way. 4 catches for 90 yards + a TD is mighty impressive. Also, he didn't look confused. If he stays healthy, he's going to top 1100 yards and 7 TD's.

 

All the media morons want to talk about how Hester is too stupid to play WR, how he doesn't know how to make the right adjustments and so on. But last night, he was the only Bears receiver who consistently looked like he knew what he was doing.

[DABEARSDABOMB]

But did anyone notice how when Cutler needed to throw a ball, he rarely looked at Hester. I thought Hester played great, but the two need to do whatever it takes to ultimately get on the same page because Hester will be the WR most likely to get open as he is just so stinking fast.

 

Bennett definitely grew during the game though. Boy would I love to have Isaac Bruce or someone like that though. You think we could make a deal with the Niners for a veteran like that who could really help our young WR's and give Cutler a crafty vet to look at.

[balta1701-A]

But did anyone notice how when Cutler needed to throw a ball, he rarely looked at Hester. I thought Hester played great, but the two need to do whatever it takes to ultimately get on the same page because Hester will be the WR most likely to get open as he is just so stinking fast.

 

Bennett definitely grew during the game though. Boy would I love to have Isaac Bruce or someone like that though. You think we could make a deal with the Niners for a veteran like that who could really help our young WR's and give Cutler a crafty vet to look at.

OTOH, isn't Green Bay in general one of those few places in the NFL where you can genuinely expect that your #1 receiver isn't going to get a whole lot of looks, just because of the quality of cornerbacks they have to put on your top guy? That's always what people said about Champ Bailey in his prime, and Charles Woodson and Al Harris are pretty highly thought of, although I didn't see enough of the game to genuinely say whether that was a factor.

[nfoligno]

I think the key issue for Hester is still route running. Yea, he can get open on a deep go route, but that takes time to develop, and how often did you see Cutler sitting there with time. The other route that actually looks good for Hester is the WR screen. It rarely works for us, but w/ Hester, it can.

 

I have always said, I believe a key reason we suck at the WR screen is DBs have no respect for our WRs, and thus press cover. Its is damn hard to run a screen when the DB starts out on top of the WR. On the other hand, WR screens often work well against us because we line up our DBs 8-10 yards off the LOS, thus the WR can not only make the catch, but has space to make a play and run. Of all our receivers, Hester is the only one who sometimes isn't pressed on the LOS and thus has the potential to make something happen on such a play.

 

Anyway, I think Hester struggles otherwise. His route running simply isn't crisp, thus he sort of negates his own speed.

 

But did anyone notice how when Cutler needed to throw a ball, he rarely looked at Hester. I thought Hester played great, but the two need to do whatever it takes to ultimately get on the same page because Hester will be the WR most likely to get open as he is just so stinking fast.

 

Bennett definitely grew during the game though. Boy would I love to have Isaac Bruce or someone like that though. You think we could make a deal with the Niners for a veteran like that who could really help our young WR's and give Cutler a crafty vet to look at.

 

[DABEARSDABOMB]

I think the key issue for Hester is still route running. Yea, he can get open on a deep go route, but that takes time to develop, and how often did you see Cutler sitting there with time. The other route that actually looks good for Hester is the WR screen. It rarely works for us, but w/ Hester, it can.

 

I have always said, I believe a key reason we suck at the WR screen is DBs have no respect for our WRs, and thus press cover. Its is damn hard to run a screen when the DB starts out on top of the WR. On the other hand, WR screens often work well against us because we line up our DBs 8-10 yards off the LOS, thus the WR can not only make the catch, but has space to make a play and run. Of all our receivers, Hester is the only one who sometimes isn't pressed on the LOS and thus has the potential to make something happen on such a play.

 

Anyway, I think Hester struggles otherwise. His route running simply isn't crisp, thus he sort of negates his own speed.

Just from looking at the replays, it looked like Hester was open on a good number of plays and seemed to be doing a much better job running routes and trying to help his QB. Clearly though, Cutler has known Bennett for longer and will look at to him right now but I really hope we see Hester develop that rappore as well.

 

And ultimately I'd still like to see the club bring in another very good WR as well and in the future we could have a corps of Bennett, Hester, Knox, another good WR and that would be a nice corp's in time, imo.

[DABEARSDABOMB]

It is too bad Plax got all that jail time cause he really would have been the perfect fit.

[jason]

I don't care about bringing in a vet at this point. You let the guys you have on the roster learn. Period.

 

The Bears have had decent WRs over the last ten years or so, but the combination of bad/average QBs, bad/average OCs, bad/average OLs, and the reluctancy of the coaching staff to give the young guys playing time has resulted in a bunch of young WRs who have not met expectations.

 

Hester, Bennett, Knox, and the two TEs should be sufficient.

[DABEARSDABOMB]

I don't care about bringing in a vet at this point. You let the guys you have on the roster learn. Period.

 

The Bears have had decent WRs over the last ten years or so, but the combination of bad/average QBs, bad/average OCs, bad/average OLs, and the reluctancy of the coaching staff to give the young guys playing time has resulted in a bunch of young WRs who have not met expectations.

 

Hester, Bennett, Knox, and the two TEs should be sufficient.

The Bears have not had decent WR's over the past 10 years. They had one star, Marcus Robinson, who got hurt immediately after becoming a star and two good WRs (Marty Booker and Bernard Berrian). Thats it. Other than that they've had nothing and over the past ten years have arguably had the worse WR corps in the NFL.

 

Heck the 4th best WR in the past 10 years is probably Justin Gage (and he did nothing while in Chicago) (I'm not counting Engram because I don't believe he was on the Bears anytime during the past 10 years). Boddy Wade would be the 5th best and he's out of a job and was only getting the reps he was because he was on a Vikings team that had a very shitty WR corps.

[bowlingtwig]

The Bears have not had decent WR's over the past 10 years. They had one star, Marcus Robinson, who got hurt immediately after becoming a star and two good WRs (Marty Booker and Bernard Berrian). Thats it. Other than that they've had nothing and over the past ten years have arguably had the worse WR corps in the NFL.

 

Heck the 4th best WR in the past 10 years is probably Justin Gage (and he did nothing while in Chicago) (I'm not counting Engram because I don't believe he was on the Bears anytime during the past 10 years). Boddy Wade would be the 5th best and he's out of a job and was only getting the reps he was because he was on a Vikings team that had a very shitty WR corps.

This past game Berrian didn't even catch a ball to further your point.

[AZ54]

Knox is not ready for prime time but I do like getting him some reps in the game. The guy I'd like to get on the field is DA. He's a bigger WR and should be better suited for the quick slants against press coverage. I think we only had 4 WR on the active roster so the coaches would have to decide between Knox or Davis. I vote for the future.

[BearFan2000]

The Bears have not had decent WR's over the past 10 years. They had one star, Marcus Robinson, who got hurt immediately after becoming a star and two good WRs (Marty Booker and Bernard Berrian). Thats it. Other than that they've had nothing and over the past ten years have arguably had the worse WR corps in the NFL.

 

Heck the 4th best WR in the past 10 years is probably Justin Gage (and he did nothing while in Chicago) (I'm not counting Engram because I don't believe he was on the Bears anytime during the past 10 years). Boddy Wade would be the 5th best and he's out of a job and was only getting the reps he was because he was on a Vikings team that had a very shitty WR corps.

 

We've also had some of the worst QBing over that stretch of time and beyond as well. With the exception of a few flashes of competency. Yes Sunday looked absolutely awful from a QB/WR standpoint Jays body of work indicates that he's better than he showed and he did settle down as the game went on which is a big difference from Rex if Rex had had that kind of first half start he'd have found a way to do worse in the second half with him when he hit rock bottom he began to dig. The positive I take from that game is that Jay calmed down and took back control of his game and didn't let it continue to get away from him. As ugly as things got he put us in a position to win. We were a blown coverage away from possibly leaving GB with a win. But I also don't blame the D for the loss as they held a potent GB offense in check for most of the game and as an offense that's all you can ask. The offense just needs to step up their game from coaching all the way down to the execution on the field. The line needs to do it's job, Jay needs to trust his line to give him time and make his reads, WR's need to run their full route at least two of the picks were caused by a WR stopping his route. People will only remember that Jay threw 4 picks not that at least two of them were not his fault. The mistakes that are happening are chemistry and timing mistakes. Fortunately those things should diminish with time and the passing game should improve. There were a lot of drops as well.

 

Hester did look the best of the WR's out there. He had a solid game. As Bolingtwig mentioned he did a better job in the return game as well, no big plays but he didn't lose yards and didn't attempt to field the punts inside the 10 like he did before he let them go.

[ParkerBear7]

I don't care about bringing in a vet at this point. You let the guys you have on the roster learn. Period.

 

The Bears have had decent WRs over the last ten years or so, but the combination of bad/average QBs, bad/average OCs, bad/average OLs, and the reluctancy of the coaching staff to give the young guys playing time has resulted in a bunch of young WRs who have not met expectations.

 

Hester, Bennett, Knox, and the two TEs should be sufficient.

 

 

I agree with Jason on this one. You have to let these kids play to be developed and will make the Bears a much better team for the long term. Not sure anyone on the street will help at this point as they are way behind on learning the plays as well as cheminstry needed to be a difference maker.

[jason]

The Bears have not had decent WR's over the past 10 years. They had one star, Marcus Robinson, who got hurt immediately after becoming a star and two good WRs (Marty Booker and Bernard Berrian). Thats it. Other than that they've had nothing and over the past ten years have arguably had the worse WR corps in the NFL.

 

Heck the 4th best WR in the past 10 years is probably Justin Gage (and he did nothing while in Chicago) (I'm not counting Engram because I don't believe he was on the Bears anytime during the past 10 years). Boddy Wade would be the 5th best and he's out of a job and was only getting the reps he was because he was on a Vikings team that had a very shitty WR corps.

 

Decent Star

 

2008: Hester, Olsen, Davis, Clark

2007: Berrian, MuhMuh, Olsen, Davis, Bradley, Clark

2006: Berrian, MuhMuh, Gage, Bradley, Davis, Clark

2005: Berrian, MuhMuh, Gage, Bradley, Wade, Clark

2004: Berrian, Terrell, Gage, Wade, Clark

2003: Booker, Terrell, Gage, Wade, Clark

2002: Booker, MRob, Terrell, White

2001: Booker, MRob, Terrell, White

2000: Booker, MRob, White, Kennison, Engram

1999: Booker, MRob, Engram, Conway

 

I'd say that's better than decent, actually. Several were underused (MuhMuh, Clark, Olsen, Terrell, Gage). A few went on to have success after the Bears (Booker, MuhMuh, Wade, Gage, Kennison, Engram, Bradley), and in most cases improvements. It's nearly impossible to intelligently argue that the Bears haven't had opportunities to use players at the WR and TE position, yet have failed miserably to do so. Go look at each WRs careers, and their stats outside of the Bears, and I think you'll find a compelling argument that there has been talent; it has just been mismanaged. Every player on the list, other than Terrell, has done better in at least one way, when they were with another team other than the Bears. I'm nearly positive of this.

 

The Bears haven't had Rice and Taylor by a long shot, but they also haven't had the dearth of talent you and many others like to pretend they have had. It's as I said before: HC, OC, QB, OL...one (or more) of the four ruined the opportunities the Bears have had to cultivate WRs and TEs.

[jason]

This past game Berrian didn't even catch a ball to further your point.

 

One game is not very statistically significant.

 

In four years with the Bears, Berrian had 2.6 RPG, 37.9 YPG, 14.6 YPC, and 13 TDs.

In the two years he started, the stats were 3.9 RPG, 55.55 YPG, 14.3 YPC, and 11 TDs.

In the one year he has started for Minnesota, he had 3.0 RPG, 60.3 YPG, 20.1 YPC, and 7 TDs.

 

In all but Receptions Per Game he improved while on the Vikings, who are just as much a running team as the Bears, and have such bad WRs - as DBDB pointed out - that a castoff from the Bears (Wade) started for more than one game, let alone more than one year. Add to that is the QB comparison, in which the Bears might actually have an advantage during the last few years.

 

Sorry, but Berrian's stats, which are admittedly only one year, only prove my point that the Bears don't utilize their WRs to their fullest potential...not the other way around.

[DABEARSDABOMB]

Decent Star

 

2008: Hester, Olsen, Davis, Clark

2007: Berrian, MuhMuh, Olsen, Davis, Bradley, Clark

2006: Berrian, MuhMuh, Gage, Bradley, Davis, Clark

2005: Berrian, MuhMuh, Gage, Bradley, Wade, Clark

2004: Berrian, Terrell, Gage, Wade, Clark

2003: Booker, Terrell, Gage, Wade, Clark

2002: Booker, MRob, Terrell, White

2001: Booker, MRob, Terrell, White

2000: Booker, MRob, White, Kennison, Engram

1999: Booker, MRob, Engram, Conway

 

I'd say that's better than decent, actually. Several were underused (MuhMuh, Clark, Olsen, Terrell, Gage). A few went on to have success after the Bears (Booker, MuhMuh, Wade, Gage, Kennison, Engram, Bradley), and in most cases improvements. It's nearly impossible to intelligently argue that the Bears haven't had opportunities to use players at the WR and TE position, yet have failed miserably to do so. Go look at each WRs careers, and their stats outside of the Bears, and I think you'll find a compelling argument that there has been talent; it has just been mismanaged. Every player on the list, other than Terrell, has done better in at least one way, when they were with another team other than the Bears. I'm nearly positive of this.

 

The Bears haven't had Rice and Taylor by a long shot, but they also haven't had the dearth of talent you and many others like to pretend they have had. It's as I said before: HC, OC, QB, OL...one (or more) of the four ruined the opportunities the Bears have had to cultivate WRs and TEs.

None of what you are selling me jumps off the page. Those guys are the definition of retreads. Eddie Kennison put up big numbers in a spread type of offense . Wade and Gage haven't been very good and Booker was not near as good outside of CHicago as he was inside. Bobby Engram was rock solid when he left and Terrell underused?

 

Terrell went to plenty of places where WR's have excelled and never did anything near what he did in Chicago (which was pretty much butkus). That list you rolled off is the definition of below average WR's.

[DABEARSDABOMB]

One game is not very statistically significant.

 

In four years with the Bears, Berrian had 2.6 RPG, 37.9 YPG, 14.6 YPC, and 13 TDs.

In the two years he started, the stats were 3.9 RPG, 55.55 YPG, 14.3 YPC, and 11 TDs.

In the one year he has started for Minnesota, he had 3.0 RPG, 60.3 YPG, 20.1 YPC, and 7 TDs.

 

In all but Receptions Per Game he improved while on the Vikings, who are just as much a running team as the Bears, and have such bad WRs - as DBDB pointed out - that a castoff from the Bears (Wade) started for more than one game, let alone more than one year. Add to that is the QB comparison, in which the Bears might actually have an advantage during the last few years.

 

Sorry, but Berrian's stats, which are admittedly only one year, only prove my point that the Bears don't utilize their WRs to their fullest potential...not the other way around.

 

Berrian's stats were very similar between Minny and Chicago so I'm not quite sure I understand what your saying? The Bears flat out developed Berrian and unfortunately let him walk (I was the one screaming to put the tag on him because of the lack of anything else at the WR position).

[nfoligno]

While I would agree w/ the statement that we have not been able to maximize the potential of our WRs, at the same time, I would also question just how great that potential was.

 

For some time, we have lacked consistency on the OL, and our QB situation is well known. When you can not put together a solid OL and your QB is average at best, you are simply not going to get full utilization out of your WR.

 

With that said, lets not pretend we have had pro bowl WRs who simply were not used in Chicago.

 

One game is not very statistically significant.

 

In four years with the Bears, Berrian had 2.6 RPG, 37.9 YPG, 14.6 YPC, and 13 TDs.

In the two years he started, the stats were 3.9 RPG, 55.55 YPG, 14.3 YPC, and 11 TDs.

In the one year he has started for Minnesota, he had 3.0 RPG, 60.3 YPG, 20.1 YPC, and 7 TDs.

 

In all but Receptions Per Game he improved while on the Vikings, who are just as much a running team as the Bears, and have such bad WRs - as DBDB pointed out - that a castoff from the Bears (Wade) started for more than one game, let alone more than one year. Add to that is the QB comparison, in which the Bears might actually have an advantage during the last few years.

 

Sorry, but Berrian's stats, which are admittedly only one year, only prove my point that the Bears don't utilize their WRs to their fullest potential...not the other way around.

 

[nfoligno]

I like a point made in an article I read. Cutler is working hard right now to build chemistry w/ his current group of WRs. Adding a new WR who he has no PT w/ is only going to hinder that process.

 

We have a young and inexperienced, but talented, group of receivers. While it is nice to believe this group of WRs and Cutler will play on a high level from day one, that is also unrealistic. We are going to see some inconsistency early on, but the hope/belief is, as the season goes on, we will see more chemistry, development and improved play.

 

By seasons end, I think we will find that we have some pretty solid WRs on the roster.

 

I agree with Jason on this one. You have to let these kids play to be developed and will make the Bears a much better team for the long term. Not sure anyone on the street will help at this point as they are way behind on learning the plays as well as cheminstry needed to be a difference maker.

 

[jason]

None of what you are selling me jumps off the page. Those guys are the definition of retreads. Eddie Kennison put up big numbers in a spread type of offense . Wade and Gage haven't been very good and Booker was not near as good outside of CHicago as he was inside. Bobby Engram was rock solid when he left and Terrell underused?

 

Terrell went to plenty of places where WR's have excelled and never did anything near what he did in Chicago (which was pretty much butkus). That list you rolled off is the definition of below average WR's.

 

The argument was that the Bears have had decent WRs over the past decade. You said otherwise. It doesn't have to "jump off the page" to be decent. Simply put, I proved you wrong. Nobody said the Bears had a team full of allstars at WR, but they have had a decent group of WRs who have been mismanaged and underutilized. You can argue semantics all you want, but the guys I mentioned, with the exception of Terrell, have gone on to success elsewhere in the NFL, and have collectively done better than when they were with the Bears.

 

Kennison - Horribly underutilized on the Bears, did better before AND after.

Wade - Did better when not on the Bears.

Gage - Hell, he didn't even get PT when he was on the Bears, and now he's the Titans' #1 WR.

Terrell - I don't know where you are getting this "plenty of places" crap, but it just didn't happen. And I still hold to the belief that he was underutilized, and stuck behind Dez "Stone Hands" White for no reason other than the apparent fact that the coaches at the time loved Dez White during practice, despite the absolute fact he sucked when in the game.

Engram - Agreed, he was rock solid, and remains so. He's put up comparable numbers in Seattle, and had a huge year just two years ago.

 

Booker - He remains the single WR of the group that goes against the grain. He was one of my favorites when on the Bears, but somehow he has aged in dog years since leaving Chicago.

 

Berrian's stats were very similar between Minny and Chicago so I'm not quite sure I understand what your saying? The Bears flat out developed Berrian and unfortunately let him walk (I was the one screaming to put the tag on him because of the lack of anything else at the WR position).

 

The point I'm making is, regardless of whether or not the stats are "similar," Berrian had a better year statistically with the Vikings. And, remember, you said the Vikings problems at WR were the only reason Wade got to start/play. They were THAT bad.

[jason]

While I would agree w/ the statement that we have not been able to maximize the potential of our WRs, at the same time, I would also question just how great that potential was.

 

For some time, we have lacked consistency on the OL, and our QB situation is well known. When you can not put together a solid OL and your QB is average at best, you are simply not going to get full utilization out of your WR.

 

With that said, lets not pretend we have had pro bowl WRs who simply were not used in Chicago.

 

Hence my previous statement:

 

"The Bears haven't had Rice and Taylor by a long shot, but they also haven't had the dearth of talent you and many others like to pretend they have had. It's as I said before: HC, OC, QB, OL...one (or more) of the four ruined the opportunities the Bears have had to cultivate WRs and TEs. "

 

[DABEARSDABOMB]

The argument was that the Bears have had decent WRs over the past decade. You said otherwise. It doesn't have to "jump off the page" to be decent. Simply put, I proved you wrong. Nobody said the Bears had a team full of allstars at WR, but they have had a decent group of WRs who have been mismanaged and underutilized. You can argue semantics all you want, but the guys I mentioned, with the exception of Terrell, have gone on to success elsewhere in the NFL, and have collectively done better than when they were with the Bears.

 

Kennison - Horribly underutilized on the Bears, did better before AND after.

Wade - Did better when not on the Bears.

Gage - Hell, he didn't even get PT when he was on the Bears, and now he's the Titans' #1 WR.

Terrell - I don't know where you are getting this "plenty of places" crap, but it just didn't happen. And I still hold to the belief that he was underutilized, and stuck behind Dez "Stone Hands" White for no reason other than the apparent fact that the coaches at the time loved Dez White during practice, despite the absolute fact he sucked when in the game.

Engram - Agreed, he was rock solid, and remains so. He's put up comparable numbers in Seattle, and had a huge year just two years ago.

 

Booker - He remains the single WR of the group that goes against the grain. He was one of my favorites when on the Bears, but somehow he has aged in dog years since leaving Chicago.

 

 

 

The point I'm making is, regardless of whether or not the stats are "similar," Berrian had a better year statistically with the Vikings. And, remember, you said the Vikings problems at WR were the only reason Wade got to start/play. They were THAT bad.

Those guys were #2-#4's everywhere else. The Bears looked at them to be #1's. That is the definition of crap. You didn't prove me wrong.

[DABEARSDABOMB]

The argument was that the Bears have had decent WRs over the past decade. You said otherwise. It doesn't have to "jump off the page" to be decent. Simply put, I proved you wrong. Nobody said the Bears had a team full of allstars at WR, but they have had a decent group of WRs who have been mismanaged and underutilized. You can argue semantics all you want, but the guys I mentioned, with the exception of Terrell, have gone on to success elsewhere in the NFL, and have collectively done better than when they were with the Bears.

 

Kennison - Horribly underutilized on the Bears, did better before AND after.

Wade - Did better when not on the Bears.

Gage - Hell, he didn't even get PT when he was on the Bears, and now he's the Titans' #1 WR.

Terrell - I don't know where you are getting this "plenty of places" crap, but it just didn't happen. And I still hold to the belief that he was underutilized, and stuck behind Dez "Stone Hands" White for no reason other than the apparent fact that the coaches at the time loved Dez White during practice, despite the absolute fact he sucked when in the game.

Engram - Agreed, he was rock solid, and remains so. He's put up comparable numbers in Seattle, and had a huge year just two years ago.

 

Booker - He remains the single WR of the group that goes against the grain. He was one of my favorites when on the Bears, but somehow he has aged in dog years since leaving Chicago.

 

 

 

The point I'm making is, regardless of whether or not the stats are "similar," Berrian had a better year statistically with the Vikings. And, remember, you said the Vikings problems at WR were the only reason Wade got to start/play. They were THAT bad.

When I referred to Wade, I was talking about the years prior to them picking up Berrian. Notice now a year into Berrian's days (along with the drafting of Percy Harvin) he's now out of a job.

 

The Bears WR's have been bad, very bad. Are some serviceable #2-#4's sure, but having a guy thats a #3 most anywhere else be our #1 is the definition of a bad WR corps.