Why we lost this game!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Wesson44]

IMHO and i have said this ever since we have gotten Ron Turner that we lose because of the plays he call or doesn't call. Prime example we are in the RED ZONE three times and you never used OLSEN ..not one time on a mismatch. Better yet why not the 6'7 DAVIS. The run up the middle never got much so why not use the play action pass to Forte/McKie in the flat. Maybe the bootleg to Olsen instead of Clark.. During the game when the Packer were coming after Cutler...where was the dump off to Forte?And for those of you who say its Cutler and the defense that lost this game.....think about this. The Packers were deep in the red zone once and that was the int run back. Other than the long pass play the defense was great! Even with the likes of #54 and #59 out at LB.Despite the Packers coming all out, we moved the ball into the red zone three times without scoring a TD thats why we lost!!!

[Mongo3451]

we moved the ball into the red zone three times without scoring a TD thats why we lost!!!

 

Nuf said. It was a team effort on offense, suffice it to say. Turner could have called perfect play after perfect play and someone could have screwed it up. It was the entire offense that failed to get it done and we'll never know the culprit. Guarantee film has been reviewed extensively and only the staff and team will ever know the extent of individual failure.

[jason]

And for those of you who say its Cutler and the defense that lost this game

 

Anyone blaming the D for losing this game, well, obviously didn't watch the game.

[CrackerDog]

I agree 110%. I firmly place the blame on Turner and to a certain extent Lovie because it's his team. The other alternative is to believe Cutler sucks and I'm not willing to believe that based on his prior performances. Turner is capable of turning a silk purse into a sow's ear. If this continues, he needs to go. And fast!

[bowlingtwig]

IMHO and i have said this ever since we have gotten Ron Turner that we lose because of the plays he call or doesn't call. Prime example we are in the RED ZONE three times and you never used OLSEN ..not one time on a mismatch. Better yet why not the 6'7 DAVIS. The run up the middle never got much so why not use the play action pass to Forte/McKie in the flat. Maybe the bootleg to Olsen instead of Clark.. During the game when the Packer were coming after Cutler...where was the dump off to Forte?And for those of you who say its Cutler and the defense that lost this game.....think about this. The Packers were deep in the red zone once and that was the int run back. Other than the long pass play the defense was great! Even with the likes of #54 and #59 out at LB.Despite the Packers coming all out, we moved the ball into the red zone three times without scoring a TD thats why we lost!!!

Great point. On one of those in the 4th quarter I believe it was we were running the ball well with Forte but it looked like Turner was more inclined to settle for a FG instead of at least trying for FG, which is crap. I don't think we even tried for the end zone during the trip into the Red Zone.

[BearFan PHX]

IMHO and i have said this ever since we have gotten Ron Turner that we lose because of the plays he call or doesn't call. Prime example we are in the RED ZONE three times and you never used OLSEN ..not one time on a mismatch. ...During the game when the Packer were coming after Cutler...where was the dump off to Forte?...Despite the Packers coming all out, we moved the ball into the red zone three times without scoring a TD thats why we lost!!!

 

Um, the interception that Cutler threw to the DT was a middle screen to Forte.

 

I think Turner called a fine game. The problems on offense are attributable to the players making errors. The WRs and Cutler all contributed with blown routes, lack of rhythm and dropped balls. The OL helped too by not opening holes in the running game.

[nfoligno]

Isn't it funny how that works. If Cutler and our WRs were working better together, not only would have have moved the ball better, but we likely would have scored several more times than we did. If our OL was capable of sustaining a block, or opening a hole, those Forte runs would have gained far more yardage. So basically, if the players didn't fail so bad, Turner would have looked great. But they failed, so Turner sucks.

 

Um, the interception that Cutler threw to the DT was a middle screen to Forte.

 

I think Turner called a fine game. The problems on offense are attributable to the players making errors. The WRs and Cutler all contributed with blown routes, lack of rhythm and dropped balls. The OL helped too by not opening holes in the running game.

 

[Lucky Luciano]

Isn't it funny how that works. If Cutler and our WRs were working better together, not only would have have moved the ball better, but we likely would have scored several more times than we did. If our OL was capable of sustaining a block, or opening a hole, those Forte runs would have gained far more yardage. So basically, if the players didn't fail so bad, Turner would have looked great. But they failed, so Turner sucks.

 

what separates the men from the boys in coaching in the nfl is how fast you can adjust DURING the game when everything you went over in that weeks practice isn't working.

 

when your OL is getting shelled how long does it take to adjust called plays to compensate say to max protection, draw plays, screens or a short drop passing attack?

 

if one side of the line is getting no push on running plays for whatever reason how long do you keep trying to run on that side and especially in the red zone?

 

if the other team has 8 or 9 in the box how long does it take to scheme around it and give your offense a real chance to move the chains and open it up?

 

if your TE's are getting double coverage what kind of pass plays and to whom do you throw to to give you relief? how many passes did our 2nd most productive receiver from last year get (forte)?

 

if your qb looks out of sinc how do you change your gameplan to compensate?

 

in my opinion if it takes an entire half to figure this out you are not doing your job at the highest level.

 

i have and am still giving turner 'some' slack but his clock is winding down for me. the problems of the past still seem to haunt this guy and if he can't turn this mess around given the quality of the offensive weapons he has to work with it is imperative we look for another alternative and soon.

 

if we aren't hitting on all cylinders by week 4 then it is time to look at some of the coaching talent elsewhere.

 

[nfoligno]

A whole half? If we made adjustments in the 2nd quarter, would you then question why it took a whole quarter?

 

The reality is, you may realize some things are not working, but a lot harder to impliment changes (at least bigger ones) before halftime. That is why you have the phrase "half time adjustments." This is when most coaches change it up. Considering how much better our offense looked in the 2nd half, I would say the coaches did a pretty good job.

 

what separates the men from the boys in coaching in the nfl is how fast you can adjust DURING the game when everything you went over in that weeks practice isn't working.

 

when your OL is getting shelled how long does it take to adjust called plays to compensate say to max protection, draw plays, screens or a short drop passing attack?

 

if one side of the line is getting no push on running plays for whatever reason how long do you keep trying to run on that side and especially in the red zone?

 

if the other team has 8 or 9 in the box how long does it take to scheme around it and give your offense a real chance to move the chains and open it up?

 

if your TE's are getting double coverage what kind of pass plays and to whom do you throw to to give you relief? how many passes did our 2nd most productive receiver from last year get (forte)?

 

if your qb looks out of sinc how do you change your gameplan to compensate?

 

in my opinion if it takes an entire half to figure this out you are not doing your job at the highest level.

 

i have and am still giving turner 'some' slack but his clock is winding down for me. the problems of the past still seem to haunt this guy and if he can't turn this mess around given the quality of the offensive weapons he has to work with it is imperative we look for another alternative and soon.

 

if we aren't hitting on all cylinders by week 4 then it is time to look at some of the coaching talent elsewhere.

 

[Lucky Luciano]

A whole half? If we made adjustments in the 2nd quarter, would you then question why it took a whole quarter?

 

The reality is, you may realize some things are not working, but a lot harder to impliment changes (at least bigger ones) before halftime. That is why you have the phrase "half time adjustments." This is when most coaches change it up. Considering how much better our offense looked in the 2nd half, I would say the coaches did a pretty good job.

 

so by your limitations, if another team comes out after half time and beats your brains out the only changes a coach can possibly figure out will be on tuesday watching the game film? hmmmm, 3rd half adjustments?

 

i don't understand where you come up with "harder to implement changes". as a coach it's your freakin job to compensate if you even halfway understand what the hell you are watching on the field. unless your playbook is the size of a comic book your coach SHOULD be able to make changes in play calling and scheme and your players SHOULD be reasonably familiar with it.

 

 

[AZ54]

Nothing was going to work until our Oline blocked pass rushers or opened some holes for Forte. Pass protection got better in second half run blocking didn't. I'm not sure what plays you can call when you are losing the battle up front on every play. Once that straightened out everyone else looked better, not great.

[Lucky Luciano]

Nothing was going to work until our Oline blocked pass rushers or opened some holes for Forte. Pass protection got better in second half run blocking didn't. I'm not sure what plays you can call when you are losing the battle up front on every play. Once that straightened out everyone else looked better, not great.

 

then our OL just needed a good tongue lashing during halftime to become partially effective?

[nfoligno]

I am not a coach, and can only go off what I have heard coaches say, and I am not just talking about Chicago coaches. You can make tweaks throughout a game, but drastic changes usually take place during halftime.

 

IMHO, we did try to do different things. For example, I think you saw more WR screens, for example, which is one way of trying to beat the rush.

 

At the end of the day though, you can honestly only do so much. If your OL is simply not blocking, there are few changes that can make everything better. If your receivers are not running their routes, or dropping the ball, again, there is only so much you can do.

 

so by your limitations, if another team comes out after half time and beats your brains out the only changes a coach can possibly figure out will be on tuesday watching the game film? hmmmm, 3rd half adjustments?

 

i don't understand where you come up with "harder to implement changes". as a coach it's your freakin job to compensate if you even halfway understand what the hell you are watching on the field. unless your playbook is the size of a comic book your coach SHOULD be able to make changes in play calling and scheme and your players SHOULD be reasonably familiar with it.

 

[Lucky Luciano]

I am not a coach, and can only go off what I have heard coaches say, and I am not just talking about Chicago coaches. You can make tweaks throughout a game, but drastic changes usually take place during halftime.

 

IMHO, we did try to do different things. For example, I think you saw more WR screens, for example, which is one way of trying to beat the rush.

 

At the end of the day though, you can honestly only do so much. If your OL is simply not blocking, there are few changes that can make everything better. If your receivers are not running their routes, or dropping the ball, again, there is only so much you can do.

 

you know, it's been nearly as long and maybe longer that this franchise has actually seen a good offensive coach as it has a good consistent qb. in my lifetime of watching the bears it has always been defense with complete offenses as an afterthought. maybe i'm being too critical of what we have had in chicago (then maybe not as i have never seen an offensive coach leave chicago to ever become even an nfl offensive coordinator of any renown).

 

but when i see other coaches like billicheck (sp), fisher, shannahan, johnson, gibbs and more able to make gametime adjustments on the fly that won games, i do have to wonder what they do that we don't.

 

it seems like we are always a halftime or full quarter behind good teams reacting to what is thrown at us.

 

to give one short example of this: our left guard is being handed his hat. how many max protects or even rollouts to the right did we implement? how many draw plays did we use to slow down the pass rush? how many screens, other than that wasted WR screen did we run in the first half? how long would it take YOU to figure out that it was a problem on that side of the line? would you maybe have changed the type of blocking schemes? would you have given him help on his side? would you have replaced him if he couldn't get the job done?

 

here is a question for all... when our D was on the field how often were our offensive linemen and qb sitting on the sidelines looking at printouts or having discussions on how to compensate for the disaster that unfolded with coaches? anybody?

 

isn't it the OC job up in the booth to understand better what is shaping up on the field because of the overall view and compensate for it? isn't that his purpose of being UP there??

[Mongo3451]

you know, it's been nearly as long and maybe longer that this franchise has actually seen a good offensive coach as it has a good consistent qb. in my lifetime of watching the bears it has always been defense with complete offenses as an afterthought. maybe i'm being too critical of what we have had in chicago (then maybe not as i have never seen an offensive coach leave chicago to ever become even an nfl offensive coordinator of any renown).

 

but when i see other coaches like billicheck (sp), fisher, shannahan, johnson, gibbs and more able to make gametime adjustments on the fly that won games, i do have to wonder what they do that we don't.

 

it seems like we are always a halftime or full quarter behind good teams reacting to what is thrown at us.

 

to give one short example of this: our left guard is being handed his hat. how many max protects or even rollouts to the right did we implement? how many draw plays did we use to slow down the pass rush? how many screens, other than that wasted WR screen did we run in the first half? how long would it take YOU to figure out that it was a problem on that side of the line? would you maybe have changed the type of blocking schemes? would you have given him help on his side? would you have replaced him if he couldn't get the job done?

 

here is a question for all... when our D was on the field how often were our offensive linemen and qb sitting on the sidelines looking at printouts or having discussions on how to compensate for the disaster that unfolded with coaches? anybody?

 

isn't it the OC job up in the booth to understand better what is shaping up on the field because of the overall view and compensate for it? isn't that his purpose of being UP there??

I agree with what you are saying here. I just don't agree with the extent you are calling out the coaches. Cutler was just plain horrible. Only Cutler could control that.

[Lucky Luciano]

I agree with what you are saying here. I just don't agree with the extent you are calling out the coaches. Cutler was just plain horrible. Only Cutler could control that.

 

i agree that cutler looked bad. but don't you compensate for what weaknesses he is displaying at that particular time if for no other reason than to boost his confidence or settle him down?

 

my contention is that this entire coaching staff is like a lumbering brontosaurus when it comes to adjustments during a game on both sides of the ball. don't good coaches plan for days or situations like that? don't good coaches plan for certain opponents players having stellar performances on a particular day and have some idea what to do about it?

 

have we watched such poor management throughout the last 40 years that we don't even recognize it when we see sub-par performance in a particular field?

 

as i said before, i have given turner the benefit of the doubt over the last few years. i won't continue to do so much longer with the quality of players he now has to work with.

 

here is to hoping turner AND lovie get a clue and sooon... cheers. :cheers

[nfoligno]

to give one short example of this: our left guard is being handed his hat. how many max protects or even rollouts to the right did we implement?

 

One, I did see us use Cutler on bootlegs. Two. from what you witnessed, was asking Cutler to throw on the run MORE a good idea?

 

how many draw plays did we use to slow down the pass rush? how many screens, other than that wasted WR screen did we run in the first half?

 

Okay, first, I saw several WRs screens, and they just never worked (until the Hester screen later). Two, I saw us try a RB screen as well, but that didn't work either.

 

See, part of the problem is, many of the things you feel should have been used as an adjustment were tried, but those didn't work either.

 

how long would it take YOU to figure out that it was a problem on that side of the line? would you maybe have changed the type of blocking schemes? would you have given him help on his side? would you have replaced him if he couldn't get the job done?

 

Sorry, but I do not think there is a coach in the league that would simply change blocking schemes mid-game. Changing blocking schemes is a big thing, and I just don't see a coach trying something like that. As for help inside, we did. We kept Forte back a ton, and he was most often lined up inside. The problem was, the defense was also sending a blitz, which Forte had to pickup.

 

At the end of the day, you can only do so much to adapt. Sorry, but if your player is playing as bad as Omiyale was, that isn't much you can do but replace him, which is about the only thing I would agree w/ you on in questioning the staff.

 

here is a question for all... when our D was on the field how often were our offensive linemen and qb sitting on the sidelines looking at printouts or having discussions on how to compensate for the disaster that unfolded with coaches? anybody?

 

Um, what makes you think they weren't? Usually, when one unit goes off the field, they are together w/ assistant coaches right there going over plays. The OL coach is with the OL whenever they are off the field, and discussing w/ them what happened and what to do different. Honestly, I have no clue why you think that is different for us. The TV camera rarely pans the bench while the game is going on.

 

isn't it the OC job up in the booth to understand better what is shaping up on the field because of the overall view and compensate for it? isn't that his purpose of being UP there??

 

Again, I just have to question why you think we didn't do anything different. For example, in the 2nd quarter, we went deep to Knox a couple times. One worked. One did not. But that was a play different from anything in the 1st quarter, and one which you might hope opens up running lanes. Also in the 2nd quarter, there were more quick outside options. What I think you are not realizing is, changes were made, but even those changes were not effective. Like the deep play to Knox. Once it worked great, and another time it was picked off. There were changes, but too often those changes too were met w/ bad results.

 

[Lucky Luciano]

One, I did see us use Cutler on bootlegs. Two. from what you witnessed, was asking Cutler to throw on the run MORE a good idea?

 

one bootleg? even though we had problems from both tackles at times i would have liked to see some more planned rollouts.

 

Okay, first, I saw several WRs screens, and they just never worked (until the Hester screen later). Two, I saw us try a RB screen as well, but that didn't work either.

 

See, part of the problem is, many of the things you feel should have been used as an adjustment were tried, but those didn't work either.

 

wr screens are generally garbage and a waste of down. about 1 in 4 gain more than 1-2 yards. a rb screen? i sure don't remember it.

 

At the end of the day, you can only do so much to adapt. Sorry, but if your player is playing as bad as Omiyale was, that isn't much you can do but replace him, which is about the only thing I would agree w/ you on in questioning the staff.

 

only so much you can do to adapt? hmmmm... how about going no huddle? we did it ONE series, the 2nd of the game, in which we moved the ball from our own 18 to the packer 31 before an INT. we never saw it again the entire first half and maybe the game.

 

max protect? how many times did we keep forte back WITH mckie to block (that is max protection)? once? twice? the time we did we had a big gain including your example of the long ball to knox.

 

our biggest problems were running 4 step drops with cutler. the tackles were bringing their outside men wide and back but the problem was by the time he set, the interior line was getting either pushed back or blitzers were coming through the gaps. our best success came running quick 2 and 3 step passes.

 

in my opinion we were totally confused on offense. our linemen didn't know which guys to block or when. two linemen would double up a guy and a second later a defender would come through the gap untouched. our pulling guard/center plays on sweeps to the outside were slow and bottled up because the guards and tackles got no penetration and were being stood up.

 

Um, what makes you think they weren't? Usually, when one unit goes off the field, they are together w/ assistant coaches right there going over plays. The OL coach is with the OL whenever they are off the field, and discussing w/ them what happened and what to do different. Honestly, I have no clue why you think that is different for us. The TV camera rarely pans the bench while the game is going on.

 

well if you or anyone else has seen out offense/qb going over printouts on the bench with coaches i haven't. maybe the don't show it on tv. anyone at the game that could shed light on this?

 

Again, I just have to question why you think we didn't do anything different. For example, in the 2nd quarter, we went deep to Knox a couple times. One worked. One did not. But that was a play different from anything in the 1st quarter, and one which you might hope opens up running lanes. Also in the 2nd quarter, there were more quick outside options. What I think you are not realizing is, changes were made, but even those changes were not effective. Like the deep play to Knox. Once it worked great, and another time it was picked off. There were changes, but too often those changes too were met w/ bad results.

 

huh? one deep pass is changing the way your offense is operating? what quick outside option? those crap wr screens? that is our major changeup we can expect for chicago offenses? we have been beating that dead horse since crowton. sorry but the things that actually worked we abandoned and continued with what didn't.