Cleveland game thoughts

[AZ54]

Another week gone by and another wasted opportunity to fire Harry. The Oline was horrible to start the game. The Browns were clearly mixing up the pass rush but still we need better from this group. Some running lanes were opened later in the game but pass protection was rarely seen.

 

RB: I'm getting tired of Forte dancing around at the LOS. On at least one play late in the game Forte completely blew his pass protection assignment and got Cutler leveled. On one of his goal line runs he stayed up high and got stopped for no gain when he could have lowered his pads and gained at least 1/2 yard or more. Isn't this fundamental RB stuff? Just how bad does Forte have to play before a message gets sent to him? What does it take to get Wolfe on the field for more reps?

 

QB: Cutler is a one tough SOB and took a lot of hits. I thought for most of the game he was confused and couldn't get a read on the defense. On one goal line play Cleveland blitzed and he should have just hit Olsen who was left open by the blitzing player instead he took a sack. He had another INT and nearly lost a fumble that was over-ruled on replay challenge. Just an average day for him. If you take the Oline out for dinner take them to a rib shack just to remind them how badly yours are hurting after Shaun Rogers landed on you, among others.

 

OC: Scrap the wildcat play. We can't execute the basic plays there's no need to add more gee-whiz stuff to the playbook. Nobody is really surprised by this stuff anymore and unlike other wildcat teams your QB is the best offensive player on the field, give him the ball on every snap. Overall the offense is underachieving even when we play some of the worst defenses in the league. We can't find a single weakness against any team we play and that has to be on you.

 

Dline: Tommie Harris you are on pace to earn $321,000 per tackle. Good for you but there's no way I'd be writing those checks next year. At least now everyone knows what your problem is; you're playing touch football. The rest of the Dline had trouble getting pass pressure and couldn't get off blocks to stop the run. We've seen this before and it didn't end well.

 

LB: Not much inspired play at all. Lots of guys getting dragged around by Jamal Lewis even when we stacked the line against the run.

 

CB: All I can say is that it's easy to look good when you have nobody to cover and it's even easier when you know the QB will likely miss anyone who is open. Still coverage wasn't all bad but we'll see what you got next week against AZ.

 

S: Great diving INT by DManning. Afalava tipped a pass on a blitz. That's about all I recall.

 

DC Lovie: Defense overall got 5 turnovers and there has to be credit for that. If we have a good defense then I'd expect multiple turnovers against a team like Cleveland and on this note they delivered. Pass rush by Dline was minimal and run defense was weak. I don't see how we survive all season on these blitzes, fake blitzes.

 

Special teams: good 95% of the time really bad the other 5% including Maynard's sideways punt and the late KR to Cribbs.

 

 

The final score doesn't reflect how long we let Cleveland stay in this game. It should have been over by halftime but the offense was totally inept in the first half. I still believe that any win in the NFL is a good win but we continue to prove that we cannot put lesser opponents away easily (Seattle, Lions, Cleveland) and that convinces me we're just not that good of a team. I thought we'd be 9-7 this year but right now I don't see that happening unless something on offense greatly improves. This defense is not nearly good enough to carry us to victory.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[nfoligno]

Agreed on Forte. He is just not playing well. Yea, he had some yards today, but ypc avg sucked, and do did the D he was going up against. But really, it is the vision. When he is running the ball, I am getting a bit tired of him not seeing a hole, and just running up the arce of our OL. He finally did bounce one outside for a big gain, but frankly, I thought those were there all day. And his vision in the backfield? As said, he whiffed on a couple blocking assignments and got Cutler leveled. I know the OL sucks, but Forte is doing the OL and team no favors. Last year got Forte some leeway, but IMHO, that leeway and benefit of doubt has expired. Upright running and poor vision? Not the things great RBs are made of.

 

Agreed on Cutler. That dude is getting drilled. And you know what. As often as our OL has hurt him, he still will stand in the pocket waiting for a WR to break open, w/ a LB bearing down on him.

 

Agreed on dumpting the wildcat. I said that before. Great for Miami who has the players for it, but we don't.

 

I didn't see you mention the receivers, but I think it has to be asked how well they are getting open. It just seemed like Cutler was looking all day for an open WR. And can I start the "start Clark" petition. Olsen just sucks in terms of blocking. At times, he doesn't even try. There was a play where Pace moves to block inside (it was obviously designed) while Olsen was on the DE. Olsen really didn't even try to block the DE, and just ran a route. The DE had a clear path and put a hit on Cutler. It was obvious, IMHO, that Olsen is expected to chip block before he runs his route, but simply didn't.

 

As for the D, agree the DL stunk, and the secondary play improved as the game went on, but I just can not give them too much credit. Maybe that isn't fair, but Anderson is just that bad. There were times I saw receivers open, but Anderson's pass was just a joke. If we were getting a pass rush and forcing those throws, maybe, but the dude is so bad, he would be sitting comfortable in the pocket and his passes were still 15 yards off.

 

Another week gone by and another wasted opportunity to fire Harry. The Oline was horrible to start the game. The Browns were clearly mixing up the pass rush but still we need better from this group. Some running lanes were opened later in the game but pass protection was rarely seen.

 

RB: I'm getting tired of Forte dancing around at the LOS. On at least one play late in the game Forte completely blew his pass protection assignment and got Cutler leveled. On one of his goal line runs he stayed up high and got stopped for no gain when he could have lowered his pads and gained at least 1/2 yard or more. Isn't this fundamental RB stuff? Just how bad does Forte have to play before a message gets sent to him? What does it take to get Wolfe on the field for more reps?

 

QB: Cutler is a one tough SOB and took a lot of hits. I thought for most of the game he was confused and couldn't get a read on the defense. On one goal line play Cleveland blitzed and he should have just hit Olsen who was left open by the blitzing player instead he took a sack. He had another INT and nearly lost a fumble that was over-ruled on replay challenge. Just an average day for him. If you take the Oline out for dinner take them to a rib shack just to remind them how badly yours are hurting after Shaun Rogers landed on you, among others.

 

OC: Scrap the wildcat play. We can't execute the basic plays there's no need to add more gee-whiz stuff to the playbook. Nobody is really surprised by this stuff anymore and unlike other wildcat teams your QB is the best offensive player on the field, give him the ball on every snap. Overall the offense is underachieving even when we play some of the worst defenses in the league. We can't find a single weakness against any team we play and that has to be on you.

 

Dline: Tommie Harris you are on pace to earn $321,000 per tackle. Good for you but there's no way I'd be writing those checks next year. At least now everyone knows what your problem is; you're playing touch football. The rest of the Dline had trouble getting pass pressure and couldn't get off blocks to stop the run. We've seen this before and it didn't end well.

 

LB: Not much inspired play at all. Lots of guys getting dragged around by Jamal Lewis even when we stacked the line against the run.

 

CB: All I can say is that it's easy to look good when you have nobody to cover and it's even easier when you know the QB will likely miss anyone who is open. Still coverage wasn't all bad but we'll see what you got next week against AZ.

 

S: Great diving INT by DManning. Afalava tipped a pass on a blitz. That's about all I recall.

 

DC Lovie: Defense overall got 5 turnovers and there has to be credit for that. If we have a good defense then I'd expect multiple turnovers against a team like Cleveland and on this note they delivered. Pass rush by Dline was minimal and run defense was weak. I don't see how we survive all season on these blitzes, fake blitzes.

 

Special teams: good 95% of the time really bad the other 5% including Maynard's sideways punt and the late KR to Cribbs.

 

 

The final score doesn't reflect how long we let Cleveland stay in this game. It should have been over by halftime but the offense was totally inept in the first half. I still believe that any win in the NFL is a good win but we continue to prove that we cannot put lesser opponents away easily (Seattle, Lions, Cleveland) and that convinces me we're just not that good of a team. I thought we'd be 9-7 this year but right now I don't see that happening unless something on offense greatly improves. This defense is not nearly good enough to carry us to victory.

 

[Connorbear]

I didn't see you mention the receivers, but I think it has to be asked how well they are getting open. It just seemed like Cutler was looking all day for an open WR. And can I start the "start Clark" petition. Olsen just sucks in terms of blocking. At times, he doesn't even try. There was a play where Pace moves to block inside (it was obviously designed) while Olsen was on the DE. Olsen really didn't even try to block the DE, and just ran a route. The DE had a clear path and put a hit on Cutler. It was obvious, IMHO, that Olsen is expected to chip block before he runs his route, but simply didn't.

Receivers were really having a hard time getting open when Cutler had time. About 75% of the time he was scrambling for his life or being put on his arse. The o-line sucks.

 

Peace

[jason]

I obviously couldn't see the off camera stuff, but I saw about three plays that looked as if a receiver was open and Cutler didn't throw that way. Of course, how can you blame Cutler when on the fourth step of a five step drop he can already smell the breath of a defensive lineman.

[Ed Hochuli 3:16]

I was at the game so it was hard to really disect the game, but I agree on Cutler. I love this guy. He's a god damn football player and I love it. He was out there getting blasted play after play by a 350 pound Shaun Rodgers, yet he kept getting up. Under the circumstances, he played well.

 

The OL looked just as bad with Beekman BTW.

[madlithuanian]

I still think we need a "big boy" WR... I think the development, but our guys are not "go to" guys...or can make plays. We need a legit WR threat. OL is still the obvious need... The OL is just garbage.

 

I didn't see you mention the receivers, but I think it has to be asked how well they are getting open. It just seemed like Cutler was looking all day for an open WR. And can I start the "start Clark" petition. Olsen just sucks in terms of blocking. At times, he doesn't even try. There was a play where Pace moves to block inside (it was obviously designed) while Olsen was on the DE. Olsen really didn't even try to block the DE, and just ran a route. The DE had a clear path and put a hit on Cutler. It was obvious, IMHO, that Olsen is expected to chip block before he runs his route, but simply didn't.

 

[nfoligno]

It isn't that I disagree necessarily. It isn't that I look at our WRs and see that stud a defense has to respect any given down.

 

But for me, that is simply a far lower need. Far lower. I don't care if we had Moss and Fitzgerald right now. Cutler would still get lit up. We need to protect Cuter #1. #2 for me is the run game. Sorry, but while last year gave Forte a bit some benefit of doubt, I think that benefit has run out. He looks like crap. Sure, he has a play here and there, but those good plays just seem isolated. His vision seems very qeustionable, and his blitz pickup (something he did well last year) looks flat out awful. I am not saying he sucks and needs to be replaced, but when looking at what is wrong with our OL, I would even put RB ahead of WR at this point.

 

I still think we need a "big boy" WR... I think the development, but our guys are not "go to" guys...or can make plays. We need a legit WR threat. OL is still the obvious need... The OL is just garbage.

 

[madlithuanian]

I hear ya. OL is THE need. But, we should have loot, and if guys are out there, we need to buy them up since we have no draft so to speak.

 

Should have taken Mendenhall... Yeah, Forte is just not good. One odd thing I noticed it that on the one TD play, he was sent up the middle as usual by the ever-s- imaginative Turner, but no, he saw it close-up and bounced it to the outside. Viola! TD! We cannot run inside with this line. Let's not try it in crucial points anymore. We need to run up the guy every now and then to keep other teams' slightly honest, but at this point, we may as well just have Cutler spike the ball.

 

It isn't that I disagree necessarily. It isn't that I look at our WRs and see that stud a defense has to respect any given down.

 

But for me, that is simply a far lower need. Far lower. I don't care if we had Moss and Fitzgerald right now. Cutler would still get lit up. We need to protect Cuter #1. #2 for me is the run game. Sorry, but while last year gave Forte a bit some benefit of doubt, I think that benefit has run out. He looks like crap. Sure, he has a play here and there, but those good plays just seem isolated. His vision seems very qeustionable, and his blitz pickup (something he did well last year) looks flat out awful. I am not saying he sucks and needs to be replaced, but when looking at what is wrong with our OL, I would even put RB ahead of WR at this point.

 

[nfoligno]

Yes, the inside was closed off, and yes, he bounced it outside for a good gain. Issue I have is, I have seen that opening many times, and last year I would argue Forte would have also seen that open outside and hit that area, but this year he just seems to run up the arce of his own OL blockers.

 

 

 

I hear ya. OL is THE need. But, we should have loot, and if guys are out there, we need to buy them up since we have no draft so to speak.

 

Should have taken Mendenhall... Yeah, Forte is just not good. One odd thing I noticed it that on the one TD play, he was sent up the middle as usual by the ever-s- imaginative Turner, but no, he saw it close-up and bounced it to the outside. Viola! TD! We cannot run inside with this line. Let's not try it in crucial points anymore. We need to run up the guy every now and then to keep other teams' slightly honest, but at this point, we may as well just have Cutler spike the ball.

 

[BigDaddy]

As much as I agree that we desparately need o line help, our WRs are just not getting open. Come on, we have 2 of the fastest guys in the league and even when they are on the field together not one of them can get open? They are either running the wrong routes, bad routes or are just getting outmuscled, but in any event, we MUST improve this group as well as the o line. If these guys can't become more physical, we are doomed. Knox needs to add about 15-20 lbs, keep that speed and THEN he'll be dangerous. But our WRs need alot more upper body strength than they have now.

[DABEARSDABOMB]

I was at the game so it was hard to really disect the game, but I agree on Cutler. I love this guy. He's a god damn football player and I love it. He was out there getting blasted play after play by a 350 pound Shaun Rodgers, yet he kept getting up. Under the circumstances, he played well.

 

The OL looked just as bad with Beekman BTW.

We can't keep letting our franchise QB taking a beating though. Hits add up. I got to admit, the guy has some big freakin stones and he's definitely stood in and made some great passes under pressure.

 

But as we know, when you get hit and hit and hit, turnovers are going to happen too.

[DABEARSDABOMB]

I still think we need a "big boy" WR... I think the development, but our guys are not "go to" guys...or can make plays. We need a legit WR threat. OL is still the obvious need... The OL is just garbage.

We don't have a #1 Wr on the roster or anyone really with the tools to be that. We can hope we add one, problem is that ranks much lower on the list than other stuff.

 

The WR's have been better than expected but they do have trouble getting open a decent chunk of the time (don't know if thats the play-calling, the route-running or what).

[nfoligno]

Sure, in a perfect world, we would go out and add WR, along w/ OL, DL, FS, CB, LB, FB and whatever else we need. In the real world, you have to prioritize your needs.

 

I don't think anyone is saying our WR corp is made up of studs, or that an upgrade would be an awful thing. But the reality is, you can only upgrade at some many areas at once. We say OL, but it isn't just one spot. We need numerous OL addtions, and that doesn't even take into consideration our DL or defense as a whole.

 

Fix the OL. If WRs like Knox, Hester, Bennett have not stepped up by then, fine. Go look for a stud WR. But do not even think about spending big to get a stud WR before you first fix the OL. If we were offered Boldin today (yes, I realize we are past the trade deadline) for a 3rd, I don't think I would do it. It isn't just the pick, but the money, as he is not going to be happy w/o a $10m/yr contract, and we simply can't afford to spend that at WR w/ our OL looking as bad as it is.

 

As much as I agree that we desparately need o line help, our WRs are just not getting open. Come on, we have 2 of the fastest guys in the league and even when they are on the field together not one of them can get open? They are either running the wrong routes, bad routes or are just getting outmuscled, but in any event, we MUST improve this group as well as the o line. If these guys can't become more physical, we are doomed. Knox needs to add about 15-20 lbs, keep that speed and THEN he'll be dangerous. But our WRs need alot more upper body strength than they have now.

 

[Connorbear]

Sure, in a perfect world, we would go out and add WR, along w/ OL, DL, FS, CB, LB, FB and whatever else we need. In the real world, you have to prioritize your needs.

 

I don't think anyone is saying our WR corp is made up of studs, or that an upgrade would be an awful thing. But the reality is, you can only upgrade at some many areas at once. We say OL, but it isn't just one spot. We need numerous OL addtions, and that doesn't even take into consideration our DL or defense as a whole.

 

Fix the OL. If WRs like Knox, Hester, Bennett have not stepped up by then, fine. Go look for a stud WR. But do not even think about spending big to get a stud WR before you first fix the OL. If we were offered Boldin today (yes, I realize we are past the trade deadline) for a 3rd, I don't think I would do it. It isn't just the pick, but the money, as he is not going to be happy w/o a $10m/yr contract, and we simply can't afford to spend that at WR w/ our OL looking as bad as it is.

Agree 100%.

 

Peace

[AZ54]

Sure, in a perfect world, we would go out and add WR, along w/ OL, DL, FS, CB, LB, FB and whatever else we need. In the real world, you have to prioritize your needs.

 

I don't think anyone is saying our WR corp is made up of studs, or that an upgrade would be an awful thing. But the reality is, you can only upgrade at some many areas at once. We say OL, but it isn't just one spot. We need numerous OL addtions, and that doesn't even take into consideration our DL or defense as a whole.

 

Fix the OL. If WRs like Knox, Hester, Bennett have not stepped up by then, fine. Go look for a stud WR. But do not even think about spending big to get a stud WR before you first fix the OL. If we were offered Boldin today (yes, I realize we are past the trade deadline) for a 3rd, I don't think I would do it. It isn't just the pick, but the money, as he is not going to be happy w/o a $10m/yr contract, and we simply can't afford to spend that at WR w/ our OL looking as bad as it is.

 

 

Boldin is already hurt and missing game time. Like i said in the offseason, I love the way he plays the game but he has only played one full season and he's just not a #1 WR but is a good complimentary WR. We already have several of those.

 

 

One thing about the WR getting open: Teams know that we can't pass protect so despite the speed we have at WR they only have to cover for about 2 perhaps 3 seconds before Cutler is on his butt or dumping off the ball. There really isn't time for deeper routes to develop and in fact we haven't seen many deep passes from Cutler, at least not like I thought we would this season. We have a young WR corps so I'm not absolving them from responsibility either. Another part of this equation is that I think we have a lot of "reads" the WR and QB have to make on the fly and right now they are all new to this and are not on the same page. If Cutler had more time to wait for things to develop it would mask this issue but with this Oline that ain't gonna happen.

[nfoligno]

I think a key problem here is playcalling, and have seen this discussed elsewhere.

 

We have a big arm QB, and our game plan is created in such a way to try and utilize that. Sounds great, but w/ our OL, it is near impossible. We continue to have our WRs running routes that take time to develop, yet Cutler does not have the luxury of time. Announcers talked about how Cutler is holding the ball trying, and trying to buy a little time, as the WRs need time to develop their routes. But the end result is Cutler is getting pressured before the WRs can develop their routes.

 

While not exciting, we need to start devising routes for our WRs more similar to last year. We need to start planning more 3 step, quite release routes. More quick slants and quick outs to get the ball out of Cutlers hands in a hurry. It seems like a waste of Cutler's talent, and it is, but his talent is being wasted right now due to the OL anyway.

 

Boldin is already hurt and missing game time. Like i said in the offseason, I love the way he plays the game but he has only played one full season and he's just not a #1 WR but is a good complimentary WR. We already have several of those.

 

 

One thing about the WR getting open: Teams know that we can't pass protect so despite the speed we have at WR they only have to cover for about 2 perhaps 3 seconds before Cutler is on his butt or dumping off the ball. There really isn't time for deeper routes to develop and in fact we haven't seen many deep passes from Cutler, at least not like I thought we would this season. We have a young WR corps so I'm not absolving them from responsibility either. Another part of this equation is that I think we have a lot of "reads" the WR and QB have to make on the fly and right now they are all new to this and are not on the same page. If Cutler had more time to wait for things to develop it would mask this issue but with this Oline that ain't gonna happen.

 

[AZ54]

I think a key problem here is playcalling, and have seen this discussed elsewhere.

 

We have a big arm QB, and our game plan is created in such a way to try and utilize that. Sounds great, but w/ our OL, it is near impossible. We continue to have our WRs running routes that take time to develop, yet Cutler does not have the luxury of time. Announcers talked about how Cutler is holding the ball trying, and trying to buy a little time, as the WRs need time to develop their routes. But the end result is Cutler is getting pressured before the WRs can develop their routes.

 

While not exciting, we need to start devising routes for our WRs more similar to last year. We need to start planning more 3 step, quite release routes. More quick slants and quick outs to get the ball out of Cutlers hands in a hurry. It seems like a waste of Cutler's talent, and it is, but his talent is being wasted right now due to the OL anyway.

 

 

I agree with you on that. Fire off more quick passes and it will also take the edge off the pass rush as they'll start thinking more about raising up to knock the pass down. That will help us when we decide to take a full 7 step drop especially if it's on a 2 and 4 type down.

[jason]

Read my signature line. That is it, period! Without an OL,the addition of a "stud wr" is almost inconsequential because we havent had the time to really utilize the full skill set of either Cutler or the WRs (or the RB & TEs for that matter).

 

Build this OL, and there can be more 5 and 7 step drops, and longer routes...and with that much time there is no team in the NFL that can cover the Bears' speed on offense.

 

it starts in the trenches, folks, and nearly all of the Bears' offensive woes would be fixed with a good OL.

[nfoligno]

From the sound of some of what I have read, it seems we may be doing just this. Turner has said we are going to pair down the playbook, but several others have said a more full meaning of that is we are going to limit the 7 step drops and call more 3 and 5 step drops, as we did last year w/ Orton.

 

I have no problem, and agree with this. As you said, it is a good way to take the edge off the pass rush. If a DE believes you are going to fire after a 3 step drop, it is virtually impossible to pressure, thus many DL will not pin there ears back, but make an initial move, then get ready to try and bat the ball down. As you said, this could help for when we do choose to call a 7 step drop.

 

The only thing for me is, while this is an effective thing to do, and something we need to see, there are still other things (bootlegs and rollouts), as well as other playcalled, which also could limit the pass rush, and which I think we need to see. We do not need to simply become a quick fire offense. We need to change things up, but we do not have to go from one extreme all the way to another extreme.

 

I agree with you on that. Fire off more quick passes and it will also take the edge off the pass rush as they'll start thinking more about raising up to knock the pass down. That will help us when we decide to take a full 7 step drop especially if it's on a 2 and 4 type down.