I Feel Bad For Jay Cutler

[selection7]

Don't anyone forget it wasn't that long ago we couldn't even move the ball with our O. Good game or bad game for Jay, at least our O moves the ball and gets first downs. Also think about this. No running game and poor pass protection paired with above average D (I'm describing the niners loss)...that's not going to win you any Superbowls. As long as the bad games don't damage Jay's psyche (he seems so cocky that I don't think it will), and he's ready to put out pro-bowl efforts when the rest of the offense is carrying their weight, who cares if he doesn't play with composure when his teamates are getting pushed around? We didn't bring him here to make us look less pathetic. He's here for playoffs and championships. That's not really a rebuttle to anyone as much as just trying hard to see the glass half full.

 

I have a similar theory that some coaches can't coach up poor talent, and some can...while the roles can get reversed when you hand those same coaches a team loaded with talent. For example, Wannstedt was quite successful getting his Miami players to not suck, but where was the next level? It could be argued that instead of Belichek learning from his Cleveland mistakes, that he is just great at dealing with talent but doesn't know how to develop a team that needs serious help (referring to the Browns). I seriously doubt that you approach coaching a team with poor talent the exact same way you do a loaded team.

[flea]

Your putting an awful ot into 1 catch Bigdaddy

[Connorbear]

Listen, if you wanna hang your hat on a wannabe WR you go right ahead. Me? I'll stick with guys who have done it for awhile and that info from the site about Aromashudo's weight may not be right. I'd be willing to bet he's 210-212. Because he got cut doesn't mean he isn't better than hester or Iglesias. Keep him in the lineup so we have someone over 6 ft so we can see what he's capable of.

Hey, I want DA to succeed I just am not going to make the jump that is going to happen.

 

He will definately be active the next 3 to 4 weeks given Wolfe's injury. Let's hope he can get on the field.

 

Peace

[BigDaddy]

Your putting an awful ot into 1 catch Bigdaddy

 

 

Let's bear in mind though flea that we watched all of last year while Bennett sat and did nothing. If you remember, DA showed alot of athleticism in preseason with ONE catch. I am not saying that DA is our most polished WR OR our best. I am merely saying that I think his size, his instincts and focus are better suited to becoming the type of WR WE NEED and that at seasons end, if given more reps and PT, he COULD be one of our most polished WRs. Get him up to 220 lbs and with his strength, he becomes a formidable threat. Not neccesarily a #1WR but a guy who can be in a crowd and come out with the ball as opposed to what's happening with this group of wideouts now. They don't seem to be able to get separation on the intermediate routes.

[nfoligno]

Hey, I never said not to "kick Cutler in the nuts". Far from it.

 

This is my point. There are some who are trying to nearly absolve Cutler of fault due to (a) awful OL, ( little help from WRs, © no run game what-so-ever and (d) that all the picks were not his fault. There are others who are basically trying to pin the woes of the world on Cutler, realizing that we have other issues too, but Cutler is the QB and it all lays at his feet.

 

I am trying to drive a middle road here. Cutler had a bad game. I don't care of Hester slipped on one or the ref threw a pick. There were other would-pick interceptions where the defense simply failed the make the play. Cutler was forcing bad passes throughout the game. With that said, the effort from our offense was so bad, and so across the board, that I refuse to simply throw Cutler under the bus w/o lots of company.

 

Nobody's demanding you agree with the assessment but please don't tell me that you didn't think to yourself after watching Cutler drive this team methodically down the field on that drive only to watch him throw a silly pick, oh no, here we go again. Because 90% of the people I talk to about it did. If we take the 3 on that drive, we only need 3 at the end. Plain and simple. Gould wins it for us. Look, you can try to find issues with our WRs. I agree with those issues. Right now, our WRs are simply NONexistant. THEY STINK. None of them seem to be able to get separation and this has been going on for weeks. Hester included. It still does not negate the fact that Cutler blew it with those picks. I know he's pressing, everyone does. Why do you think we're seeing the schemes we're seeing? But Cutler has to be smarter than that. If he wants to roll out and move that pocket, doggone it, he has to tell Turner, look you idiot, you get some schemes together that allow me to get outside so I can have more time. Those are things he must do to fix this thing but don't sit there and tell me that Cutler wasn't the biggest culprit in this loss with 5 picks. That's just silly. I'll give the rest of these guys a solid kick in the ass for their crappy offensive play but Cutler needs a kick in the nuts for his stupidity. He should know better. This whole thing is about trust now. NOBODY on that offense trusts anyone and nobody on that defense trusts anyone. I'm sure Cutler probably thought hey, if I don't get 7, this defense is going to give up points all day, I can't afford to take just three. I wouldn't blame him if he didn't trust the defense, who does? He has to know though, that when he makes that decision, he just took 3 points from us and ANY points for an offense that has struggled as bad as this one is a good thing.

 

[flea]

Let's bear in mind though flea that we watched all of last year while Bennett sat and did nothing. If you remember, DA showed alot of athleticism in preseason with ONE catch. I am not saying that DA is our most polished WR OR our best. I am merely saying that I think his size, his instincts and focus are better suited to becoming the type of WR WE NEED and that at seasons end, if given more reps and PT, he COULD be one of our most polished WRs. Get him up to 220 lbs and with his strength, he becomes a formidable threat. Not neccesarily a #1WR but a guy who can be in a crowd and come out with the ball as opposed to what's happening with this group of wideouts now. They don't seem to be able to get separation on the intermediate routes.

 

 

Personaly I don't rate him but yes he could be, but remember also theres always a guy who plays well at the position who becomes a fan favourite. Rideau, Hass, Ball where are they now?

[Connorbear]

Personaly I don't rate him but yes he could be, but remember also theres always a guy who plays well at the position who becomes a fan favourite. Rideau, Hass, Ball where are they now?

Hass just got cut from Seattle. Anyone want him again????

 

Peace

[madlithuanian]

BINGO!!!!

 

Jay Cutler needs to decide what HE wants to be when he grows up. He's fixable but unfortunately, not by anyone on our staff.

 

[madlithuanian]

Wanny did nothing in Miami but inherit a Jimmy Johnson squad the performed decently for the 1 year after Johnson hung it up. Then, they proceeded to blow...

 

I have a similar theory that some coaches can't coach up poor talent, and some can...while the roles can get reversed when you hand those same coaches a team loaded with talent. For example, Wannstedt was quite successful getting his Miami players to not suck, but where was the next level? It could be argued that instead of Belichek learning from his Cleveland mistakes, that he is just great at dealing with talent but doesn't know how to develop a team that needs serious help (referring to the Browns). I seriously doubt that you approach coaching a team with poor talent the exact same way you do a loaded team.

 

[madlithuanian]

I agree basically. He the physical presence that no other of our WR's have. At least height... Mixing him in with our clones of short and fast guys could be a plus.

 

Let's bear in mind though flea that we watched all of last year while Bennett sat and did nothing. If you remember, DA showed alot of athleticism in preseason with ONE catch. I am not saying that DA is our most polished WR OR our best. I am merely saying that I think his size, his instincts and focus are better suited to becoming the type of WR WE NEED and that at seasons end, if given more reps and PT, he COULD be one of our most polished WRs. Get him up to 220 lbs and with his strength, he becomes a formidable threat. Not neccesarily a #1WR but a guy who can be in a crowd and come out with the ball as opposed to what's happening with this group of wideouts now. They don't seem to be able to get separation on the intermediate routes.

 

[madlithuanian]

I do! Can't help it, liked the guy's effort. Practice Squad...

 

Hass just got cut from Seattle. Anyone want him again????

 

Peace

 

[Controlled Chaos]

Hass just got cut from Seattle. Anyone want him again????

 

Peace

I do.

[jason]

I do.

 

Why?

 

Look, I like the guy too...but he won't help.

 

1] The OL will still stink

2] He will be at best the 5th WR

3] Cutler won't have time behind this OL to throw more than a few passes that aren't 3-step drops

 

Adding Haas does nothing for this team at the moment.

[madlithuanian]

PS him...

 

Nothing's going to help this team this season...

 

Keep Hass around for next year. You know we're not going to get very many picks or options in FA depending on how the CBA goes...

 

Why?

 

Look, I like the guy too...but he won't help.

 

1] The OL will still stink

2] He will be at best the 5th WR

3] Cutler won't have time behind this OL to throw more than a few passes that aren't 3-step drops

 

Adding Haas does nothing for this team at the moment.

 

[selection7]

Wanny did nothing in Miami but inherit a Jimmy Johnson squad the performed decently for the 1 year after Johnson hung it up. Then, they proceeded to blow...

Nope. They were one of the most successful teams for 4 straight years in the regular season...a lot better than our Bears unfortunately. To not acknowledge that they were actually more successful than Jimmy's Dolphins (that only cracked 10 wins once--getting exactly 10) and not acknowledge they held that up for years...you might as well be lying for all intents and purposes. Now if you had been way less sensational than saying "did nothing" and "decent" "for the 1 year", then I might have even replied with a "good point". That's the value of being more restrained with the dramatic...the difference between making a good point and sounding ridiculous.

[ParkerBear7]

This does not even touch on Turner.

 

 

 

 

 

Speaking of Turner; too bad we did not sign Michael Turner the Burner 2 years ago as a FA and then used the High 2nd round pick that was used on Forte to fill the OL with some much need youth and talent? Just a random thought I got from reading this post.

[jason]

This does not even touch on Turner.

 

Speaking of Turner; too bad we did not sign Michael Turner the Burner 2 years ago as a FA and then used the High 2nd round pick that was used on Forte to fill the OL with some much need youth and talent? Just a random thought I got from reading this post.

 

Odd that you mention that. It's very similar to my thoughts from the past two years when I advocated keeping Benson and using high picks on offensive linemen.

 

 

[madlithuanian]

I was one of a bunch of folks that wanted Turner...and better utilize a pick for something else...

 

Odd that you mention that. It's very similar to my thoughts from the past two years when I advocated keeping Benson and using high picks on offensive linemen.

 

[ParkerBear7]

Odd that you mention that. It's very similar to my thoughts from the past two years when I advocated keeping Benson and using high picks on offensive linemen.

 

 

Yeah there are plenty of things I am sure JA could have been done differently over the past few years in the draft and FA. I don't remember who was available at the time but what if we took the best OL with the 4th overall pick that was used on Benson? JA simply discards the notion of building an offense via the draft which could not be more opposite his approach on developing the DEF. Hence the current state of the Bears.

[defiantgiant]

Speaking of Turner; too bad we did not sign Michael Turner the Burner 2 years ago as a FA and then used the High 2nd round pick that was used on Forte to fill the OL with some much need youth and talent? Just a random thought I got from reading this post.

One second-round pick wouldn't have turned our line into Atlanta's. We took Forte #44 - the next offensive linemen off the board were Mike Pollak, John Greco, Jeremy Zuttah, Chad Rinehart, and Oniel Cousins. Zuttah's the only quality starter out of the bunch: he's a pretty good left guard for Tampa. That'd be a start, but the Bears' line still wouldn't be close to the Falcons'. Turner wouldn't have come close to 1700 yards rushing behind our group. Meanwhile, who knows what Forte's rookie year would have looked like if he'd had the Falcons blocking for him.

 

I wanted Turner, too, but he's just not as complete a back as Forte. He doesn't have a ton of cutback ability, he doesn't catch the ball at all; he's a straight-ahead runner, and Atlanta's a team built for a power-running offense. I'd compare him to a faster Brandon Jacobs: he's fast in a straight line, a load to bring down, and great in short yardage. He's a great piece for an offense that has a complete cast around him: nasty run-blocking o-line, a game-changing wideout like Roddy White, a quality complementary back like Jerious Norwood, etc. Put Turner on last year's Bears, though, and he'd just be plowing into the line for no gain, 1 yard, etc. Same thing with Brandon Jacobs: he's great at what he does, but you can't ignore the fact that the Giants are built for power running and have all the pieces around him in place.

 

Honestly, I can't think of very many halfbacks in the NFL that could have carried a subpar team on their backs the way Forte did last year. He WAS our running game, and most of our passing game too, all with very little help. Turner's awesome at what he does, but he couldn't have done what Forte did.

[nfoligno]

Honestly, I can't think of very many halfbacks in the NFL that could have carried a subpar team on their backs the way Forte did last year. He WAS our running game, and most of our passing game too, all with very little help. Turner's awesome at what he does, but he couldn't have done what Forte did.

 

The sad thing is, one of the first RBs that come to mind would be Thomas Jones, who also carried our team when we lacked at OL, QB and WR. Thomas Jones not only was capable of hard yards, but also big plays and was a solid receiver too.

 

Regarding Turner, while I agree w/ some of what you said, don't be so quick to take away from him either. While he did have a solid OL last year, he also had a rookie QB and teams were absolutely stacking the box to stop him. I agree he would not look nearly so good behind our OL. I just don't want to take away from what he is or has done. The pieces were absolutely not all in place when he took over, as they had a rookie QB.

 

Final point. Nice to go back and talk "what-ifs" but even if we did sign Turner, does anyone truly believe we would have used that 2nd round pick on an OL? Heck, if fans recall, many (myself included) were looking at that 2nd round pick for a QB. Brian Brohm was the favorite of many, and from what I have read, he has sucked for GB. Henne was another, though fewer Chi fans liked him.

 

I think I would rather have Forte and Cutler than Turner and Brohm.

[GakMan23]

Is it possible that maybe Harry Hiestand doesn't have a clue how to teach technique or is just so dumb as far as teaching and using different blocks schemes that the players are regressing? I know I have heard OB and Buffone on post game multiple times screaming for them to use different blocking techniques. Or is it possible that Ron Turner is so dumb he just refuses to call running plays that use these techniques by always running at the same point of attack? Sorry I don't have more info to work with but I don't have time to research right now as I'm busy fixing my car.

[ParkerBear7]

I think I would rather have Forte and Cutler than Turner and Brohm.

 

 

I absolutely rather have Culter and Forte to build around. I personally like to live life forward and not dwell on past mistakes or what have you. The important thing to do is learn from past experince and make better decision going forward. With that said I think the Bears are a few players away from being a good team on both side of the ball but it must start with a rebuilt offensive line.

[jason]

Honestly, I can't think of very many halfbacks in the NFL that could have carried a subpar team on their backs the way Forte did last year. He WAS our running game, and most of our passing game too, all with very little help. Turner's awesome at what he does, but he couldn't have done what Forte did.

 

The sad thing is, one of the first RBs that come to mind would be Thomas Jones, who also carried our team when we lacked at OL, QB and WR. Thomas Jones not only was capable of hard yards, but also big plays and was a solid receiver too.

 

Regarding Turner, while I agree w/ some of what you said, don't be so quick to take away from him either. While he did have a solid OL last year, he also had a rookie QB and teams were absolutely stacking the box to stop him. I agree he would not look nearly so good behind our OL. I just don't want to take away from what he is or has done. The pieces were absolutely not all in place when he took over, as they had a rookie QB.

 

Final point. Nice to go back and talk "what-ifs" but even if we did sign Turner, does anyone truly believe we would have used that 2nd round pick on an OL? Heck, if fans recall, many (myself included) were looking at that 2nd round pick for a QB. Brian Brohm was the favorite of many, and from what I have read, he has sucked for GB. Henne was another, though fewer Chi fans liked him.

 

I think I would rather have Forte and Cutler than Turner and Brohm.

 

Which is why I was so opposed to drafting Benson. It seems like this stuff is cyclical.

 

Bears have Thomas Jones.

Bears don't need RB.

Bears draft Cedric Benson.

Bears get rid of Thomas Jones.

Bears don't need RB.

Bears get rid of Cedric Benson.

Bears draft Matt Forte.

Bears don't need RB.

 

What's next? For some odd reason, I think the Bears are going to get rid of Forte before he's had time to truly show his worth, and it'll be because this OL stinks.

[nfoligno]

You and I have always been on a different page a bit when it comes to TJ/Benson. I was not against drafting Benson. TJ was simply not the proven stud at the time that he becamse after we drafted Benson. Add in that he was basically a bust for two prior teams, and went down w/ injury most every year of his career, and I simply understood drafting a RB when you felt you were looking at a "special" player.

 

Frankly, most anytime you are in the draft and believe you are looking at a truly "special" player, I think you should do it. I remember when we drafted Urlacher. Minter was our MLB at the time, and while not elite by any means, he was solid and we had far greater holes. But I think most would agree drafting Urlacher was the right move. It does not always workout that the player you believed was a special player turns out to be so, but I just can't fault drafting such a player, even if over greater needs.

 

And no way I can fault the team for drafting Forte, though as I am sure you will recall, I was all for OL that year as well. But Benson was not only unproven, but had so many character red flags that there was simply plenty of reason to question him too.

 

Understand, you have few peers on this board as strong as I in the fight for OL. At the same time, while I fully agree our OL has been in major need for years, that does not always mean our drafting a RB was always the wrong way to go.

 

Which is why I was so opposed to drafting Benson. It seems like this stuff is cyclical.

 

Bears have Thomas Jones.

Bears don't need RB.

Bears draft Cedric Benson.

Bears get rid of Thomas Jones.

Bears don't need RB.

Bears get rid of Cedric Benson.

Bears draft Matt Forte.

Bears don't need RB.

 

What's next? For some odd reason, I think the Bears are going to get rid of Forte before he's had time to truly show his worth, and it'll be because this OL stinks.