2008 draft class

[Connorbear]

What are your thoughts on their performance so far?

 

1st - Williams

2nd - Forte

3rd - Bennett

3rd - Harrison

4th - Steltz

5th - Bowman

5th - Davis

6th - Baldwin (gone)

7th - ?

 

Throw in Hanie as UDFA and DA and Roach who we snagged off of other teams practice squads.

 

To me, this is actually shaping up as a fairly good group. Thoughts?

 

Peace

[azbearsfan]

What are your thoughts on their performance so far?

 

1st - Williams

2nd - Forte

3rd - Bennett

3rd - Harrison

4th - Steltz

5th - Bowman

5th - Davis

6th - Baldwin (gone)

7th - ?

 

Throw in Hanie as UDFA and DA and Roach who we snagged off of other teams practice squads.

 

To me, this is actually shaping up as a fairly good group. Thoughts?

 

Peace

 

I agree.

 

Williams looked a heck of a lot better at LT the last two games. Forte is good but was hurt. Bennett looks solid so far. Harrison is fat. To me, the best value is Bowman, he does get hurt but he can make plays. He still needs to work out man coverage, but he could be a starter. Davis looked good this year too.

 

[Mongo3451]

What are your thoughts on their performance so far?

 

1st - Williams

2nd - Forte

3rd - Bennett

3rd - Harrison

4th - Steltz

5th - Bowman

5th - Davis

6th - Baldwin (gone)

7th - ?

 

Throw in Hanie as UDFA and DA and Roach who we snagged off of other teams practice squads.

 

To me, this is actually shaping up as a fairly good group. Thoughts?

 

Peace

That's actually pretty damn good

[madlithuanian]

1 - Williams appears to be getting it towards the end. However, was that Willimas getting it, or that we landed Minny at the right time when they weren't all that hungry and got the JV squad from Detroit. I'd like to think it's an upside.

2 - Forte - Loved last year, hated this year. he dropped the injury excuse bomb. I don't like that. Seemed like a stand up guy and now seems like he's one of many excuse guys. I'm concerned. But, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

3 - Bennett - Seems OK. Would have like the staff to have given him reps last season. But if he improves next, like he did this past...he could be a decent possession guy. I don't see him as a real breakthrough guy. Just a solid contributor.

3 - Harrison. Scream sot me of bust. Has character issues, did very little this past season, and same into camp like a lump of turd.

4- I've actually always liked Steltz when he plays. He appreas to practice like crud, but seems to do well game time. I'd like this guy to get a legit shot. But I fear this staff will have it's mind made up by signing some other ex-Ram that is now a has-been.

5- Bowman. Like his upside. Injury prone it appears though.

6 - Davis - Love the guy. Needs to be used more often. Big target.

7 - Baldwin - who? Useless.

Hanie - not enough to really make a call on. I like his attitude and some of what I've seen in pre-season. I think we still may need a more legit back-up when a real coaching staff is in place and we start to make a run.

Roach - decent back-up. Nothing to get too excited about I think.

 

 

 

What are your thoughts on their performance so far?

 

1st - Williams

2nd - Forte

3rd - Bennett

3rd - Harrison

4th - Steltz

5th - Bowman

5th - Davis

6th - Baldwin (gone)

7th - ?

 

Throw in Hanie as UDFA and DA and Roach who we snagged off of other teams practice squads.

 

To me, this is actually shaping up as a fairly good group. Thoughts?

 

Peace

 

[defiantgiant]

My two cents: the 2008 draft class is looking good, but several important players need to prove they can stay healthy before the group gets a passing grade.

 

1st - Williams: Looked capable once he moved back to his natural position. Is getting better about penalties, and he stonewalled Jared Allen (without help on at least 15 snaps) in the Vikings game without giving up a sack. Pretty decent run-blocker for a left tackle, especially after Pace. However, the back injury is a major long-term concern, and it's one Angelo knew about. Some o-linemen can play a whole career through disc issues and stenosis, but for other guys it can be a career-ender. Williams' draft grade depends very much on whether he's the former or the latter.

2nd - Forte: Good all-around back, not spectacular in any one area. Suffered from really poor run-blocking for most of this season, and games where Turner just abandoned the run. Still, he was good value for his draft position, unless his hamstring/MCL issues crop up again next season.

3rd - Bennett: Appears to have hit his ceiling. May never be better than a possession/slot receiver, but he should be fine in that role.

3rd - Harrison: Looks like a bust. Showed up way out of shape, and then flat-out admitted that he got outplayed by Anthony Adams. He's talented, but unless he turns it around he's not going to be anything. Still, taking a gamble on a first-round talent in the late third isn't that stupid.

4th - Steltz: Not so great in coverage. He's a pretty good special teamer, but looks stretched as a starter.

5th - Bowman: Looks like a VERY capable starter, but again, has to prove he can stay healthy long-term. Major injury issues.

5th - Davis: Looks like a great pickup. Getting much better as a blocker, and he's turning into a major red-zone threat.

7th - Ervin Baldwin/Chester Adams/Joey LaRocque/Kirk Barton/Marcus Monk: All gone.

 

[madlithuanian]

We look to be preety much on the same page...

[nfoligno]

If that draft class turns out, as it appears it might:

 

Franchise LT

Franchise RB

Starting WR (or even solid slot, possession WR)

Staring CB

 

...it would make for a damn good class. Even w/ Harrison as a bust, getting 4 starters, especially if two are franchise caliber guys at premier positions, would make for a damn good class. Then throw in a potential starting SS and solid TE depth guy w/ later pick, and I think it is a pretty dang good looking class.

 

Williams will continue to be the greatest key. If he continues to develop and mans our left side for years, that would make the draft nearly by itself, as LT is simply of such a premier position.

 

My two cents: the 2008 draft class is looking good, but several important players need to prove they can stay healthy before the group gets a passing grade.

 

1st - Williams: Looked capable once he moved back to his natural position. Is getting better about penalties, and he stonewalled Jared Allen (without help on at least 15 snaps) in the Vikings game without giving up a sack. Pretty decent run-blocker for a left tackle, especially after Pace. However, the back injury is a major long-term concern, and it's one Angelo knew about. Some o-linemen can play a whole career through disc issues and stenosis, but for other guys it can be a career-ender. Williams' draft grade depends very much on whether he's the former or the latter.

2nd - Forte: Good all-around back, not spectacular in any one area. Suffered from really poor run-blocking for most of this season, and games where Turner just abandoned the run. Still, he was good value for his draft position, unless his hamstring/MCL issues crop up again next season.

3rd - Bennett: Appears to have hit his ceiling. May never be better than a possession/slot receiver, but he should be fine in that role.

3rd - Harrison: Looks like a bust. Showed up way out of shape, and then flat-out admitted that he got outplayed by Anthony Adams. He's talented, but unless he turns it around he's not going to be anything. Still, taking a gamble on a first-round talent in the late third isn't that stupid.

4th - Steltz: Not so great in coverage. He's a pretty good special teamer, but looks stretched as a starter.

5th - Bowman: Looks like a VERY capable starter, but again, has to prove he can stay healthy long-term. Major injury issues.

5th - Davis: Looks like a great pickup. Getting much better as a blocker, and he's turning into a major red-zone threat.

7th - Ervin Baldwin/Chester Adams/Joey LaRocque/Kirk Barton/Marcus Monk: All gone.

 

[madlithuanian]

As good as that sounds, and to be negative...shouldn't all drafts turn out that way? Whay do we appear pleased when the rarity happens?

 

If that draft class turns out, as it appears it might:

 

Franchise LT

Franchise RB

Starting WR (or even solid slot, possession WR)

Staring CB

 

...it would make for a damn good class. Even w/ Harrison as a bust, getting 4 starters, especially if two are franchise caliber guys at premier positions, would make for a damn good class. Then throw in a potential starting SS and solid TE depth guy w/ later pick, and I think it is a pretty dang good looking class.

 

Williams will continue to be the greatest key. If he continues to develop and mans our left side for years, that would make the draft nearly by itself, as LT is simply of such a premier position.

 

[nfoligno]

Honestly, I am not sure this is as much the norm as you think. If teams regularly got 4 starters from each draft, you wouldn't see much activity in FA. There are a few rare teams that may find such success common, but I don't think this would be nearly the norm you think.

 

I think 4 starters would be considered a very good draft for any team. If you put a franchise LT and RB in that mix, that grade jumps way up. If Bowman doesn't just start, but becomes a truly good starting CB, the grade soars.

 

But again, for me, it really is all about Williams. Finding a good RB is great. Finding a good possession WR is nice. Getting a quality CB is great. But none of those come close to finding a franchise LT.

 

Any year you find yourself a franchise player, it pretty much makes there draft, but there are a few positions that are simply higher IMHO. QB, LT, Pass rusher (DE or DT) and CB.

 

For the record, I am not declaring Williams to be a franchise LT. Only saying that he looked pretty damn good when finally moved to LT.

 

As good as that sounds, and to be negative...shouldn't all drafts turn out that way? Whay do we appear pleased when the rarity happens?

 

[madlithuanian]

I think it's more the norm for good franchises. And as good as the potential looks...we'll need to see how it indeed plays out.

 

 

 

Honestly, I am not sure this is as much the norm as you think. If teams regularly got 4 starters from each draft, you wouldn't see much activity in FA. There are a few rare teams that may find such success common, but I don't think this would be nearly the norm you think.

 

I think 4 starters would be considered a very good draft for any team. If you put a franchise LT and RB in that mix, that grade jumps way up. If Bowman doesn't just start, but becomes a truly good starting CB, the grade soars.

 

But again, for me, it really is all about Williams. Finding a good RB is great. Finding a good possession WR is nice. Getting a quality CB is great. But none of those come close to finding a franchise LT.

 

Any year you find yourself a franchise player, it pretty much makes there draft, but there are a few positions that are simply higher IMHO. QB, LT, Pass rusher (DE or DT) and CB.

 

For the record, I am not declaring Williams to be a franchise LT. Only saying that he looked pretty damn good when finally moved to LT.

 

[Connorbear]

I think it's more the norm for good franchises. And as good as the potential looks...we'll need to see how it indeed plays out.

I think I remember an analyst saying that getting 2 quality starters off of any draft is a successful draft.

 

Peace

[DABEARSDABOMB]

As good as that sounds, and to be negative...shouldn't all drafts turn out that way? Whay do we appear pleased when the rarity happens?

That type of draft is incredibly rare and it is what seperate the elite GM's from the not so elite. Angelo has a pretty darn good track-record at drafting talent and a lot of you guys constantly under-sell him and the organization, imo.

 

Go down the lists, pick even the great teams, and you'll see most would be pretty exstatic to have that 2008 draft class.

[madlithuanian]

OK, let's be honest. Only Williams, Forte, and Bowman are really potential "starters" at this point. And Forte has many concerned. So to say we've got 4 is pushing it a little. When you have garbage, and a guy you have is starting, that doesn't make him a real starter. Like how poepl kept telling us how Hester was a #1 receiver.

 

Don't get me wrong...it's a good draft I believe. However, tha vast majoirty of Angelo's other drafts are long gone and/or busts...

 

I don not feel Angelo has a good track record. I feel he's average at best.

 

That type of draft is incredibly rare and it is what seperate the elite GM's from the not so elite. Angelo has a pretty darn good track-record at drafting talent and a lot of you guys constantly under-sell him and the organization, imo.

 

Go down the lists, pick even the great teams, and you'll see most would be pretty exstatic to have that 2008 draft class.

 

[DABEARSDABOMB]

OK, let's be honest. Only Williams, Forte, and Bowman are really potential "starters" at this point. And Forte has many concerned. So to say we've got 4 is pushing it a little. When you have garbage, and a guy you have is starting, that doesn't make him a real starter. Like how poepl kept telling us how Hester was a #1 receiver.

 

Don't get me wrong...it's a good draft I believe. However, tha vast majoirty of Angelo's other drafts are long gone and/or busts...

 

I don not feel Angelo has a good track record. I feel he's average at best.

Forte was the best rookie rb in the NFL last year and played this year on one leg most of the season. I'd be hard pressed to not see how he isn't considered a bonafide starter. He was one of the elite RB's in the league in his rookie season.

 

Yes the 2nd year wasn't so good, but most teams in the league would take Forte and start him.

 

Bennett is a borderline starter and a very good 3rd wideout and as much as you guys are ripping on Harrison, he's two years into the league, has a lot of talent, and appeared to be humbled by his 2nd season which could be a strong indication that he has a pretty big season next year.

[Connorbear]

Bennett is a borderline starter and a very good 3rd wideout and as much as you guys are ripping on Harrison, he's two years into the league, has a lot of talent, and appeared to be humbled by his 2nd season which could be a strong indication that he has a pretty big season next year.

Bennett reminds me alot of Bobby Engram (a possession receiver with limited speed but great hands and route running). Engram was in the league for over 10 years. IMHO, Bennett has alot of value in this league.

 

Everyone is overlooking DA. I realize he was not drafted last yr, but Angelo did pull him off of another teams practice squad (similar to Roach). He looks like a strong #2 and possibly a #1 with development.

 

Peace

 

[madlithuanian]

Salaam looked pretty good his first season too. I hope Forte is having his sohpomore slump. But I am concerned. I also don't like his excuse of playing hurt. Seems a bit convenient now and bad players looks for excuses. But I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. And while he led in yards, his average was poor as nfo pointed out numerous time last year when I was drinking kool-aid like free Guinness at St. James' Gate...

 

Not sure most would take and start.... Is he better than:

 

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tab...mp;d-447263-n=1

 

1. AP

2. Chris Johnson

3. Steven Jackson

4. Cedric Benson

5. Thomas jones

6. MJD

7. Ray Rice

8. Jonathan Stewart

9. Jamaal Charles

10. Ricky Williams

11. Frank Gore

12. Ryan Grant

13. Rashard Mendenhall

14. Fred Jackson

15. DeAngelo Williams

16. Moreno

17. Barber

 

All these guys had better years than Forte. That's over 50% of the runners, and 2 on one team. Forte needs to prove more.

 

Bennett is borderline. And on a team with a real #1 WR, he'd be a bench warmer like he was for us last year. I'll let you say Harrison was humbled by this past season when he shows up in shape and on a tear this upcoming training camp. Until then, it's lip service from him.

 

 

 

Forte was the best rookie rb in the NFL last year and played this year on one leg most of the season. I'd be hard pressed to not see how he isn't considered a bonafide starter. He was one of the elite RB's in the league in his rookie season.

 

Yes the 2nd year wasn't so good, but most teams in the league would take Forte and start him.

 

Bennett is a borderline starter and a very good 3rd wideout and as much as you guys are ripping on Harrison, he's two years into the league, has a lot of talent, and appeared to be humbled by his 2nd season which could be a strong indication that he has a pretty big season next year.

 

[madlithuanian]

Let's not annoint Bennett the new Engram yet Connor! There are similarities, but to say this guy will be solid for 10 years is a reach!

 

DA was a great pick up... But FA booms and busts are another discussion... For every DA (who really has yet to to a thing in a meaningful game), there's an Archuetta...or Pace...etc.

 

Bennett reminds me alot of Bobby Engram (a possession receiver with limited speed but great hands and route running). Engram was in the league for over 10 years. IMHO, Bennett has alot of value in this league.

 

Everyone is overlooking DA. I realize he was not drafted last yr, but Angelo did pull him off of another teams practice squad (similar to Roach). He looks like a strong #2 and possibly a #1 with development.

 

Peace

 

[Connorbear]

Let's not annoint Bennett the new Engram yet Connor! There are similarities, but to say this guy will be solid for 10 years is a reach!

 

DA was a great pick up... But FA booms and busts are another discussion... For every DA (who really has yet to to a thing in a meaningful game), there's an Archuetta...or Pace...etc.

IMHO I see Bennett with the same skill set as Engram. I could see him as a solid contributor with us for some time.

 

I don't see Roach and DA as regular FA pickups. They were pulled from other teams practice squads during the season. I was specifically talking about additions to the roster last year.

 

Peace

[balta1701-A]

Forte was the best rookie rb in the NFL last year and played this year on one leg most of the season. I'd be hard pressed to not see how he isn't considered a bonafide starter. He was one of the elite RB's in the league in his rookie season.

 

No offense...but 2nd best.

[madlithuanian]

Contributor yes...as good as Engram...I just don't see it yet.

 

Roach made a ton of blunders. And I'm not quite ready to annoint DA the end all be all. He's a bit small and I wonder if he can take the rigors of a season. He was injured at the onset. Good pickup for sure. And DA could prove very worthy. Roach I'm just not as sold on. I like what I saw out of Jamar more.

 

IMHO I see Bennett with the same skill set as Engram. I could see him as a solid contributor with us for some time.

 

I don't see Roach and DA as regular FA pickups. They were pulled from other teams practice squads during the season. I was specifically talking about additions to the roster last year.

 

Peace

 

[nfoligno]

Salaam looked pretty good his first season too. I hope Forte is having his sohpomore slump. But I am concerned. I also don't like his excuse of playing hurt. Seems a bit convenient now and bad players looks for excuses. But I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. And while he led in yards, his average was poor as nfo pointed out numerous time last year when I was drinking kool-aid like free Guinness at St. James' Gate...

 

I said all year it seemed like he was hurt, but at the same time, I do agree. It always feel a tad "convenient" when a player who struggled through the year comes out AFTER THE SEASON is over to say he was playing hurt. Doesn't mean it isn't true. For example, when it came out late that Reuben Brown was playing w/ one arm, there was plenty of proof and evidence of how bad the injury was. Something like w/ Forte is harder to provide evidence, but as a radio guy here always says, "just watch the damn game". Flat out, Forte did not seem to have the burst or speed he did last year. That isn't something that just happens in a sophmore slump. That is something that happens when a player is hurt.

 

Okay, the jury is still out on a final grade, but at the end of the day, Forte has 2,167 rushing yards and just under 1,000 receiving yards after two years. Those are great numbers for a 2nd round pick. Period.

 

All these guys had better years than Forte. That's over 50% of the runners, and 2 on one team. Forte needs to prove more.

 

It should be pointed out though that Forte had more rushing yards than all but 3 of those guys the prior year. Many of those players are coming off a better year, but have just as much to prove as they didn't have the prior success, and thus could flop next year the way Forte did this year.

 

Bennett is borderline. And on a team with a real #1 WR, he'd be a bench warmer like he was for us last year.

 

You could just as easily argue that Bennett could look far better on a team with a real #1. The fact is though, Bennett was a starter, and put up solid numbers in his first year as a starter.

 

I'll let you say Harrison was humbled by this past season when he shows up in shape and on a tear this upcoming training camp. Until then, it's lip service from him.

 

Agreed here.

 

Seriously though, I think you have a bit of a lofty idea of what the norm is. As I think Conner, or maybe someone else said, while you always hope for the best, 2 starters is about the norm from a draft. Not just from the bears, but around the league. Getting 3 or 4 starters, as well as a couple more contributors, makes that draft a damn good one, by anyones standards. Now, the final grades have yet to be doles out, and I still believe the key is Williams. If Williams becomes a 10 year starting LT, then that draft is a A in my book no matter what happens with the rest.

[nfoligno]

I said this before, but I still believe the Engram-like player is going to end up being Iglesias. It blows my mind we could not get him playing time this year, just as we couldn't for Bennett his rookie year. Iglesias, in college, was a very smart player who picked up the playbook quickly and was a superior route runner. It is simply difficult for me to believe he couldn't grasp our playbook, or his route running suddenly was bad. Bennett is a good route runner, and has good hands, but I think Iglesias will prove the superior player. I think he is very much like Engram, but frankly, Iglesias has more burst. He doesn't have elite 40 speed, so he won't win a ton of go routes, but has exceptional burst in and out of breaks, and can rack up the yards after the catch.

 

Honestly, I am pretty excited about our WR corp. DA showed a ton at the end of the season. Not only did he appear on the same page as Cutler, but I love the way he times his jumps and go up to get the ball at its highest point. That is something I dont' think any of our other receivers (or Olsen) do. I like the possession ability Bennett brings. I love the downfield potential of Knox. I still think Hester can be dangerous if his roles (best suited to the slot) is changes. And I still believe Iglesias will prove to be a damn good WR.

 

I believe (hope) we upgrade the OL. Combine that with a better OC, and I think the group of young WRs we currently have will prove to be a damn good group.

 

Bennett reminds me alot of Bobby Engram (a possession receiver with limited speed but great hands and route running). Engram was in the league for over 10 years. IMHO, Bennett has alot of value in this league.

 

Everyone is overlooking DA. I realize he was not drafted last yr, but Angelo did pull him off of another teams practice squad (similar to Roach). He looks like a strong #2 and possibly a #1 with development.

 

Peace

 

[madlithuanian]

No arguement on your assessment of Frote. My comment regardin the other RB's was simply to point out that Forte isn't the stud we were hoping he'd be. Many others are performing as well or better. And that theline to bring him on one's team isn't quite as long as we'd hope. But I do think he's in the top 1/3 at the moment.

 

At best, we can only give Bennett an incomplete with high hopes....

 

I think I was just a bitter man when posting. Our 2008 draft is a good one it would appear. I am just annoyed that so many others before that and what looks like after that aren't remotely as good.

 

Salaam looked pretty good his first season too. I hope Forte is having his sohpomore slump. But I am concerned. I also don't like his excuse of playing hurt. Seems a bit convenient now and bad players looks for excuses. But I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. And while he led in yards, his average was poor as nfo pointed out numerous time last year when I was drinking kool-aid like free Guinness at St. James' Gate...

 

I said all year it seemed like he was hurt, but at the same time, I do agree. It always feel a tad "convenient" when a player who struggled through the year comes out AFTER THE SEASON is over to say he was playing hurt. Doesn't mean it isn't true. For example, when it came out late that Reuben Brown was playing w/ one arm, there was plenty of proof and evidence of how bad the injury was. Something like w/ Forte is harder to provide evidence, but as a radio guy here always says, "just watch the damn game". Flat out, Forte did not seem to have the burst or speed he did last year. That isn't something that just happens in a sophmore slump. That is something that happens when a player is hurt.

 

Okay, the jury is still out on a final grade, but at the end of the day, Forte has 2,167 rushing yards and just under 1,000 receiving yards after two years. Those are great numbers for a 2nd round pick. Period.

 

All these guys had better years than Forte. That's over 50% of the runners, and 2 on one team. Forte needs to prove more.

 

It should be pointed out though that Forte had more rushing yards than all but 3 of those guys the prior year. Many of those players are coming off a better year, but have just as much to prove as they didn't have the prior success, and thus could flop next year the way Forte did this year.

 

Bennett is borderline. And on a team with a real #1 WR, he'd be a bench warmer like he was for us last year.

 

You could just as easily argue that Bennett could look far better on a team with a real #1. The fact is though, Bennett was a starter, and put up solid numbers in his first year as a starter.

 

I'll let you say Harrison was humbled by this past season when he shows up in shape and on a tear this upcoming training camp. Until then, it's lip service from him.

 

Agreed here.

 

Seriously though, I think you have a bit of a lofty idea of what the norm is. As I think Conner, or maybe someone else said, while you always hope for the best, 2 starters is about the norm from a draft. Not just from the bears, but around the league. Getting 3 or 4 starters, as well as a couple more contributors, makes that draft a damn good one, by anyones standards. Now, the final grades have yet to be doles out, and I still believe the key is Williams. If Williams becomes a 10 year starting LT, then that draft is a A in my book no matter what happens with the rest.

 

[DABEARSDABOMB]

No offense...but 2nd best.

Last year you could have made the case that Forte was better than Johnson because he carried the load and had less around him.

 

Clearly Johnson backed up his rookie campaign and is now the best RB in the NFL.

[Connorbear]

No arguement on your assessment of Frote. My comment regardin the other RB's was simply to point out that Forte isn't the stud we were hoping he'd be. Many others are performing as well or better. And that theline to bring him on one's team isn't quite as long as we'd hope. But I do think he's in the top 1/3 at the moment.

 

At best, we can only give Bennett an incomplete with high hopes....

 

I think I was just a bitter man when posting. Our 2008 draft is a good one it would appear. I am just annoyed that so many others before that and what looks like after that aren't remotely as good.

Agreed. I was just talking about 2008. Most of his other drafts are below average to crap.

 

Peace