FA Running Backs:

[DABEARSDABOMB]

The rumblings around Chicago are that the Bears will look to sign a big-time back-up running back to team up with Matt Forte and LT (Cap Casualty)/Chester Taylor (UFA) are expected to be guys the Bears consider.

 

Evidently McGahee might be joining that group and I think he could be a real nice fit if he does get cut. LT and Chester Taylor are also real nice fits. And no matter what, it seems like we have a few real good options to help improve our rushing attack (from the RB perspective).

 

Willis McGahee done with Ravens?

As running back Willis McGahee packed his suitcase in the locker room following a 20-3 AFC divisional playoff loss to the Indianapolis Colts, he wasn’t certain whether it was his last game playing for the Baltimore Ravens. Signed to a seven-year, $40.12 contract following a trade from the Buffalo Bills three years ago that included $15 million in guaranteed money, McGahee is due a $3.6 million salary next season. Even if this does turn out to be an uncapped year if a new collective bargaining agreement isn’t brokered, it’s still a lot of money to pay a backup running back with Pro Bowl selection Ray Rice entrenched as the starter. Whatever happens, McGahee said he’s unconcerned about his future after tying a franchise record by scoring14 touchdowns in a reserve role. “No doubt about it, I still have a lot left in my tank,” McGahee said. “Right now, I’ll let them handle it when the time comes. “Man, I ain’t even worried about it right now to tell you the truth. If I do, I do. If I don’t, I don’t. It is what it is. Who knows what the future holds for me? Sky’s the limit.” — Carroll County Times

[Chitownhustla]

The rumblings around Chicago are that the Bears will look to sign a big-time back-up running back to team up with Matt Forte and LT (Cap Casualty)/Chester Taylor (UFA) are expected to be guys the Bears consider.

 

Evidently McGahee might be joining that group and I think he could be a real nice fit if he does get cut. LT and Chester Taylor are also real nice fits. And no matter what, it seems like we have a few real good options to help improve our rushing attack (from the RB perspective).

 

[/i][/b]

 

I would be happy with all three. Chester having the least amount of INJ concerns.

[balta1701-A]

Which one of them is the best blocker?

[defiantgiant]

Which one of them is the best blocker?

 

They're all pretty good at it. Taylor might have the best blocking technique, but he's also the smallest of the three. Personally, I'd like for the Bears to go with McGahee. He's a monster in short-yardage (12 rushing TDs this season for Baltimore,) which the Bears desperately need. He's also two years younger than LT and Taylor. True, he's been a little dinged up, but he's never missed more than 3 games in a season, and he hasn't fallen off a cliff the way that LT has. Hell, he averaged 5 yards a carry splitting time with Ray Rice. And since Ray Rice and Forte are somewhat similar backs (good at receiving out of the backfield, shifty, not great at pushing the pile) I think a Forte-McGahee tandem would probably work the same way as Rice-McGahee in Baltimore.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

I think (hope) the Bears learned their lesson after the Thomas Jones / Cedric Benson affair from a few years ago. If you recall, Benson was labeled the whiner as he didn't get the ball enough (especially as a number 4 overall pick) so off went TJ. Then a bit later off went Benson. I think leaving things as they are, in the RB dept, is the best course of action. Forte will get better and I think there is something there with Bell. And I believe that Wolfe offers a different angle with his size and Sproles - like ability. I think upsetting the apple cart at this point would prove detrimental, especially with a malcontent like McGahee. If it came down to it and the Bears thought they HAD to have another back then I'd say go with Taylor. He's a real decent player and person. Reminds me a lot of TJ in fact.

 

I say the money needs to go toward a WR (Marshall, Cribbs or even Harrison) and OL.

[nfoligno]

Not sure McGahee would want this. He never wanted the Rice-McGahee tandem thing, and never seemed to fond of it. It is one thing to say what it best for a player, but another thing entirely for a player to realize and accept that. I think McGahee still considers himself as a 1a type RB, and will be seeking a team that will give him the top spot on the roster. If no one looks at him that way, maybe he changes his mind, but I think someone will.

 

Taylor on the other hand seems very accepting of such a role player role.

 

They're all pretty good at it. Taylor might have the best blocking technique, but he's also the smallest of the three. Personally, I'd like for the Bears to go with McGahee. He's a monster in short-yardage (12 rushing TDs this season for Baltimore,) which the Bears desperately need. He's also two years younger than LT and Taylor. True, he's been a little dinged up, but he's never missed more than 3 games in a season, and he hasn't fallen off a cliff the way that LT has. Hell, he averaged 5 yards a carry splitting time with Ray Rice. And since Ray Rice and Forte are somewhat similar backs (good at receiving out of the backfield, shifty, not great at pushing the pile) I think a Forte-McGahee tandem would probably work the same way as Rice-McGahee in Baltimore.

 

[nfoligno]

I think (hope) the Bears learned their lesson after the Thomas Jones / Cedric Benson affair from a few years ago. If you recall, Benson was labeled the whiner as he didn't get the ball enough (especially as a number 4 overall pick) so off went TJ. Then a bit later off went Benson. I think leaving things as they are, in the RB dept, is the best course of action. Forte will get better and I think there is something there with Bell. And I believe that Wolfe offers a different angle with his size and Sproles - like ability. I think upsetting the apple cart at this point would prove detrimental, especially with a malcontent like McGahee. If it came down to it and the Bears thought they HAD to have another back then I'd say go with Taylor. He's a real decent player and person. Reminds me a lot of TJ in fact.

 

While I am less confident in our "apple cart" I do agree w/ avoiding McGahee. Taylor would be a much better fit.

 

I say the money needs to go toward a WR (Marshall, Cribbs or even Harrison) and OL.

 

One, disagree we put money to the WR position. I like our WRs, quite a bit, and would like to see how some develop further w/ an improved OL. Funny how, later in the year Cuter had more time, and suddenly our WRs look pretty damn good. As for your examples,

 

Marshall - I don't think he is going to be an UFA, and we don't have the ammo to trade for him, even if we wanted to.

Cribbs - Um, not a WR. Hester is more of a WR than Cribbs. We already tries to take an elite return man and make him into something he is not. You really want to try and do this again?

Harrison - Seriously. His game was going downhill fast. Not a team in the league wanted him last year, and now he is simply a year older and further removed.

 

I am not saying that we should not even consider adding a WR, but I sure don't want to put any legit amount of money there. IMHO, there are 4 areas of top ticket need (OL, DL, FS, CB). I doubt we can afford DL or CB, as those two units are simply so expensive. I think we should be able to afford OL and FS though.

[lemonej]

I think (hope) the Bears learned their lesson after the Thomas Jones / Cedric Benson affair from a few years ago. If you recall, Benson was labeled the whiner as he didn't get the ball enough (especially as a number 4 overall pick) so off went TJ. Then a bit later off went Benson. I think leaving things as they are, in the RB dept, is the best course of action. Forte will get better and I think there is something there with Bell. And I believe that Wolfe offers a different angle with his size and Sproles - like ability. I think upsetting the apple cart at this point would prove detrimental, especially with a malcontent like McGahee. If it came down to it and the Bears thought they HAD to have another back then I'd say go with Taylor. He's a real decent player and person. Reminds me a lot of TJ in fact.

 

I say the money needs to go toward a WR (Marshall, Cribbs or even Harrison) and OL.

A Grizz the problem through the years with this team is that they haven't upset the "apple cart" enough. IMO if I had been JA I would have kept a pissed off TJ and Benson because it seems that animosity served the team well. Now we have a bunch of guys who supposedly like each other and they have missed the playoffs 3 straight years.

 

As for Bell he is what he is an undrafted free agent RB we have gotten more than we expected from him and if he gives us anything more we should be considered fortunate.The Steelers unearthed a gem like Willie Parker and still used a first round pick on Mendenhall. This is how successful teams operate and the Bears should start to do the same.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

"Marshall - I don't think he is going to be an UFA, and we don't have the ammo to trade for him, even if we wanted to."

 

Actually I believe Marshall will be an RFA and regardless I hear Seattle is making a push for him. With Carroll now there, things could get challenging for a team like the Bears to go into a bidding war. And as far as "ammo" I would offer up a player like Urlacher or even Hester in trade talks and entertain whatever the team the Bears talk to in regards to other players. The Bears are most definitely in the "beggas can't be choosers" role this next year.

 

"Cribbs - Um, not a WR. Hester is more of a WR than Cribbs. We already tries to take an elite return man and make him into something he is not. You really want to try and do this again?"

 

Cribbs is actually listed as WR even though he played QB in college (compared to Hester's prior experience at CB). And his size (6'1" 215) versus Hester (5'11" 190) makes him a much more targetable WR. Especially given his speed and weight. He would be a great over the middle type receiver. He is more along the size of Aromashadu who I definitely hope the Bears keep around. As far as the rest; Knox - maybe one to two years left with speed being his main attribute (and depending on his later season injury), Bennett - I like him as a #3 in most cases. Beyond that they can all go.

 

"Harrison - Seriously. His game was going downhill fast. Not a team in the league wanted him last year, and now he is simply a year older and further removed."

 

All the more reason to consider him. The Bears won't have a lot in the way of bargaining chips to offer up so why not try him out for one year? Think Muhammad. He was a great pick up for the Bears who did OK (probably due to Orton running the offense) but when he returned to Carolina he turned out to be a pretty good utility receiver behind Steve Smith.

 

Another few notables that I totally forgot about; Anquan Boldin will probably be looking for a new home and next to Cutler I would be willing just about to give anything to bring him in as a #1 WR. Since Angelo tried once already maybe Boldin will appreciate that fact and appreciate that he would be the man at WR if he came to Chicago.

 

The list continues: Antonio Bryant, Steve Breaston, Braylon Edwards (probably too much money and depends on how far the Jets make it), Josh Reed and Troy Williamson - once a first rounder who recently was heard to say that he would like to "duke it out with Brad Childress". That would be fun to see especially since he could see him twice in the same year.

 

One other notable RB to consider is Leon Washington. He will probably be the odd man out with the Jets with TJ being the perrenial 1,000 yard back and the surge of the rookie Green. Washington definitely has the game breaker ability and has shown he could play alongside another showcase RB, in this case Forte.

 

"I am not saying that we should not even consider adding a WR, but I sure don't want to put any legit amount of money there. IMHO, there are 4 areas of top ticket need (OL, DL, FS, CB). I doubt we can afford DL or CB, as those two units are simply so expensive. I think we should be able to afford OL and FS though."

 

Agreed. But in the long run a lot of what comes down the pike in regards to eventually signing players depends on who is chosen as the new OC.

[Alaskan Grizzly]

"IMO if I had been JA I would have kept a pissed off TJ and Benson because it seems that animosity served the team well. Now we have a bunch of guys who supposedly like each other and they have missed the playoffs 3 straight years."

 

Actutally, I don't think TJ was "pissed off" until he was traded away to the Jets (until he found himself one game away from returning to the Super Bowl that is). Conversely, Benson was "pissed off" before. And I don't think that there are a bunch of players that "like each other" ergo Cutler and Urlacher, on this team.

 

"As for Bell he is what he is an undrafted free agent RB we have gotten more than we expected from him and if he gives us anything more we should be considered fortunate.The Steelers unearthed a gem like Willie Parker and still used a first round pick on Mendenhall."

 

I'm not sure of the point here. Bell could very well be the "gem" you compare to in Willie Parker so why would you think the Bears should consider a high pick like Mendenhall if Forte is already in the mix?

 

"This is how successful teams (Pittsburgh) operate and the Bears should start to do the same."

 

Sorry, I didn't realize that 9-7 and out of the playoffs was considerd "successful".

 

 

 

[lemonej]

"Marshall - I don't think he is going to be an UFA, and we don't have the ammo to trade for him, even if we wanted to."

 

Actually I believe Marshall will be an RFA and regardless I hear Seattle is making a push for him. With Carroll now there, things could get challenging for a team like the Bears to go into a bidding war. And as far as "ammo" I would offer up a player like Urlacher or even Hester in trade talks and entertain whatever the team the Bears talk to in regards to other players. The Bears are most definitely in the "beggas can't be choosers" role this next year.

 

"Cribbs - Um, not a WR. Hester is more of a WR than Cribbs. We already tries to take an elite return man and make him into something he is not. You really want to try and do this again?"

 

Cribbs is actually listed as WR even though he played QB in college (compared to Hester's prior experience at CB). And his size (6'1" 215) versus Hester (5'11" 190) makes him a much more targetable WR. Especially given his speed and weight. He would be a great over the middle type receiver. He is more along the size of Aromashadu who I definitely hope the Bears keep around. As far as the rest; Knox - maybe one to two years left with speed being his main attribute (and depending on his later season injury), Bennett - I like him as a #3 in most cases. Beyond that they can all go.

 

"Harrison - Seriously. His game was going downhill fast. Not a team in the league wanted him last year, and now he is simply a year older and further removed."

 

All the more reason to consider him. The Bears won't have a lot in the way of bargaining chips to offer up so why not try him out for one year? Think Muhammad. He was a great pick up for the Bears who did OK (probably due to Orton running the offense) but when he returned to Carolina he turned out to be a pretty good utility receiver behind Steve Smith.

 

Another few notables that I totally forgot about; Anquan Boldin will probably be looking for a new home and next to Cutler I would be willing just about to give anything to bring him in as a #1 WR. Since Angelo tried once already maybe Boldin will appreciate that fact and appreciate that he would be the man at WR if he came to Chicago.

 

The list continues: Antonio Bryant, Steve Breaston, Braylon Edwards (probably too much money and depends on how far the Jets make it), Josh Reed and Troy Williamson - once a first rounder who recently was heard to say that he would like to "duke it out with Brad Childress". That would be fun to see especially since he could see him twice in the same year.

 

One other notable RB to consider is Leon Washington. He will probably be the odd man out with the Jets with TJ being the perrenial 1,000 yard back and the surge of the rookie Green. Washington definitely has the game breaker ability and has shown he could play alongside another showcase RB, in this case Forte.

 

"I am not saying that we should not even consider adding a WR, but I sure don't want to put any legit amount of money there. IMHO, there are 4 areas of top ticket need (OL, DL, FS, CB). I doubt we can afford DL or CB, as those two units are simply so expensive. I think we should be able to afford OL and FS though."

 

Agreed. But in the long run a lot of what comes down the pike in regards to eventually signing players depends on who is chosen as the new OC.

I think Garrett Wolfe and Leon Washington are the same players with Washington having more experience as a returner. We need a back that compliments Forte and IMO that would be a big physical type back.

[Bears4Ever_34]

Yeah I'd be happy with any one of the three. I don't really know who I'd want the most out of those guys, they all have their own specialties. Chester Taylor is probably the most complete running back out of the 3 now. It wasn't too long ago where he was a starter and rushed for over 1,000 yards for the Vikings before Peterson got there. Now he's a very valuable 3rd down back because he can block and can catch out of the backfield. McGahee is a good short yardage guy that still has some fuel left in his tank. He may make the most sense because Forte is pretty awful at picking up the short yardage, atleast this year he was. LT might be a great compliment to Forte. He doesn't have near the quickness he once had 3 or 4 years ago but he can still be a good guy to have on your team to share carries with. Like I said before I really have no preference over which guy I'd really like the Bears to get. Any one of those three would be great for us.

[lemonej]

"IMO if I had been JA I would have kept a pissed off TJ and Benson because it seems that animosity served the team well. Now we have a bunch of guys who supposedly like each other and they have missed the playoffs 3 straight years."

 

Actutally, I don't think TJ was "pissed off" until he was traded away to the Jets (until he found himself one game away from returning to the Super Bowl that is). Conversely, Benson was "pissed off" before. And I don't think that there are a bunch of players that "like each other" ergo Cutler and Urlacher, on this team.

 

"As for Bell he is what he is an undrafted free agent RB we have gotten more than we expected from him and if he gives us anything more we should be considered fortunate.The Steelers unearthed a gem like Willie Parker and still used a first round pick on Mendenhall."

 

I'm not sure of the point here. Bell could very well be the "gem" you compare to in Willie Parker so why would you think the Bears should consider a high pick like Mendenhall if Forte is already in the mix?

 

"This is how successful teams (Pittsburgh) operate and the Bears should start to do the same."

 

Sorry, I didn't realize that 9-7 and out of the playoffs was considerd "successful".

A quote from JA about TJ when he made the trade with the Jets was that he promised TJ he would try to accomadate him after the season when he demanded a trade after the Bears drafted Benson. When a player demands a trade it doesn't sound like he is happy with his current team. The so called rift between Cutler and Urlacher as first reported by the well-traveled Bobby Wade and then a attributed more recently to a comment heard in an interview by a player who was injured during the first half of the first game of the season( which BTW Cutler agreed with). The local media hear in Chicagoland has said that most of the players get along with each other and the fact that you mention 2 of a 53 man roster is a very low %.

 

How many SB trophies do the Steeler have totally? How many this decade? If you answer these questions truthfully you realize that this is a successful franchise.

 

[nfoligno]

Actually I believe Marshall will be an RFA and regardless I hear Seattle is making a push for him. With Carroll now there, things could get challenging for a team like the Bears to go into a bidding war. And as far as "ammo" I would offer up a player like Urlacher or even Hester in trade talks and entertain whatever the team the Bears talk to in regards to other players. The Bears are most definitely in the "beggas can't be choosers" role this next year.

 

We can talk about this offer or that, but the reality is, this is a mega long shot.

 

Cribbs is actually listed as WR even though he played QB in college (compared to Hester's prior experience at CB). And his size (6'1" 215) versus Hester (5'11" 190) makes him a much more targetable WR. Especially given his speed and weight. He would be a great over the middle type receiver. He is more along the size of Aromashadu who I definitely hope the Bears keep around. As far as the rest; Knox - maybe one to two years left with speed being his main attribute (and depending on his later season injury), Bennett - I like him as a #3 in most cases. Beyond that they can all go.

 

Maybe Cribbs body is more like that of a WR, but that is not really the point. Cle has tried to use him more as a WR, and that simply has not worked out. The difference between Cle and Chicago in this regard is we basically took Hester away from his return duties to focus on WR development, while Cle tried to develop his WR game while always making his return duties priority. But if we brought him here, how would you want to handle him. He is seeking Hester money, and wants to be paid like a WR. Yet at the same time, he has not developed as one. He is a freak in the return game, but would we not be doing the same thing many have blasted us for in taking an electrifying return man and trying to make him into something he is not. Further, we would be paying a bit of a premium to do so.

 

All the more reason to consider him. The Bears won't have a lot in the way of bargaining chips to offer up so why not try him out for one year? Think Muhammad. He was a great pick up for the Bears who did OK (probably due to Orton running the offense) but when he returned to Carolina he turned out to be a pretty good utility receiver behind Steve Smith.

 

One very key issue I have w/ adding a player like Harrison, even if we could get him, is he would take away snaps from a very good looking group of young WRs, IMHO. DA is a WR we need to get more snaps for. bennett did well in his first year on the field. Knox was a true rookie and lit it up on a level far beyond expectations. And we still have our 3rd round pick WR (Iglesias) who is likely to be seen more after his Bennett like red shirt season. Then we have Hester. I think we have talent at the WR spot, but the combo of poor coaching, no protection for the QB and lack of chemistry held the group back.

 

You look at what Cutler and the WRs did the last two games. Key in those games was the protection and time Cutler had. I would take that over the span of 16 games. Wouldn't you? If you want to help the passing game, start w/ the OL. I don't care if we added Fitzgerald. If Cutler is on his back, he can't get the ball to Fitz.

 

Another few notables that I totally forgot about; Anquan Boldin will probably be looking for a new home and next to Cutler I would be willing just about to give anything to bring him in as a #1 WR. Since Angelo tried once already maybe Boldin will appreciate that fact and appreciate that he would be the man at WR if he came to Chicago.

 

Boldin is a hell of a WR, but once again, he showed an inability to stay healthy. We suffer through enough injuries w/o trading away players/ picks to add more injury prone players.

 

The list continues: Antonio Bryant, Steve Breaston, Braylon Edwards (probably too much money and depends on how far the Jets make it), Josh Reed and Troy Williamson - once a first rounder who recently was heard to say that he would like to "duke it out with Brad Childress". That would be fun to see especially since he could see him twice in the same year.

 

Josh Reed? In 8 NFL seasons, his best season was less than what Bennett gave us this year. Why would we want him?

 

Troy Williamson? Yea, he was a 1st round pick, and may have wanted to fight Big Brad, but he sucks. Jax traded for him thinking he could elevate their passing game, and he didn't even play well enough to be on the field. Single digit catch totals the last two years, and he did little in Minny before that.

 

Bryant - Depends on money. If he wants to be paid based on his 1,300 yards two years ago. No. If he wants to be paid based on his 600 yards this past year? Maybe.

 

Edwards - Unless there is a new CBA, Edwards only has 5 years in the league, and is thus a RFA. NY will keep him after trading for him.

 

Breaston - Hey, I like him, but I can see him coming at a pretty high cost, and I just don't think that is worth it for us.

 

Edwards is a RFA, and Breaston could hit paydirt this FA. I like our players over the rest. Josh Reed? You have to be kidding.

 

One other notable RB to consider is Leon Washington. He will probably be the odd man out with the Jets with TJ being the perrenial 1,000 yard back and the surge of the rookie Green. Washington definitely has the game breaker ability and has shown he could play alongside another showcase RB, in this case Forte.

 

Maybe be someone worth considering.

 

Agreed. But in the long run a lot of what comes down the pike in regards to eventually signing players depends on who is chosen as the new OC.

 

Disagree. I don't care who we bring in. If we do not fix the OL, no system in the world is going to run well.

 

 

[Alaskan Grizzly]

"A quote from JA about TJ when he made the trade with the Jets was that he promised TJ he would try to accomadate him after the season when he demanded a trade after the Bears drafted Benson. When a player demands a trade it doesn't sound like he is happy with his current team. The so called rift between Cutler and Urlacher as first reported by the well-traveled Bobby Wade and then a attributed more recently to a comment heard in an interview by a player who was injured during the first half of the first game of the season( which BTW Cutler agreed with). The local media hear in Chicagoland has said that most of the players get along with each other and the fact that you mention 2 of a 53 man roster is a very low %."

 

I think we are getting off topic but I will give your comment due diligence. I believe the above reply was to your generalization that "we have a bunch of guys that like each other" so I pointed out the top two "leaders" of the team and recalled their disagreements. I really doubt "2 out of 53" is all you would find are discontented with their current situation.

 

"How many SB trophies do the Steeler have totally? How many this decade? If you answer these questions truthfully you realize that this is a successful franchise."

 

As far as this microcosm with regards to the Steelers being so successful, the same could have been said had we had this discussion about the Bears in the 80's. In fact if we were to compare the franchises in whole the Bears would come out on top with 9 total Championships (since their inception in 1919) versus the Steelers 6 total championships. And this from Wikipedia: "The Bears have the most enshrinees in the Pro Football Hall of Fame, with 26 members. The Bears have also recorded more regular season and overall victories than any other NFL franchise." That seems pretty successful to me.

 

I think realisitcally it is all in the eye of the beholder. What's done is done. Let's see how the next decade goes.

 

I still like Boldin before any RB or any other player for that matter in FA.

 

 

 

[Alaskan Grizzly]

"You look at what Cutler and the WRs did the last two games. Key in those games was the protection and time Cutler had. I would take that over the span of 16 games. Wouldn't you? If you want to help the passing game, start w/ the OL. I don't care if we added Fitzgerald. If Cutler is on his back, he can't get the ball to Fitz."

 

Ah ha, so you admit that the current OLmen could work if coached by the right person (Tice)? No need to go out to the FA market to sign another Pace or Shaffer or Omiyale?

 

"Boldin is a hell of a WR, but once again, he showed an inability to stay healthy. We suffer through enough injuries w/o trading away players/ picks to add more injury prone players."

 

I don't know that I would call Boldin "injury prone" unless you consider when he had his head almost removed in '08 and still managed to play again despite having his mouth wired shut....injury prone. This year he was injured a bit more than advertised and I believe held out a few games not because of injury but instead he and Whisenhunt not getting along. My money is he would have still played in those games if allowed.

 

"Josh Reed? In 8 NFL seasons, his best season was less than what Bennett gave us this year. Why would we want him?"

 

Ok, maybe Reed is a bit of a stretch but maybe he and the rest on the list could find themselves in a better enviornment with a QB like Cutler and the soon to be named OC.

"Disagree. I don't care who we bring in. If we do not fix the OL, no system in the world is going to run well."

 

See my earlier comments. How do you fix the OL again? Keep what you got and fix it or spend more money on other FA's?

 

[nfoligno]

The OL looked better in the final two games, but lets be honest for a moment, even then they were far from great, or even good.

 

Against Minny, we were moving the pocket a lot more, and using Cutler the way we should, but you can only do that so much. Final game was against Minny, who has a pass rush weaker than ours.

 

No, I do not think our OL is close to settled. I think Williams replacing Pace is a great start, but I am not happy with anyone we have projecting to RT at the moment. Also, while Omiyale improved, that is a very relative comment. Garza is not awful, but not good either. And Kreutz is near the end, and many thing the end was a few years ago.

 

OL played better at the end, but comments like yours exemplify my greatest concern. Just because it played well for a game or two does not mean it isn't in need of fixing. I am sure you would say the same for the WR position, but here are the differences, IMHO.

 

(a) I believe it all starts in the trench. On defense, I am far more happy w/ upgrading the DL over the CB position. I don't care how good of a cover corner you have, if you don't rush the passer and the QB has all day, no CB in the league can sustain his cover forever. On the other hand, if you have a great pass rush, I think even an average CB can look good. Similar on offense. If you build the OL and have a great OL, you will find the parts you have on offense look so much better. On the other hand, if you build up the skill positions w/o the OL, you have simply wasted talent. Just look at Cutler. We finally went out and got us a pro bowl QB, but w/ the OL we had, he looked like Rex Grossman as often as not.

 

( Other than the Williams switch, our OL was much the same as it started. At WR however, toward the end, and only when forced, we finally got DA onto the field. You know, the WR Cutler had begged to see out there since camp. Suddenly we have a WR able to go up and make the big plays. As DA is doing this, the whole field seems to open up and others now are making plays. We all wanted a playmaker, but I just have to wonder if we didn't have that playmaker on the team all along, but only at the end did we give him a shot.

 

© On the OL, we are getting old fast. If this player or that player doesn't play well, we have little to turn to. At WR, it is a near opposite situation. Bennett just played his first season after a red shirt. Knox was a true rookie. Iglesias will be coming off his Bennett like red shirt season. DA is also young and finally got his shot at the end. Even Hester, far and away the most experienced WR in the group, is still learning and developing. If you add a veteran, you are taking snaps away from a promising young WR. In the past, I was all for going after someone like Harrison, Holt or another veteran to bring stability to our group, but I also didn't think at the time we had a lot of talent to begin with. Now, w/ all these good looking young talents, I would rather simply developing them and getting them as many snaps as possible.

 

Boldin - I am not really trying to take away from him. I like him. Always have. At the same time, I just do not feel that is where we need to spend our money. Understand, I believe we will enter this offseason w/ limited funds. As much as Boldin may look good, to me, it would be like buying a bar of chocolate when you have no money for dinner. We need meat and potatoes (OL) before we spend on chocolate (WR).

 

As for the other WRs, sure, they may find themselves in a better situation w/ Cutler, but at the same time, I wuold argue so may our current group be in a better situation w/ more development/ experience and a new OC.

 

At the end of the day, this is sort of how I look at it.

 

OL - Our group of starters leave much to be desires, and we have little in the pipeline to fill the voids. It is likely we will project Schaffer at RT, and that is fairly weak, IMHO. And please don't get me started on Omiyale.

 

CB - Tillman is fading fast. Bowman could be a find. But what else do we have. Graham? Coaches sure didn't seem to favor him. McBride? Gone. Vasher? Likely gone. Moore? Couldn't even make the active roster.

 

FS - Um, we have a bunch of SS', but really no FS to choose from.

 

DL - Situation is just sad, though you could make some level of an argument we have younth which we can hope develops.

 

then you look at our WR situation. Is it the most proven? Hell no. Yet more than most other units, I would argue at WR we have more young talent which may develop for us w/o having to add in FA or the draft. At other positions, I find it hard to even make a legit argument we are solid w/o adding talent to the mix. At WR though, while not yet fully proven, you can easily look at who we have and argue we currently have the talent in place, yet simply need to give that talent time.

 

You can allow all the time you want, and I do not think we are going to get much from the groups we have at OL, CB, FS or even DL.

 

"You look at what Cutler and the WRs did the last two games. Key in those games was the protection and time Cutler had. I would take that over the span of 16 games. Wouldn't you? If you want to help the passing game, start w/ the OL. I don't care if we added Fitzgerald. If Cutler is on his back, he can't get the ball to Fitz."

 

Ah ha, so you admit that the current OLmen could work if coached by the right person (Tice)? No need to go out to the FA market to sign another Pace or Shaffer or Omiyale?

 

"Boldin is a hell of a WR, but once again, he showed an inability to stay healthy. We suffer through enough injuries w/o trading away players/ picks to add more injury prone players."

 

I don't know that I would call Boldin "injury prone" unless you consider when he had his head almost removed in '08 and still managed to play again despite having his mouth wired shut....injury prone. This year he was injured a bit more than advertised and I believe held out a few games not because of injury but instead he and Whisenhunt not getting along. My money is he would have still played in those games if allowed.

 

"Josh Reed? In 8 NFL seasons, his best season was less than what Bennett gave us this year. Why would we want him?"

 

Ok, maybe Reed is a bit of a stretch but maybe he and the rest on the list could find themselves in a better enviornment with a QB like Cutler and the soon to be named OC.

"Disagree. I don't care who we bring in. If we do not fix the OL, no system in the world is going to run well."

 

See my earlier comments. How do you fix the OL again? Keep what you got and fix it or spend more money on other FA's?

 

[Alaskan Grizzly]

"Against Minny, we were moving the pocket a lot more, and using Cutler the way we should, but you can only do that so much. Final game was against Minny, who has a pass rush weaker than ours."

 

What?? With both the Williams', Jared Allen, Jimmy Kennedy and Ray Edwards? They have a worse pass rush than the Bears??

 

"No, I do not think our OL is close to settled. I think Williams replacing Pace is a great start, but I am not happy with anyone we have projecting to RT at the moment. Also, while Omiyale improved, that is a very relative comment. Garza is not awful, but not good either. And Kreutz is near the end, and many thing the end was a few years ago."

 

I am pretty sure that most here, myself included, would be ok with Omiyale being shown the door. I believe Beekman is ready to come into his own. I would be much better with leaving Garza where he is and ok with Kreutz returning. Williams is definitely the long term solution on the left (better be after the draft choice he cost) and maybe Shaffer is the answer (for now) at Right. If not then maybe one pickup for RT could do the trick. In that I would be inclined to use either the 3rd or 4th round pick and entertain other players later in the preseason for G/C.

 

"OL played better at the end, but comments like yours exemplify my greatest concern. Just because it played well for a game or two does not mean it isn't in need of fixing. I am sure you would say the same for the WR position, but here are the differences, IMHO."

 

Not sure why my comments "concern" you as I was only agreeing with the previous poster. And I was trying to make a point in not venturing in FA with the thought the Bears should waste money on OL when there are higher and more valuable skill players available IE: Boldin and Marshall. To me, that is where you make the money. I think the problem with the Bears' OL from last year was the inability to solidify and work as a true unit.

 

 

As far as the rest, it is pretty clear you and I disagree what the Bears priorities are and again, are off topic.

 

I still like Boldin over any other FA...RB or otherwise.

[nfoligno]

What?? With both the Williams', Jared Allen, Jimmy Kennedy and Ray Edwards? They have a worse pass rush than the Bears??

 

I meant Det, not Minny, when I said our last game of the year and mentioned their having a worse pass rush then ours.

 

I am pretty sure that most here, myself included, would be ok with Omiyale being shown the door. I believe Beekman is ready to come into his own. I would be much better with leaving Garza where he is and ok with Kreutz returning. Williams is definitely the long term solution on the left (better be after the draft choice he cost) and maybe Shaffer is the answer (for now) at Right. If not then maybe one pickup for RT could do the trick. In that I would be inclined to use either the 3rd or 4th round pick and entertain other players later in the preseason for G/C.

 

Problem is, as I mentioned before, there is little to no depth, much less Plan B options. What if Beekman isn't going to work out. Or Schaffer at RT? We simply lack depth, not to mention legit quality, along the OL. We can talk about the OL in best case scenario terms, but how often does that play out. W/o significant upgrades, we are setting ourselves up for trouble.

 

Not sure why my comments "concern" you as I was only agreeing with the previous poster. And I was trying to make a point in not venturing in FA with the thought the Bears should waste money on OL when there are higher and more valuable skill players available IE: Boldin and Marshall. To me, that is where you make the money. I think the problem with the Bears' OL from last year was the inability to solidify and work as a true unit.

 

I was not trying to call you out. I talked about this some time ago when I brought up the idea that our late improved play along the OL could be trouble IMHO as it could give a false sense of security in our OL, and allow Angelo the opinion that the OL is not as great of a need as I believe it truly is. Your recent comments, IMHO, exemplify that as you think (a) we can simply insert Beekman ( Kreutz and Garza are fine and © Schaffer can man the RT spot, and even if not, it would not be too difficult to replace him w/ a 2nd day rookie.

 

You say, "that is where you make your money". If you actually mean money, I would argue winning makes you money. If you meant it symbolically, I would argue you win in the trenches. W/o solid OL play, the best RBs get stuffed at the LOS and the best QBs will be wasted as they continually get sacked or throw it away. You can surround an offense w/ loads of elite talent, but if you get blocking like we did this year, I just don't think it matters. To me, we could have had Fitz and Reggie Wayne on the team, and our offense would have still struggled due to the OL.

 

As far as the rest, it is pretty clear you and I disagree what the Bears priorities are and again, are off topic.

 

I still like Boldin over any other FA...RB or otherwise.

 

The key difference though is cost. I am not advocating spending big bucks on any RB. In fact, I would be totally against such a move. I like Boldin over any RB I have heard about too, and if I was told we could spend big at WR or RB (excluding all other options) I too would go w/ Boldin, but I don't think that is a legit argument as I don't think anyone is really suggesting spending big at the RB position.

 

[defiantgiant]

Just chiming in on the receiver debate: a lot of the guys who've been discussed (Brandon Marshall, Braylon Edwards, Josh Cribbs, Steve Breaston) are not going to be available without sending draft picks as compensation to their teams. The Bears can't afford to part with those picks, and couldn't if they wanted to for some of these guys. For example, the Jets could give Braylon Edwards the very cheapest RFA tender (which sets compensation as a pick in the round where the player was originally drafted) and the Bears couldn't touch him, since they don't have a 1st-round pick. The next-cheapest level of RFA tender offer (it was $1.4 million in 2008) sets compensation as a 2nd-round pick, which would take the Bears out of the running for anybody. That means the Broncos would only have to tender like a $1.5 million offer to Brandon Marshall, which is chump change for a receiver like him, and the Bears would be totally powerless to get him. And since every team is going to have two franchise tags and two transition tags this offseason, any of these guys could just get tagged, too.

 

As a result, we're going to be looking solely at unrestricted free agents, if anybody. And the UFA market this year is thin, to say the least. Assuming no new CBA gets done, here's the list of wideouts who are going to be UFAs:

Antonio Bryant, Derrick Mason, Terrell Owens, Arnaz Battle, Marty Booker, Nate Burleson, Tim Carter, Chris Chambers, Antonio Chatman, Terrance Copper, Bobby Engram, Brian Finneran, Mike Furrey, Greg Lewis, Brandon Lloyd, Shaun McDonald, Sean Morey, Muhsin Muhammad, Kassim Osgood, Josh Reed, David Tyree, Bobby Wade, Kevin Walter, Kelley Washington, Ernest Wilford.

 

That's not an inspiring group of receivers. Out of that list, the only guys I'd be remotely interested in are Kevin Walter and maybe Antonio Bryant. Derrick Mason might retire, and the Ravens' WR situation is even worse than the Bears', so they'd certainly resign him if he plays another year. TO is a cancer and drops more than half of his targets every season...he also looked like a total nonfactor in Buffalo's offense this season. You could make an argument for Chris Chambers, but he's also on the wrong side of 30 and was always a #2 receiver (at best) in San Diego and Kansas City. I think the Bears are better off continuing to develop the guys we already have.

[nfoligno]

Nice detailed look at Edwards, and the overall picture with regard to our ability to go after RFAs.

 

I think Alaska, and maybe others, mentioned sending players in a trade for certain WRs. For example, I think he mentioned sending Urlacher to Denver for Marshall. Whether picks or players, I am simply not for such a move. We have enough holes on the team w/o creating more holes, which I think the above example would do.

 

Then you start to look at the UFAs, and I would point out another aspect I am not sure you mentioned. Even if there is a WR or two we might like, due to the very thin pool of talent, you are likely to see some really over-priced guys in the mix. Antonio Bryant did jack this past season, but when another GM looks at what is available, he may offer Bryant a deal based on production from two years ago rather than last year. Any WRs we might find interesting, you can bet others will as well, and due to the lack of talent out there, those few players are going to get far more than they deserve.

 

With all that said, I just don't think WR is a need for us. When I look over our roster, I see numerous areas that are not just holes, but holes which I see no potential candidates on our roster to fill. At FS, for example, when I look at our roster, I see only a bunch of strong safeties. When I look at CB, not only does our starting duo look questionable, but I don't even see the players beyond that who are likely to step up.

 

At WR however, we have a group that may lack experience, but does in fact seem to have talent. Look at Minny and their WR Rice who is finishing his 3rd season. In his first two years, he looked like a bust. This year, he went from basically nothing to 1,300 yards and being called a near stud. It just goes to show that (a) don't give up too soon and take time to develop players you draft and ( how much a QB upgrade can help.

 

We have Bennett, who was a 3rd round pick, and didn't even see the field (not enough to speak of) as a rookie. In year 2, he has 54 catches for 717 yards (nice 13+ ypc). Those are solid numbers for a kid playing his first season.

 

We have Knox, who was a true rookie. Not only that, but he was a 5th round pick who was considered more of a project coming from a small school, and a kid who would need time to develop. Well, the kid grabbed 45 for 520 and 5 scores, while showing some tremendous speed and quickness. Very solid numbers for a rookie WR.

 

We have DA, who Cutler begged to see on the field in camp. Our esteemed OC though didn't believe there was room for him on the active roster, so he sits until the end of the year until injuries force DA into the lineup. The result is (over the final 4 games) 22 catches, 280 yards and 4 scores. Spread that over a season and you have 88-1,150 and 16 scores. No, I am not saying he would have that, but it puts how well he played in perspective. Looking past the numbers, he showed the sort of body control and big play ability we have longed for here in Chicago, and showed great chemistry w/ our franchise QB.

 

We also have Hester. No, few here still think of him as a #1 WR, but I honestly believe if we can get past that thinking, which I never agreed w/ to begin with, Hester is a pretty solid looking WR. Hester has increased his catch and yardage totals each of the last three seasons. While I do not want him as our #1, and frankly would rather he played slot, he can still be a very effective and dangerous WR for us.

 

To add one more name, we also have Iglesias, who basically got the Bennett, red shirt treatment. I said prior to the draft, and believe it now, Iglesias has more talent and potential than Bennett. I think he has better route running and hands than Bennett, and more quickness as well.

 

I am honestly excited about this position and what Cutler can do with it. We got more production our of our WR position this year than in some time, and I think that will only get better w/ (a) increased chemistry between Cutler and WRs ( further development of these young WRs © improved OL play, buying Cutler and WRs more time to allow routes to develop and (d) better playcalling.

 

Just chiming in on the receiver debate: a lot of the guys who've been discussed (Brandon Marshall, Braylon Edwards, Josh Cribbs, Steve Breaston) are not going to be available without sending draft picks as compensation to their teams. The Bears can't afford to part with those picks, and couldn't if they wanted to for some of these guys. For example, the Jets could give Braylon Edwards the very cheapest RFA tender (which sets compensation as a pick in the round where the player was originally drafted) and the Bears couldn't touch him, since they don't have a 1st-round pick. The next-cheapest level of RFA tender offer (it was $1.4 million in 2008) sets compensation as a 2nd-round pick, which would take the Bears out of the running for anybody. That means the Broncos would only have to tender like a $1.5 million offer to Brandon Marshall, which is chump change for a receiver like him, and the Bears would be totally powerless to get him. And since every team is going to have two franchise tags and two transition tags this offseason, any of these guys could just get tagged, too.

 

As a result, we're going to be looking solely at unrestricted free agents, if anybody. And the UFA market this year is thin, to say the least. Assuming no new CBA gets done, here's the list of wideouts who are going to be UFAs:

Antonio Bryant, Derrick Mason, Terrell Owens, Arnaz Battle, Marty Booker, Nate Burleson, Tim Carter, Chris Chambers, Antonio Chatman, Terrance Copper, Bobby Engram, Brian Finneran, Mike Furrey, Greg Lewis, Brandon Lloyd, Shaun McDonald, Sean Morey, Muhsin Muhammad, Kassim Osgood, Josh Reed, David Tyree, Bobby Wade, Kevin Walter, Kelley Washington, Ernest Wilford.

 

That's not an inspiring group of receivers. Out of that list, the only guys I'd be remotely interested in are Kevin Walter and maybe Antonio Bryant. Derrick Mason might retire, and the Ravens' WR situation is even worse than the Bears', so they'd certainly resign him if he plays another year. TO is a cancer and drops more than half of his targets every season...he also looked like a total nonfactor in Buffalo's offense this season. You could make an argument for Chris Chambers, but he's also on the wrong side of 30 and was always a #2 receiver (at best) in San Diego and Kansas City. I think the Bears are better off continuing to develop the guys we already have.

 

[defiantgiant]

Also, I do like the idea of going after Leon Washington, if he's recovered fully from his leg injury. He's basically what Garrett Wolfe was supposed to be, but never turned into: a shifty, make-you-miss change of pace back. I know a lot of people on these boards like Wolfe, but I just haven't seen it. Just because he's small doesn't make him Darren Sproles. I mean, the #2 running back job was basically his for the taking this season, and he only put up 120 yards. On top of that, over a quarter of those yards came on one gadget play, that fake punt against Cleveland. That one play aside, he gained 84 yards on 21 carries, which is pretty unspectacular.

 

Wolfe was dynamite in college, but at the NFL level, he's just not fast enough to make defenders miss, and he's not strong enough even to run through arm tackles. Anyone who can get a hand on him just takes him down; I can't remember the last time where he didn't get stopped by the first defender to reach him. You hear people say all the time that to be a good running back in the NFL, you have to beat the first defender: big backs need to run over the guy, and quicker backs need to make him miss. Wolfe can't do either. A guy like Leon Washington would be a big upgrade.

 

If it were me, though, I'd cut everybody but Forte and Bell, then draft a running back late on Day 2. Joique Bell from Wayne State has a 4th-5th round grade right now, and if he lasts until the 5th, I'd take him in a heartbeat to compete with Kahlil Bell for the #2 spot. He reminds me of a bigger Ahmad Bradshaw: he's got great shiftiness and balance to bounce off tackles, but also generates a lot of lower-body power on contact. Forte-Bell-Bell (whichever way it works out) could be a good platoon.

[defiantgiant]

Nfo, nice take on the receivers. I agree that we could do just fine at the WR position with what we have now: if we start Devin and Devin, with Bennett in the slot and Knox rotating in/returning kicks, that'd be a pretty decent group of wideouts. Also, you mentioned how Aromashodu's stats extrapolate out over a season; I'd add that Hester only played in 13 games. If he had played all 16 games, he'd have had something like 70 catches for 930 yards and 4 TDs. Not stellar numbers, but he made a major improvement from last season, and he did it while getting significantly more attention from opposing defenses. If we had Aromashodu putting up 1100-1200 yards a season and Hester contributing 900-1000, we'd have a pretty solid passing game on the outside. Not to mention the fact that Aromashodu's presence could make it a lot harder for teams to double Hester all game or have their #1 corner shadow Olsen.

[nfoligno]

Honestly, I would really like to see a starting duo w/o Hester. That is not to bash Hester, but I simply believe he would be better of in the slot, w/ nickel DBs forced to defend him, rather than in the starting rotation w/ staring caliber CBs covering.

 

DA should start next year. Opposite him though could be interesting, and I think you could go in two directions. I think you could start Bennett, and then use DA as your downfield guy and Bennett as your possession guy. Or you could go w/ Knox as a starter and have him work downfield and DA a bit less.

 

That is what is funny to me. While some feel we need to add at WR, I honestly struggle to see how we can get enough reps to the guys we have. I would love to see the new OC come in and use much more spread formations. I think we have the talent to use a lot of 3 and 4 WR formations. Not only that, but we have Olsen at TE, and while he didn't step up as much as some would have liked, the fact so many defenses put their #1 CB prove that he, more than any other, is who DCs were game planning for. Then throw in our having a RB who many would consider in the elite category in terms of receiving from the back position.

 

We have a lot of weapons, IMHO. What we have lacked is (a) and OL which provides time for our QB to utilize those weapons and ( and OC imaginitive enough to get the most out of what he has.

 

Nfo, nice take on the receivers. I agree that we could do just fine at the WR position with what we have now: if we start Devin and Devin, with Bennett in the slot and Knox rotating in/returning kicks, that'd be a pretty decent group of wideouts. Also, you mentioned how Aromashodu's stats extrapolate out over a season; I'd add that Hester only played in 13 games. If he had played all 16 games, he'd have had something like 70 catches for 930 yards and 4 TDs. Not stellar numbers, but he made a major improvement from last season, and he did it while getting significantly more attention from opposing defenses. If we had Aromashodu putting up 1100-1200 yards a season and Hester contributing 900-1000, we'd have a pretty solid passing game on the outside. Not to mention the fact that Aromashodu's presence could make it a lot harder for teams to double Hester all game or have their #1 corner shadow Olsen.

 

[defiantgiant]

OK, so I think we're kind of in agreement here. For base 2-receiver and 3-receiver sets, I'd like to see Hester on the outside. This is just my own inexpert opinion, but a lot of the routes that I saw him run really well were outside the numbers: he beat I don't know how many corners with that hitch-and-go that he does. He sells that first step and gets back into his route better than most receivers in the NFL, in my opinion. In the Philly game he spun Asante Samuel around 360 degrees with a hitch-and-go, and Samuel's a pretty good corner. He's pretty good on deep out and deep post patterns, too, and he's also gotten very good at tracking the ball over his shoulder on those routes.

 

When I saw him go across the middle on slants/square-ins/drags, though, it wasn't nearly as impressive. Remember when Cutler got picked off because Hester basically ran into the ref on a shallow cross? I don't think his route-running is precise enough (at least right now) to be effective on the inside routes that a traditional slot receiver runs, and he's not very good at picking through traffic from what I've seen. Bennett, I think, should be the normal slot receiver when we go 3-wide, since he's better in traffic and runs cleaner routes.

 

That said, I could definitely see Hester moving into the slot when the play calls for the slot receiver to run a deep pattern. Pittsburgh used Nate Washington that way, as a vertical threat from the slot, and it was very effective. Unless I'm wrong, Philly rotates DeSean Jackson into the slot for some plays, with similar results. I could definitely see the Bears having success with one or two personnel packages that put Hester in the slot. Also, if we had a 3- or 4-wide set with Knox and Aromashodu on the outside and Hester in the slot, that would just be nasty. Aromashodu's the slowest of the three, and he ran like a 4.35 in the 40. There'd be a huge amount of vertical pressure on the defense, which could really open things up underneath for Olsen/Clark/Bennett to work.

 

As for who's covering Hester, I agree that he got shut down too often this season, but I think having Aromashodu in the starting lineup would solve a lot of that. Teams this year could double and bracket Hester all game long if they wanted to, because Bennett simply doesn't have the speed or change-of-direction to beat single coverage. You can single-cover Bennett all you want, and he's not going to break a big gain. That wouldn't be a problem if he were in the slot, but with Bennett as the starting X receiver, it meant that Hester got doubled a lot. Aromashodu could make defenses play Hester more honestly, which would help him take the next step as a receiver.