Mike Martz Becomes Bears OC

[jason]

yep its a win-win situation with Martz. Cutler and our recievers are going to love this guy- our defense is going HATE this guy. Since we no longer have that top ranked defense, you might as well go into a high powered offensive system and attempt to win as many shootouts as you can. If it fails- so long Lovey and so long angelo and let the Cowher era begin!

 

Precisely. I just don't see how the Bears offense doesn't experience a MAJOR upgrade next year. Sure, the defense may do poorly, or even worse than last year, but it's not like Lovie's crew (coaches and players) have really been top notch for a while now.

[nfoligno]

For me, the key in your comment is when you say "offense." I can see Cutler having more passing yards. That is a near given w/ Martz. But just because you have more passing yards doesn't mean your "offense" is really improved. If your run game is less, that takes away from the passing yards. If you continue to throw picks and/or struggle to score points, that too takes away.

 

I think we will have more passing yards, but fear most other areas actually get worse, and thus the offense as a whole declines.

 

Precisely. I just don't see how the Bears offense doesn't experience a MAJOR upgrade next year. Sure, the defense may do poorly, or even worse than last year, but it's not like Lovie's crew (coaches and players) have really been top notch for a while now.

 

[bowlingtwig]

For me, the key in your comment is when you say "offense." I can see Cutler having more passing yards. That is a near given w/ Martz. But just because you have more passing yards doesn't mean your "offense" is really improved. If your run game is less, that takes away from the passing yards. If you continue to throw picks and/or struggle to score points, that too takes away.

 

I think we will have more passing yards, but fear most other areas actually get worse, and thus the offense as a whole declines.

With Martz throughout is stays the first year he was there the running game may not get better, but the # of rushing yds per game stays around the same, you see a dramatic upgrade in passing yds per game and also more pts per game. Even if all this stays the same and Cutler gets sacked more and throws around the same amount of picks or even a little more but the bottom line is we put up more Points. Its an upgrade. I am sorry I just can't see how this is a negative, unless the Oline is just as horrible as last year.

[nfoligno]

One. In Det, yes, they saw a huge jack in offense in Martz first year, but Martz was not the only change. No one is going to mistake Kitna for a great QB, but would you not agree he was a huge upgrade over Joey Harrington? That is who was running Det' offense before Martz got there. Kitna, a couple years earlier when starting for Cincy tossed 26 Tds to only 16 picks. In SF, Hill and JT were nothing special, but the prior year, the team went through 4 QBs due to injuries. Not many offenses are going to do well when they go through 4 QBs. I am not taking away Martz' contribution, but at the same time, I think there was more than "just" Martz in looking at that first year change.

 

As for points... Kitna had 21 TDs to Joey's 12, and they only had 1 fewer rushing score. So yes, they scored more. On the other hand, Kitna had 10 more interceptions than Joey. Kitna also fumbled the ball 3 times. Further, Kitna was sacked 63 times to Joey's 24. An extra 9 scores is great, but how much of that is offset by all the increased turnovers and sacks.

 

One final point. You are assuming we are going to score more, but I am not so sure. In both Det and SF, he took over awful offenses. For those offenses, the only direction to go was up. In Chicago, as up and down as our offense was, we actually did score. Cutler had 27 passing scores. Its one thing to take over an offense run by Joey Harrington and his 12 TD passes and create improvement. But Cutler threw for 27 scores. You think Cutler will have a ton more passing TDs? I don't.

 

With Martz throughout is stays the first year he was there the running game may not get better, but the # of rushing yds per game stays around the same, you see a dramatic upgrade in passing yds per game and also more pts per game. Even if all this stays the same and Cutler gets sacked more and throws around the same amount of picks or even a little more but the bottom line is we put up more Points. Its an upgrade. I am sorry I just can't see how this is a negative, unless the Oline is just as horrible as last year.

 

[jason]

For me, the key in your comment is when you say "offense." I can see Cutler having more passing yards. That is a near given w/ Martz. But just because you have more passing yards doesn't mean your "offense" is really improved. If your run game is less, that takes away from the passing yards. If you continue to throw picks and/or struggle to score points, that too takes away.

 

I think we will have more passing yards, but fear most other areas actually get worse, and thus the offense as a whole declines.

 

I agree wholeheartedly, but I'm willing to accept the change. If the Bears offense does not improve in overall TDs, overall yards, and overall points, I will be friggin amazed.

[Pixote]

I agree wholeheartedly, but I'm willing to accept the change. If the Bears offense does not improve in overall TDs, overall yards, and overall points, I will be friggin amazed.

 

I agree. I expect a top 10 offense. I also think our defense will be greatly improved.

[AZ54]

Wouldn't that be of a question about Tice instead of Martz? I am pretty sure, from what I have seen, Tice has them fire out, old school smash mouth football. None of this pansy step in the bucket routine, not the "zone" blocking routine, just plain and simple get in your face and get ugly. I sure hope I am right because that is the way I played OT when I was a young'n and that is what I would like to see happen. Slobberknocker football. Pancakes anyone???

 

That's what I'm hoping to see too because for run blocking I think it will benefit guys like Shaffer, Omiyale, and Kreutz. I wish it were all Tice's decision because his past shows he knows how to coach successful Oline players but the reason I asked is because Martz is running the show. Is what he wants going to mesh with what Tice wants to do?

[bowlingtwig]

One. In Det, yes, they saw a huge jack in offense in Martz first year, but Martz was not the only change. No one is going to mistake Kitna for a great QB, but would you not agree he was a huge upgrade over Joey Harrington? That is who was running Det' offense before Martz got there. Kitna, a couple years earlier when starting for Cincy tossed 26 Tds to only 16 picks. In SF, Hill and JT were nothing special, but the prior year, the team went through 4 QBs due to injuries. Not many offenses are going to do well when they go through 4 QBs. I am not taking away Martz' contribution, but at the same time, I think there was more than "just" Martz in looking at that first year change.

 

As for points... Kitna had 21 TDs to Joey's 12, and they only had 1 fewer rushing score. So yes, they scored more. On the other hand, Kitna had 10 more interceptions than Joey. Kitna also fumbled the ball 3 times. Further, Kitna was sacked 63 times to Joey's 24. An extra 9 scores is great, but how much of that is offset by all the increased turnovers and sacks.

 

One final point. You are assuming we are going to score more, but I am not so sure. In both Det and SF, he took over awful offenses. For those offenses, the only direction to go was up. In Chicago, as up and down as our offense was, we actually did score. Cutler had 27 passing scores. Its one thing to take over an offense run by Joey Harrington and his 12 TD passes and create improvement. But Cutler threw for 27 scores. You think Cutler will have a ton more passing TDs? I don't.

If your asking if I see a ton more passing TD's the answer is no, you do make valid points but Cutler did throw 27 scores with "very bad" WR like everyone was saying. He now has another year with these same guys so that should improve things. The main will be how quickly can Cutler and the receivers get the playbook down. Last year Cutler was trying to learn a new playbook while also getting to know the guys around him. At this point Cutler shoudl know the guys for the most part except maybe Iggy since he wasn't on field except week 17. So now everyone can concentrate on learning the playbook.

[nfoligno]

Last year, he had to learn a new playbook, but that new playbook was likely not that different from the one he knew in Denver. This year, he will have to essentially learn a new language.

 

I agree he "should" have more chemistry w/ the receivers. My fear is the new scheme will essentially negate that improvement of chemistry.

 

I also think the extra 5-7 step drops, increased reliance on OTs holding blocks w/o chip block support and a significantly harder schedule will lead to lower passing scores.

 

If your asking if I see a ton more passing TD's the answer is no, you do make valid points but Cutler did throw 27 scores with "very bad" WR like everyone was saying. He now has another year with these same guys so that should improve things. The main will be how quickly can Cutler and the receivers get the playbook down. Last year Cutler was trying to learn a new playbook while also getting to know the guys around him. At this point Cutler shoudl know the guys for the most part except maybe Iggy since he wasn't on field except week 17. So now everyone can concentrate on learning the playbook.

 

[nfoligno]

I also think our defense will be greatly improved.

 

Why? W/ the addition of Martz, we have been pretty focused on the offense, but why do you believe our D will be not only improved, but greatly improved.

 

The return of Urlacher alone will help the defense. That is one point I will agree w/ immediately. At the same time....

 

DL - Unless we add someone like Kampman, which I don't think we should "expect," where do you see the improvement. Wale is a FA, and it does not sound to me like he will return. While not great, I think it fair to question whether his replacement will be an upgrade. The only thing Harris has shown is that we can't count on him. Harrison was a total disappointement, and even his attitude is now in question. Can we really expect much from Gilbert, who showed nothing last year, or Melton, who spent the year on IR. Brown is a nice player, but I think what we have seen is what we will get. I question expecting much more than what we have seen from him at this point. The guy we traded a 2nd round pick for, and who was pegged to replace Wale, passed away. I just don't see why any would expect much from this group, and so goes our DL, so goes our defense.

 

CB - Is there really reason to expect a great improvement from this group? Tillman seems to be going downhill more than the other way around, and doesn't seem able to stay healthy. Bowman could improve, but that may only slightly offset Tillman. Depth is seriously lacking.

 

S - Unless we add a player, we simply do not have a FS on the team. Not really even one to develop. We have a bunch of SS' who struggle in coverage.

 

FA could alter the opinion here, no question, but looking at our team now, I question why you expect such improvement from a D that has been pretty bad since the SB.

[BigDaddy]

I keep hearing that Martz will employ the 5-7 step drops from everyone but Martz. You don't think they guy has been paying attention to our line play? Look, Martz is alot of things but he isn't stupid. I think it's a mistake to assume that Martz hasn't tweaked his scheme to Cutler's ability and strengths. But let's be honest, Cutler needs as much help as anyone in this offense. He needs to fix the fundamentals and Martz will help him do that. Martz will DEMAND he does that. One other thing we'll see from Martz that will be refreshing versus Ron Turners offense is that Martz is a guy who does not script plays, he goes by what is happening in the game NOW. We aren't going to hear that we couldn't get Olsen into the game because we game planned to use 4WR sets OR we game planned for him to be a H back.

 

The key to success will be Cutler and Martz trusting one another enough to change.

 

 

Last year, he had to learn a new playbook, but that new playbook was likely not that different from the one he knew in Denver. This year, he will have to essentially learn a new language.

 

I agree he "should" have more chemistry w/ the receivers. My fear is the new scheme will essentially negate that improvement of chemistry.

 

I also think the extra 5-7 step drops, increased reliance on OTs holding blocks w/o chip block support and a significantly harder schedule will lead to lower passing scores.

 

[bowlingtwig]

I keep hearing that Martz will employ the 5-7 step drops from everyone but Martz. You don't think they guy has been paying attention to our line play? Look, Martz is alot of things but he isn't stupid. I think it's a mistake to assume that Martz hasn't tweaked his scheme to Cutler's ability and strengths. But let's be honest, Cutler needs as much help as anyone in this offense. He needs to fix the fundamentals and Martz will help him do that. Martz will DEMAND he does that. One other thing we'll see from Martz that will be refreshing versus Ron Turners offense is that Martz is a guy who does not script plays, he goes by what is happening in the game NOW. We aren't going to hear that we couldn't get Olsen into the game because we game planned to use 4WR sets OR we game planned for him to be a H back.

 

The key to success will be Cutler and Martz trusting one another enough to change.

I completely agree. Martz is very intelligent and I think that he is out to prove the naysayers wrong.

[defiantgiant]

I keep hearing that Martz will employ the 5-7 step drops from everyone but Martz. You don't think they guy has been paying attention to our line play? Look, Martz is alot of things but he isn't stupid. I think it's a mistake to assume that Martz hasn't tweaked his scheme to Cutler's ability and strengths. But let's be honest, Cutler needs as much help as anyone in this offense. He needs to fix the fundamentals and Martz will help him do that. Martz will DEMAND he does that. One other thing we'll see from Martz that will be refreshing versus Ron Turners offense is that Martz is a guy who does not script plays, he goes by what is happening in the game NOW. We aren't going to hear that we couldn't get Olsen into the game because we game planned to use 4WR sets OR we game planned for him to be a H back.

 

The key to success will be Cutler and Martz trusting one another enough to change.

I couldn't agree more. Martz is a great offensive mind and Cutler's a tremendous talent, but they both have some problems they're going to need to overcome. If (and only if) both of them can change the way they approach the game, we could see something really good emerging on offense.

 

Cutler needs to clean up his fundamentals some; he's gotten away with sloppy footwork and throwing off his back foot because of his ridiculous arm strength, but it hurts his accuracy (like we saw with all the overthrows in the Philadelphia game) and leads to interceptions. Martz needs to whip Cutler into shape for this offense to be successful.

 

The thing that I'm really worried about, though, is whether Martz is willing to adapt his scheme to our personnel and the elements at Soldier Field. I really hope that he's planning to change the scheme to fit the personnel, rather than trading players or changing the roster to fit his system.

 

As far as Olsen goes, I'll say this: Martz may prefer his TEs to block, but he also has no problem with slower wideouts in his offense. Look at Ricky Proehl, Mike Furrey, and Shaun McDonald...I don't think any of them were as fast in a straight line as Olsen is. I don't see any reason why Martz couldn't use Olsen more like an extra wide receiver, and leave the blocking to Clark and Davis. If he does that, I think Olsen could have some great success under Martz.

 

I know that Martz didn't do that with Vernon Davis, but Davis is more of an athlete and less of a receiver than Olsen. He's also WAY stronger than Olsen, which would make it more tempting to ask him to block. Between Olsen's mediocre blocking and how smooth/polished he is as a receiver, I don't think it'd be hard for Martz to figure out how best to use him, provided that Martz is willing to be flexible.

[Bears4Ever_34]

Last year, he had to learn a new playbook, but that new playbook was likely not that different from the one he knew in Denver. This year, he will have to essentially learn a new language.

 

I agree he "should" have more chemistry w/ the receivers. My fear is the new scheme will essentially negate that improvement of chemistry.

 

I also think the extra 5-7 step drops, increased reliance on OTs holding blocks w/o chip block support and a significantly harder schedule will lead to lower passing scores.

I agree. Martz' system is completely different than that of Turner's. His scheme is purely based on timing and where receivers are "supposed to be." It took the Bears about 14 games for Cutler to finally get in sync with his WR's. If it takes that long next year we won't make the playoffs.

 

My hope is that D.A becomes our #1 guy and can put up 80 catches and 1000 yards while Johnny Knox emerges as the speedy "YAC" receiver like an Az Akeem except better. Forte is going to have a career year catch the ball out of the backfield. I have a feeling Martz will use him similar to how he used Faulk. He will have him lineup as a WR several times throughout the game and he'll actually have to catch the ball running routes and not just out of the flat. It'll be interesting to see how this works but if Forte can put up over 600-700 yards receiving, we will be a very dangerous offense.

[defiantgiant]

I agree. Martz' system is completely different than that of Turner's. His scheme is purely based on timing and where receivers are "supposed to be." It took the Bears about 14 games for Cutler to finally get in sync with his WR's. If it takes that long next year we won't make the playoffs.

Yeah, that worries me. It could go either way: if Cutler and the receivers were struggling because they were each trying to guess what the other one was going to do, then maybe Martz's scheme will help, since he'll presumably be telling them both where to be and when.

 

On the other hand, our receivers don't run very precise routes and Cutler likes to string a play out until he sees someone get open, then gun it in there, kind of like Roethlisberger does or like Culpepper did back in 2004. That's pretty much the antithesis of a Martz QB. Cutler's going to need to change the way he does things, but Martz is probably going to have to meet him halfway. If Martz can get everybody on the same page in a single offseason, he's a genius. That said, if he actually can do it, he's got better personnel here than he did in Detroit or San Francisco...there's no reason to think the Bears' offense won't be better than the Niners/Lions offenses were (though certainly not as good as the St. Louis offense back in the day.)

[nfoligno]

All we can go off is someone's past. Look at Det when Martz took it over. Their OL was crap, and yet he still had Kitna taking 5 and 7 step drops. I think Kitna had around 60 sacks that season, and may have led the league.

 

I keep hearing that Martz will employ the 5-7 step drops from everyone but Martz. You don't think they guy has been paying attention to our line play? Look, Martz is alot of things but he isn't stupid. I think it's a mistake to assume that Martz hasn't tweaked his scheme to Cutler's ability and strengths. But let's be honest, Cutler needs as much help as anyone in this offense. He needs to fix the fundamentals and Martz will help him do that. Martz will DEMAND he does that. One other thing we'll see from Martz that will be refreshing versus Ron Turners offense is that Martz is a guy who does not script plays, he goes by what is happening in the game NOW. We aren't going to hear that we couldn't get Olsen into the game because we game planned to use 4WR sets OR we game planned for him to be a H back.

 

The key to success will be Cutler and Martz trusting one another enough to change.

 

[defiantgiant]

All we can go off is someone's past. Look at Det when Martz took it over. Their OL was crap, and yet he still had Kitna taking 5 and 7 step drops. I think Kitna had around 60 sacks that season, and may have led the league.

While I tend to agree, I will say this: Martz has never worked with a mobile quarterback like Cutler. If Jeff Garcia had still been with the Niners (or Alex Smith hadn't been injured) when Martz was there, maybe we'd have some idea of what he would do with a QB who can scramble and buy time, but as it is there's no relevant history to go on. He could try to fit a square peg into a round hole and make Cutler into a 7-step-drop, pocket passer, but he's never had to do that before: the guys he had in the past were already cut out for it.

 

Look at it this way: if you want to call a long-developing pass play and Jon Kitna or Shaun Hill is your quarterback, what can you do? Dial up a deep drop and hope your pass protection holds up. Martz got Kitna sacked a million times, but he didn't call all those deep drops because he loves sacks. He called them because he loves deep vertical pass plays that take a long time to develop. And with an immobile QB, the only way to get those plays off is with a deep drop and excellent pass protection.

 

For example, let's say your QB is Ben Roethlisberger instead of Kitna: you can call the same vertical shots, but using a normal drop, then rely on him to get out of the pocket, buy time, and make the throw on the move. I'm not saying Martz will do that with Cutler, but Cutler is the first QB he's ever had who has that kind of scrambling ability and can make every throw on the run. The fact that Martz was so high on him in the draft makes me think he must understand what makes Cutler special. And if he understands that, he'd be stupid not to take advantage of it.

 

I'm less worried about Martz adapting his playcalling to fit Cutler, since he seems to understand what a talent the guy is, and more worried about him adapting it to fit Olsen, the receivers, and the elements (read: crappy turf) at Soldier Field. Martz's offense is famous for requiring extremely precise routes, receivers who can stem off at exactly the right depth, etc. How many times have we seen Bears receivers slip and fall on the Soldier Field mud just trying to run a normal square-in or something? I don't know how Martz could get around that, but it'll require some adjustments on his part, that's for sure.