Guest TerraTor Posted March 13, 2010 Report Share Posted March 13, 2010 who knows what his health is really like but hed come insanely cheap and probably be the most talented and vet reciever on the team. If he doesnt make the Training Camp stuff (physical, playbook, etc etc) dump him. Personally I want TO, but i didnt wanna post that cuz id just get ripped, but kinda enjoy it anyway so.... Good Video-------------------------- http://www.nfl.com/players/javonwalker/profile?id=WAL209632 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bschmaranz Posted March 13, 2010 Report Share Posted March 13, 2010 Invite him to camp if there's nothing on the table for him. Other then that, I wouldn't guarantee him a damn thing. Before the Raiders came calling with HUGE money, Javon was thinking retirement. Maybe he'll consider it again. As for Owens, I've been pretty indifferent to bringing him in. If he doesn't cost a lot, whatever. The guy can still contribute and you know Cutler ain't gonna put up with his bullshit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradjock Posted March 13, 2010 Report Share Posted March 13, 2010 who knows what his health is really like but hed come insanely cheap and probably be the most talented and vet reciever on the team. If he doesnt make the Training Camp stuff (physical, playbook, etc etc) dump him. Personally I want TO, but i didnt wanna post that cuz id just get ripped, but kinda enjoy it anyway so.... Good Video-------------------------- http://www.nfl.com/players/javonwalker/profile?id=WAL209632 PFT had an article a while back calling Walker's contract with the Raiders the worst free agent signing of all time. He's injured to the point he can no long run. We keep talking about what kind of WR Martz wants for his system . . . I'm thinking the ability to run might be key. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TerraTor Posted March 13, 2010 Report Share Posted March 13, 2010 PFT had an article a while back calling Walker's contract with the Raiders the worst free agent signing of all time. He's injured to the point he can no long run. We keep talking about what kind of WR Martz wants for his system . . . I'm thinking the ability to run might be key. Ya that may be, Ha! I like TO alot, dont care much about walker, just a boring time and thought id post somethin. TO would instantly become the best player on offense Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bears4Ever_34 Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 I'm also pretty indifferent about T.O. I wouldn't go crazy over signing him because of his well documented antics on the field and in the locker room. He's a me first player and if he doesn't get what he wants he wines about it. The one thing you gotta give him credit for is his work ethic. He is known for being the hardest worker in practice and if your team is winning and he's doing well you've got yourself a pro bowl player. I just don't know if it's worth it because as soon as our offense goes through a dry spell T.O will get in Cutler's face and walk up and down the sideline griping. That's my fear with him. I know if we sign him he'll be a great player just like he always has been. It's the antics he does when he's not getting the ball is what worries me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TerraTor Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 I'm also pretty indifferent about T.O. I wouldn't go crazy over signing him because of his well documented antics on the field and in the locker room. He's a me first player and if he doesn't get what he wants he wines about it. The one thing you gotta give him credit for is his work ethic. He is known for being the hardest worker in practice and if your team is winning and he's doing well you've got yourself a pro bowl player. I just don't know if it's worth it because as soon as our offense goes through a dry spell T.O will get in Cutler's face and walk up and down the sideline griping. That's my fear with him. I know if we sign him he'll be a great player just like he always has been. It's the antics he does when he's not getting the ball is what worries me. Id take cutler in that rumble, just because he'd be loaded. Haha. You are correct about his work ethic, the guy is what 36? and is rediculously shredded and doesnt seem to have lost much of anything to his game. I know hed be a band aid but Id take 1000 and 10tds anyday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 Id take cutler in that rumble, just because he'd be loaded. Haha. You are correct about his work ethic, the guy is what 36? and is rediculously shredded and doesnt seem to have lost much of anything to his game. I know hed be a band aid but Id take 1000 and 10tds anyday. I've been calling for TO for several years now...but everyone is too worried about sideline antics to ignore his consistent production and dominance (minus the Buffalo year, where he was merely good). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bowlingtwig Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 I've been calling for TO for several years now...but everyone is too worried about sideline antics to ignore his consistent production and dominance (minus the Buffalo year, where he was merely good). Hell NO to both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Connorbear Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 Hell NO to both. Exactly. Peace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wesson44 Posted March 15, 2010 Report Share Posted March 15, 2010 Exactly. Peace 6'3 215 can catch....hell lets kick the tires and see how this baby runs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TerraTor Posted March 15, 2010 Report Share Posted March 15, 2010 No. well thougt out and i like how u back that opinion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ54 Posted March 16, 2010 Report Share Posted March 16, 2010 I've been calling for TO for several years now...but everyone is too worried about sideline antics to ignore his consistent production and dominance (minus the Buffalo year, where he was merely good). Does this "everyone" include all of T.O.'s former teammates, coaches, and management? How often do you see a team cut a good player not because they go after another player who they feel is better rather because they think the negatives that leave with the player will make the overall team better? How often is that team located in Dallas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wesson44 Posted March 16, 2010 Report Share Posted March 16, 2010 Does this "everyone" include all of T.O.'s former teammates, coaches, and management? How often do you see a team cut a good player not because they go after another player who they feel is better rather because they think the negatives that leave with the player will make the overall team better? How often is that team located in Dallas? Ok we get your point, but can you please explain what happened with TO and the Bills last year. When he had actually two bad QB'S to talk about. I think him being with the Bears would bring some excitement to the passing game if he still has it but I just don't think he's the player to bring in for the Martz system. Walker might be a better option if he has recovered. He and Driver were killing us back in the day and he is a bigger target for Cutler at 6'3 215lbs than Davis(gone) Hester, Bennett, Knox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bowlingtwig Posted March 16, 2010 Report Share Posted March 16, 2010 Ok we get your point, but can you please explain what happened with TO and the Bills last year. When he had actually two bad QB'S to talk about. I think him being with the Bears would bring some excitement to the passing game if he still has it but I just don't think he's the player to bring in for the Martz system. Walker might be a better option if he has recovered. He and Driver were killing us back in the day and he is a bigger target for Cutler at 6'3 215lbs than Davis(gone) Hester, Bennett, Knox TO destroys teams from the inside out. This happens all the time with all sports. Prime example is look at the Chicago Cubs last year. A very good team that goes out signs Milton Bradley. Team was willing to give him a chance despite the obvious character issues. Anybody who follows baseball saw what happened to the Cubs last year so much so that the team was willing to straight cut him thinking that its an addition to the team. You can't just have all the best players on your team. The team needs unity. TO's teams never have unity and at the 1st sign of trouble you will see him through the QB under the bus. Most so called experts say that Cutler is one of the hardest players in the league to get along with because of his competitiveness. Do you really want to see what could happen when Cutler decides not to through TO the ball 10+ times in a game. Granted the team would be very entertaining to say the least but not sure I want to see it with a team that I follow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balta1701-A Posted March 16, 2010 Report Share Posted March 16, 2010 The Cubs were not a very good team last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bowlingtwig Posted March 16, 2010 Report Share Posted March 16, 2010 The Cubs were not a very good team last year. Yes I agree the team was bad but the point is that they were a very good team in '08, they signed Milton Bradley to help get them over and instead he destroyed the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
defiantgiant Posted March 16, 2010 Report Share Posted March 16, 2010 I've been calling for TO for several years now...but everyone is too worried about sideline antics to ignore his consistent production and dominance (minus the Buffalo year, where he was merely good). What consistent production and dominance? He's lost a step or three and hasn't been able to reliably get off a jam for the past two seasons. And he's hardly consistent: in the 2008-2009 seasons he caught less than half the passes thrown to him. The only starting receiver who was less reliable over that span was Braylon Edwards. As for dominance, T.O. might have put up some decent yardage in recent years, but he got the ball thrown to him 249 times, so his yards-per-target are crap. I think of yards-per-target numbers for receivers like yards-per-carry for running backs. Signing T.O. is like signing a running back with a 2.8 YPC: sure, he can get you maybe 900 or 1000 yards, but only if you give him 350 carries. Any good starting receiver would have had WAY more production if he'd had as many opportunities as T.O. did. T.O. didn't even have good per-target production with Dallas in 2008: he got 140 passes thrown to him that season, and he barely squeaked over 1000 yards. For comparison, if Devin Hester had gotten 140 passes last year, he would have had 88 catches for 1165 yards. To find the last time T.O. had good yards-per-target, you have to go back to 2007 or even 2006. At the end of the day, we're talking about a receiver who gets nearly 250 passes in the last two seasons and only averages 900-950 yards a season. When you start looking at guys who got as many or more passes than T.O., they're all major #1 receivers: Larry Fitzgerald, Brandon Marshall, Andre Johnson, etc. Basically, T.O. can definitely still give you decent #2 receiver production, but only if you throw to him as much as a high-end #1 receiver. That's not a good deal. If Angelo has a time machine and can sign T.O. from 2006, then I'm all for it. But in 2010, T.O. looks like he's pretty much done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azbearsfan Posted March 16, 2010 Report Share Posted March 16, 2010 What consistent production and dominance? He's lost a step or three and hasn't been able to reliably get off a jam for the past two seasons. And he's hardly consistent: in the 2008-2009 seasons he caught less than half the passes thrown to him. The only starting receiver who was less reliable over that span was Braylon Edwards. As for dominance, T.O. might have put up some decent yardage in recent years, but he got the ball thrown to him 249 times, so his yards-per-target are crap. I think of yards-per-target numbers for receivers like yards-per-carry for running backs. Signing T.O. is like signing a running back with a 2.8 YPC: sure, he can get you maybe 900 or 1000 yards, but only if you give him 350 carries. Any good starting receiver would have had WAY more production if he'd had as many opportunities as T.O. did. T.O. didn't even have good per-target production with Dallas in 2008: he got 140 passes thrown to him that season, and he barely squeaked over 1000 yards. For comparison, if Devin Hester had gotten 140 passes last year, he would have had 88 catches for 1165 yards. To find the last time T.O. had good yards-per-target, you have to go back to 2007 or even 2006. At the end of the day, we're talking about a receiver who gets nearly 250 passes in the last two seasons and only averages 900-950 yards a season. When you start looking at guys who got as many or more passes than T.O., they're all major #1 receivers: Larry Fitzgerald, Brandon Marshall, Andre Johnson, etc. Basically, T.O. can definitely still give you decent #2 receiver production, but only if you throw to him as much as a high-end #1 receiver. That's not a good deal. If Angelo has a time machine and can sign T.O. from 2006, then I'm all for it. But in 2010, T.O. looks like he's pretty much done. I am with you dude. I didnt know TO was dominant. I dont really want those antics from a has been. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfoligno Posted March 17, 2010 Report Share Posted March 17, 2010 Dead on, and I love the RB/ypc analogy. Too often the total yardage is looked at in a tunnel. A RB that gets 1,000 yards looks good until you see a 3.2 average and realize he only had the yards due to getting the ball so many times. Same thing with TO. He can still rack up the yards when the QB forces the ball his way, but the difference between TO of yesterday and TO of today is TO simply (as you said) does get seperation. He never had great hands, but now he has a DB in his face making the catch even more difficult. TO comes w/ loads of baggage, and there was a time when it could be argued (by others, not myself) that his talent make such baggage an acceptible risk, but no longer. Again, I point to Dallas. If Dallas didn't let TO walk, Miles Austin would have never emerged. I think I would rather have Austin. By that same line of thought, I would rather see if one (or more) of our young WRs can develop into something special, rather than watch TO yell at the QB to throw him the ball, even if he is blanket covered. What consistent production and dominance? He's lost a step or three and hasn't been able to reliably get off a jam for the past two seasons. And he's hardly consistent: in the 2008-2009 seasons he caught less than half the passes thrown to him. The only starting receiver who was less reliable over that span was Braylon Edwards. As for dominance, T.O. might have put up some decent yardage in recent years, but he got the ball thrown to him 249 times, so his yards-per-target are crap. I think of yards-per-target numbers for receivers like yards-per-carry for running backs. Signing T.O. is like signing a running back with a 2.8 YPC: sure, he can get you maybe 900 or 1000 yards, but only if you give him 350 carries. Any good starting receiver would have had WAY more production if he'd had as many opportunities as T.O. did. T.O. didn't even have good per-target production with Dallas in 2008: he got 140 passes thrown to him that season, and he barely squeaked over 1000 yards. For comparison, if Devin Hester had gotten 140 passes last year, he would have had 88 catches for 1165 yards. To find the last time T.O. had good yards-per-target, you have to go back to 2007 or even 2006. At the end of the day, we're talking about a receiver who gets nearly 250 passes in the last two seasons and only averages 900-950 yards a season. When you start looking at guys who got as many or more passes than T.O., they're all major #1 receivers: Larry Fitzgerald, Brandon Marshall, Andre Johnson, etc. Basically, T.O. can definitely still give you decent #2 receiver production, but only if you throw to him as much as a high-end #1 receiver. That's not a good deal. If Angelo has a time machine and can sign T.O. from 2006, then I'm all for it. But in 2010, T.O. looks like he's pretty much done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrizzlyBear Posted March 17, 2010 Report Share Posted March 17, 2010 no to TO and walker , shoot we shoulda hung on to Lloyd then , about the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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