TO in Halas today??

[Chitownhustla]

Friend of mine said he heard on the radio that TO was at Halas today. Im looking online and cant find anything about it. Anyone else hear this too???

[adam]

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/...tler-olsen.html

 

There ya go.

 

and here: http://twitter.com/terrellowens

[Connorbear]

No. Too old and douche baggy.

 

Peace

[Chitownhustla]

No. Too old and douche baggy.

 

Peace

 

 

Def douchey way too douchey if you ask me

[Guest TerraTor]

Honestly Id be all for it. I like the guy, care less about his antics. Id rather take his 1000 and 10td with constant bitching then nice citizens and teammates who cant run routes.

[bradjock]

A few things:

 

1. Why is TO such a jack-ass? You want to work for the Bears so you advertise it by saying, "I'm drinking at a bar! Hey! There's Cutler & Olsen! We should be teammates!" Making an ass of yourself is no way to gain the trust of a potential employer.

2. TO can drink with Cutler, Urlacher, or that ball-boy who ran down the side-lines when Knox returned the kick. If he ain't talking to Martz or JA, it ain't happening

3. Martz just came out saying how thrilled he was with the WR but he wants a veteran QB. If he wanted TO, I think he'd push for it.

 

 

[GrizzlyBear]

Nah let him sign footballs for Nike, B ut play for Bears? No Thank you.

[Guest TerraTor]

Not that it matters about TO or anyone else, but what Martz say?

 

He was given a job after what 3 or 4 other guys were already gone? He got the job through his old friends and of course hell buy right into their BS about the offense being good. The Oline may be worst in league, and i wouldnt argue with anyone saying the WR Corps is the worst. I mean seriously

[jason]

Honestly Id be all for it. I like the guy, care less about his antics. Id rather take his 1000 and 10td with constant bitching then nice citizens and teammates who cant run routes.

 

Been saying this for several years, but almost everyone on the board has been all against it. If everyone remembers correctly, TO AND Randy Moss could have been had at one time. In fact, I'm sure I made a post about it. But no, the Bears need Boy Scouts instead of football players.

 

It would have been nice seeing him catch balls from Cutler last year. Unfortunately, it's one year late.

[Connorbear]

Been saying this for several years, but almost everyone on the board has been all against it. If everyone remembers correctly, TO AND Randy Moss could have been had at one time. In fact, I'm sure I made a post about it. But no, the Bears need Boy Scouts instead of football players.

 

It would have been nice seeing him catch balls from Cutler last year. Unfortunately, it's one year late.

We don't have to have boy scouts but keep away locker room cancers. TO is without a doubt a locker room cancer.

 

Peace

[GrizzlyBear]

We don't have to have boy scouts but keep away locker room cancers. TO is without a doubt a locker room cancer.

 

Peace

 

 

Agreed

[ChileBear]

Been saying this for several years, but almost everyone on the board has been all against it. If everyone remembers correctly, TO AND Randy Moss could have been had at one time. In fact, I'm sure I made a post about it. But no, the Bears need Boy Scouts instead of football players.

 

It would have been nice seeing him catch balls from Cutler last year. Unfortunately, it's one year late.

There is a very good reaason why "TO AND Randy Moss could have been had at one time". They are not team friendly players, but guys who demand all the attention, of teammates, coaches, fans, media and anyone else. There is enough to worry about to get the team to lay as a unit; adding either one of those two wouldnot get us over the hump, just cause more disruption and take focus away from winning as a team. Other teams don't want them cause they are not worth the price. . .and I'm not talking about money. So, let TO visit Chicago, but stay out of Halas Hall. please.

[jason]

We don't have to have boy scouts but keep away locker room cancers. TO is without a doubt a locker room cancer.

 

Peace

 

...who puts up stats at the WR position that the Bears have NEVER seen in their entire history.

 

Think about that for a minute. EVER. That's effing ridiculous.

[nfoligno]

But Jason, how many times have you pointed out that it has been as much, and more, due to the play of the QB and OL than the WRs.

 

You so often make the boy scout comments, but there is a great deal of space between boy scout and locker room cancer. It isn't that most feel we have to hire choir boys, but at the same time, you can hire solid talent while avoiding the worst of the worst in terms of character.

 

Also, there is a difference between TO of a some years ago, and the TO of recent. I saw it here in Dallas. Dallas didn't have a plethora of WR talent, but felt they simply were better off getting rid of TO rather than keeping him. TO yells at the QB anytime he doesn't see the ball come his way, even though he no longer gets open as he used to. If TO has 3 DB blanket covering him, he still demands the ball. Further, as those here in Dallas often point out, if TO were here, Miles Austin would have never developed as he did.

 

I like the young talent we have at WR, and feel a player like TO would do far more harm than good.

 

...who puts up stats at the WR position that the Bears have NEVER seen in their entire history.

 

Think about that for a minute. EVER. That's effing ridiculous.

 

[Connorbear]

But Jason, how many times have you pointed out that it has been as much, and more, due to the play of the QB and OL than the WRs.

 

You so often make the boy scout comments, but there is a great deal of space between boy scout and locker room cancer. It isn't that most feel we have to hire choir boys, but at the same time, you can hire solid talent while avoiding the worst of the worst in terms of character.

 

Also, there is a difference between TO of a some years ago, and the TO of recent. I saw it here in Dallas. Dallas didn't have a plethora of WR talent, but felt they simply were better off getting rid of TO rather than keeping him. TO yells at the QB anytime he doesn't see the ball come his way, even though he no longer gets open as he used to. If TO has 3 DB blanket covering him, he still demands the ball. Further, as those here in Dallas often point out, if TO were here, Miles Austin would have never developed as he did.

 

I like the young talent we have at WR, and feel a player like TO would do far more harm than good.

What he said.

 

Peace

[BearSox]

I love the argument that TO is too much of a douche and destroys chemisty, etc... Do you guys not realize we have one of the biggest douches in the NFL with Urlacher? He's broken up the Bears locker room far too many times. If he doesn't like a player, he'll try and turn the whole team against said player.

 

I've heard numerous stories about him being a huge douche, and his latest antics are even more annoying as now he's picking fights with former Bear greats.

 

Personally, I don't care. These are grown men and not everyone is going to like each other. Chemistry is overrated in the locker room for football, and the only thing most players care about is winning. And TO cares about winning as much as anyone else does, perhaps even more so than a lot of players. If you win, there won't be any worries about team chemistry.

[jason]

But Jason, how many times have you pointed out that it has been as much, and more, due to the play of the QB and OL than the WRs.

 

Often, because it is important. And since the OL sucked last year, it's up to the QB and the WRs.

 

You so often make the boy scout comments, but there is a great deal of space between boy scout and locker room cancer. It isn't that most feel we have to hire choir boys, but at the same time, you can hire solid talent while avoiding the worst of the worst in terms of character.

 

The key word in your statement is "solid." I agree; often you can get solid players. But rarely do you get superstars who don't have a little bit of "me first" in them, maybe more. Randy Moss sure seems to be doing fine in New England. Terrell Owens sure seems to do well when his teams are winning. Both have no issues getting along with teammates while ON the field. That's what I care about. I'm not saying they'll be perfect, but neither has punched a teammate in the face like another person on our team. None has helped split the team against another teammate.

 

Also, there is a difference between TO of a some years ago, and the TO of recent. I saw it here in Dallas. Dallas didn't have a plethora of WR talent, but felt they simply were better off getting rid of TO rather than keeping him. TO yells at the QB anytime he doesn't see the ball come his way, even though he no longer gets open as he used to. If TO has 3 DB blanket covering him, he still demands the ball. Further, as those here in Dallas often point out, if TO were here, Miles Austin would have never developed as he did.

 

I like the young talent we have at WR, and feel a player like TO would do far more harm than good.

 

Agreed. That's why I said it was too late in my original reply to this thread. The problem is, just about this entire board has said no to TO for multiple years, even back to the old board, despite the fact that we had bums like Dez White and others at WR.

 

TO was available in 2004 when the Bears had Thomas Jones lead the team with receiving. A RB led the team.

RM was available in 2005 when the Bears had Muhsin Muhammed lead the team with a weak 64 receptions.

TO was available in 2006 when the Bears had Muhsin Muhammed lead the team with a weak 60 receptions.

RM was available in 2007 when the Bears had Bernard Berrian lead the team with 71 receptions, not bad, but not #1 quality.

 

The point is, EACH year those two stars were available, the Bears needed WR help in a VERY bad way. Each year they were ignored...much like the team seems to ignore the OL.

[nfoligno]

The key word in your statement is "solid." I agree; often you can get solid players. But rarely do you get superstars who don't have a little bit of "me first" in them, maybe more.

 

1. I am not sure that is as true today as it used to be. It seems like not that long ago, when you looked at the elite WRs in the league, they are all prima dona's (at the very least) and often worse. Is that really still true though? Look at the top 10 WRs from last year,

 

A.Johnson, Welker, M.Austin, S.Rice, R.Moss, Wayne, Holmes, S.Smith(NYG), Hines Ward and V.Jackson.

 

From that list, Moss and Holmes are the only two I know of who would be considered character red flags. If we look at recent years, I think we see the same. While you still have a couple up there, I think there has been a shift away from the Owens and similar character receivers.

 

2. You mention "a little me first", or even say "maybe more" but that is a far cry from Terrell Owens. It is one thing when you mention a WR who has a bit of prima dona, or whatever mentality, but another all together when talking about Owens. Honestly, this is one part of your argument that always drove me nuts. Just because many did not want TO, you would say we only want choir boys, not realizing there is a huge gap between choir boy and TO, who is considered by most the worst locker room cancer among WRs.

 

Randy Moss sure seems to be doing fine in New England.

 

Moss has done well in NE, but look what it took for that to be true. Moss is the sort that need incredible leadership around him. I would argue that if he came to the bears, it would be far more like his time in Oakland, where there was a lack of leadership. You really think Lovie could control him like Billicheck? You really think Rex or Orton could have kept him in like the way Brady does?

 

Terrell Owens sure seems to do well when his teams are winning.

 

Disagree. Phily was still a strong and winning football team when TO blew up and divided the locker room. Ditto in Dallas, where they made the playoffs twice. Sure, he was "getting his" and putting up some stats, but at the same time, he was destroying the locker room and throwing his QBs under the bus. He totally called out McNabb, and then in Dallas, called out Romo and Witten and cried that Romo preferred to throw to his buddy rather than to him.

 

Both have no issues getting along with teammates while ON the field. That's what I care about. I'm not saying they'll be perfect, but neither has punched a teammate in the face like another person on our team. None has helped split the team against another teammate.

 

Wow do I disagree with this. He called his QB in SF gay. That isn't what I call getting along. In Phily, he really split that locker room. Maybe he didn't punch a player in the face, but I also recall another Phily teamate punching a another player, and per the reports, the locker room split TO caused was the cause of the fight, as the two players were taking sides, one for TO and the other for McNabb. Everything I read said TO split that locker room such that half the team was against McNabb. That is pretty damning. Then in Dallas, he called out Romo and said he only threw to Witten, his friend. Every time Romo would not throw to TO, TO would throw up his hands and run over to Romo and give him crap. It got to the point camera's really started to focus on this and showed his antics after each play. TO would be draped with coverage, yet still get upset Romo would not throw him the ball. And it didn't even matter that Romo would throw a completion, or pickup a 1st down. TO was still upset. That is not getting along with player, on or off the field.

 

Agreed. That's why I said it was too late in my original reply to this thread. The problem is, just about this entire board has said no to TO for multiple years, even back to the old board, despite the fact that we had bums like Dez White and others at WR.

 

Even when TO was more in his prime, I was against the move. Sorry, but if the QB/coach combination in Phily was not enough to control him, how the heck do you think Lovie and Rex or Orton could have? Did we need help at WR. W/O question. But there were other options who could have helped, and IMHO, done far more for us.

 

The point is, EACH year those two stars were available, the Bears needed WR help in a VERY bad way. Each year they were ignored...much like the team seems to ignore the OL.

 

No argument, but the point is, TO was not the only option available.

[nfoligno]

One. Urlacher. I am not sure about the locker room split you are talking about. I don't think I have ever heard about Urlacher being the cause of a locker room split. Was Urlacher part of the Benson drama? Yes. But so were Briggs, Mike Brown and Alex Brown, among others. Frankly, that wasn't even a locker room split, as it was pretty much the entire locker room against Benson. Other than this, I am not sure when you are talking about. Urlacher can be an idiot and should avoid reporters as he puts his foot in his mouth too often, but I have never heard of Urlacher being a cause for locker room chemistry issues. Quite the contrary, he is always considered a leader and captain among his players.

 

Two. I disagree TO cares about winning nearly so much as he cares about "getting his". I saw it first hand here in Dallas. There were times when Dallas would win big, but did so w/o TO having a big role. Was TO happy the team won? If he was, you wouldn't know it as he would sulk, and only talk about his lack of production in the game, rather than talk about the win or how great the other players performed.

 

Three. Phily and Dallas were both winning teams, and yet had huge locker room issues that TO was considered a direct cause of. Both teams got rid of TO after a playoff season due to the chemistry issues he created. I don't know where the belief came from that TO only goes mental when the team does not win. He was caused problems in both Phily and Dallas when the teams were playing well and winning. To TO, it wasn't so much about the team winning, but about his stats.

 

I love the argument that TO is too much of a douche and destroys chemisty, etc... Do you guys not realize we have one of the biggest douches in the NFL with Urlacher? He's broken up the Bears locker room far too many times. If he doesn't like a player, he'll try and turn the whole team against said player.

 

I've heard numerous stories about him being a huge douche, and his latest antics are even more annoying as now he's picking fights with former Bear greats.

 

Personally, I don't care. These are grown men and not everyone is going to like each other. Chemistry is overrated in the locker room for football, and the only thing most players care about is winning. And TO cares about winning as much as anyone else does, perhaps even more so than a lot of players. If you win, there won't be any worries about team chemistry.

 

[Mongo3451]

The key word in your statement is "solid." I agree; often you can get solid players. But rarely do you get superstars who don't have a little bit of "me first" in them, maybe more. Randy Moss sure seems to be doing fine in New England. Terrell Owens sure seems to do well when his teams are winning. That is a cop-out and simply not true, TO was throwing McNabb under the bus after a Championship run in which he got the ball often. Both have no issues getting along with teammates while ON the field. While I’ll agree on Moss, TO has proven to be a different story. He’s completely clueless to his surroundings. I think it goes a little deeper than being a prima dona. TO simply does not know right from wrong on how to interact with men. He’s more like a bitch in a beauty parlor. That's what I care about. I'm not saying they'll be perfect, but neither has punched a teammate in the face like another person on our team. None has helped split the team against another teammate. Again, TO has been accused of being a locker room divider wherever he has been. It’s been talked about in detail in SF, Philly and Dallas.

 

 

The point is, EACH year those two stars were available, the Bears needed WR help in a VERY bad way. Each year they were ignored...much like the team seems to ignore the OL. Disagree with our team addressing needs of OL and WR. The team has tried, but failed. That’s more of an indictment on JA’s talent evaluation or the coaching staff’s ability to get production out of players. Moose went back to Carolina and had good stats again. We have a starting left tackle playing for the Cards and another Starting right tackle playing for the Cowboys. (Both playoff teams) I’m more convinced than ever we have a bunch of bumbling idiots running this team. I’m leaning toward Lovie and below, as I think JA has done at least an average job. I think the positions have been addressed, just miserably

[nfoligno]

The only thing I would question is to what extent we have even attempted to address OL.

 

Look how long Angelo has been here, and simply how little he has drafted along the OL. Worse, how few 1st day (rounds 1-3) picks he has invested along the OL. Then look at the FAs. The majority of OL FAs he has brought in were lower cost players. We might sign a guy over 30 who we hope to squeeze a year or two out of. Or we sign a guy w/ injury history who we hope can stay healthy. Or we sign a guy who hasn't proven much, but we hope can develop. Whatever, the point is, we invested little by way of draft picks or money along the OL.

 

Too often, we would sign an older OL, which is fine, but we didn't follow that up by drafting an OL to develop and be ready to take over. And drafting OL in the 6th and 7th rounds just doesn't really count.

 

In Angelo's 1st draft, he took OL in the 1st and 3rd rounds. Great. But it would be another 5 drafts before he drafted another OL (not counting 6th/7th picks). That was Beekman in the 4th.

 

In 9 drafts, Angelo has spent only 4 picks on OL in the top 5 rounds. Only in 2 of those 9 drafts did Angelo go OL on day 1.

 

He was adding FAs (some) but again, when you sign players like Brown, Miller or Pace, you just can't expect much more than a year or two. Those picks would be fine if you were also drafting OL to develop, but we added aging veterans while not adding youth.

 

I agree we tried and failed at WR. We spent day one picks on WRs, as well as added FAs. They just didn't workout. Along the OL though, I think it was far more about our not even making a legit effort to add to the position.

 

Angelo has drafted 13 DL in the top 5 rounds of those same 9 drafts, again, compared to the 4 OL. Might out OL have looked better of the years if that was just a bit more rounded out?

 

The key word in your statement is "solid." I agree; often you can get solid players. But rarely do you get superstars who don't have a little bit of "me first" in them, maybe more. Randy Moss sure seems to be doing fine in New England. Terrell Owens sure seems to do well when his teams are winning. That is a cop-out and simply not true, TO was throwing McNabb under the bus after a Championship run in which he got the ball often. Both have no issues getting along with teammates while ON the field. While I’ll agree on Moss, TO has proven to be a different story. He’s completely clueless to his surroundings. I think it goes a little deeper than being a prima dona. TO simply does not know right from wrong on how to interact with men. He’s more like a bitch in a beauty parlor. That's what I care about. I'm not saying they'll be perfect, but neither has punched a teammate in the face like another person on our team. None has helped split the team against another teammate. Again, TO has been accused of being a locker room divider wherever he has been. It’s been talked about in detail in SF, Philly and Dallas.

 

 

The point is, EACH year those two stars were available, the Bears needed WR help in a VERY bad way. Each year they were ignored...much like the team seems to ignore the OL. Disagree with our team addressing needs of OL and WR. The team has tried, but failed. That’s more of an indictment on JA’s talent evaluation or the coaching staff’s ability to get production out of players. Moose went back to Carolina and had good stats again. We have a starting left tackle playing for the Cards and another Starting right tackle playing for the Cowboys. (Both playoff teams) I’m more convinced than ever we have a bunch of bumbling idiots running this team. I’m leaning toward Lovie and below, as I think JA has done at least an average job. I think the positions have been addressed, just miserably

 

[Mongo3451]

The only thing I would question is to what extent we have even attempted to address OL.

 

Look how long Angelo has been here, and simply how little he has drafted along the OL. Worse, how few 1st day (rounds 1-3) picks he has invested along the OL. Then look at the FAs. The majority of OL FAs he has brought in were lower cost players. We might sign a guy over 30 who we hope to squeeze a year or two out of. Or we sign a guy w/ injury history who we hope can stay healthy. Or we sign a guy who hasn't proven much, but we hope can develop. Whatever, the point is, we invested little by way of draft picks or money along the OL.

 

Too often, we would sign an older OL, which is fine, but we didn't follow that up by drafting an OL to develop and be ready to take over. And drafting OL in the 6th and 7th rounds just doesn't really count.

 

In Angelo's 1st draft, he took OL in the 1st and 3rd rounds. Great. But it would be another 5 drafts before he drafted another OL (not counting 6th/7th picks). That was Beekman in the 4th.

 

In 9 drafts, Angelo has spent only 4 picks on OL in the top 5 rounds. Only in 2 of those 9 drafts did Angelo go OL on day 1.

 

He was adding FAs (some) but again, when you sign players like Brown, Miller or Pace, you just can't expect much more than a year or two. Those picks would be fine if you were also drafting OL to develop, but we added aging veterans while not adding youth.

 

I agree we tried and failed at WR. We spent day one picks on WRs, as well as added FAs. They just didn't workout. Along the OL though, I think it was far more about our not even making a legit effort to add to the position.

 

Angelo has drafted 13 DL in the top 5 rounds of those same 9 drafts, again, compared to the 4 OL. Might out OL have looked better of the years if that was just a bit more rounded out?

Yeah, there's no doubt we agree on this issue of OL. I think where JA's philosophy differs from ours is that he places a premium on DL. As we've heard many times, they are the key to the defense. The fact that JA has failed so miserably at having a stud DL, QB and S has dramatically shifted his ability to aquire OL via the draft. Leaving him to take late flyers, hoping to get lucky or supplementing with servicable FA veterens.

 

IMO - if they would have focused a higher level of attention on OL and coaching them up, everything else would have fallen into place on the offense. It would have made everyone else better, including the QB's.

 

Here's the funny thing; DL in the cover two is supposed to be one of the easiest positions to find, yet JA has had success with only one out of 13 draft choices?? That tells me our coaching sucks. How many times have you heard that JA had solid drafts from people in the know, only to have them NOT pan out. Coaching...

 

I have preached for years to have the OL fixed or to have one side of the ball be dominant. Neither has happened, but not for a lack of trying to draft D. Coach is a defensive guru and they still can't get it right? I'm blaming Lovie.

 

IMO - where JA screwed the pooch was during our Superbowl window. Remember the draft after the Superbowl? GM's from other teams thought we bulletproof and the only team that could win it all despite not having a good QB. He took flyers at many positions to gamble on explosiveness. That draft with not adding OL high and letting TJ go put a world of hurt on our future. It was a squandered opportunity by drafting a bunch of men for their measurables. IE: men in shorts.

[jason]

The key word in your statement is "solid." I agree; often you can get solid players. But rarely do you get superstars who don't have a little bit of "me first" in them, maybe more.

 

1. I am not sure that is as true today as it used to be. It seems like not that long ago, when you looked at the elite WRs in the league, they are all prima dona's (at the very least) and often worse. Is that really still true though? Look at the top 10 WRs from last year,

 

A.Johnson, Welker, M.Austin, S.Rice, R.Moss, Wayne, Holmes, S.Smith(NYG), Hines Ward and V.Jackson.

 

From that list, Moss and Holmes are the only two I know of who would be considered character red flags. If we look at recent years, I think we see the same. While you still have a couple up there, I think there has been a shift away from the Owens and similar character receivers.

 

2. You mention "a little me first", or even say "maybe more" but that is a far cry from Terrell Owens. It is one thing when you mention a WR who has a bit of prima dona, or whatever mentality, but another all together when talking about Owens. Honestly, this is one part of your argument that always drove me nuts. Just because many did not want TO, you would say we only want choir boys, not realizing there is a huge gap between choir boy and TO, who is considered by most the worst locker room cancer among WRs.

 

Randy Moss sure seems to be doing fine in New England.

 

Moss has done well in NE, but look what it took for that to be true. Moss is the sort that need incredible leadership around him. I would argue that if he came to the bears, it would be far more like his time in Oakland, where there was a lack of leadership. You really think Lovie could control him like Billicheck? You really think Rex or Orton could have kept him in like the way Brady does?

 

Terrell Owens sure seems to do well when his teams are winning.

 

Disagree. Phily was still a strong and winning football team when TO blew up and divided the locker room. Ditto in Dallas, where they made the playoffs twice. Sure, he was "getting his" and putting up some stats, but at the same time, he was destroying the locker room and throwing his QBs under the bus. He totally called out McNabb, and then in Dallas, called out Romo and Witten and cried that Romo preferred to throw to his buddy rather than to him.

 

Both have no issues getting along with teammates while ON the field. That's what I care about. I'm not saying they'll be perfect, but neither has punched a teammate in the face like another person on our team. None has helped split the team against another teammate.

 

Wow do I disagree with this. He called his QB in SF gay. That isn't what I call getting along. In Phily, he really split that locker room. Maybe he didn't punch a player in the face, but I also recall another Phily teamate punching a another player, and per the reports, the locker room split TO caused was the cause of the fight, as the two players were taking sides, one for TO and the other for McNabb. Everything I read said TO split that locker room such that half the team was against McNabb. That is pretty damning. Then in Dallas, he called out Romo and said he only threw to Witten, his friend. Every time Romo would not throw to TO, TO would throw up his hands and run over to Romo and give him crap. It got to the point camera's really started to focus on this and showed his antics after each play. TO would be draped with coverage, yet still get upset Romo would not throw him the ball. And it didn't even matter that Romo would throw a completion, or pickup a 1st down. TO was still upset. That is not getting along with player, on or off the field.

 

Agreed. That's why I said it was too late in my original reply to this thread. The problem is, just about this entire board has said no to TO for multiple years, even back to the old board, despite the fact that we had bums like Dez White and others at WR.

 

Even when TO was more in his prime, I was against the move. Sorry, but if the QB/coach combination in Phily was not enough to control him, how the heck do you think Lovie and Rex or Orton could have? Did we need help at WR. W/O question. But there were other options who could have helped, and IMHO, done far more for us.

 

The point is, EACH year those two stars were available, the Bears needed WR help in a VERY bad way. Each year they were ignored...much like the team seems to ignore the OL.

 

No argument, but the point is, TO was not the only option available.

 

I'll summarize for the sake of argument...

-TO and Randy Moss are hard to handle OFF the field, but not so much ON the field. Your points are almost always things that happen OFF the field. I saw TO do the stuff you mention in Dallas, but nowhere else. I have not heard of the fight in the Eagles locker room being caused by TO.

-Both WRs may have been locker room problems, or interview problems, but that is an organizational problem that should be handled in house.

-If a team has a problem with a player, then the coach and the organization need to handle it. If the combined will/authority can't control the player, then it's poor management. This is true in all organizations.

 

We'll always disagree, but I think you guys put too much into this off the field junk. If the dude is putting up 10 TDs or more every year, then he's a damn player. And that's what I want to see on the Bears: players. I want the Bears to win more than I want them to have a bunch of good guys. Notice that I was COMPLETELY against drafting Benson, once he was on the team I was equally against getting rid of him because I thought it was a bad move ("bad" guy or not). If the Bears from yesteryear had to deal with today's sensitive, PC climate, where every decision is questioned and everything is overanalyzed, you guys would not remember players like Butkus or Ditka fondly...because they would have been run out of town.

[jason]

Three. Phily and Dallas were both winning teams, and yet had huge locker room issues that TO was considered a direct cause of. Both teams got rid of TO after a playoff season due to the chemistry issues he created. I don't know where the belief came from that TO only goes mental when the team does not win. He was caused problems in both Phily and Dallas when the teams were playing well and winning. To TO, it wasn't so much about the team winning, but about his stats.

 

When things were going well in both places, you barely heard a peep out of TO. I don't know where you are getting the reverse angle from. TO's reactions, from what I have seen over many, many games, always seem to be negative when the team loses, and he feels he could have helped the team more. Both of those teams were winning teams...but both ultimately lost.

[jason]

The key word in your statement is "solid." I agree; often you can get solid players. But rarely do you get superstars who don't have a little bit of "me first" in them, maybe more. Randy Moss sure seems to be doing fine in New England. Terrell Owens sure seems to do well when his teams are winning. That is a cop-out and simply not true, TO was throwing McNabb under the bus after a Championship run in which he got the ball often. Both have no issues getting along with teammates while ON the field. While I’ll agree on Moss, TO has proven to be a different story. He’s completely clueless to his surroundings. I think it goes a little deeper than being a prima dona. TO simply does not know right from wrong on how to interact with men. He’s more like a bitch in a beauty parlor. That's what I care about. I'm not saying they'll be perfect, but neither has punched a teammate in the face like another person on our team. None has helped split the team against another teammate. Again, TO has been accused of being a locker room divider wherever he has been. It’s been talked about in detail in SF, Philly and Dallas.

 

Show me where TO has caused a problem while on the field. Oh, and BTW, it's "throwing a QB under the bus after a championship run"...that eventually ended with a loss. Therefore, it's not a true "championship" run.

 

The point is, EACH year those two stars were available, the Bears needed WR help in a VERY bad way. Each year they were ignored...much like the team seems to ignore the OL. Disagree with our team addressing needs of OL and WR. The team has tried, but failed. That’s more of an indictment on JA’s talent evaluation or the coaching staff’s ability to get production out of players. Moose went back to Carolina and had good stats again. We have a starting left tackle playing for the Cards and another Starting right tackle playing for the Cowboys. (Both playoff teams) I’m more convinced than ever we have a bunch of bumbling idiots running this team. I’m leaning toward Lovie and below, as I think JA has done at least an average job. I think the positions have been addressed, just miserably

 

I agree that the coaches and much of the front office are idiots, but IDK what you're talking about with the OL. It's rarely addressed, and the one mistake (Colombo) is not really a mistake...it's an unfortunate injury. As for the Cardinals' player, I have no clue which starter was formerly with the Bears. I'm missing something here.