JA: "team not loaded w/ great talent"

[Lucky Luciano]

I think you might be doing the math backwards.

 

It isn't Angelo's goal to get great picks with every pick, he KNOWS the draft is hit or miss, it's his goal to keep every position stocked with players that fit the scheme.

 

i really disagree with this statement. that IS the definition of his job.

 

a GM's goal should be to draft HOF quality players with every pick and not just throw $h!t against a wall and hope something sticks!!

 

So when you see him picking Gilbert and Melton, for example, he may not be thinking "each of these guys is a blue chipper" he's probably thinking "I need to increase COMPETITION on the defensive line, and each of these guys has an upside, but also has some risk. If I take two, I better my odds of having at least one of them come out, and that helps my DL issue."

 

the 4th round on is where you can reach for players or take a chance on an injured or character issue player. your special teams, project players and depth are important in these rounds.

 

the first three rounds of the draft should be high quality players that constitute the blood, muscle and bone of your franchise. a shotgun approach with the hopes of "increasing COMPETITION" is a recipe for what we currently have and leads to disaster. these rounds are where your best chance is to draft quality starters, not just average players or depth.

 

let's look at our running back situation for instance. we spent THREE first day picks to find one who 'could' probably turn out to be good. even then we spent a good hunk of change in FA, getting taylor, because one first round pick was cut (in which i believe we paid a good chunk of garanteed money to get rid of him) and one round 3 pick is at BEST a special teams player!!! think back as to what quality players we could have drafted in 2 of those 3 slots. hasn't this effected our cap situation also for the worse?

 

with the salary cap in effect in todays NFL it is imperative that you draft quality starters. picking up quality free agents to fill your base needs, rather than the draft, is just too expensive. it can't be done with any lasting success. usually these high quality FA players are...

 

1. on the downside of their careers due to age or health. you can 'usually' expect only a few years of very high quality play out of them before they need to be replaced again. not many are just coming into the prime of their careers. a good example is ted washington.

 

2. the cost is prohibitive as these players are demanding top dollar. in this instance you have to probably let other good players go into FA or cut them because they won't fit under the cap thus weakening your team. you also make the other players on your team wonder why they aren't getting top dollar too even when in some instances they are clearly better players than the new comer.

 

3. you risk continuity and locker room problems with players you have not brought up under your system. plus, even with really good FA's, in many instances it takes a season to acclimate them into your system just to get top play out of them and the players around them.

 

Just as a good financial portfolio (or offensive gameplan) includes some conservative plays and some high risk high reward choices, so does Jerry also take some swings on players that have a VERY high upside, but also have glaring issues that have caused them to fall in the draft. There's nothing wrong with taking a flier on some physical specimen and seeing if you can coach him up a little.

 

For example, when we need help at a position, it's not uncommon to see Jerry take several players in kind of a shotgun mode. Your aim can be off, but if you put enough pellets in the right direction, you're going to hit something. if he does that, spends say 3 picks on a position, and develops a good starter there from one of them, does it matter that the other two 9which were at the same position) didn't pan out? Would you rather he put all his eggs in one basket and take only ONE player and just get it right all the time? Angelo is factoring in the uncertainty in the draft into his moves, and you aren't measuring that at all in your analysis.

 

high risks have NOT paid out dividends for jerry angelo!! we wasted multiple 2nd rd picks reaching for players.

 

example: dan bazuin a small school, injured BUST who is out of the NFL, d. manning a small school safety who FIVE YEARS later is still a below average, m. bradley an injured, inexperienced WR who never even broke the starting lineup and is out of football (BUST) and tank johnson a decent player who had character issues who we CUT.

 

peanut who has turned out to be a good player but not utilized to his greatest potential and was a small school reach 7 years ago, devin hester who was drafted at least one round higher than he should have for a DB and special team player prospect (who failed at DB).

 

the only player drafted that wasn't a reach and was drafted rounds before anyone else would have is possibly forte. then add gaines adams and angie trading OUT of our first pick in the 2009 draft, to the list of idiotic moves and that sums up the second round of the NFL draft for his career.

 

well... how bout the THIRD round?

 

the great offensive lineman t. metcalf, who the idiot angelo gave an extension, is currently out of football. seems like nobody wanted him except us because he sucked forever. roosevelt williams another small school reach who we cut after camp a year later and is currently out of the NFL, dusty D another injured player who we reached on and is currently out of the NFL, the great mike okwo a player projected at least 1-3 rounds lower who is now out of the NFL, garret wolfe a special teams player who we again reached for who would have gone at least 1-3 rounds lower, m. harrison another reach due to character issues who couldn't even make to camp because of supposedly weight problems and is average at very best, iglesias who couldn't even get off our practice squad and is currently GONE.

 

that leaves ONE very good player in briggs who was drafted 7 YEARS ago, b. barrian an average WR and bennet another WR prospect who is yet to be evaluated.

 

would you want this mess on YOUR portfolio if you were looking for a job in this area?

 

Let's say he's looking for a CB. Say he takes one in the 2nd round, and a long shot again int he 4th. Hopefully the 2nd rounder is surer, and certainly he was rated higher, but there are players that dont pan out. If Jerry hits on the 4th, you're going to criticize him for the 2nd being a flop - but HIS approach was to find A PLAYER, and he committed TWO picks of value to that ONE goal. The way you score it, he'd lose points, when in fact he should GAIN them for good insurance move.

 

Jerry's doing it right, and your analysis of him is based on a premise that isn't true - he doesnt play to hit each pick, he USES picks as a tool to stock his team.

 

when has this approach ever worked? list the players who are 'quality' starters on this team on EITHER side of the ball that angelo drafted in ANY round.

 

a good measuring stick is this... if we traded ANY player on this roster angelo drafted, what round draft pick would we be compensated with from the trading team? is it even as high as what we drafted them with?

 

The way to judge him is to point to the team, and whether he addresses needs etc. You want to say he missed on the OL this year? That's fair. But overall, especially on defense, he seems to do a good job of identifying what we need and doing things to fix them, without spending too much. And in the cases of Cutler and peppers, knowing when and how to win the bidding.

 

To simply look at each pick, out of context to the other picks, and free agents etc, isn't really the right way to value the draft. Look at the team they field, the final product, and if there are weaknesses then hold him accountable for that.

 

angie drafted 11 offensive linemen. he "MISSED" on the offensive line for his entire tenure here. the ONLY player we are not sure of is the OLT who is now playing GUARD because he is worse than one of the worst OLT's in the NFL who he drafted in the 1st round.

 

what has he done on the defensive side of the ball to make this team better with his drafts? at what position? we have the worst DB's probably in the nfl and couldn't get more than a 4th rounder for any or all of them. at LB we have lance briggs with no depth at LB at all ready to start for a season now or in the future. DL? he drafted m. harrison a depth, at VERY best, defensive lineman and tommie harris who is, due to injury or is mentally toast, finished. who else?

 

sorry, but in my opinion none of this is out of context. let's look at our starters...

 

CB - none are very good. peanut is aging and quite frankly hasn't been a good CB for some time (although he would have been an excellent safety). that means we need 2. is there any depth on this roster you could say is good enough to start for any real good team in the nfl?

 

S - d. manning is consistantly average at best. wright? an unknown at this time, c. harris?.

 

safety, especially free safety, is a very important key when running the defense we currently do. we need at LEAST one very good one and maybe even a very good strong safety to boot.

 

LB - all three starters are 30 + years old. who on this roster is qualified to be a starter behind them?

 

DL - both DE's are 30+. one DT, adams, is 30+. tommy harris is done. so what depth is there currently on our roster to replace any of them as sure starters?

 

OL - kreutz is 33. who else is worth anything on this starting roster? maybe c. williams in the future? at what position? we need in essence 2 tackles, 1 guard and a center.

 

FB - mamu is over 30

 

that comes out to 14 key starters who are aging or suck who need to be replaced within the next 1-4 years.

 

[DrunkBomber]

Jerry Angelo has done just about the worst job drafting players of any gm in the NFL. Even though Lovie gets on our nerves at times its actually impressive he has had some success with what he has been given.

[balta1701-A]

Jerry Angelo has done just about the worst job drafting players of any gm in the NFL.

Really...Go pay attention to some other teams.

 

Angelo's is not an incredible record...but Buffalo Bills fans are laughing at you. Which is nice for them, since humor is the only thing they can take out of their team's draft record. And Josh McDaniels wants to invite you to a frat party where they'll decide his next team's draft picks using some sort of keg-stand based algorithm.

[Daventry]

Really...Go pay attention to some other teams.

 

Angelo's is not an incredible record...but Buffalo Bills fans are laughing at you. Which is nice for them, since humor is the only thing they can take out of their team's draft record. And Josh McDaniels wants to invite you to a frat party where they'll decide his next team's draft picks using some sort of keg-stand based algorithm.

 

 

Absolutely! JA is far from great but he is not the absolute worst that some would like to say he is....

[CrackerDog]

Absolutely! JA is far from great but he is not the absolute worst that some would like to say he is....

 

But this is the internet where everything is either black or white. And everyone posting here is far superior to anyone the Bears have ever hired... Except Ditka. I doubt even Jason would claim to be better than Da Coach. Then again...

[madlithuanian]

Name dropping the Bill's GM as garbage doesn't mean we should all be thrilled that we're not at rock bottom.

 

I want our GM to be the top. And he's far from it. I'd settle for close to the top, but I think he's just run of the mill at best.

 

But this is the internet where everything is either black or white. And everyone posting here is far superior to anyone the Bears have ever hired... Except Ditka. I doubt even Jason would claim to be better than Da Coach. Then again...