New Mock 3/9/11

[Ed Hochuli 3:16]

Sign Mike Sims-Walker: 5 years, $20 million.

 

1. Gabe Carimi, OT, Wisconsin

---The Bears had 3 scouts at Wisconsin's pro day. If he's there, he's the pick.

2. Stephen Paea, DT, Oregon State

---I can't imagine he'll fall this far, but if he does, he should be the selection.

3. Rock Carmichael, CB, Virginia Tech

---Carmichael had a good year and is a winner. In round 3, this should be a good time to find a guy to replace Jennings in a year or 2.

4. Kris O'Dowd, C, USC

---O'Dowd can sit a year behind Kreutz.

5. Jah Reid, OG, Central Florida

---The Bears need some OG depth, badly.

6. Dion Lewis, RB, Pittsburgh

---This is iffy because apparently Taylor is staying, but Lewis is a shifty, small back who would be a nice change-of-pace guy.

EDIT: NO 7TH ROUND PICK

[Guest TerraTor]

Sign Mike Sims-Walker: 5 years, $20 million.

 

i was thinking this as well. Like the draft but Paea wont make it out of Top5 in 2nd Round

 

[Wesson44]

Sign Mike Sims-Walker: 5 years, $20 million.

 

1. Gabe Carimi, OT, Wisconsin

---The Bears had 3 scouts at Wisconsin's pro day. If he's there, he's the pick.

2. Stephen Paea, DT, Oregon State

---I can't imagine he'll fall this far, but if he does, he should be the selection.

3. Rock Carmichael, CB, Virginia Tech

---Carmichael had a good year and is a winner. In round 3, this should be a good time to find a guy to replace Jennings in a year or 2.

4. Kris O'Dowd, C, USC

---O'Dowd can sit a year behind Kreutz.

5. Jah Reid, OG, Central Florida

---The Bears need some OG depth, badly.

6. Dion Lewis, RB, Pittsburgh

---This is iffy because apparently Taylor is staying, but Lewis is a shifty, small back who would be a nice change-of-pace guy.

7. Alex Henery, P, Nebraska

---Henery can kick the s*** out of it, and played in tough conditions. Maynard ended the season miserably.

You need to change your draft we do not have a 7th rd pick

[Ed Hochuli 3:16]

i was thinking this as well. Like the draft but Paea wont make it out of Top5 in 2nd Round

I've never been a huge MSW fan, but he's 6'2, 215 and has been a good WR in Jacksonville with virtually nobody around him. However, he has played 9, 15, and 14 games the past 3 seasons.

 

You need to change your draft we do not have a 7th rd pick

Then take the selection out.

[defiantgiant]

I've never been a huge MSW fan, but he's 6'2, 215 and has been a good WR in Jacksonville with virtually nobody around him. However, he has played 9, 15, and 14 games the past 3 seasons.

I'm not a big fan of Sims-Walker either. He's young and has some talent, but he had a golden opportunity to become the guy in Jacksonville and didn't do anything with it. The Jags didn't even make him a tender offer...the fact that they're letting him walk away for no compensation even though they have next to nothing behind him tells you that he's not valuable, even to a team in desperate need of a receiver.

 

Here's a Jaguars insider (via rotoworld) on Sims-Walker: "He can't beat press coverage off the line of scrimmage and he also whines if they don't throw to him even if they win. He doesn't want to take the blame when he doesn't make a catch and he has a bad knee."

 

They characterized him as more of a problem than an asset - that's not a guy who I think is going to be the answer for Chicago. I'd rather make an offer to Sidney Rice, even if it means overpaying, and get a guy who's proved he can make plays as a go-to receiver. That's better than taking a flyer on a guy who's never put it all together.

 

Apart from that, though, I like your draft. Paea would be an impact replacement for Anthony Adams if he fell that far, Carimi would be a great addition to the o-line, and Virginia Tech's defensive backs always seem to come out of college NFL-ready.

[Ed Hochuli 3:16]

I'm not a big fan of Sims-Walker either. He's young and has some talent, but he had a golden opportunity to become the guy in Jacksonville and didn't do anything with it. The Jags didn't even make him a tender offer...the fact that they're letting him walk away for no compensation even though they have next to nothing behind him tells you that he's not valuable, even to a team in desperate need of a receiver.

 

Here's a Jaguars insider (via rotoworld) on Sims-Walker: "He can't beat press coverage off the line of scrimmage and he also whines if they don't throw to him even if they win. He doesn't want to take the blame when he doesn't make a catch and he has a bad knee."

 

They characterized him as more of a problem than an asset - that's not a guy who I think is going to be the answer for Chicago. I'd rather make an offer to Sidney Rice, even if it means overpaying, and get a guy who's proved he can make plays as a go-to receiver. That's better than taking a flyer on a guy who's never put it all together.

 

Apart from that, though, I like your draft. Paea would be an impact replacement for Anthony Adams if he fell that far, Carimi would be a great addition to the o-line, and Virginia Tech's defensive backs always seem to come out of college NFL-ready.

Didn't Minnesota put a 1st round tender on Rice?

[jason]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who hates the idea of signing Sims-Walker.

[clnr]

Didn't Minnesota put a 1st round tender on Rice?

Yes, they tendered him with an RFA tender. But if a new CBA is signed it will likely be moot if they will have the 4-year of eligibility rule as in the old CBA.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/...s-three-others/

[defiantgiant]

Yes, they tendered him with an RFA tender. But if a new CBA is signed it will likely be moot if they will have the 4-year of eligibility rule as in the old CBA.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/...s-three-others/

 

Yeah, the tender offers that are flying around right now aren't all meaningful. Nobody knows which players are going to be RFAs and which players are going to be UFAs, so they're just tendering everyone as if they'll be restricted. The NFLPA wants the new CBA to make 4-year vets eligible for unrestricted free agency, whereas the owners want to bump it up to 5 years. If the union wins out on that issue, players like Rice will be unrestricted free agents, and the tender offer won't mean a thing.

[Stinger226]

I like the positions you took where there took them,but in the second round we need to address a 3 technique tackle, of which Paea is not. Better choices would be Wilkerson/Temple or Austin/NC or Drake Nevis/LSU. One of them will be there.

 

O'Dowd in not a good choice at center. Injury prone, plays to upright, easliy bull rushed. Better choices would be Linnenkohl/Ore state or Kirkpatick/TCU. Both are hard working, leader types, smart players. Will develope into starters at the next level.

 

Walker sucks, we need to sign Rice/Min or Smith/NY. Much better wrs.

 

Would like him to be, not sure Carimi will be there. The top 4 OTs are worthy of being picked that high, but probably wont be there. Sherrod is now being rated more of a early second rounder. If the tackles arent there, I would love to Watkins/TCU/OG. He is nasty and physical, will be a starter till he retires. Could possibly play OT at the next level.

[bradjock]

I like the positions you took where there took them,but in the second round we need to address a 3 technique tackle, of which Paea is not.

 

Mike Mayock on Paea: "He lifted 225 pounds a record 49 times at the combine, and the best part about those reps is it translates to functional strength on the field. He's a 3-technique player who can really get it done." http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/09000d5d81e...s?module=HP_cp2

 

Walker sucks, we need to sign Rice/Min or Smith/NY. Much better wrs.

 

Are you talking about Steve Smith from the Giants? (I assume you don't mean Brad Smith . . . ) I just don't see him being much better then Mike Sims Walker. I'd love to get Rice, but I wonder how much he'll cost. I can't see us breaking the bank for a WR when we're happy with the progress Knox & Bennett are making. Especially when he only played 6 games last year and caught for 280 yards.

 

If Mike Sims Walker is fairly cheap, I'd love to get him and let him compete.

 

Would like him to be, not sure Carimi will be there. The top 4 OTs are worthy of being picked that high, but probably wont be there. Sherrod is now being rated more of a early second rounder. If the tackles arent there, I would love to Watkins/TCU/OG. He is nasty and physical, will be a starter till he retires. Could possibly play OT at the next level.

 

Everyone assumes we'll draft an OT cause we're so bad. The signs indicate that Chris Williams will move back to OT. Omiyale is a nice swing tackle and an ideal back-up, while we're thrilled with J Webb. I can't see us getting rid of one of those guys. I look for us to start Williams & Webb at Tackle.

 

There are several good offensive guards set to be available via free agency. I look for us to sign a guard, and take a DT in round #1. There are simply not many 3 technique tackles available via free agency. Tommie Harris would be the pick of the litter . . .

[Stinger226]

I like the positions you took where there took them,but in the second round we need to address a 3 technique tackle, of which Paea is not.

 

Mike Mayock on Paea: "He lifted 225 pounds a record 49 times at the combine, and the best part about those reps is it translates to functional strength on the field. He's a 3-technique player who can really get it done." http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/09000d5d81e...s?module=HP_cp2

 

Walker sucks, we need to sign Rice/Min or Smith/NY. Much better wrs.

 

Are you talking about Steve Smith from the Giants? (I assume you don't mean Brad Smith . . . ) I just don't see him being much better then Mike Sims Walker. I'd love to get Rice, but I wonder how much he'll cost. I can't see us breaking the bank for a WR when we're happy with the progress Knox & Bennett are making. Especially when he only played 6 games last year and caught for 280 yards.

 

If Mike Sims Walker is fairly cheap, I'd love to get him and let him compete.

 

Would like him to be, not sure Carimi will be there. The top 4 OTs are worthy of being picked that high, but probably wont be there. Sherrod is now being rated more of a early second rounder. If the tackles arent there, I would love to Watkins/TCU/OG. He is nasty and physical, will be a starter till he retires. Could possibly play OT at the next level.

 

Everyone assumes we'll draft an OT cause we're so bad. The signs indicate that Chris Williams will move back to OT. Omiyale is a nice swing tackle and an ideal back-up, while we're thrilled with J Webb. I can't see us getting rid of one of those guys. I look for us to start Williams & Webb at Tackle.

 

There are several good offensive guards set to be available via free agency. I look for us to sign a guard, and take a DT in round #1. There are simply not many 3 technique tackles available via free agency. Tommie Harris would be the pick of the litter . . .

The more I read about him, I have to agree with you. A few websites had him listed as a under tackle, same as A Adams would play, but his stats show he can be a disruptive 3 t.

I dont think Williams will be around if we bring in a quality tackle, Omiyale beat him out last year, and Webb showed enough promise to keep developing him. He would have to improve drasticly to start at LT, and I dont think he has it in him.

Sims-Walker drops a lot of passes and whines when he doesnt get the ball. Him and Rice both have some down time with injuries, but Rice with a good quarterback will shine, as he did with Brent, Walker will be cheaper, but why did Jauguars get rid of him when they are hurting at WR?

I think if we get a stud OG in FAgency that he will be not much less money than Rice would be, and Rice will be a stud with Culter. I think we will take the highest rated DT or OT with that first pick and pick the opposite with the 2nd round. Its possible Watkins could slip to the #2 pick and that would be awesome, or a Boling/Geo and possibly Ijalana/Vill at that spot.

What do you think about Alex Linnenholt/Ore State? I think he sounds like a perfect fit to replace Olin in another year and could be had with a 4th or 5th round pick.

[bradjock]

The more I read about him, I have to agree with you. A few websites had him listed as a under tackle, same as A Adams would play, but his stats show he can be a disruptive 3 t.

 

True. While he can play the 3 technique, we want guys who can get to the QB. What Scout's Inc says, "Lacks explosive burst through the hole and shows below-average change-of-direction skills. Doesn't show many counter moves. Needs to develop his swim, rip and club moves. All three sacks in 2009 came in one game (UCLA). However, he can be disruptive as a pass rusher, primarily as a straight-line bull rusher."

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft/playe...14/stephen-paea

 

That's not ideal for what the Bears want to do.

 

I dont think Williams will be around if we bring in a quality tackle, Omiyale beat him out last year, and Webb showed enough promise to keep developing him. He would have to improve drasticly to start at LT, and I dont think he has it in him.

 

Was Chris Williams moved because he was bad at tackle or because our guards were so bad? I don't think Omiyale ever beat C Williams out. C Williams left the Dallas game in week #2 with an injury. He wasn't healthy until week 6 vs. Seattle. By week 6 Roberto Garza was too injured to play & we'd determined Asiata & Lance Louis were worthless. We were starting Edwin Williams, a guy who wasn't even on the team a few weeks earlier.

 

While you can't believe everything the Bear's say, they said they made the switch because they thought it was the best combination. Seeing how desperate we were for a guard, I have to believe them.

 

Before the injury, we were still being told Chris Williams would be our LT for the next 10 years. I didn't see anything in the Detroit or Dallas game to change that. All we know is that he's not good at guard. If Williams can stilll be our tackle of the future, that drastically changes our needs.

 

To me it's more prudent to sign a top-shelf guard and draft 2 more to eventually replace Kreutz & Garza.

 

Sims-Walker drops a lot of passes and whines when he doesnt get the ball. Him and Rice both have some down time with injuries, but Rice with a good quarterback will shine, as he did with Brent, Walker will be cheaper, but why did Jauguars get rid of him when they are hurting at WR?

 

True. It's my thought we'll go after WR's to compete & push Knox & Bennett, not to replace them. Sims-Walker would be competition while Rice would start.

 

I think we will take the highest rated DT or OT with that first pick and pick the opposite with the 2nd round.

 

That's what most people think There's a good article in the Sun Times where Kipers says you can get a good DT in round #2 but you can't get a good OT in round #2.

I still think we're might be satisfied with our OT, and guard will be the priority. Ultimately, JA LOVES drafting D-linemen.

 

Its possible Watkins could slip to the #2 pick and that would be awesome, or a Boling/Geo and possibly Ijalana/Vill at that spot.

What do you think about Alex Linnenholt/Ore State? I think he sounds like a perfect fit to replace Olin in another year and could be had with a 4th or 5th round pick.

 

We'll likely have to take Watkins/Boling/Ijalana in the first round if we want them.

 

I don't know much about Linnenkohl but it does seem strange to replace one of the best centers to ever play the game with a 5th round pick.

[defiantgiant]

The more I read about him, I have to agree with you. A few websites had him listed as a under tackle, same as A Adams would play, but his stats show he can be a disruptive 3 t.

 

Under tackle is actually another name for the three-tech. Adams' position (the one-tech) is sometimes called a nose guard, but never called an under tackle as far as I know.

 

As for Paea at the 3-technique, I think Mayock called him a 3-tech because he played there some in college and because he's kind of undersized as DTs go. He definitely CAN play there for some teams, but he won't be the kind of 3-technique that a Tampa-2 defense requires. Bradjock already pointed it out, but Paea's not very refined as a pass-rusher, and he's lacking the natural agility/balance to slip through a crease. Warren Sapp talks a lot about how the under tackle in a Tampa defense needs to be able to "get skinny" through a crack. That's how he says you beat double-teams from that position: get the guard off-balance so there's a crease between him and the tackle, then you have to have the body control to slip through into the backfield. I don't really see that from Paea, from the little bit that I've watched him. He's not very flexible when he has to dip or move laterally, and he usually just overpowers guys.

 

In a 4-3 defense that asks both d-tackles to stuff the run and creates pass pressure with LB blitzes and DE stunts, I could see him being an excellent 3-technique. In Tennessee, Detroit, or Philly he could be a 3-tech. Maybe in Denver under John Fox or in Carolina, depending on which scheme Rivera decides to go with from the ones he's coached in the past. In one of those defenses he'd be fine, but in a 4-3 like the one in Chicago (and Minnesota, Indy, Tampa, etc.) that relies on pass pressure from just the front 4, I don't think Paea's a 3-tech. That's the position where you need a freakish pass rusher, and having a guy who's got a good bull rush and some quickness probably won't cut it. In our defense I think he's a one-tech, and a very very good one at that, but they'd have to make sure they found Tommie's replacement first. I wouldn't be shocked if Minnesota looked at him in Round 2 as a one-tech, where he could replace Pat Williams. Same goes for Tampa Bay if Brian Price's hip/hamstring thing is as nasty as it sounds. Sucks since they just drafted the guy, but if he's done they might have to take a long look at Paea in the 2nd.

[jason]

Everyone assumes we'll draft an OT cause we're so bad. The signs indicate that Chris Williams will move back to OT. Omiyale is a nice swing tackle and an ideal back-up, while we're thrilled with J Webb. I can't see us getting rid of one of those guys. I look for us to start Williams & Webb at Tackle.

 

I refuse to let this go any time I see it posted on any board. WTF games did you watch last year that would lead you to believe Omiyale is a "nice swing tackle," much less a nice regular tackle?!

 

It sickens me that the season is only a few months old and so many are already to trump up the memory and concept of Omiyale because it suits some sort of convolutely draft philosophy. Say it with me: Frank Omiyale sucks. To say otherwise is either ignorance from someone who didn't watch the games, straight up lying from someone who watched the games, or a complete lack of understanding and memory from someone who watched the games. Under no circumstances is Omiyale a nice player at any position.

 

If you like a DT in the first or a DB in the second, just say so. There's no need to sell us a bridge in Brooklyn.

[flea]

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[defiantgiant]

I refuse to let this go any time I see it posted on any board. WTF games did you watch last year that would lead you to believe Omiyale is a "nice swing tackle," much less a nice regular tackle?!

 

Dude, the standard for a "nice swing tackle" isn't that high. We're talking about a bench-warmer here. Frank Omiyale is worse than most of the league's starting left tackles, but so is every swing tackle. If they weren't, they'd be starters somewhere. How many pure backup OTs can you name, guys that are sitting on the bench unless someone gets hurt, who would be better starters at LT than Omiyale?

 

The fact is that if you're starting your backup LT for any length of time, you're already in trouble. There are very, VERY few teams in the league that can lose their starting LT, bring a guy off the bench in his place, and keep right on moving without a blip. Why do you think so many teams shuffle o-linemen around when they lose a guy? Usually, your best bet to replace the LT is a starter somewhere else on the o-line, not your swing tackle. If you're lucky enough to have a second starting-caliber LT, chances are he's going to win a starting job at RT or somewhere else on the line. What team in the NFL has 2 above-average LTs, PLUS four other o-linemen good enough to keep one of those LTs on the bench?

 

It sickens me that the season is only a few months old and so many are already to trump up the memory and concept of Omiyale because it suits some sort of convolutely draft philosophy. Say it with me: Frank Omiyale sucks. To say otherwise is either ignorance from someone who didn't watch the games, straight up lying from someone who watched the games, or a complete lack of understanding and memory from someone who watched the games. Under no circumstances is Omiyale a nice player at any position.

 

Really? Anyone who doesn't agree with you is either lying, ignorant, or forgot everything that happened this season? That's a little much, man. I watched every game. I watched every one of Omiyale's dumb false starts and holding penalties. I watched it every time he got beat for a sack. I remember all those games. And I still think Omiyale is at least as good as most teams' swing tackles, because most backups are backups for a reason. Remember that we went into the seasons with Chris Williams, not Omiyale, as the starting LT: he was never Plan A to begin with, and I don't think anybody here thinks he should be. But a swing tackle isn't even Plan B on the left side, he's like Plan C or D. And I'm OK with Omiyale being that.

[jason]

Dude, the standard for a "nice swing tackle" isn't that high. We're talking about a bench-warmer here. Frank Omiyale is worse than most of the league's starting left tackles, but so is every swing tackle. If they weren't, they'd be starters somewhere. How many pure backup OTs can you name, guys that are sitting on the bench unless someone gets hurt, who would be better starters at LT than Omiyale?

 

The fact is that if you're starting your backup LT for any length of time, you're already in trouble. There are very, VERY few teams in the league that can lose their starting LT, bring a guy off the bench in his place, and keep right on moving without a blip. Why do you think so many teams shuffle o-linemen around when they lose a guy? Usually, your best bet to replace the LT is a starter somewhere else on the o-line, not your swing tackle. If you're lucky enough to have a second starting-caliber LT, chances are he's going to win a starting job at RT or somewhere else on the line. What team in the NFL has 2 above-average LTs, PLUS four other o-linemen good enough to keep one of those LTs on the bench?

 

If you phrase it like that, which is essentially a way of saying "Omiyale sucks, but what else could they do?" then I have less a problem with it. However, Omiyale might be the worst OLineman I've ever seen in an NFL game. And if other teams also have to put in "swing tackles," then that means he's worse than most of those guys as well.

 

Really? Anyone who doesn't agree with you is either lying, ignorant, or forgot everything that happened this season? That's a little much, man. I watched every game. I watched every one of Omiyale's dumb false starts and holding penalties. I watched it every time he got beat for a sack. I remember all those games. And I still think Omiyale is at least as good as most teams' swing tackles, because most backups are backups for a reason. Remember that we went into the seasons with Chris Williams, not Omiyale, as the starting LT: he was never Plan A to begin with, and I don't think anybody here thinks he should be. But a swing tackle isn't even Plan B on the left side, he's like Plan C or D. And I'm OK with Omiyale being that.

 

See above. If you refer to him as Plan D, then you don't fall into any of the categories I listed and my rant wasn't directed to you. I had a problem with the phrasing is all. "Nice swing tackle," made it sound like he was a good option coming off the bench. Which he wasn't. He was a bad option coming off the bench. Maybe it's just the word "nice" that irritated me. "Nice" is not a adjective I would use to describe anything he did on the football field. In fact, I honestly think there must be plenty of guys out there who are trying out in various secondary football leagues who are better than Omiyale. They just lack the drive, discipline, finances, resources, connection, etc. to try out or be seen. Hell, I saw a guy last year in a semi-pro game who was burying 60-65yd Field Goals with ease in pregame, went 1-2 from just under 50 during the game, and bombed every kickoff deep into the end zone. I asked him why he wasn't trying out somewhere, and he replied, "It costs a lot of money to travel and try out." If a random kicker with that sort of talent is out there, then SURELY there is an Omiyale replacement (because kickers are much harder to find).

 

Having said all that, if Omiyale is Plan C or D (I contend he can be no higher than D), then that is even more of a reason for the Bears to draft OL early and often. Because that would mean the Bears had to resort to the fourth option when filling out a starting offensive line this past year. And that's just plain disgusting.

[bradjock]

Sheesh Jason, did Omiyale kidnap your dog & sell him to Vick? As Defiant pointed out, I love Omiyale as a swing tackle, which I meant to imply back-up. As Defiant wondered, who in this league has a good back-up tackle? Most teams can't find 2 good ones . . .. or in our case, 1 good one.

 

I know you've indicated the entire line is horrible. Do you really expect us to replace the whole damn line? Right or wrong, you have to concede it ain't gonna happen. So I'd love to hear your opinion on the following: (If you've spoken to this already I apologize i missed it. I typically only frequent when there's no football)

1. Is Webb worth a damn? I know the scouts love him. His feet are SLOW. For what it's worth, I think he's worse then Omiyale.

2. Can Chris Williams play LT? Nobody can explain how he went from being the LT for the next 10 years to being a guy playing bad out of position.

3. Martz wants quick o-lineman who can sustain blocks forever. Tice likes road-graters. Who wins this argument?

 

There are two questions I won't ask since I know the answers: 1) Can Kreutz & Garza be mediocre for one more year? (we'd better hope they can) 2) Why did the staff try to convince us all those bad guards could get the job done? (we were too cheap/stupid to get anybody better)

 

You mentioned I like DT or DB early. Ultimately, I don't give a damn what position we draft as long we get difference makers. For better or for worse, we'll spend all summer bitching or gloating about the pick, but none of it matters once the season starts.

 

I refuse to let this go any time I see it posted on any board. WTF games did you watch last year that would lead you to believe Omiyale is a "nice swing tackle," much less a nice regular tackle?!

 

It sickens me that the season is only a few months old and so many are already to trump up the memory and concept of Omiyale because it suits some sort of convolutely draft philosophy. Say it with me: Frank Omiyale sucks. To say otherwise is either ignorance from someone who didn't watch the games, straight up lying from someone who watched the games, or a complete lack of understanding and memory from someone who watched the games. Under no circumstances is Omiyale a nice player at any position.

 

If you like a DT in the first or a DB in the second, just say so. There's no need to sell us a bridge in Brooklyn.

[GrizzlyBear]

I know you've indicated the entire line is horrible. Do you really expect us to replace the whole damn line? Right or wrong, you have to concede it ain't gonna happen. So I'd love to hear your opinion on the following: (If you've spoken to this already I apologize i missed it. I typically only frequent when there's no football)

1. Is Webb worth a damn? I know the scouts love him. His feet are SLOW. For what it's worth, I think he's worse then Omiyale.

2. Can Chris Williams play LT? Nobody can explain how he went from being the LT for the next 10 years to being a guy playing bad out of position.

3. Martz wants quick o-lineman who can sustain blocks forever. Tice likes road-graters. Who wins this argument?

 

 

 

1. Webb, After watching his games and hear Tice talking about him, I would disagree that Webb has slow feet. From everything said his feet are excellant and warrant a look at left tackle according to Tice. But he was gonna keep him there at Right because it was that side they needed most.

His slow moves were accounted to his rookie ways. Next year he will be more solid then this now that Tice is staying.

 

2. Williams had a bunch to do with the changes at guard. Left guard was Horrible and right guard was just as bad. The left side was due to Garza being moved there at the last minute. The Right guard situation was do to bad play. E Williams was bad and so was Louis. So they moved Garza back left side when Williams returned from injury he proved better at guard then Omiyale. That is why the guard situation was at it was. On the Depth charts currently Omiyale has moved back to Guard and Williams has returned to tackle. It is why one of the reasons I think the Bears will be looking for guard rather then Tackle.

 

3. Martz wants Lineman to hold a Block longer then 3 seconds. Period. They can be a Moose or light weights. It dont matter to him. Ask Pace on that one. Yes Tice wants solid lineman who can block in RUn as well as pass. I think thats a wish list for most O line coaches in the NFL. And to be honest I think there is no Argument.

[ParkerBear7]

1. Webb, After watching his games and hear Tice talking about him, I would disagree that Webb has slow feet. From everything said his feet are excellant and warrant a look at left tackle according to Tice. But he was gonna keep him there at Right because it was that side they needed most.

His slow moves were accounted to his rookie ways. Next year he will be more solid then this now that Tice is staying.

 

2. Williams had a bunch to do with the changes at guard. Left guard was Horrible and right guard was just as bad. The left side was due to Garza being moved there at the last minute. The Right guard situation was do to bad play. E Williams was bad and so was Louis. So they moved Garza back left side when Williams returned from injury he proved better at guard then Omiyale. That is why the guard situation was at it was. On the Depth charts currently Omiyale has moved back to Guard and Williams has returned to tackle. It is why one of the reasons I think the Bears will be looking for guard rather then Tackle.

 

3. Martz wants Lineman to hold a Block longer then 3 seconds. Period. They can be a Moose or light weights. It dont matter to him. Ask Pace on that one. Yes Tice wants solid lineman who can block in RUn as well as pass. I think thats a wish list for most O line coaches in the NFL. And to be honest I think there is no Argument.

 

 

I agree on the point of Chris Williams may have been healthy enough to return from his injury but not enough to return to LOT and was plugged into LG as frank omiyale prooved the year before that he could not handle the transition to guard from tackle. IT may have been a case of the lesser of three evils! With that said a healthy Williams may be a solid but not great LOT, we will see.

 

It certainly will be interesting what the Bears actually will do in the draft. Hopefully the addition of Tim Hasskell (spelling) will help the Bears take the best player available or the balls to move up and get the implact player the team wants; please no more projects or swinging for the fences with early picks! Can we please do what the Ravens and Steelers do so well year after year and draft good football players that can play football!

 

Kee in mind the Bears "Defense" is among the top 5 oldest in the league which gives me a feeling that JA will draft more "D" early and OL later per his m.o.

 

My draft wish list in the first 5 rounds Best impact player available would include the following positions: OL (OG/OT/C), DT, CB (big and physical atleast 6', no more T. Jennings) and probably a LB.

 

Free Agent Targets: OG, WR, CB, LB & S for depth

 

Like others on this board I - I would like to get WR Sid Rice!

 

Or why not Fix the OL via this years draft & FA, get a new 3 tech DT and go after Larry Fitzgerald next offseason? This would make the most sense is to keep Cutler healthy and get some help for Peppers. I have a feeling that Larry Fitzgerald will end up in Chicago in 2012.

 

 

[jason]

Sheesh Jason, did Omiyale kidnap your dog & sell him to Vick? As Defiant pointed out, I love Omiyale as a swing tackle, which I meant to imply back-up. As Defiant wondered, who in this league has a good back-up tackle? Most teams can't find 2 good ones . . .. or in our case, 1 good one.

 

I know you've indicated the entire line is horrible. Do you really expect us to replace the whole damn line? Right or wrong, you have to concede it ain't gonna happen. So I'd love to hear your opinion on the following: (If you've spoken to this already I apologize i missed it. I typically only frequent when there's no football)

1. Is Webb worth a damn? I know the scouts love him. His feet are SLOW. For what it's worth, I think he's worse then Omiyale.

2. Can Chris Williams play LT? Nobody can explain how he went from being the LT for the next 10 years to being a guy playing bad out of position.

3. Martz wants quick o-lineman who can sustain blocks forever. Tice likes road-graters. Who wins this argument?

 

There are two questions I won't ask since I know the answers: 1) Can Kreutz & Garza be mediocre for one more year? (we'd better hope they can) 2) Why did the staff try to convince us all those bad guards could get the job done? (we were too cheap/stupid to get anybody better)

 

You mentioned I like DT or DB early. Ultimately, I don't give a damn what position we draft as long we get difference makers. For better or for worse, we'll spend all summer bitching or gloating about the pick, but none of it matters once the season starts.

 

HAHA. Nope, Omiyale did nothing to me personally. He does, however, represent what has bugged me about this franchise for quite some time. The problem is twofold. First, they simply haven't addressed the OL like it should have been. I don't know if this is due to philosophy or what, but as a former thread pointed to, we've ALL said that OL is a priority for 3-5 years. Aside from the Chris Williams pick, it has been unaddressed. Second, when a major need is identified, the Bears don't always address it in the draft with an early pick. It's not a good time based upon ratings, and then "well our guy didn't fall." I fear this is going to happen again. DT in the first, then "well, none of the current OTs are rated high enough," then "oooh, we love [insert small school WR/DB/S here]," and the Bears are stuck picking an OLineman in the 4th. I hate it. If something is the major problem, you address it, and then address it again until it's unequivocally fixed.

 

As for the questions:

**Can we replace the entire line? Obviously not. Do I want them to? No. But I would LOVE to see 2 of the first 3 rounds spent on OL. In fact, I think if 2 of the first 3 rounds are NOT spent on OL, it's a mistake.

1) I don't like Webb, but there is no way he's worse than Omiyale. I could get a sack off Omiyale. Webb has potential, maybe. It seems the Bears now have high and low rated OTs (Williams and Webb) who just might be better suited to play Guard. Either way, Webb has a much higher floor than Omiyale, in my opinion, and he showed promise in the running game on multiple occasions.

2) I don't know if Williams can be a good OT, much less a LT. The problem is, other guys sucked so much that Williams had to move to help out the team. This tells me he's the best lineman on the team. If he's good enough to switch positions and still be better than the backup, then he's pretty damn good. For what it's worth, I don't think he played that poorly last year. Then again, maybe he was overshadowed by Omiyale and Webb?

3) Good question. I think Tice (i.e. Webb is not a typical Martz player) wins, and it hurts the Martz offense. I can just see them in a draft war room, Tice drowning out everyone else because of his size and voice. What I hope happens is that Tice wins, and then Tice and Martz get together to make it work for the Bears offense by making the offense versatile running and passing.

 

[azbearsfan]

Sheesh Jason, did Omiyale kidnap your dog & sell him to Vick? As Defiant pointed out, I love Omiyale as a swing tackle, which I meant to imply back-up. As Defiant wondered, who in this league has a good back-up tackle? Most teams can't find 2 good ones . . .. or in our case, 1 good one.

 

I know you've indicated the entire line is horrible. Do you really expect us to replace the whole damn line? Right or wrong, you have to concede it ain't gonna happen. So I'd love to hear your opinion on the following: (If you've spoken to this already I apologize i missed it. I typically only frequent when there's no football)

1. Is Webb worth a damn? I know the scouts love him. His feet are SLOW. For what it's worth, I think he's worse then Omiyale.

2. Can Chris Williams play LT? Nobody can explain how he went from being the LT for the next 10 years to being a guy playing bad out of position.

3. Martz wants quick o-lineman who can sustain blocks forever. Tice likes road-graters. Who wins this argument?

 

There are two questions I won't ask since I know the answers: 1) Can Kreutz & Garza be mediocre for one more year? (we'd better hope they can) 2) Why did the staff try to convince us all those bad guards could get the job done? (we were too cheap/stupid to get anybody better)

 

You mentioned I like DT or DB early. Ultimately, I don't give a damn what position we draft as long we get difference makers. For better or for worse, we'll spend all summer bitching or gloating about the pick, but none of it matters once the season starts.

 

 

Pay no attention to Jason. His elitism is supposed to be part of his charm. You should feel lucky that he was going to let it go, but felt personally offended enough with your use of the word "nice" to bother to comment. How dare you call Omiyale a nice swing tackle?

 

 

He is still trying to wrap his head around the fact that Martz' awesome offense was 21st in scoring and the "passive" defense was 4th in points allowed.

[jason]

Pay no attention to Jason. His elitism is supposed to be part of his charm. You should feel lucky that he was going to let it go, but felt personally offended enough with your use of the word "nice" to bother to comment. How dare you call Omiyale a nice swing tackle?

 

He is still trying to wrap his head around the fact that Martz' awesome offense was 21st in scoring and the "passive" defense was 4th in points allowed.

 

Pay no attention to az. His elitism is supposed to be proof of his vast experience and knowledge. You should feel lucky he even participates on this board. Besides, the board is pointless since we don't work in the NFL. They know better than anyone on this board, despite the fact that everyone on the board - and everyone who has seen the Bears play - has been in agreement for multiple years that the OL is probably the weakest aspect of the team.

 

He is still trying to wrap his head around the fact that the Martz' awesome offense actually made drastic changes during the season, completely morphing from a traditional Martz offense to a more run-oriented attack, improved after the by week, and somehow still managed to be 21st in scoring despite the utter failures at OL that couldn't protect a pocket passer with great mobility for more than 2 seconds.

[bradjock]

HAHA. Nope, Omiyale did nothing to me personally. He does, however, represent what has bugged me about this franchise for quite some time. The problem is twofold. First, they simply haven't addressed the OL like it should have been. I don't know if this is due to philosophy or what, but as a former thread pointed to, we've ALL said that OL is a priority for 3-5 years.

 

For me it comes to to picking your poison. We've ignored the o-line & WR's while the focus has been on defense. Every team has a weakness.

 

**Can we replace the entire line? Obviously not. Do I want them to? No. But I would LOVE to see 2 of the first 3 rounds spent on OL. In fact, I think if 2 of the first 3 rounds are NOT spent on OL, it's a mistake.

 

What if we just draft the top guard (Gallery?) and use either our #1 or #2 on the line. Would that be enough for this year? (that's what I think we'll do . . . )

 

1) I don't like Webb, but there is no way he's worse than Omiyale. I could get a sack off Omiyale. Webb has potential, maybe. It seems the Bears now have high and low rated OTs (Williams and Webb) who just might be better suited to play Guard. Either way, Webb has a much higher floor than Omiyale, in my opinion, and he showed promise in the running game on multiple occasions.

 

I hope you're right about Webb. Here's why I'm skeptic: The Bears find, target, and make something out of a guy every other team in the league didn't want to touch. Hell, he was considered a reach in the 7th round. I hope he's the next Big-Cat but I'm afraid he's the next Q-Mitchell . . .

 

2) I don't know if Williams can be a good OT, much less a LT. The problem is, other guys sucked so much that Williams had to move to help out the team. This tells me he's the best lineman on the team. If he's good enough to switch positions and still be better than the backup, then he's pretty damn good. For what it's worth, I don't think he played that poorly last year. Then again, maybe he was overshadowed by Omiyale and Webb?

 

Man if he could solidify a tackle spot, that would be huge.

 

3) Good question. I think Tice (i.e. Webb is not a typical Martz player) wins, and it hurts the Martz offense. I can just see them in a draft war room, Tice drowning out everyone else because of his size and voice. What I hope happens is that Tice wins, and then Tice and Martz get together to make it work for the Bears offense by making the offense versatile running and passing.

 

Don't you think that one of these guys has to go for it to work? If we hadn't passed the ball 80 times against the Packers on the last game of the season, they might never had the chance to win the Super Bowl.

Thanks for the insight.