The Knox/Williams Debate

[lemonej]

Let me start off by saying that I have no problem with Knox being demoted in favor of Roy Williams for obvious reasons.They didn't bring Williams here to be a backup. The problem I have is Martz's BS reasoning for doing so.Basically saying that Knox didn't really earn the position in the first place over Bennett and it was handed to him.Really! How has Williams earned a starting position in this short time? I'll tell you sometimes I wish Martz would not talk and just coach. The other thing that has come into question about Knox is his professionalism. Things like his route running and attention to detail are starting to come out. If the recent whispers here in the local media are true, its really hard to pay attention to detail if you are snoozing in meetings. Thats the rumor that has been circulating since his so called demotion from the starting lineup. Hopefully this is a ploy to light a fire under Knox and makes him earn the contract extension the he too covets.

[madlithuanian]

Knox's issues are nothing new. A good lot of us here have been mentioning them for a while.

 

And is anyone really surprised that someone was "given" a position under this staff? Or really any staff for that matter? Heck, what were our options last year?

 

Williams gets a moderate pass due to his history with Martz and that he has shown in previous years. He'll get the benefit of the doubt. But I think if he alligator arms too many, drops too many, etc...he'll find his way onto the bench. If they thought that highly of him, his contract would be longer than a season. He needs to prove himself as well.

 

Martz speak is about as useful as Smith speak. I can't listen to either without grabbing a barf bag.

 

I hadn'theard Knox was snoozing in meetings. and if that's the case, why didn't team leader, Kretuz, hit himupside the head?

 

I hope Knox grows and becomes a good part of this team. But, he definitley needs to improve.

 

Let me start off by saying that I have no problem with Knox being demoted in favor of Roy Williams for obvious reasons.They didn't bring Williams here to be a backup. The problem I have is Martz's BS reasoning for doing so.Basically saying that Knox didn't really earn the position in the first place over Bennett and it was handed to him.Really! How has Williams earned a starting position in this short time? I'll tell you sometimes I wish Martz would not talk and just coach. The other thing that has come into question about Knox is his professionalism. Things like his route running and attention to detail are starting to come out. If the recent whispers here in the local media are true, its really hard to pay attention to detail if you are snoozing in meetings. Thats the rumor that has been circulating since his so called demotion from the starting lineup. Hopefully this is a ploy to light a fire under Knox and makes him earn the contract extension the he too covets.

 

[Pixote]

I like Knox. I feel he is getting a bum rap. I personally saw a different player in Knox last year than 99% of the posters here. Yes, there were some routes he missed on, it was a 1st year system that all of our WRs and out QB struggled with at times. He may have dropped a few but made many excellent catches diving and sliding and wound up with the most yards for a WR since 2002 Marty Booker. Say what you want but I like the kid.

 

Now if he is snoozing in team meetings, quite frankly I am surprised he has not been cut. Lovie & Co. would never allow that to happen and just let it go lightly.

 

 

[lemonej]

Knox's issues are nothing new. A good lot of us here have been mentioning them for a while.

 

And is anyone really surprised that someone was "given" a position under this staff? Or really any staff for that matter? Heck, what were our options last year?

 

Williams gets a moderate pass due to his history with Martz and that he has shown in previous years. He'll get the benefit of the doubt. But I think if he alligator arms too many, drops too many, etc...he'll find his way onto the bench. If they thought that highly of him, his contract would be longer than a season. He needs to prove himself as well.

 

Martz speak is about as useful as Smith speak. I can't listen to either without grabbing a barf bag.

 

I hadn'theard Knox was snoozing in meetings. and if that's the case, why didn't team leader, Kretuz, hit himupside the head?

 

I hope Knox grows and becomes a good part of this team. But, he definitley needs to improve.

Kreutz is gone Mad L. The whispers are about this year.

[madlithuanian]

oops! Thanks for clarifying! How 'bout Garza hitting him upside the head then?

 

Kreutz is gone Mad L. The whispers are about this year.

 

[madlithuanian]

I also like Knox. I still contend he needs to improve. But, he's young. He needs to be given a chance to improve. I don't want to dump him only see him join the Pats and become a pro bowl WR! He's also a dangerous return man when Hester needs to be spelled.

 

I like Knox. I feel he is getting a bum rap. I personally saw a different player in Knox last year than 99% of the posters here. Yes, there were some routes he missed on, it was a 1st year system that all of our WRs and out QB struggled with at times. He may have dropped a few but made many excellent catches diving and sliding and wound up with the most yards for a WR since 2002 Marty Booker. Say what you want but I like the kid.

 

Now if he is snoozing in team meetings, quite frankly I am surprised he has not been cut. Lovie & Co. would never allow that to happen and just let it go lightly.

 

[lemonej]

I like Knox. I feel he is getting a bum rap. I personally saw a different player in Knox last year than 99% of the posters here. Yes, there were some routes he missed on, it was a 1st year system that all of our WRs and out QB struggled with at times. He may have dropped a few but made many excellent catches diving and sliding and wound up with the most yards for a WR since 2002 Marty Booker. Say what you want but I like the kid.

 

Now if he is snoozing in team meetings, quite frankly I am surprised he has not been cut. Lovie & Co. would never allow that to happen and just let it go lightly.

I'm thinking this isn't a reocurring thing and may be a one-time incident and Martz may be zero tolerance with Knox for reasons that may not have been clarified in his measured quote.

['TD']

Knox is the best WR on the team(Williams still has to prove he can be who he was), and should be starting. Given Williams past, It doesn't bother me that he is starting, but with out a doubt Knox should be on the other side.

 

Knox got a lot of blame for Cutler's mistakes. I'm not saying he didn't make his own. I mean he was a second year 5th round pick in a new system. I'm just saying he got a lot more blame then he deserved and arguably a top 3 talent on the offensive side of the ball on this team.

[Ed Hochuli 3:16]

Knox is the best WR on the team(Williams still has to prove he can be who he was), and should be starting. Given Williams past, It doesn't bother me that he is starting, but with out a doubt Knox should be on the other side.

 

Knox got a lot of blame for Cutler's mistakes. I'm not saying he didn't make his own. I mean he was a second year 5th round pick in a new system. I'm just saying he got a lot more blame then he deserved and arguably a top 3 talent on the offensive side of the ball on this team.

Knox is the best WR on the team? Please. He's not even the 3rd best WR on the team (Bennett, Hester, Williams).

[balta1701-A]

Knox is the best WR on the team? Please. He's not even the 3rd best WR on the team (Bennett, Hester, Williams).

It kinda depends on what we're defining as "Best". He's not the best hands receiver, that's Bennett, but at least last year, he was probably the Bears' best downfield receiver. Hester could easily steal that role from him at some point, but he hadn't done so yet. Considering where Knox is in his career, there's still a lot of promise here.

 

Put it this way...if Knox would up being clearly the best receiver on the Bears this year, would anyone be legitimately surprised? It'd take a lot of work from Knox, but it's certainly plausible.

[lemonej]

It kinda depends on what we're defining as "Best". He's not the best hands receiver, that's Bennett, but at least last year, he was probably the Bears' best downfield receiver. Hester could easily steal that role from him at some point, but he hadn't done so yet. Considering where Knox is in his career, there's still a lot of promise here.

 

Put it this way...if Knox would up being clearly the best receiver on the Bears this year, would anyone be legitimately surprised? It'd take a lot of work from Knox, but it's certainly plausible.

I too believe that Knox has a lot of room for improvement but what he has that can't be coached is 4.26 speed in the 40 from his Combine numbers and there is no one else on the Bears that runs that fast. I still believe that this is a wake up call.

[jason]

I too believe that Knox has a lot of room for improvement but what he has that can't be coached is 4.26 speed in the 40 from his Combine numbers and there is no one else on the Bears that runs that fast. I still believe that this is a wake up call.

 

Yes. Good point. What CAN be coached, however, is proper route running...something that Knox is probably the worst at out of all the WRs on the team. And that's not even considering his apparent lack of football instincts (i.e. turning out when Cutler throws in). Since it wasn't an epidemic with any other WR, I'm going to go ahead and put it on Knox.

 

Speed? Good. The other stuff? Probably led to 6-10 INTs (I did the film study and math last year).

 

All that said, I like him. I think he's solid and has a lot of potential. It's why I didn't think the Bears needed a WR the entire time everyone was circle-jerking each other about the possibility of getting a "Big WR"©. And now look...the Bears have a big WR and lots of people think Knox should still be in the lineup.

 

Knox - Hester - Bennett was fine. Only two things were missing last year: 1) Time to grow, 2) Time to throw

[Mongo3451]

I have no problem with Williams being the #1. Last time he played for Martz, he made the pro bowl. Besides Knox will probably be on the field for 70% of passing plays while isolated against weaker coverage. IMO - his big play ability doubles from last year. I like our top 4 recievers.

[Guest TerraTor]

I have no problem with Williams being the #1. Last time he played for Martz, he made the pro bowl. Besides Knox will probably be on the field for 70% of passing plays while isolated against weaker coverage. IMO - his big play ability doubles from last year. I like our top 4 recievers.

 

 

Sorry but that was 5 years ago and he was a loudmouth moron then, and only thing changed since is his production

[bradjock]

A few thoughts:

1. Knox was benched last week. Why is everyone treating this like it is new news?

2. SCORE hinted to get Williams, we promised to make him a star and roll out the red carpet. That makes sense when you consider he turned down more money for us.

2. Hester has been "given" the starting spot ever since we paid him. He didn't always deserve it, and half the time he didn't actually start (although he was listed as the starter). If Knox returns the opening kick-off, he really shouldn't start anyway. In other words, being called a starter is meaningless.

3. Knox: I love his potential, but he needs to get better. Everyone forgets he'd have had 1000 yards if he didn't tank the Packers game and go missing in the playoffs.

4. Lemone: Please clarify what you heard about Knox sleeping. I listened to the SCORE for a good 3 hours today and didn't hear anything . . .

[lemonej]

A few thoughts:

1. Knox was benched last week. Why is everyone treating this like it is new news?

2. SCORE hinted to get Williams, we promised to make him a star and roll out the red carpet. That makes sense when you consider he turned down more money for us.

2. Hester has been "given" the starting spot ever since we paid him. He didn't always deserve it, and half the time he didn't actually start (although he was listed as the starter). If Knox returns the opening kick-off, he really shouldn't start anyway. In other words, being called a starter is meaningless.

3. Knox: I love his potential, but he needs to get better. Everyone forgets he'd have had 1000 yards if he didn't tank the Packers game and go missing in the playoffs.

4. Lemone: Please clarify what you heard about Knox sleeping. I listened to the SCORE for a good 3 hours today and didn't hear anything . . .

Bradjock I really don't listen to the Score too much anymore.I listen to Waddle and Silvy.One is a former Bear and The Afternoon Saloon with Carmen ,Jurko and Harry which also features a former NFL player in John Jurkovic. He is the one who I first heard making those comments and I have good reason to believe that he has solid sources.If you noticed the backlash that came out about the Brad Biggs story from Knox and Drake doesn't squash these rumors about him snoozing in meetings and if you listen closely to what Martz is saying about how"Johnny is still learning". There seems to be more to it than he is willing to let out.I don't understand how your most prolific WR could be demoted unless he is taking things for granted.

[Mongo3451]

Sorry but that was 5 years ago and he was a loudmouth moron then, and only thing changed since is his production

You can attribute that to immaturity. Plus, hes been quiet since hes left the lions. He's young enough to where his skills haven't eroded. Gotta give him a shot here before I lay judgement. Sometimes receivers aren't fits for the system they are brought into. Hes proven in this one.

[AZ54]

I have no issues with the tough love from the coaches and have asked for this in the past. Man up. If Knox wants to request a trade I can't see how that is Angelo's fault. Nor does Angelo have to give in unless it's in the Bears best interest. If Knox is such a great 1000 yd receiver and we can get a 1st Rd pick for him make the deal.

[madlithuanian]

I have a friend from Dallas that is lamenting losing those 3 guys. He thinks they'll be better fits in Chicago than they were in Dallas. Owens took away from Williams, then some injuries occurred, and some sloppy play on Williams' part...all led to some sub-par results. I'm far from convinced he'll pick up from his 1300 yd season...but I do think the planets could align and he could become the threat we are hoping for.

 

He thinks Barber got the shaft in Dallas...and could be huge for the Bears at the goal line. He also laments losing Hurd as he was a special teams pro.

 

All that bodes at least fairly well for us I think.

 

I respect his opinion as he's a realist about the Cryboys.

 

You can attribute that to immaturity. Plus, hes been quiet since hes left the lions. He's young enough to where his skills haven't eroded. Gotta give him a shot here before I lay judgement. Sometimes receivers aren't fits for the system they are brought into. Hes proven in this one.

 

[madlithuanian]

We'll never get a 1st round pick for Knox....

 

We'd be lucky for a 3rd or 2nd is he turns into something truly legit.

 

 

I have no issues with the tough love from the coaches and have asked for this in the past. Man up. If Knox wants to request a trade I can't see how that is Angelo's fault. Nor does Angelo have to give in unless it's in the Bears best interest. If Knox is such a great 1000 yd receiver and we can get a 1st Rd pick for him make the deal.

 

[Controlled Chaos]

Funny I just heard Michael Wright on ESPN discussing how Knox's problems are more mental. Check out the 2:25 mark He needs to get in the classroom..etc...

 

Haven't we been here before...

Now I'm not overwhelmed by Roy Williams either, but until I see him run behind the defender on a slant route, I'll give him the upper hand on Knox.